5 forest fires in Hmong territory last night

[NorthernRyland]

Last night I'm rode out to my house in Samoeng (the 226 number sitting alone on the east of the map) and I counted no less than 5 forest fires and multiple smaller fire in various places. I can't prove it but this seems coordinated. My guess is that they started burning in anticipation of the summer storm that was supposed to come on the 3rd-5th.

 

This is why the air is so horrible today, stupid selfish people. I mostly blame the Hmong people but there's probably others involved too. So it doesn't matter how much the city of Chiang Mai does to reduce pollution because all it takes is a handful of these bleeps to start fires and the whole city will be wrecked.

 

 

 

[at15]

Ya I was shocked we have numbers this high in May

[NorthernRyland]

8 minutes ago, at15 said:

Ya I was shocked we have numbers this high in May

We're screwed they're going to keep burning and won't stop until the rains. 

[KhunLA]

No way could I ever live there.   Udon Thani was bad enough, and at worst, was just 100-150 AQI range.  Here/PKK, and only a couple months, if that, hit's or breaks 100 AQI.

[Chetzee]

When you're dealt a crap hand  , with no access to citizenship and education , you're gonna do what you can to survive ....    40 years ago those Hmong and others were growing Opium as a cash crop .... I don't remember any fires back then  ..... 

 When the Gov grew tired of being pressured by the USA about their Heroin epidemic in the 80's , they put their foot down and set out to clean up the hills . I remember one project where the Gov encouraged some Black Lahu to grow Ginger as an alternative ... it was a huge success and big payday for the village ...... But it caught the attention of Thai farmers further down the valley .... and in a year or two all and sundry were growing it ...... the price collapsed and the Lahu where again impoverished ...

  As I understand it a lot of the Hill burning is clearing so as to be able to access wild mushrooms when the rains start ..... one cash crop that still exists for these marginalised communities ...

 

   Other than that , some fires are started by arsonists ..... who  need locking up !

Others the result of growing Maize .. which is the devils crop all over the world and should be banned in my opinion .  

[at15]

2 hours ago, KhunLA said:

No way could I ever live there.   Udon Thani was bad enough, and at worst, was just 100-150 AQI range.  Here/PKK, and only a couple months, if that, hit's or breaks 100 AQI.

100 AQI your still gonna be at a terrible pm2.5 value like 40µg/m³.

You really need keep your pm2.5 level under 10µg/m³ yearly average for minimal health risk.

Udon thani yearly average is 23.4 µg/m³, still very high but better than Chiang mai at 32.3 μg/m³.

 

Cardiovascular health is the major problem, especially for males, heart disease and erectile dysfunction much higher with pm2.5 pollution.

 

 

[KhunLA]

I think they are doing the same here, getting in as much burning as they can.  Hills in the distance are a blur, and AQI is in the 70s

 

About a month or so ago, I thought it was all over, as a week of AQI 25-50.  We even waited for a non windy day to burn all our saved up trash, and all of 1 wheel barrel full 

 

Lite rain in the forecast next week, 50% chance, but I doubt it.  Amphur could use some water though, and it's a trickle coming out of the faucet during the day.   Seems to be restricted from 0900 - 1800 hrs.  Had to use the water tanks the past couple days, during the day.

[Nick Carter icp]

47 minutes ago, Chetzee said:

When you're dealt a crap hand  , with no access to citizenship and education , you're gonna do what you can to survive ....    40 years ago those Hmong and others were growing Opium as a cash crop .... I don't remember any fires back then  ..... 

 When the Gov grew tired of being pressured by the USA about their Heroin epidemic in the 80's , they put their foot down and set out to clean up the hills . I remember one project where the Gov encouraged some Black Lahu to grow Ginger as an alternative ... it was a huge success and big payday for the village ...... But it caught the attention of Thai farmers further down the valley .... and in a year or two all and sundry were growing it ...... the price collapsed and the Lahu where again impoverished ...

