British Pensioner Struggles with Frozen Pension in Thailand

[Wrwest]

2 hours ago, freeworld said:

Sorry sounds harsh but while one sympathises and that they could return to the UK where the govt should take care of them at that age the conditions they are in are solely of their choice.

 

The govt is one thing but one has a personal responsibility to also make private financial arrangements for health and retirement and has a choice to not have ventured to Thailand to reside without considering longetivity and future health and financial requirements.

 

2 hours ago, freeworld said:

Sorry sounds harsh but while one sympathises and that they could return to the UK where the govt should take care of them at that age the conditions they are in are solely of their choice.

 

The govt is one thing but one has a personal responsibility to also make private financial arrangements for health and retirement and has a choice to not have ventured to Thailand to reside without considering longetivity and future health and financial requirements.

I recognize this is for Brits to deal with as I am a Yank. I would point out that, while I am in Thailand at my own volition, I cannot afford to be retired in the USA. OK, at least with a working middle class level, whereas I can here in Thailand. I am thinking there are many others, including Brits in the same boat, unable to afford costs in there homeland.

[shortstop2]

Just now, Georgealbert said:

Pensions became payable anywhere in the world, but without uprating

 

Seems to me, the big issue is not the lack of uprating but the inability to use the NHS.   Yank's equivalent of uprating is Social Security's Cost of Living Adjustment (COLA) for which we are eligible no matter where we live.  

 

But our inability to use Medicare (which we paid into all our lives) anywhere in the world except in the USA is problematic.  

 

 

 

[shortstop2]

Just now, Georgealbert said:

Pensions became payable anywhere in the world, but without uprating

 

Seems to me, the big issue is not the lack of uprating but the inability to use the NHS.   Yank's equivalent of uprating is Social Security's Cost of Living Adjustment (COLA) for which we are eligible no matter where we live.  

 

But our inability to use Medicare (which we paid into all our lives) anywhere in the world except in the USA is problematic.  

 

 

 

[BusyB]

2 hours ago, freeworld said:

Sorry sounds harsh but while one sympathises and that they could return to the UK where the govt should take care of them at that age the conditions they are in are solely of their choice.

 

The govt is one thing but one has a personal responsibility to also make private financial arrangements for health and retirement and has a choice to not have ventured to Thailand to reside without considering longetivity and future health and financial requirements.

 

Yes. Much as I can feel. for her, fact is this policy has been in place since well before her move. It should have been one of her considerations when making it. Sadly noone is perfect and can fall foul of themselves and their own careless or wishful thinking.

 

It also highlights the "I'll self insure and make it back to Blighty for any serious ailments" fallacy. Sometimes you just can't fly. Especially where accidents are involved.

[Blueman1]

5 minutes ago, ronster said:

I doubt she would get much in the UK after being away so long .

I returned during COVID and tried to claim disability benefits as I can't work due to my disabilities. Was told I couldn't get anything from any place I applied as I would need be in the country 2 years before being able to claim .

Is her son allowed to run a car rental business ? Thought a bunch of Russians got arrested last month for that 😀

I returned during COVID and tried to claim disability benefits as I can't work due to my disabilities. Was told I couldn't get anything from any place I applied as I would need be in the country 2 years before being able to claim . I Think You'll Find it's 180 Days in Any TAX Year Apri l6th to April 5th.......Plus I doubt she would get much in the UK after being away so long . She WOULD They have to SUPPORT Her...

[transam]

6 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

There is no reason, or you don't want to see the obvious reason?

a) If she spends the money in the UK then this is part of the UK economy.

b) If she spends money in Thailand the money is lost for the UK.

Why should the UK government support b)?

 

 

Wrong, we can all move to any country that has a reciprical agreement with the UK Gov. and spend our pension there...

 

There is a list, which YOU can look up, places like the Philippines, USA, Europe.

 

But sadly we cannot go to places which has historical links to the UK, like, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, now isn't that strange........... 

[Wrwest]

2 hours ago, freeworld said:

Sorry sounds harsh but while one sympathises and that they could return to the UK where the govt should take care of them at that age the conditions they are in are solely of their choice.

 

The govt is one thing but one has a personal responsibility to also make private financial arrangements for health and retirement and has a choice to not have ventured to Thailand to reside without considering longetivity and future health and financial requirements.

 

2 hours ago, freeworld said:

Sorry sounds harsh but while one sympathises and that they could return to the UK where the govt should take care of them at that age the conditions they are in are solely of their choice.

