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Israel is at War - General discussion (pt3)

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Just now, ozimoron said:

 

Joe Biden does not want to be the man who stopped arming Israel, not least because that would leave the country vulnerable to the mighty arsenal of Hezbollah just across the northern border with Lebanon.

 

I can interpret that as I see fit. The purpose of that sentence is to assert the major reason is the threat from Hezbollah, otherwise it would have no point.

You said it was in the link, its not.

 

"The reason the US is reluctant to stop weapons transfer to Israel is the threat of Hezbollah, not support for Israel's bombing of Palestinians."

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7 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

You said it was in the link, its not.

 

"The reason the US is reluctant to stop weapons transfer to Israel is the threat of Hezbollah, not support for Israel's bombing of Palestinians."

 

As I said, that's my interpretation of what that sentence means. Without that interpretation the sentence would have no point. Read the sentence in the context of those around it.

 

 

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

As I said, that's my interpretation of what that sentence means. Without that interpretation the sentence would have no point.

Rubbish, again you said it was in the link, there is nothing there to indicate that in the link, highly misleading.

1 minute ago, Bkk Brian said:

Rubbish, again you said it was in the link, there is nothing there to indicate that in the link, highly misleading.

 

What then did the sentence really mean? Just a throw away and that both issues carried equal weight?

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

What then did the sentence really mean? Just a throw away and that both issues carried equal weight?

Its not up to me to answer your questions, its up to you to back up your claims in the article link.

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1 minute ago, Bkk Brian said:

Its not up to me to answer your questions, its up to you to back up your claims in the article link.

 

I answered your questions. You never answer questions with a direct answer as put to you. I'll not grace your objections further and just leave it to others to decide how they interpret that sentence. After all, my primary target for commenting is not you since the list of questions unanswered by you would require a forest to print.

Just now, ozimoron said:

 

I answered your questions. You never answer questions with a direct answer as put to you. I'll not grace your objections further and just leave it to others to decide how they interpret that sentence. After all, my primary target for commenting is not you since the list of questions unanswered by you would require a forest to print.

No you didn't, you deflected as usual and continue to do so when asked to back up your misleading claims

 

5 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Its not up to me to answer your questions, its up to you to back up your claims in the article link.

 

“There are good reasons why US law prohibits arms support for governments that block life-saving aid or violate international law with US weapons,” said Sarah Yager, Washington director at Human Rights Watch. “Given ongoing hostilities in Gaza, the Israeli government’s assurances to the Biden administration that it is meeting US legal requirements are not credible.” 

 

NSM-20 establishes that foreign security partners such as Israel submit assurances to the Departments of State and Defense that they are not arbitrarily blocking US humanitarian assistance and not violating international humanitarian law.

 

https://www.hrw.org/news/2024/03/19/israeli-assurances-use-us-arms-legally-are-not-credible

12 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Yes, there have been about five wars and numerous other individual attacks .

This war is called the 2 nd Yom kippur war , which succeeded the 1 st Yom Kippur war in 1973

Thanks for clarifying that. I, as you know, consider this conflict all the same "war," and each major episode, like Oct 7, is just another campaign of that war. To call each of these separate "wars," for me, just seems to ignore that they are all part of the same conflict. But I understand what you are saying, and you are right in that many of these, what I would call "campaigns," are called "wars" by the media.

Thanks again for your explanation.

Nearly 70 former U.S. officials, diplomats and military officers on Wednesday urged President Joe Biden to warn Israel of serious consequences if it denies civil rights and basic necessities to Palestinians and expands settlement activity in the occupied West Bank.

 

"The United States must be willing to take concrete action to oppose" such practices, the group said in an open letter to Biden, "including restrictions on provision of (U.S.) assistance (to Israel) consistent with U.S. law and policy."

 

Among the signatories were more than a dozen former ambassadors, as well as other retired State Department officials and former Pentagon, intelligence and White House officials, including Anthony Lake, a national security adviser to former President Bill Clinton.

 

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2024-03-20/dozens-of-former-u-s-officials-urge-biden-to-take-harder-line-with-israel

10 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

ooops aweful news, vetoed by Russia and China. 

 

U.S. Gaza ceasefire resolution vetoed by China, Russia at UN Security Council

Russia and China on Friday vetoed a U.S. draft UN Security Council resolution which called for an "immediate and sustained ceasefire" in Gaza along with "the release of all remaining hostages" held by Hamas.

Why it matters: This was the fourth time since the war began in October that the Security Council failed to agree on a resolution calling for a ceasefire. This time, the dispute was over the U.S. insistence on linking the ceasefire call to a hostage deal and condemnation of Hamas, rather than the unconditional ceasefire resolution demanded by Russia and China.

https://www.axios.com/2024/03/22/us-ceasefire-resolution-veto-un-security-council

 

Another huge let down for the hostages and families along with the ceasefire of course

And another one of your posts with which I agree - awful news... 

I can only point out which countries vetoed this: Russia and China. Why, I don't know, but anything they team up to do, especially if they are the only ones, is suspiciously deviant to me.

Was Isreal allowed a vote on this? If so, how did they vote?

Just now, WDSmart said:

And another one of your posts with which I agree - awful news... 

I can only point out which countries vetoed this: Russia and China. Why, I don't know, but anything they team up to do, especially if they are the only ones, is suspiciously deviant to me.

Was Isreal allowed a vote on this? If so, how did they vote?

 

This was a security council vote. I believe Israel is not currently on the security council. It would be a travesty if it was.

2 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

And another one of your posts with which I agree - awful news... 

