Clutch and gears or automatic?

[NickyLouie]

22 hours ago, HappyExpat57 said:

After years of riding Honda 110/125's, I just got a Click 160 automatic. I love it! I still occasionally find myself looking for the gear pedal with my left foot, but it's just easier.

and horrible on gas, you should mention

[Stevemercer]

Scooters aren't real motorbikes, but they are convenient around town. I remember Honda brought out a 750 cc automatic bike once. It was dirt cheap (due to low demand), and I was tempted to buy one, but in the end I couldn't bring myself to do it.

 

I prefer a simple, more classic bike. Air-cooled, single cylinder (if <500cc, 2 cylinders or more). I'm currently riding a Stallions 400cc which was the ony new bike I could afford at the time (100,000 Baht about 4 or 5 years ago). I just wanted a 'rat' bike that I don't care too much about its looks (minimal care, only regular maintenance is to change the oil every 4,000 km) and the bike admiredly suits this purpose.

[MarcelV]

Never ridden a manual bike, as I learned to ride in Thailand and have since used my trusty automatic Fino. Closest I ever came was riding a semi-automatic with the foot gear switch.

[eisfeld]

10 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Your can change gears up and down on many manual motorbikes without using the clutch it just takes bit of practice.

Obviously pull clutch lever in when stopping. ????

 

 

Up yea, no problem. Actually works amazingly smooth on my CBR500R. Pretty much like a good quickshifter! Down though I wouldn't recommend for most gearboxes.

[OneMoreFarang]

20 minutes ago, NickyLouie said:

and horrible on gas, you should mention

That is relative.

My VFR400 in Bangkok traffic used about 10l per 100km. 1st gear up to 100km/h at 14,500 RPM and all that.

[Kwasaki]

9 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

Up yea, no problem. Actually works amazingly smooth on my CBR500R. Pretty much like a good quickshifter! Down though I wouldn't recommend for most gearboxes.

Downshifting is just as easy it's when and how it's done, for sure you cannot bang it down too quick like you can manually.

[tingtongfarang]

My answer was gears and clutch as i bought a new triumph bonneville just a few days ago...dont think they do automatics but i have a honda pcx automatic which gets used for 7/11 and the market, my car (toyota vios) also manual-clutch and gears is 17 years old had it from new and runs-drives same as new, i have had automatic cars in europe-jags and mercs - i like automatics in big cars only,

In my experience automatic cars at least use more fuel than manual.

Edited December 19, 2022 by tingtongfarang

[VocalNeal]

1 hour ago, eisfeld said:

Given that most motorbikes sold are probably CVT scooters these days, maybe 'standard' is not so clear. Dunno.

 

I think it makes the most sense to use 'auto', 'semi-auto' and 'manual'. Though some blur the line even there.

Maybe the thread title should be clutch and gears or CVT.  That delineates the choice to bike or scooter

[Kwasaki]

5 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

Maybe the thread title should be clutch and gears or CVT.  That delineates the choice to bike or scooter

Or bikes with Shaft, chain or rubber band. ????

[FriendlyFarang]

4 hours ago, PaoloR said:

But - what about my newest bike with an up and down quickshifter? I can ride using the clutch or ride without using it as I choose - problem solved!

A quickshifter doesn’t remove the most annoying burden of a clutch, starting/stopping.

[VocalNeal]

2 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

Or bikes with Shaft, chain or rubber band. ????

Would eliminate rubber band Harleys and BMW's????

[FriendlyFarang]

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Obviously it is possible and IMHO advisable to use two hands on the handlebar on all bikes

Luckily my bike has cruise control, so I can use both hands for my phone.

[VocalNeal]

3 minutes ago, FriendlyFarang said:

A quickshifter doesn’t remove the most annoying burden of a clutch, starting/stopping.

But adding a Rekluse clutch would https://rekluse.com/

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, Kwasaki said:

Or bikes with Shaft, chain or rubber band. ????

I don't like rubber bands.

 

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, FriendlyFarang said:

the most annoying burden of a clutch, starting/stopping

If that is the most annoying thing in your life... 

[Hummin]

If you like mixed riding, you need to be able to (I prefer) disconnect traction control and abs! 

[eisfeld]

  

1 hour ago, VocalNeal said:

Maybe the thread title should be clutch and gears or CVT.  That delineates the choice to bike or scooter

But there are scooters with clutch and gears. If the thread was supposed to be big bike or scooter than the easiest way to title it would be... "big bike or scooter" ????

 

But I think the OP is more interested in manual vs automatic.

 

For me personally I enjoy DCTs a lot. Though not for the automatic - I use it in manual mode. It's kinda the best of both worlds. I manually choose the gear but the shifts are very well done, better than any quickshifter I've ever experienced. Starting and stopping doesn't need a pulled in clutch - the gearbox does it for you. Is it perfect? Nah. But I believe it could be very close.

