China warns ,don’t appease trump

[MicroB]

1 hour ago, thesetat said:

I do not see Australians volunteering their tax money and divvying out trillions to pay for their war. 

 

They are.

 

https://www.pmc.gov.au/resources/australian-government-response-to-inquiry-into-support-for-ukraine/introduction

 

No one is "divvying out trillions".

 

 

[Bannoi]

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

You don't think the US will be the only ones to slap tariffs on China? The EU have already done so. So have Turkey, Brazil, Indonesia and many others. The Asean countries are worried sick that now that the US has closed its doors there will be an avalanche of cheap Chinese products coming their way. Destroying more of their indigenous industries, the way Chinese dumping has already done in the past. You don't think they will put their own tariffs in place?

The EU did put tariffs on China mainly electric cars  45% however thanks to that brilliant multi-bankrupt businessman in the White House the EU and China will look into setting minimum prices on electric vehicles. 

 

Negotiations set to start immediately.

 

The US is being frozen out. The EU and China are getting closer.

 

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/eu-china-start-talks-lifting-eu-tariffs-chinese-electric-vehicles-handelsblatt-2025-04-10/

 

[thesetat]

5 hours ago, MicroB said:

 

They are.

 

https://www.pmc.gov.au/resources/australian-government-response-to-inquiry-into-support-for-ukraine/introduction

 

No one is "divvying out trillions".

 

 

How can you even use this to compare.. 1.6 billion compared to the 66.9 billion the us has put out already in money and supplies

[MicroB]

7 minutes ago, thesetat said:

How can you even use this to compare.. 1.6 billion compared to the 66.9 billion the us has put out already in money and supplies

 

I'm not comparing. You are.

 

You said the Australian taxpayer wasn't contributing anything, and the US was putting in trillions. On both counts you are incorrect. Go back to your beer, grandad. Happily you have googled and found the US President has been lying.

[thesetat]

8 hours ago, placeholder said:

Deflecting much? Australia runs a deficit with the USA and Trump is imposing tariffs on them anyway. Not a way to win allies.

Not deflecting.., I was being a smartass.. 

 

7 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

Yes, that's what Chinese are known for the world over. Sticklers for rules they are. Put the Swiss to shame.

I would not be so sure about that. They are forced to comply. In every city on every street there are dozens of cameras watching what people are doing. They have the most advanced facial recognition and control systems and if you commit a crime you are sure to get caught. But minor crimes like doing drugs and prostitution are done without fear or worry. There is also a lot of corruption within the ranks to buy your way out of trouble if it is not serious. 

Then you have to remember that almost 8% of the people are in the CCP. 

The punishments are severe as well for breaking laws. Winning in courts over technicalities are rare. 

[thesetat]

1 minute ago, MicroB said:

 

I'm not comparing. You are.

 

You said the Australian taxpayer wasn't contributing anything, and the US was putting in trillions. On both counts you are incorrect. Go back to your beer, grandad. Happily you have googled and found the US President has been lying.

not lying. just my exaggeration to make a point you failed to see..

[Lacessit]

35 minutes ago, thesetat said:

How can you even use this to compare.. 1.6 billion compared to the 66.9 billion the us has put out already in money and supplies

Australian population 27 million. US population 330 million. Go back to basic arithmetic school.

 

Most of what America has supplied is obsolete inventory which was going to be scrapped.

[Lacessit]

27 minutes ago, thesetat said:

not lying. just my exaggeration to make a point you failed to see..

Admit it, you lied.

[blaze master]

56 minutes ago, thesetat said:

How can you even use this to compare.. 1.6 billion compared to the 66.9 billion the us has put out already in money and supplies

 

You said trillions though.

[placeholder]

7 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

You don't think the US will be the only ones to slap tariffs on China? The EU have already done so. So have Turkey, Brazil, Indonesia and many others. The Asean countries are worried sick that now that the US has closed its doors there will be an avalanche of cheap Chinese products coming their way. Destroying more of their indigenous industries, the way Chinese dumping has already done in the past. You don't think they will put their own tariffs in place?

Really? These are targeted tariffs. Not broad universal tariffs like the ones Trump is proposing. These countries also send a lot of stuff to China. Yes, they have good reason to be afraid of an increase in Chinese exports. But they also have a good reason to fear American import restrictions. Trump isn't doing a brilliant job of persuading these countries to support the USA. There is no indication that they will follow Trump's model.

[Ben Zioner]

China is right, should be obvious. No ties with the US until they get a decent government.

[Cameroni]

5 hours ago, Bannoi said:

The US is being frozen out.

 

Indonesia has pledged to increase its imports from the United States by up to US$19 billion, including US$10 billion in energy purchases and make other trade concessions, as part of a broader strategy to stave off looming tariffs from Washington.

 

 

https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/economics/article/3307096/move-avert-trumps-tariff-indonesia-raise-us-imports-us19-billion

 

Doesn't look like the USA is "frozen out". Looks like countries are desperate to trade with the US and falling overthemselves to offer trade concessions to the US.