 

The govt is one thing but one has a personal responsibility to also make private financial arrangements for health and retirement and has a choice to not have ventured to Thailand to reside without considering longetivity and future health and financial requirements.

I recognize this is for Brits to deal with as I am a Yank. I would point out that, while I am in Thailand at my own volition, I cannot afford to be retired in the USA. OK, at least with a working middle class level, whereas I can here in Thailand. I am thinking there are many others, including Brits in the same boat, unable to afford costs in there homeland.

 

29 minutes ago, Georgealbert said:

Yes it is not fair, but being realistic it is not going to change, however many online petitions or stories like this appear.

 

The UK pension is a 100 years old next year, here is the history of why it remains frozen in Thailand.

 

1925 - Pension introduced and only payable in Great Britain, Northern Ireland and Isle Of Man.

 

1929 - The Contributory Pension Act, which allowed pensions to be paid in HM’s Dominions (as a means of encouraging emigration to countries of the ‘British Empire’).

 

1946 - The National Insurance Act and Regulations, provide that the pension was typically not paid abroad, except it was payable for pensioners in HM Dominions, or when an absence abroad didn’t exceed 12 months.

 

1948 - The first pension increase was from 10 shillings to 26 shillings per week.  This significant increase was not paid abroad because the pensioners concerned were deemed not to have made sufficient contribution to the new insurance scheme.

 

1948 to 1981 - First reciprocal agreements with France, Italy, Switzerland, the Netherlands and Luxembourg provided for uprating. There was a special arrangement for UK pensioners living in Ireland to also receive the state pension, but they didn’t receive the uprating until 1966. Later UK negotiated reciprocal agreements with 30 countries which allowed for uprating  (Barbados; Bermuda; Bosnia-Herzegovina; Croatia; Guernsey; Isle of Man; Israel; Jamaica; Jersey; Mauritius; Montenegro; the Philippines; Serbia; Turkey; the United States of America; and, the former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia plus all EU countries)

 

1955 - Pensions became payable anywhere in the world, but without uprating, without a reciprocal agreement.

 

So in 99 years of the pension, there has never been any uprating in Thailand, and before 1955 there would be nothing paid.

 

 

Thank you for providing the history.

[Blueman1]

8 minutes ago, Homburg said:

Much of the pension money paid by UK government to pensioners resident in the UK is recovered through taxes paid by the pensioners in the UK.  These taxes are recovered through a variety of means - Council Tax, VAT, fuel taxes, IPT, taxes on the businesses that pensioners buy from (including supermarkets), etc.  These taxes cannot be recovered for non-resident pensioners who therefore cost the government more than resident pensioners, so the government "freezes" these pensions in order to compensate.

YOU Are Talking Bo**ocks M8.....Where were The SUPERmarkets 70 Years Ago....??

[Peterphuket]

Isn't that a crime against humanity what GB is doing.
After all, no human being can stay alive these days from that amount paid out.
Ultimately, she is and remains a British citizen, I am not a lawyer but it is food for thought for an expert in this.

[roo860]

9 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

If she can't fly maybe there is a ship to the UK.

No problem if it takes a little longer.

Absolutely, there's a dinghies leaving France 3 times a day, welcome aboard madam 🙃

[crazykopite]

Even if she lived in the UK she would struggle as she is on the old pension she would get £169 per week along with some other benefits my pension is also frozen I get £525 per month thankfully my military pension helps but that doesn’t stop HMRC from deducting some £50 per week in tax even though I have lived in the Kingdom for 19 years but having said that it’s a small price to pay where I can walk the streets without fear of being murdered by some yob !I don’t think this woman would have a better life if she was able to return to the UK 

[Kinok Farang]

I wonder what the government is spending our contributions on?

i thought the country was thriving.All the hotels seem to be full.

[crazykopite]

2 hours ago, freeworld said:

A lesson to all the digital nomads roaming about the world living in the present and not worrying about the future and retirement money and benefits.

If they have any sense they have invested part of there money in a private property or better still property 

[itsari]

59 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

Which is a lot more than most Thais get from their government.

Son must be useless.

800 baht a month many Thai pensioners live on.

[Blueman1]

12 minutes ago, BusyB said:

 

Yes. Much as I can feel. for her, fact is this policy has been in place since well before her move. It should have been one of her considerations when making it. Sadly noone is perfect and can fall foul of themselves and their own careless or wishful thinking.

