Uncertainty Surrounds Approval of Thailand's Submarine Deal

[webfact]

 

The future of Thailand's controversial submarine acquisition from China remains uncertain, as expressed by Defence Minister Suthin Khlangsang today.

 

The deal, heavily scrutinized both domestically and internationally, involves the purchase of a Yuan-class S26T submarine worth 12.4 billion baht (approximately £280 million).

 

Speaking in Bangkok, Minister Suthin highlighted that the cabinet's decision hinges on thorough legal reviews surrounding significant changes to the planned submarine specifications, including a switch in the engine model and an extended construction period.

 

The original contract stipulated a German-made engine, but revisions have proposed a substitution with a Chinese-made counterpart, coupled with a longer timeframe for delivering the vessel.

 

This pivotal decision rests with a legal team overseen by Prime Minister Srettha Thavisin and the Council of State. Emphasizing the government's cautious approach, Suthin explained that all legalities must be clearly resolved to ensure transparency and public confidence.

 

Naval officials, including the current navy chief, Adm. Adung Pan-iam, await the cabinet's verdict with bated breath, as retirement looms for some involved in the initial stages of the agreement.

 

The deal has its roots in the tenure of former Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha and former navy chief Ruechai Ruddit, who both pushed the purchase through just before their respective retirements in 2020.

 

To date, Thailand has paid approximately half of the total cost, with around 5.5 billion baht outstanding.

 

The acquisition, if finalized, would be Thailand’s first submarine procurement in over sixty years, marking a significant milestone in the country's naval modernization efforts. However, the myriad legal and procedural hurdles suggest that a final decision may still be some time away.

 

Picture courtesy: Khaosod

 

-- 2024-07-09

 

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[sammieuk1]

Prepare the oars the sub deal is sinking again 🤔

[stoner]

9 minutes ago, webfact said:

Speaking in Bangkok, Minister Suthin highlighted that the cabinet's decision hinges on thorough legal reviews surrounding significant changes to the planned submarine specifications, including a switch in the engine model and an extended construction period.

 

not mentioned were the upgraded brand new screen doors. the best.

[Tropicalevo]

China has failed to deliver on the contract.

Anywhere else and the contract would be void and monies returned.

China ignores international law.

[Presnock]

5 minutes ago, Tropicalevo said:

China has failed to deliver on the contract.

Anywhere else and the contract would be void and monies returned.

China ignores international law.

Of course they do, especially with a country like Thailand - just what kind of retaliation could Thailand do to scare off the Chinese?  

[steven100]

20 minutes ago, webfact said:

Suthin explained that all legalities must be clearly resolved.

 

Naval officials, including the current navy chief, Adm. Adung Pan-iam, await the cabinet's verdict with bated breath, as retirement looms for some involved in the initial stages of the agreement.

 

 

In other words,    we have to work out how much everyone's cutis of the 12.4 billion 

[steven100]

14 minutes ago, Tropicalevo said:

China has failed to deliver on the contract.

Anywhere else and the contract would be void and monies returned.

China ignores international law.

 

what did they expect ...   an honest China who will abide by the contract  

[lom]

This sub needs more grease.

[JoePai]

You pay peanuts and this is the result

[edwinchester]

The farce that just keeps on running, now into it's eighth year of hilarious entertainment.

[J Branche]

No Thai knows how to operate a Submarine.  No idea but guessing quality of underwater mapping for structures and objects is pretty dated. Then you are at the mercy of company that foreign government can restrict from exporting parts.  

 

This is right up there with the buying new VIP aircraft story.

[hotchilli]

4 hours ago, Presnock said:

Of course they do, especially with a country like Thailand - just what kind of retaliation could Thailand do to scare off the Chinese?  

Re-introduce visa approvals before entry?

[Karma80]

I think you just multipurpose the headline - Uncertainty surrounds Everything TIT.

[spidermike007]

My question is this. If the extremely toxic and dangerously timid army were unwilling to take any risks whatsoever, with regard to Covid, why are they spending 22 billion baht now on submarines? Obviously there is some risk in operating subs, and even more risk if as they say, they are purposed to protect against terrorist threats and any threat in the South China Sea. The real budget is more like 13 billion baht for the first 

S26T Yuan Class sub, and the real cost for the subsequent two? 