  As I understand it a lot of the Hill burning is clearing so as to be able to access wild mushrooms when the rains start ..... one cash crop that still exists for these marginalised communities ...

 

   Other than that , some fires are started by arsonists ..... who  need locking up !

Others the result of growing Maize .. which is the devils crop all over the world and should be banned in my opinion .  

 

   Haven't many of those hill tribers been given Thai citizenship , or in the process of gaining citizenship ?

[KhunLA]

20 minutes ago, at15 said:

100 AQI your still gonna be at a terrible pm2.5 value like 40µg/m³.

You really need keep your pm2.5 level under 10µg/m³ yearly average for minimal health risk.

Udon thani yearly average is 23.4 µg/m³, still very high but better than Chiang mai at 32.3 μg/m³.

 

Cardiovascular health is the major problem, especially for males, heart disease and erectile dysfunction much higher with pm2.5 pollution.

 

 

Agree, and that why we have air purifiers.   Keeps it in low single digits, if not -0-.

 

Now, AQI 49 & PM2.5 @ 19 or ~4X healthy.

[NorthernRyland]

4 hours ago, Chetzee said:

   Other than that , some fires are started by arsonists ..... who  need locking up !

Others the result of growing Maize .. which is the devils crop all over the world and should be banned in my opinion .  

They're just foraging I think. Burning crops is one thing which they and everyone else does but it's the burning of entire forests which is so horrible. I haven't seen a crop fire in months but there are constant forest fires for the last 2 months. I bring this up because I don't hear enough people talking about it and it's the major factor as far as I can tell. Government should be keeping a close eye on them but I don't see that happening.

[NorthernRyland]

3 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

Haven't many of those hill tribers been given Thai citizenship , or in the process of gaining citizenship ?

They have some form of ID which they can use. They don't seem to build anything themselves so the public hospital in Samoeng are packed with hmong because they get free health care same as Thais. My wife was complaining the public hospital in Sansai (mae jo) was full of Hmong also when she went last week. I think they get full access to public schools too.

[Nick Carter icp]

9 minutes ago, NorthernRyland said:

They have some form of ID which they can use. They don't seem to build anything themselves so the public hospital in Samoeng are packed with hmong because they get free health care same as Thais. My wife was complaining the public hospital in Sansai (mae jo) was full of Hmong also when she went last week. I think they get full access to public schools too.

 

   You make them sound like they are a different species .

The Thai Government is trying to get them all legal Thai citizens within a few years 

They are legally required to send their kids to school , it isn't optional 

[NorthernRyland]

2 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   You make them sound like they are a different species .

The Thai Government is trying to get them all legal Thai citizens within a few years 

They are legally required to send their kids to school , it isn't optional 

 

They're basically foreigners like we are and there's tension between them and the Thais even. Thailand have done basically all then can and try to integrate them with public schools and healthcare. I bet they resent getting required by law to attend Thai schools. I know Canada and US did this too and they resented them for it later. 

[NorthernRyland]

7 hours ago, Chetzee said:

When you're dealt a crap hand  , with no access to citizenship and education , you're gonna do what you can to survive ....

Thailand basically encroached upon them and they're in a much better situation now than they were before so no they didn't get dealt a crap hand. Long before they ever saw a Thai person they were living like that. Now they get access to schools, hospitals,  and roads into cities where they can sell their crops and buy imports from all the world.

[Nick Carter icp]

3 minutes ago, NorthernRyland said:

Thailand basically encroached upon them and they're in a much better situation now than they were before so no they didn't get dealt a crap hand. Long before they ever saw a Thai person they were living like that. Now they get access to schools, hospitals,  and roads into cities where they can sell their crops and buy imports from all the world.

 

   They have more right to live on the land than you do .

[NorthernRyland]

Just now, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   They have more right to live on the land than you do .

true but they're still another ethnic group with different language and they live apart from the Thai people which is why I say that. The government even gives them full control over their mountain top villages which is something they wouldn't let anyone else including Thai people do.

