Problems with TM.30

[StayinThailand2much]

I asked for help recently as my landlady was unwilling to do the TM.30 report for me.

 

Someone suggested that I instead do the report myself online, which I did. However, doing my 90-day report in person today at Chaengwattana Immigration, I was asked to "redo the report" then and there. My online TM.30 was not accepted, I was informed that I, as the tennant, cannot do it, my report was cancelled, and I was fined. Considering time and money spent, I wish I had not done either report, as the expense would have been about the same, but no stress, and time wasted.

 

 

[zappalot]

I thought the fine is on the landlord...

 

How can it be your fault if the landlord is not doing what is required by law?

[Maestro]

2 hours ago, StayinThailand2much said:

...My online TM.30 was not accepted, I was informed that I, as the tennant, cannot do it, my report was cancelled, and I was fined...

What amount is shown on the receipt for the fine?

[BritTim]

If you can show you have a long term rental agreement, and have photocopies of the landlady's id card, you should be able to do the TM30 notification yourself as the possessor of the apartment. It is possible that the online app does not support this, but I am very surprised that Chaengwattana would fine you unless you were unable to redo the TM30 in person when asked. Maybe, there was a personality conflict between you and the official.

[problemfarang]

did you register yourself as the owner when doing online?

if so.. well.. no need to think too much

 

if not, then did you add copies of the house book and owner ID?

 

i would do it via mobile app. its really easy and in english too. try that way. screenshot every step.

i did my tm30 via mobile app by myself. the only problem took time was my passport. it took some time that the program recognize it. 

[aluc]

57 minutes ago, BritTim said:

If you can show you have a long term rental agreement, and have photocopies of the landlady's id card, you should be able to do the TM30 notification yourself as the possessor of the apartment. It is possible that the online app does not support this, but I am very surprised that Chaengwattana would fine you unless you were unable to redo the TM30 in person when asked. Maybe, there was a personality conflict between you and the official.

He will need a power of attorney to do TM30 in person, but that seems unlikely if landlady isn`t very cooperative.

Also in Phuket I was asked for chanote, all together it took me three trips to immigration to get my tm30 done, just didn`t want to bother my landlord who is 75 years old man and Im not sure he even knows what that tm30 is.

[scottiejohn]

Get a blank "rental form" from a bookstore a, preferably Thai, friend to fill it in as if you were renting from them and get the appropriate ID's etc.  

 

My Landlord lives overseas and could not provide the docs I needed soon enough for stuff I had to at IO.  He suggested this solution and it worked OK.  Once he had access to all that was required I just "moved house" to his address.  No problems.

 

PS we used the MIL's details!

 

PPS;  Will not of course work for anything to do with marriage extensions where visits by IO's are required!

 

 

[OJAS]

3 hours ago, BritTim said:

I am very surprised that Chaengwattana would fine you unless you were unable to redo the TM30 in person when asked. Maybe, there was a personality conflict between you and the official.

As I recall, CW were certainly gleefully fining people left, right and centre (including, I believe, @lopburi3) for the non-submission of completed TM30's when they abruptly inflicted this requirement on their punters with zero advance notice a few years ago, after ages of not bothering about it. So they definitely have a rogue track record IMHO when it comes to the TM30 form.

[DrJack54]

15 minutes ago, OJAS said:

As I recall, CW were certainly gleefully fining people left, right and centre (including, I believe, @lopburi3) for the non-submission of completed TM30's when they abruptly inflicted this requirement on their punters with zero advance notice a few years ago, after ages of not bothering about it. So they definitely have a rogue track record IMHO when it comes to the TM30 form.

That occured when there was change of head guy Big Joke.

The new guy that replaced him had to be seen to do something and randomly selected TM30. 

To be fair it was across the board and most immigration offices started enforcing it.

Good news it only lasted couple of months.

Many people were fined 800b.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Like dogs and fire hydrants.... every one needs to leave their mark!

 

[StayinThailand2much]

4 hours ago, zappalot said:

I thought the fine is on the landlord...

 

How can it be your fault if the landlord is not doing what is required by law?

