An abolition of conscription will mean more inequality : Nipit

[BKKBike09]

2 hours ago, hotchilli said:

Nah, she'll drive her Merc to the nearest detail shop and allow a Myanmarese national do it for a pittance.

Some mistake here, surely? SHE won't drive her Merc, her driver (ie conscript) will.

[IamNoone88]

Anytime you hear a politician, anywhere, say "..but the change should be implemented gradually" ....  actually means "never".

[ignore it]

Abolish the draft?

 

I'll miss the ladyboy show.

[h90]

35 minutes ago, Asquith Production said:

Well you understand wrong. Son finished his Masters and still had to do lottery. He lost and got conscripted 2 weeks ago although he only as to do 1 year

There was this discussion with Abhisit, that he did not have to do the regular military as he studied......Your son has to do the normal military in the dirt or some better thing?

[crazykopite]

Having spent more than 22 years in the U.K. military which during that time spending several years assigned to US Forces in the USA as well as serving  with Allied Forces Central Europe unfortunately I had a number of my subordinates Dutch mainly who were conscripted soldiers and I would say 70% didn’t want to be soldiers they were my worst nightmare turning up late for parade refusing to do work assigned to them by doing this they were hoping that they would be kicked out problem was that those personnel who had joined up on there own free will were caught in the middle .If your going to hall conscription it has to be done in one foul swoop not dries and drabs and let’s face it Thailand has not experienced a major conflict just skirmishes with borders Cambodia comes to Mind . By eliminating conscription you end up with a more professional military due to those who want to be a part of the organisation rather than those who detest the idea and picking by straws as apparently happens here in Thailand is absurd if your going to have conscription it has to be for everyone regardless. . By abolishing conscription Thailand will have a far more disciplined and professional military be it Army , Navy or Airforce 

[sidneybear]

Conscription is a good thing, as it instills discipline, patriotism and respect. I hope they don't get rid of it, or if they do get rid of it they bring it back once this lot of progressives gets kicked out. 

[robertson468]

1 hour ago, h90 said:

I have seen western military leadership.....it all looks professional.....but it is not....just the alcohol problem is a story on itself....

What are you talking about.  I am a retired British Soldier and whilst like most people, we enjoy a social drink/party, you would not survive in the Army if you had an alcohol problem and would be medically discharge.  The British Army is a highly professiona organisation with very well trained leaders and are all Regulars (except the TA).  They are an outstanding fighting force, albeit now very small, and have a "will do attitude" when thrown in to a multitude of scenarios - such as Firemen, Ambulance Drivers, Rescuers et al.  Were you ever a member of the Armed Forces I wonder?

[Andrew65]

4 hours ago, Srikcir said:

So conscription the entire nation and eliminate income inequality instantly.

But somehow military wages that may or may not actual go to conscripts may by themselves increase income inequality.

Whatever. There's simply no academic proof that conscription reduces income inequality. But there is evidence that eight years under the military political coalition has increased the nation's income inequality.

An old Ozzie friend worked for a Japanese oil & gas company in Bangkok. One of the reasons that they gave for pulling out of Thailand was having to deal with military men who didn't have the faintest-clue about what their business was in Thailand.

[Andrew65]

1 hour ago, crazykopite said:

Having spent more than 22 years in the U.K. military which during that time spending several years assigned to US Forces in the USA as well as serving  with Allied Forces Central Europe unfortunately I had a number of my subordinates Dutch mainly who were conscripted soldiers and I would say 70% didn’t want to be soldiers they were my worst nightmare turning up late for parade refusing to do work assigned to them by doing this they were hoping that they would be kicked out problem was that those personnel who had joined up on there own free will were caught in the middle .If your going to hall conscription it has to be done in one foul swoop not dries and drabs and let’s face it Thailand has not experienced a major conflict just skirmishes with borders Cambodia comes to Mind . By eliminating conscription you end up with a more professional military due to those who want to be a part of the organisation rather than those who detest the idea and picking by straws as apparently happens here in Thailand is absurd if your going to have conscription it has to be for everyone regardless. . By abolishing conscription Thailand will have a far more disciplined and professional military be it Army , Navy or Airforce 

When I worked in Saudi I had a Syrian friend/colleague who lived in Beirut. He was not able to visit Syria for either 5 or 10 years because he was dodging the draft. After that he could return and pay a $10,000 fine and everything would be ok. (this was many years before the war in Syria)

It would seem that the draft is unpopular wherever it is. Also, many regular soldiers do not want colleagues serving with them who obviously do not want to be there.

