What is the real deal with proposed foreign income tax changes?

[webfact]

 

 

VIDEO: Pattaya News Special

By Goongnang Suksawat

 

Source: THE PHUKET NEWS 2023-09-25

 

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[HappyExpat57]

It's in the title of your post - "proposed."

 

And, just to be clear, if anything IS ever announced to clarify, it will be countermanded the next day.

[hotchilli]

Touch my pension I'm gone.

[jacko45k]

23 minutes ago, hotchilli said:

Touch my pension I'm gone.

That 800,000 baht would buy a nice 1st class, one way ticket, easily!

[RichardColeman]

4 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

That 800,000 baht would buy a nice 1st class, one way ticket, easily!

I would imagine that 800k will be severely effected by 'retro income tax' coming later ! 

[jacko45k]

1 minute ago, RichardColeman said:

I would imagine that 800k will be severely effected by 'retro income tax' coming later ! 

Very pessimistic......

[DrMJA]

Well, the neighboring countries are worth looking into ... no rush, never hurts to have a contingency plan!

[hotchilli]

20 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

That 800,000 baht would buy a nice 1st class, one way ticket, easily!

Much better in a Philippine bank..

[mfd101]

What is the real deal? Noone knows, least of all the government. But the likelihood of it affecting genuine old-age pensioners living in Thailand is small indeed.

[koolkarl]

It isn't proposed but a fact and has been in the works for years.  It is an income and asset cooperating agreement between Thailand and most other countries and this info is updated yearly.  The information goes both ways. If you reside in Thailand more than 180 days a year, you will be liable for tax on your world income and Thai tax authorities will know about it.  So start packing.

[topt]

6 minutes ago, koolkarl said:

It isn't proposed but a fact and has been in the works for years.  It is an income and asset cooperating agreement between Thailand and most other countries and this info is updated yearly.  The information goes both ways. If you reside in Thailand more than 180 days a year, you will be liable for tax on your world income and Thai tax authorities will know about it.  So start packing.

I think you are referring to CRS?

If so that is something completely separate to the proposal announced by the new PM and being discussed here.

[retarius]

I have accelerated some saving transfers over to Thailand, to buy assets like land for my missus for when I die. Apart from that I will wait and see what actually emerges rather that to speculate on what might happen. Prayut's reckless spending and borrowing has left the new government short of money and with interest rates going up, borrowing is not an attractive proposition.

[daveAustin]

21 minutes ago, koolkarl said:

It isn't proposed but a fact and has been in the works for years.  It is an income and asset cooperating agreement between Thailand and most other countries and this info is updated yearly.  The information goes both ways. If you reside in Thailand more than 180 days a year, you will be liable for tax on your world income and Thai tax authorities will know about it.  So start packing.

They can F off 'stealing' ALREADY taxed income and pensions though, which was proposed in the original document. That would be obscene Orwellian banana republic behaviour.

[wwest5829]

28 minutes ago, koolkarl said:

It isn't proposed but a fact and has been in the works for years.  It is an income and asset cooperating agreement between Thailand and most other countries and this info is updated yearly.  The information goes both ways. If you reside in Thailand more than 180 days a year, you will be liable for tax on your world income and Thai tax authorities will know about it.  So start packing.

According to the recent tax expert who spoke at the Chiang Mai Expat Club meeting, your statement is false. I think I will listen to those whose business is tax matters between Thailand and the countries having tax treaties.

[Gknrd]

99% already there will pay up .. Same as the 800K in the bank.. Bitch , but no action.

[koolkarl]

43 minutes ago, topt said:

I think you are referring to CRS?

If so that is something completely separate to the proposal announced by the new PM and being discussed here.

I am. And you are astute.

[Wuvu2]

38 minutes ago, daveAustin said:

That would be obscene Orwellian banana republic behaviour.

So only in the USA then ????

[sirineou]

10 minutes of could , might, we don't know , let's wait and see . 

The man is a financial genius. 

[Ben Zioner]

1 hour ago, retarius said:

I have accelerated some saving transfers over to Thailand, to buy assets like land for my missus for when I die.

I'll do the same,  transfer all our 2024 income  before the end this year. For those who can I'd suggest to switch to the LTR visa, as it might protect them and even allow them to spend their THB 800000 deposit.

 

LTR Royal Decree

[WorriedNoodle]

After clicking one second into the vid seeing some yahoo sat on a bench supping a can I knew I wasn't watching the 'real deal' as implied by the subject title so switched it off.

[Trippy]

17 minutes ago, WorriedNoodle said:

After clicking one second into the vid seeing some yahoo sat on a bench supping a can I knew I wasn't watching the 'real deal' as implied by the subject title so switched it off.

AJ is actually a pretty smart guy who loves to talk and has connections all over Pattaya, he's not your average brain dead youtuber.

[fulhamster]

2 hours ago, hotchilli said:

Much better in a Philippine bank..

And the Brits will get the pension increases over there

[expat_4_life]

Personally, I'm not too concerned about this "overblown" story.