 

It also highlights the "I'll self insure and make it back to Blighty for any serious ailments" fallacy. Sometimes you just can't fly. Especially where accidents are involved.

 

Yes. Much as I can feel. for her, fact is this policy has been in place since well before her move....But WE Weren't Even TOLD Our Pensions would be Frozen, Well at least I Wasn't 9 Years Ago.....And NOW I'm in the same boat as Her....

Edited June 1 by Blueman1

[Sheryl]

3 minutes ago, crazykopite said:

Even if she lived in the UK she would struggle as she is on the old pension she would get £169 per week along with some other benefits my pension is also frozen I get £525 per month thankfully my military pension helps but that doesn’t stop HMRC from deducting some £50 per week in tax even though I have lived in the Kingdom for 19 years but having said that it’s a small price to pay where I can walk the streets without fear of being murdered by some yob !I don’t think this woman would have a better life if she was able to return to the UK 

She would have access to free health care. 

 

Health care costs ars a big part of her current problem. 

[OneMoreFarang]

3 minutes ago, transam said:

Wrong, we can all move to any country that has a reciprical agreement with the UK Gov. and spend our pension there...

 

There is a list, which YOU can look up, places like the Philippines, USA, Europe.

 

But sadly we cannot go to places which has historical links to the UK, like, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, now isn't that strange........... 

What do you mean, you cannot go to Australia, New Zealand, Canada, etc. ? 

[transam]

1 hour ago, MalcolmB said:

Which is a lot more than most Thais get from their government.

Son must be useless.

Really, Rob............

[Blueman1]

4 minutes ago, Peterphuket said:

Isn't that a crime against humanity what GB is doing.
After all, no human being can stay alive these days from that amount paid out.
Ultimately, she is and remains a British citizen, I am not a lawyer but it is food for thought for an expert in this.

Try & Get any Lawyer to fight The Goverment.....Immpossible !!

[Roo Island]

Should have stayed at home and gotten government assistance. Terrible decision to move to Thailand.

[Blueman1]

5 minutes ago, Kinok Farang said:

I wonder what the government is spending our contributions on?

i thought the country was thriving.All the hotels seem to be full.

All the hotels seem to be full....Yes Of People that have NOT even Paid into the System....( YOU Know Who I Mean )

[ronster]

10 minutes ago, Blueman1 said:

I returned during COVID and tried to claim disability benefits as I can't work due to my disabilities. Was told I couldn't get anything from any place I applied as I would need be in the country 2 years before being able to claim . I Think You'll Find it's 180 Days in Any TAX Year Apri l6th to April 5th.......Plus I doubt she would get much in the UK after being away so long . She WOULD They have to SUPPORT Her...

Not if you have been out of the country continually for 3 years or more I was told by the DWP.

[bubblegum]

What visa is she holding?

[newbee2022]

This thread is like riding a dead horse.

It was "discussed" many times with all cons and pros concerning the govt decision. Migrating outside UK implements many advantages and disadvantages you should know before leaving UK.

Good, that this Lady got a family to support her. Good luck🙏

[Peterphuket]

3 minutes ago, Blueman1 said:

Try & Get any Lawyer to fight The Goverment.....Immpossible !!

Then again, you are right about that, this same rogue government can make unlimited use of lawyers paid for by taxpayers while you have to pay it yourself.

[Kinok Farang]

1 minute ago, Blueman1 said:

All the hotels seem to be full....Yes Of People that have NOT even Paid into the System....( YOU Know Who I Mean )

Can you be more specific please?

[moe666]

45 minutes ago, DaLa said:

Would it make more sense to lobby the Thai government to enter into a reciprocal social security agreement with the UK government. An increase in all those 'frozen' pensions would result in £ entering the country and ฿ in the economy. If the Philippines have the facility/legislation then it can't be rocket science for it to be introduced here.

Not Thailands problem. They have enough problems taking care of their own people.

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, Chris Daley said:

Put the man in prison for illegally owning a business.  Get the woman on the 90 days treadmill.

What is illegal about a foreigner owning a business here?

[roo860]

1 minute ago, bubblegum said:

What visa is she holding?

Non of your business. 

[prakhonchai nick]

5 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

She would have access to free health care. 

 

Health care costs ars a big part of her current problem. 

She would have to join the queue, for any serious treatment.  Immigrants and refugees seem to get priority these days