Edited May 30, 2023 by Andrew65

[Alex80]

4 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

They do not need conscription, just make the young convicted thugs do 2 years service. Might make better people of them...............or not

Yeah, filling the army with thugs and young criminals, giving them weapons, power and a chance of career seems a great idea. What could be go wrong?

[mfd101]

8 minutes ago, Alex80 said:

Yeah, filling the army with thugs and young criminals, giving them weapons, power and a chance of career seems a great idea. What could be go wrong?

Ask Putin. He'll tell you.

[Guderian]

What a shame! One of the highlights of the year is the sight of the preening katoeys who've been conscripted, together with the doubtful, worried faces of the non-katoey conscripts surveying their new comrades-in-arms, lol!

[scorecard]

5 hours ago, h90 said:

If I understand right, these who study at university don't get conscripted the normal way. Might be a good idea but that is pretty much the definition of inequality as only people who are well off go to universities

Kids can do 'military' service at high school, a couple of hours a week and 1 or 2 easy camps (2 or 3 days) a year. Over several years this produces a certificate which gives them exemption from conscription.

 

Stydying at uni doesn't automatically bring exemption. 

 

[DJ54]

Military should offer opportunities to learn skills, provide education for future growth 

in Military or Civil arena. 

[h90]

1 hour ago, robertson468 said:

What are you talking about.  I am a retired British Soldier and whilst like most people, we enjoy a social drink/party, you would not survive in the Army if you had an alcohol problem and would be medically discharge.  The British Army is a highly professiona organisation with very well trained leaders and are all Regulars (except the TA).  They are an outstanding fighting force, albeit now very small, and have a "will do attitude" when thrown in to a multitude of scenarios - such as Firemen, Ambulance Drivers, Rescuers et al.  Were you ever a member of the Armed Forces I wonder?

I was in the ministry of defense where all the army looked like christmas trees. 3 large beer and 3 Schnaps (served in wine glasses, they were large) per person at lunch brake was normal for one table. Another group went with some small vehicle buying bottles of wine for an office every day. Some guy of the secret service complete drunk at the security guards monologing how top secret he is and having a different passport every 2 weeks.....Where we began the commander was a Lieutenant for lifetime because they found Nazi things in his workplace...but still commanding officer in this place....The officer who took care of the weapons...he sat all the day alone in his room, as there was nothing to do and drinking....
Not the British Army....the professionals of Austria.....Most of it you could direct sell as Monty Python script. I was drafted but used in the Ministery of Defense...environmental department in the office as I was one of the rare one who did the military after university.
I can easily believe that the lower ranks outside do a professional job but the top brass there is nothing....and you see it....red faces, big bellies.....

[Bday Prang]

5 hours ago, wazzupnow said:

dropping the consciption is the best thing ever 

many countries did so before i was the one of the last guys in my country that got drafted

than they started to exclude several years of birth for draft

and after 5 years the draft was completely gone

it only gives more job opportunity and better motivated soldiers

halve of the army now would run to their mothers skirts after the first missile to launch

Half of the population are quick to run to their mothers at he slightest excuse, !

Not a big fan of the military in general but I have seen a few wasters turn them selves around after having been dragged kicking and screaming from their mothers and done their national service? 

8 hours ago, webfact said:

except when the country is at war.

Seriously ??  best of luck with that lads, its ok singing about it in the national anthem, but don't kid yourselves  eh?    

[h90]

17 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Kids can do 'military' service at high school, a couple of hours a week and 1 or 2 easy camps (2 or 3 days) a year. Over several years this produces a certificate which gives them exemption from conscription.

 

Stydying at uni doesn't automatically bring exemption. 

 

couple of hours every week at high school and 1-2 easy camps for 2-3 days is an exemption with some cosmetic so they can call it different....

[Bday Prang]

1 hour ago, Alex80 said:

Yeah, filling the army with thugs and young criminals, giving them weapons, power and a chance of career seems a great idea. What could be go wrong?