[Chetzee]

4 hours ago, NorthernRyland said:

Thailand basically encroached upon them and they're in a much better situation now than they were before so no they didn't get dealt a crap hand. Long before they ever saw a Thai person they were living like that. Now they get access to schools, hospitals,  and roads into cities where they can sell their crops and buy imports from all the world.

I think you'll find the for the most part they are Sino Tibetan in origin , and that most in Thailand have migrated from Yunnan , some via Kachin State over a period of 200 years .... they were not there before Thai or Lanna culture . The have camped in the forest where they could scratch a living ..  generally in the upper less productive levels ..... even amongst the hill tribes there is a hierarchy... with Akha and Black Lahu the poorest having to survive on the tops of hills . They were dealt a crap hand , lack of land and the search for it ,has meant they have had to migrate to lands where until recently they have had no status ....... I'm sorry your wife had issues at the hospital .... maybe go private ....  just a thought !

[motdaeng]

18 hours ago, at15 said:

Udon thani yearly average is 23.4 µg/m³, still very high but better than Chiang mai at 32.3 μg/m³.

 

where do you get this numbers / data (yearly average is 23.4 µg/m³) ?

thank you!

 

 

[NorthernRyland]

13 hours ago, Chetzee said:

I think you'll find the for the most part they are Sino Tibetan in origin , and that most in Thailand have migrated from Yunnan , some via Kachin State over a period of 200 years .... they were not there before Thai or Lanna culture . The have camped in the forest where they could scratch a living ..  generally in the upper less productive levels ..... even amongst the hill tribes there is a hierarchy... with Akha and Black Lahu the poorest having to survive on the tops of hills . They were dealt a crap hand , lack of land and the search for it ,has meant they have had to migrate to lands where until recently they have had no status ....... I'm sorry your wife had issues at the hospital .... maybe go private ....  just a thought !

the Thai were there before them? In Chiang Mai the Hmong occupy all the mountain tops and I assume have been back there all the way up through Burma into China long before Thailand annexed any of that. Even to this day the Thai presence is very minimal on all the mountain regions in the west. There's Thai/Burmese people but even they are a different group from Thais.

[herfiehandbag]

On 5/4/2024 at 1:13 PM, at15 said:

Cardiovascular health is the major problem, especially for males, heart disease and erectile dysfunction much higher with pm2.5 pollution.

Could be the way forward, convince the " burners" that if they set fires their willys will stop working!

[Chetzee]

4 hours ago, NorthernRyland said:

the Thai were there before them? In Chiang Mai the Hmong occupy all the mountain tops and I assume have been back there all the way up through Burma into China long before Thailand annexed any of that. Even to this day the Thai presence is very minimal on all the mountain regions in the west. There's Thai/Burmese people but even they are a different group from Thais.

you

 

4 hours ago, NorthernRyland said:

the Thai were there before them? In Chiang Mai the Hmong occupy all the mountain tops and I assume have been back there all the way up through Burma into China long before Thailand annexed any of that. Even to this day the Thai presence is very minimal on all the mountain regions in the west. There's Thai/Burmese people but even they are a different group from Thais.

you might wanna check your history ........ And just why do you think the occupy mountain tops ? because they were not welcome further down .    West of CNX was the domaine of Tai Yai people my first wife was one ..... Same people as Shan state 

[motdaeng]

On 5/4/2024 at 1:13 PM, at15 said:

Udon thani yearly average is 23.4 µg/m³, still very high but better than Chiang mai at 32.3 μg/m³.

 

@at15 

 

where do you get this numbers / data from ? (yearly average pm2.5 µg/m³)  

 

[at15]

iqair.com

 

from 2019....

chiang rai 37.0

chiang mai 32.3
udon thani 23.4
bangkok 22.8

hua hin 21.0
pattaya 20.9

surat thani 16.6
phuket 11.4