 

The Brits would not make this up and denial is the M.O. of the CCP. The Chinese ships and subs are likely poorly made. Thankfully the Chinese navy is incapable of traveling more than 1,500 km., in ideal conditions. Likely more like 600 km. in war conditions. And they have very few deep sea ports. Their navy is a threat only to their smaller neighbors. 

 

Thai naval forces have not operated submarines for over 60 years now, while neighboring countries, particularly those with a major dispute at sea with Thailand, such as Vietnam, are all equipped with modern submarines. 

 

Looks like they are willing to take a huge risk with the treasury. Why were they so timid with Covid? Because:

 

This government is a whirlpool of conflicting loyalties and interests. It's leader has to manage those interests, and effectively buy the loyalties of the various parts of the armed forces. The submarines are the price he has to pay for the navy supporting him. They will end up unusable and unaffordable, as did the aircraft carrier. There is no strategic justification for the submarines. There is really no military threat to Thailand, none of the countries with which it shares a land border have the capacity for anything other than the occasional cross border firefight. If you look carefully at all the military procurement of recent years, they are all to support ambitions, and thus buy the support of the various rival groups within the armed forces. They simply do not add up to any sort of a coherent modernisation or re-equipment of what remains a largely obsolete, immobile and under trained force, able only to undertake the most mundane of garrison duties, whilst it's bloated leadership occupies itself with playing politics or their own largely unregulated business ventures.

 

The government however (or more realistically those to whom it reports) must rely upon the military to keep it in power. It was put into power for one core function; to prevent the nascent political, social and economic liberalisation of Thai society which arose with the arrival of new technologies and communications, which have allowed a (younger) population which has long been kept ill educated and dependent for any advancement on its elders and sponsors, to communicate, educate themselves and develop business independent of those elders and sponsors. The Covid crisis was in a dimension beyond that, and it's timid, chaotic "rabbit in the headlights" response to the challenges it brought were simply because it did not know how to react, other than to use some of the opportunities to exercise power, in pursuit of that core function, which the social and political restrictions they argue the disease has necessitated, and granted them.

 

[BarraMarra]

Well lets be honest if you pay 280 million for one of these as opposed to a British Built Astute Class Submarine costing well over a Billion pounds what do you expect.

[john donson]

exchange for vip helicopters and planes for the elite?

[ignore it]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

To date, Thailand has paid approximately half of the total cost, with around 5.5 billion baht outstanding.

 

Ferengi Rules of Acquisition.  

#1. Once you have their money...you never give it back.

 

 

[Tailwagsdog]

Bangladesh bought Chinese subs & they leak like sieves ....go to China Observer - Leaking Warships on You tube

[Srikcir]

55 minutes ago, ignore it said:

 

Ferengi Rules of Acquisition.  

#1. Once you have their money...you never give it back.

 

 

Once you execute a purchase contract that requires a down payment and annual payments that cannot be stopped by parliament, you can't negotiate any other terms nor substitute the product, ie., for frigates, unless the product proves to be defective. Especially with China if you want it to continue to allow tens of millions Chinese tourists into Thailand.

Thailand needs to question just how vital it's economic and security agreements are with China.

[Burma Bill]

8 hours ago, edwinchester said:

The farce that just keeps on running, now into it's eighth year of hilarious entertainment.

 Yes indeed. Just like the HST from China to Bangkok- light years away!

Edited July 9 by Burma Bill
additional information

[cowellandrew]

Thailand should just follow Ukraines sub deal just ask the west to supply them for free,

Ukraines lates shopping list from the UK

[NedR69]

On 7/9/2024 at 8:52 AM, Presnock said:

- just what kind of retaliation could Thailand do to scare off the Chinese?  

Maybe charge them for a visa and no more free entry.  

[connda]

Come on - get the sub!  I want to see how long it takes for ya'll to take it to the bottom of the ocean permanently.  I expect not too long.

[cowellandrew]

7 hours ago, connda said:

Come on - get the sub!  I want to see how long it takes for ya'll to take it to the bottom of the ocean permanently.  I expect not too long.

It's ok going down, its coming back up

😁😁😳😳