 

Remember, not long ago, when they implemented regulations on Paypal to close the loophole on undisclosed income?

I look at this the same way, it most likely to close another loophole that allows Thais to bring in undeclared income and pay no taxes.  Add to that poorly explained.

For the time being I'm not worried in the least as regards pension income.

Edited September 25, 2023 by expat_4_life

[Litlos]

This has been coming for a while and is not a recently conceived idea. Abit of history of linked events I am aware off: The auto no tax on non resident income option deleted a couple of years ago, no problem rely on the bring it in next year option. Anyone with an address in Thailand on their Paypal account has to reregister with a Thai Id number, this was apparently a way that Thai overseas workers were sending money home in the same year and bypassing the Thai tax, Anyone spending more than 180 days in Thailand is considered a tax resident of Thailand in Jan this year. About May this year Thailand joins CRS which is a multinational scheme to share tax and income details across borders. Last week the final nail in the tax free coffin the removal of the bring it in next year option, so now all the pieces are in place to levy tax on overseas income.

The interesting part is I have seen it referred to as a tax on income and a tax on income remitted to Thailand, the second version came out as a clarification a few days after the first, so hopefully this the the more accurate version. But lots of questions all on overseas transactions, such as how are capital gains treated? Income previously earned, retrospective tax. Share dividends?

So I am following closely to optimise this year to minimise in future, but clarifications are sparse.

There is always the option when travelling to Thailand to bring in up to USD20,000 in cash without the need to declare it, 2 x overseas trips a year is doable when flight prices decrease. Can also bring in 500k Baht from bounded countries, Bank account in Malaysia?

Cheers

[keithkarmann]

4 hours ago, hotchilli said:

Touch my pension I'm gone.

Back to the UK would be an option with my Thai wife and daughter. Imagine all those benifits we would get that we don't get here.

[NoshowJones]

2 hours ago, keithkarmann said:

Back to the UK would be an option with my Thai wife and daughter. Imagine all those benifits we would get that we don't get here.

What benefits? The health service is screwed, TV licence. council tax, and worst of all energy prices, then if you are not a state pensioner, transport charges, bus, train. Oh! and don't forget the dreadful weather. I was in the UK last June and July and never once been able to leave my rented flat without wearing a hoody.

[hotchilli]

2 hours ago, keithkarmann said:

Back to the UK would be an option with my Thai wife and daughter. Imagine all those benifits we would get that we don't get here.

Back to the UK is the last place on earth I'd go, further East is my plan if Thailand touch my pension.

[Marco100]

3 hours ago, Litlos said:

This has been coming for a while and is not a recently conceived idea. Abit of history of linked events I am aware off: The auto no tax on non resident income option deleted a couple of years ago, no problem rely on the bring it in next year option. Anyone with an address in Thailand on their Paypal account has to reregister with a Thai Id number, this was apparently a way that Thai overseas workers were sending money home in the same year and bypassing the Thai tax, Anyone spending more than 180 days in Thailand is considered a tax resident of Thailand in Jan this year. About May this year Thailand joins CRS which is a multinational scheme to share tax and income details across borders. Last week the final nail in the tax free coffin the removal of the bring it in next year option, so now all the pieces are in place to levy tax on overseas income.

The interesting part is I have seen it referred to as a tax on income and a tax on income remitted to Thailand, the second version came out as a clarification a few days after the first, so hopefully this the the more accurate version. But lots of questions all on overseas transactions, such as how are capital gains treated? Income previously earned, retrospective tax. Share dividends?

So I am following closely to optimise this year to minimise in future, but clarifications are sparse.

There is always the option when travelling to Thailand to bring in up to USD20,000 in cash without the need to declare it, 2 x overseas trips a year is doable when flight prices decrease. Can also bring in 500k Baht from bounded countries, Bank account in Malaysia?

Cheers

With the AEOI - CRS ( automatic exchange of information banks to country  ) if you are registered  at your bank as a Thai resident  than the Thai fiscal authorities will know your bank statements end of the year .

If you reside  more than 180 days in Thailand I assume you will enter in the taxable regime. 

Till now if it was savings it was not taxed .

Will have to understand  what they want to tax and what % ....

[circa02]

Deleted original, bad maths, deductions are from the personal allowance not on top. Pages of interest https://taxsummaries.pwc.com/thailand/individual/deductions
https://www.uobam.co.th/en/tax-calculation

 

 

Edited September 25, 2023 by circa02

[Denim]

6 hours ago, koolkarl said:

If you reside in Thailand more than 180 days a year, you will be liable for tax on your world income and Thai tax authorities will know about it.  So start packing.

When I first came to Thailand  in 1979 , if you stayed longer than 180 days you had to get a tax clearance  certificate  from the revenue office before you could leave. This cost a certain  amount of money ( forget how much ).

 

To avoid paying this you could ( for a much smaller fee ) get a civil servant to act as your guarantor . These guys would openly  hang out around the revenue department offering  their services.  Everyone knew about this and it was considered  standard  practice.

 

 

Edited September 25, 2023 by Denim