I really do not know. But they told me:

1. If the landlord doesn't do the TM.30 report, I will have to do it on the first(!) day of the lease in person.

2. I cannot do it online for the landlord.

3. If I do the TM.30 report late in person (if the landlord does not do it) I get fined!

 

There was neither mentioning by the Immigration staff that the landlord was at fault, nor that he/she would be fined.

 

To make it even more confusing; I was asked for earlier TM.30 reports for times (mid March to end of May) when I did not rent an apartment. Of course I didn't have those, as I stayed at a few hotels during that time... Shouldn't Immigration have them in their computer system?? Or am I supposed to ask every single hotel I'm staying at in Thailand, even if only for one night, for a copy of the TM.30 report, so that I can present them to Immigration whenever I have to go there?

 

[StayinThailand2much]

25 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Good news it only lasted couple of months.

Many people were fined 800b.

I was fined that amount today.

[DrJack54]

1 minute ago, StayinThailand2much said:

I was fined that amount today.

Back to your OP.

I'm not sure why you needed a TM30 to make your 90 day report.

 

Have you recently returned to Thailand or changed address etc.

 

 

[StayinThailand2much]

3 hours ago, aluc said:

He will need a power of attorney to do TM30 in person, but that seems unlikely if landlady isn`t very cooperative.

Funnily enough they asked me to fill out the form (which no-one, incl. me even signed), while my earlier online report (shortly after I had moved in, and knew of the landlady's refusal to do it) was cancelled.

[StayinThailand2much]

1 minute ago, DrJack54 said:

Back to your OP.

I'm not sure why you needed a TM30 to make your 90 day report.

 

Have you recently returned to Thailand or changed address etc.

Yes. Returned to Thailand. Obviously, for a 90-day report, I needed the TM.30 first.

 

The one I did (instead of my landlady) was in the system. So, before I could do a 90-day report, I was asked to "re-do a TM.30"...

[Sandboxer]

When one gets fined for TM30 (or 90 day) infraction, does the passport get some sort of "fined/paid for ___" stamp like on an overstay, or is it just a piece of paper/receipt?

 

 

[DrJack54]

3 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

Yes. Returned to Thailand. Obviously, for a 90-day report, I needed the TM.30 first.

I won't sidetrack the topic.

However to be clear.

If you are doing a 90 day report ..

Presumably you obtained a non O and have extension and hence need a 90 report? 

How did you return to Thailand?

Meaning visa status

[StayinThailand2much]

4 hours ago, BritTim said:

but I am very surprised that Chaengwattana would fine you unless you were unable to redo the TM30 in person when asked. Maybe, there was a personality conflict between you and the official.

I did a TM.30 online by myself, which was accepted by the system. However, visiting Chaengwattana today, they threw it out (not accepted at '90-day counter', then cancelled by 'TM.30 official'), but asked me to re-do it by filling out the form. Still I was fined for 'reporting late'! And no, there was no personality conflict between me and the official.

[StayinThailand2much]

2 minutes ago, Sandboxer said:

When one gets fined for TM30 (or 90 day) infraction, does the passport get some sort of "fined/paid for ___" stamp like on an overstay, or is it just a piece of paper/receipt?

They had a form that I had to sign 3 times. I received a receipt, nothing in the passport.

[StayinThailand2much]

4 hours ago, Maestro said:

What amount is shown on the receipt for the fine?

The same I paid, 800 baht.

[StayinThailand2much]

3 hours ago, problemfarang said:

did you register yourself as the owner when doing online?

if so.. well.. no need to think too much

I did, and it was accepted by the online system.

[CecilM]

On 7/3/2023 at 3:49 PM, problemfarang said:

did you register yourself as the owner when doing online?

if so.. well.. no need to think too much

 

if not, then did you add copies of the house book and owner ID?

 

i would do it via mobile app. its really easy and in english too. try that way. screenshot every step.

i did my tm30 via mobile app by myself. the only problem took time was my passport. it took some time that the program recognize it. 

iOS or Android?

What’s the name of the App?

thank you. 

[problemfarang]

2 hours ago, CecilM said:

iOS or Android?

What’s the name of the App?

thank you. 

works for both of course.

 

i think you can download it from the immigration website. i checked playstore but couldnt find it. 

its called 'section38'   or  'น.38'

[CRUNCHER]

2 hours ago, problemfarang said:

works for both of course.