[VocalNeal]

11 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

But there are scooters with clutch and gears.

Currently available retail in Thailand. I don't think many vintage Vespa or Lambretta owners will be watching this.

Maybe a better delineation would be left-hand brake or right foot brake. et al. 

Edited December 19, 2022 by VocalNeal

[richard_smith237]

As far as ‘big bikes’ go, I’ve only ever ridden geared. 

As far as ‘scooters' go,  I’ve only ever ridden auto.

 

I imagine a larger ‘auto-bike’ would be easier to ride, especially in heavy traffic. 

I remember my left hand aching sometimes when feathering the clutch in Bangkok traffic. 

 

I think a Honda NC750X would be a good option, also the AfricaTwin (DCT)..

I think there’s an option for the BMW F850GS for an automatic too... 

 

I get why someone would want gears on larger bikes. I also get why with the advanced modern tech it doesn’t make a whole lot of difference any more. 

 

I don’t really understand why someone would want manual gears on a little 100cc or 300cc scooter... just seems pointless. 

[eisfeld]

5 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

Currently available retail in Thailand. I don't think many vintage Vespa or Lambretta owners will be watching this. 

Are you counting semi-autos as having clutch and gears? Because they certainly have those and are plentyful in Thailand.

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by eisfeld

[VocalNeal]

9 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

Are you counting semi-autos as having clutch and gears?

They have two driveline clutches but don't count as scooters as they are small motorbikes????

I don't know which part of their operation is truly auto. The rider has to make all the decisions and carry out the actions.

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by VocalNeal

[Cake Monster]

4 hours ago, Kwasaki said:

Well auto has been about some 70 years before google. ????

But Google Etc, has only really been in Thailand for the last 12 Years or so.

Before that the locals sat at the lights squeezing out their Blackheads, and rode with both hands in control, cos their was nothing else to do

[eisfeld]

24 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

They have two driveline clutches but don't count as scooters as they are small motorbikes????

I don't know which part of their operation is truly auto. The rider has to make all the decisions and carry out the actions.

 

Our definitions of scooters are not the same then. For me a scooter is defined by it's frame and shape mostly. A scooter is a small motorbike but not all small motorbikes are scooters. Can be fully manual, gearing doesn't have anything to do with it imho. You still need to differentiate scooters and bigger bikes in the era of electric drivetrains so you can't go by drivetrain.

 

The part that is auto in the semi-autos is the clutch actuation.

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by eisfeld

[OneMoreFarang]

44 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

But I think the OP is more interested in manual vs automatic.

Yes, confirmed, that is what my question is about.

Currently I have a 150cc bike and the 390cc bike, both are manual with gears and manual clutch.

I can't imagine that I will ever buy an automatic bike. I just don't like them.

But I am not surprised that many here, it seems the majority, prefer automatic bikes. That seems to be the trend these days.

[Hummin]

5 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

Our definitions of scooters are not the same then. For me a scooter is defined by it's frame and shape mostly. A scooter is a small motorbike but not all small motorbikes are scooters. Can be fully manual, gearing doesn't have anything to do with it imho. You still need to differentiate scooters and bigger bikes in the era of electric drivetrains so you can't go by drivetrain.

 

The part that is auto in the semi-autos is the clutch actuation.

 

ADV and NC 750 is pr definition big scooters with DCT

[Hummin]

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Yes, confirmed, that is what my question is about.

Currently I have a 150cc bike and the 390cc bike, both are manual with gears and manual clutch.

I can't imagine that I will ever buy an automatic bike. I just don't like them.

But I am not surprised that many here, it seems the majority, prefer automatic bikes. That seems to be the trend these days.

I enjoyed my PCX for use in city. Handy when shopping and going to the beach. Easy parking in thight spots

Edited December 19, 2022 by Hummin

[OneMoreFarang]

41 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

I don’t really understand why someone would want manual gears on a little 100cc or 300cc scooter... just seems pointless. 

Habit. And it feels like a real bike. ????

 

 

[VocalNeal]

I have one of each. I quite enjoy tinkering with CVT. Quite easy to remove and replace. 

Smaller bike/scooter is easier to park/manoeuvre when downtown at the market. 

I would quite like an Aprilia Mana just for a laugh.

[Kwasaki]

51 minutes ago, Cake Monster said:

But Google Etc, has only really been in Thailand for the last 12 Years or so.

Before that the locals sat at the lights squeezing out their Blackheads, and rode with both hands in control, cos their was nothing else to do

I don't think there was so many auto scoots on the road then. 

[Kwasaki]

41 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

I have one of each. I quite enjoy tinkering with CVT. Quite easy to remove and replace. 

Smaller bike/scooter is easier to park/manoeuvre when downtown at the market. 

I would quite like an Aprilia Mana just for a laugh.

An Aprilia spare parts wouldn't make you laugh. ????????????