No need for conscripts or anybody else to be using real weapons,  just give them wooden imitations

[ozz1]

The Thai army has to have some one to bully so these conscripts are ideal

[Burma Bill]

6 hours ago, 2baht said:

Will the Generals wife have to wash her own car??? Heaven forbid!

Good comment. I was thinking along the same lines with the generals and other senior officers losing their "bag carriers", shoe shine boys, gardeners etc. etc.

[wealthychef]

Really, what a sad statement, that if you don't conscript citizens they will fall into poverty.  How about doing something about the poverty in your society that involves non-military, non-police solutions?  Is that so hard to imagine?  

[spidermike007]

Who are these guys, where do they come from, why are they so spectacularly ignorant, and does anyone listen to any of them? Equating equality in society with conscription, is like saying if you keep education the same as it is now, much prosperity will flow to the common man. Such tripe.

 

If anything is certain, it is that the power and wealth of the Thai army needs to be diminished, in order for the nation to prosper. They are like a vacuum, sucking the blood and treasury from society. A vampire group.

[Falcon]

6 hours ago, h90 said:

If I understand right, these who study at university don't get conscripted the normal way. Might be a good idea but that is pretty much the definition of inequality as only people who are well off go to universities

What a ridiculous comment. You don’t have to be well off to go to university. There are a lot of universities that are cheap enough for almost anyone, except the very poor. Together with a government loan which is very small but does just about cover the cost of going to university. As for university students not being conscripted, of course they are, as the conscription ag is from 21-35, just that, if at university, they get an exemption until the y are no longer there and then, if they have already picked the wrong ball, they will go and serve their two years. Only way out of it is to do Lor Dor for 3 years while at high school. This is basically like joining the army cadets but those completing the 3 years get exempted from the call up.

[hotchilli]

4 hours ago, BKKBike09 said:

Some mistake here, surely? SHE won't drive her Merc, her driver (ie conscript) will.

My mistake, apologies for my over-sight.

[PETERTHEEATER]

1 hour ago, Bday Prang said:

No need for conscripts or anybody else to be using real weapons,  just give them wooden imitations

A wooden submarine.....now there's a thought.....????

[Eric Loh]

Conscription in Thailand was introduced in 1905 when the region was unstable and population was about 8 million. Small nations like Israel and Singapore have reasons to have citizen army. Thailand now has more than 10 times that population and have enough resources for a standing army without the need for conscription. The budget for conscripted army can easily pay for a regular army. Moreover the conscription is riddled with corruption and poor discipline. Yes get rid of conscription for regulars. 

[BritScot]

4 hours ago, h90 said:

I have seen western military leadership.....it all looks professional.....but it is not....just the alcohol problem is a story on itself....

Please explain this bizzare statement? I served in a western military where commissions were not purchased and officers were educated and well trained . I never saw officers drunk infact the few I served with hardly drank. I did only serve 10 and a half years, 3 of which were active service.

[Bday Prang]

24 minutes ago, PETERTHEEATER said:

A wooden submarine.....now there's a thought.....????

that wooden go down very well????

[h90]

2 minutes ago, BritScot said:

Please explain this bizzare statement? I served in a western military where commissions were not purchased and officers were educated and well trained . I never saw officers drunk infact the few I served with hardly drank. I did only serve 10 and a half years, 3 of which were active service.

I did explain a bit previous.....From your name I assume you are British....the drunks were Austrian military. I was 6 month in the defense ministry (or a part of it...different building than the politicians) and it was straight out of a Monty Python movie....and it was the environment department that wrote funny things on how to not disturb the birds when exercising (which is nonsense because the birds get used to it, and tanks really help them, as they can find worms easier).....there was also a "secret floor" with one of the people drunk monologing in front of the guards how secret he is.....

[h90]

29 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Conscription in Thailand was introduced in 1905 when the region was unstable and population was about 8 million. Small nations like Israel and Singapore have reasons to have citizen army. Thailand now has more than 10 times that population and have enough resources for a standing army without the need for conscription. The budget for conscripted army can easily pay for a regular army. Moreover the conscription is riddled with corruption and poor discipline. Yes get rid of conscription for regulars. 

You could add some militia to it...So you have manpower in case of floods and have some structure to rebuild a big army in case you need it.