 

i think you can download it from the immigration website. i checked playstore but couldnt find it. 

its called 'section38'   or  'น.38'

Can't find it the App Store either

[CecilM]

3 hours ago, problemfarang said:

works for both of course.

 

i think you can download it from the immigration website. i checked playstore but couldnt find it. 

its called 'section38'   or  'น.38'

Thank you. I’ll check it out. 
(It’s easy enough to do it on a computer, but a mobile app looks interesting.)

[Skeptic7]

On 7/3/2023 at 6:30 PM, OJAS said:

As I recall, CW were certainly gleefully fining people left, right and centre (including, I believe, @lopburi3) for the non-submission of completed TM30's when they abruptly inflicted this requirement on their punters with zero advance notice a few years ago, after ages of not bothering about it. So they definitely have a rogue track record IMHO when it comes to the TM30 form.

Yes CW loves doling out max fines❗And not only TM30. Loathe that place because of the arrogance & "baditude". Glad to be in another province now. 

[Lemsta69]

11 hours ago, CRUNCHER said:

Can't find it the App Store either

Yeh this has been talked about in other threads; it's almost impossible to find now.

 

For Android you'll have to download the APK full from a third-party website and for Apple the last I read was you need an iPhone bought in Thailand and that has only ever had a Thai peeson's profile added to it (or something like that).

[Red Phoenix]

On 7/3/2023 at 2:07 PM, StayinThailand2much said:

I really do not know. But they told me:

1. If the landlord doesn't do the TM.30 report, I will have to do it on the first(!) day of the lease in person.

2. I cannot do it online for the landlord.

3. If I do the TM.30 report late in person (if the landlord does not do it) I get fined!

 

There was neither mentioning by the Immigration staff that the landlord was at fault, nor that he/she would be fined.

Re the points they told you:

1. It is correct that if the landlord does not notify local Immigration by issuing a TM-30 report that a foreigner (you) is staying at this premises, and you need a service from Immigration that Immigration will put the burden on you for meeting the TM-30 notification requirement. 

And indeed it has to be done within 24 hours of arrival of the foreigner at the premises.  Normally Immigration are not so strict, but when you told them that you arrived there already some time ago, they can fine you for having done it late. 

2. You CAN do it on-line on behalf of the landlord.

a) If the landlord already registered the place on the IO TM-30 website, that would require that you have to ask for his username/password to issue the TM-30 (takes 2 minutes).

b) If the landlord has not registered the place he is renting on the IO TM-30 website, you can do it on his behalf.  You would need a copy of the house-book and a signed front/back copy of the owner's Thai ID-card. 

Having provided those documents with the registration, you will receive the username/password, that will allow you then to do the TM-30. 

Immigration has no way of knowing that you did it on behalf of the landlord.

3. Yes that's correct (see point #1). A crazy and frustrating experience...

And once Immigration collected the fine from you, the landlord is 'off the hook'.

 

[Red Phoenix]

On 7/3/2023 at 2:07 PM, StayinThailand2much said:

To make it even more confusing; I was asked for earlier TM.30 reports for times (mid March to end of May) when I did not rent an apartment. Of course I didn't have those, as I stayed at a few hotels during that time... Shouldn't Immigration have them in their computer system?? Or am I supposed to ask every single hotel I'm staying at in Thailand, even if only for one night, for a copy of the TM.30 report, so that I can present them to Immigration whenever I have to go there?

This is totally 'out of bounds'.  You must have met an Imm Officer that for one reason or another had a grudge against you.  There is absolutely no reason for you to provide evidence of all the places where you have stayed in Thailand earlier than your current address. And the Hotels/guesthouses where you stayed are required by Thai law to notify Immigration that a foreigner is staying at their premises, and indeed that notification is available in the central IO TM-30 database where they can see all the TM-30s issued of you staying somewhere. 

[OJAS]

46 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

This is totally 'out of bounds'.  You must have met an Imm Officer that for one reason or another had a grudge against you.

Either that, or the plain fact could be that, when it comes to issues relating to the TM30 form, Chaengwattana are a ROGUE OFFICE PAR EXCELLENCE.