I can only point out which countries vetoed this: Russia and China. Why, I don't know, but anything they team up to do, especially if they are the only ones, is suspiciously deviant to me.

Was Isreal allowed a vote on this? If so, how did they vote?

Was Israel allowed a vote on this? If so, how did they vote?

 

No not allowed

 

The UN Security Council

https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/un-security-council

7 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Was Israel allowed a vote on this? If so, how did they vote?

 

No not allowed

 

The UN Security Council

https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/un-security-council

 

The accused aren't normally allowed to sit on the jury.

 

edit: going to Starbucks Pattaya Beach for morning coffee to help sharpen my wit. Back soon for more, stay tuned. 🙂

8 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

The accused aren't normally allowed to sit on the jury.

Stop trolling, this is not a jury and they are not accused of anything in the UN vote. Its evident you treat this topic as sick entertainment

11 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Kushner pushing a genocide narrataive.

 

 

What's Kushner got to do with this? He's not got any official say, he's not part of the US gov.
 

 

Senator John Fetterman

 

"troops have killed hundreds of fighters [...] and also detained over 500 suspects, including 358 members" of Hamas & Islamic Jihad.

Standing with Israel

All Hamas can do is hide in hospitals or tunnels. There are only 2 paths to sustainable peace: surrender or be eliminated.

https://twitter.com/SenFettermanPA/status/1771182259296477505

2 minutes ago, coolcarer said:

What's Kushner got to do with this? He's not got any official say, he's not part of the US gov.
 

 

Senator John Fetterman

 

"troops have killed hundreds of fighters [...] and also detained over 500 suspects, including 358 members" of Hamas & Islamic Jihad.

Standing with Israel

All Hamas can do is hide in hospitals or tunnels. There are only 2 paths to sustainable peace: surrender or be eliminated.

https://twitter.com/SenFettermanPA/status/1771182259296477505

 

And killed 20,000 civilians in the process.

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

And killed 20,000 civilians in the process.

No Kushner did not………I asked what’s Kushner got to do with this 😉

Just now, coolcarer said:

No Kushner did not………I asked what’s Kushner got to do with this 😉

 

A public figure who was part of the previous administration advocating genocide is what Kushner has to do with this.

14 minutes ago, coolcarer said:

All Hamas can do is hide in hospitals or tunnels. There are only 2 paths to sustainable peace: surrender or be eliminated.

There may not ever be a path to a "sustainable" peace, but for a chance at that, here's what I believe has to be done, and in this order:
1 - a permanent (I guess the term is now "sustained") ceasefire, preferably enforced by some armed, on-site, peacekeeping force;
2 - an exchange of hostages/prisoners;

3 - forced negotiations started on a two-state solution.

Of course, Fetterman, and probably a few on this forum, would not require all of these conditions...

Netanyahu remains intransigent and advocates further genocide by "evacuating" Rafah civilians. And prevents Palestinians from conducting annual religious rituals.

 

 

3 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

There may not ever be a path to a "sustainable" peace, but for a chance at that, here's what I believe has to be done, and in this order:
1 - a permanent (I guess the term is now "sustained") ceasefire, preferably enforced by some armed, on-site, peacekeeping force;
2 - an exchange of hostages/prisoners;

3 - forced negotiations started on a two-state solution.

Of course, Fetterman, and probably a few on this forum, would not require all of these conditions...

I have read what you believe before. 

Just now, coolcarer said:

I have read what you believe before. 

Yes it was crock then just as it is now.

1 minute ago, Wobblybob said:
3 minutes ago, coolcarer said:

I have read what you believe before. 

Yes it was crock then just as it is now.

Yes, I know you think that, but the crock is now simmering. Soon it will be ready to serve, and when it does, you'll see the proposal, and hopefully agreement, on the plate is very similar to what I've been suggesting. 

16 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

A public figure who was part of the previous administration advocating genocide is what Kushner has to do with this.

Nah, that’s your take, not his.

 

It's a little bit of an unfortunate situation there, but I think from Israel's perspective, I would do my best to move the people out and then clean it up,” Kushner added. “But I don't think that Israel has stated that they don't want the people to move back there afterwards.”

5 minutes ago, WDSmart said:

Yes, I know you think that, but the crock is now simmering. Soon it will be ready to serve, and when it does, you'll see the proposal, and hopefully agreement, on the plate is very similar to what I've been suggesting. 

Dream on Boutros Boutros Ghali wannabe. Who is going to protect the peacekeeping force, they are more of a hindrance than help!

6 minutes ago, coolcarer said:

Nah, that’s your take, not his.

 

It's a little bit of an unfortunate situation there, but I think from Israel's perspective, I would do my best to move the people out and then clean it up,” Kushner added. “But I don't think that Israel has stated that they don't want the people to move back there afterwards.”

 

"Moving the people out" is displacement of a civilian population in whole or in part. That's does constitute genocide and ethnic cleansing.

 

 

1 minute ago, ozimoron said:

 

"Moving the people out" is displacement of a civilian population in whole or in part. That's does constitute genocide.

 

Where is the claim he does not want them to return after it’s been rebuilt?

1 minute ago, coolcarer said:

Where is the claim he does not want them to return after it’s been rebuilt?

 

Irrelevant. You can choose to believe he doesn't mean Gaza should be repopulated by Israeli property developers if you wish. I choose not to. The initial displacement is illegal under international law.

 

2 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Irrelevant.

Highly relevant, show me where it would still be genocide if you intend them to move back after it has been rebuilt or the war is over

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