 

Clearly Trump's tariff strategy is working and enabling the US to secure better conditions from a whole list of countries. Far from being "frozen out" countries are falling over themselves to offer improved and more favourable trading conditions to the US. I wonder why that is. Trump's tariffs maybe, what do you think?

 

https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/economics/article/3307096/move-avert-trumps-tariff-indonesia-raise-us-imports-us19-billion

 

 

[Cameroni]

1 hour ago, placeholder said:

Really? These are targeted tariffs. Not broad universal tariffs like the ones Trump is proposing. These countries also send a lot of stuff to China. Yes, they have good reason to be afraid of an increase in Chinese exports. But they also have a good reason to fear American import restrictions. Trump isn't doing a brilliant job of persuading these countries to support the USA. There is no indication that they will follow Trump's model.

 

Target tariffs you say?

 

 

"Indonesia Announces Hefty Tariffs on Chinese-made Goods

 

The country’s small businesses could “collapse” under a flood of low-cost Chinese goods, the country’s trade minister said.

 

On Friday, a senior Indonesian official announced that the country would impose an import tariff of up to 200 percent on a range of Chinese goods, in order to protect the country’s micro, small, and medium enterprises (MSMEs).

 

“The United States can impose a 200-percent tariff on imported ceramics or clothes; we can do it as well to ensure our MSMEs and industries will survive and thrive,” he said, the Antara news agency reported.

 

Reuters paraphrased Zulfikli by saying that the tariffs would range between 100 and 200 percent and that they “could affect imports of footwear, clothing, textiles, cosmetics and ceramics.” 

 

https://thediplomat.com/2024/07/indonesia-announces-hefty-tariffs-on-chinese-made-goods/

 

Well, targeted maybe, but on a whole "range" of Chinese products, and 200 per cent, quite a lot higher than even US tariffs. One can't blame them, the Chinese have single-handedly  destroyed the Indonesian garment industry with their avelanche of cheap products.

 

And it's not just Indonesia either. 

 

"Industry groups in Thailand have also expressed increasing concern about an influx of cheap products from China, which they say have greatly hurt sales by domestic producers who are unable to compete.

In what it called an urgent measure, the Thai government imposed a 7% value-added tax on all imported products, a change from the previous rule that only collected taxes on imported products that cost more than 1,500 baht ($44). The policy is only in effect from July until December this year to give the government time to study the issue before a longer-term solution can be applied"

 

https://apnews.com/article/indonesia-china-imports-duties-textiles-bd24d26daf70f0f4b917795095854455

 

Indeed, these countries also have to fear US trade restrictions, which is why Indonesia has just offered the US major concessions such as increasing trade with the US by 19 bililon USD. In fact Trump IS doing a brilliant job in persuading these countries to increase trade with the US.

 

 

 

[Cameroni]

2 hours ago, thesetat said:

 

 

I would not be so sure about that. They are forced to comply. In every city on every street there are dozens of cameras watching what people are doing. They have the most advanced facial recognition and control systems and if you commit a crime you are sure to get caught. But minor crimes like doing drugs and prostitution are done without fear or worry. There is also a lot of corruption within the ranks to buy your way out of trouble if it is not serious. 

Then you have to remember that almost 8% of the people are in the CCP. 

The punishments are severe as well for breaking laws. Winning in courts over technicalities are rare. 

 

The Chinese justice system is one of the harshest in the world, issuing more death penalties than any other nation on earth. China issues so many death penalties that, unique among nations, China is forced to keep the true number of executions a state secret, for fear of embarassment.

 

I'm sure that's because the Chinese are such law-abiding sticklers for rules as Lacessit has said. 

[placeholder]

3 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Target tariffs you say?

 

 

"Indonesia Announces Hefty Tariffs on Chinese-made Goods

 

The country’s small businesses could “collapse” under a flood of low-cost Chinese goods, the country’s trade minister said.

 

On Friday, a senior Indonesian official announced that the country would impose an import tariff of up to 200 percent on a range of Chinese goods, in order to protect the country’s micro, small, and medium enterprises (MSMEs).

 

“The United States can impose a 200-percent tariff on imported ceramics or clothes; we can do it as well to ensure our MSMEs and industries will survive and thrive,” he said, the Antara news agency reported.

 

Reuters paraphrased Zulfikli by saying that the tariffs would range between 100 and 200 percent and that they “could affect imports of footwear, clothing, textiles, cosmetics and ceramics.” 

 

https://thediplomat.com/2024/07/indonesia-announces-hefty-tariffs-on-chinese-made-goods/

 

Well, targeted maybe, but on a whole "range" of Chinese products, and 200 per cent, quite a lot higher than even US tariffs. One can't blame them, the Chinese have single-handedly  destroyed the Indonesian garment industry with their avelanche of cheap products.

 

And it's not just Indonesia either. 

 

"Industry groups in Thailand have also expressed increasing concern about an influx of cheap products from China, which they say have greatly hurt sales by domestic producers who are unable to compete.

In what it called an urgent measure, the Thai government imposed a 7% value-added tax on all imported products, a change from the previous rule that only collected taxes on imported products that cost more than 1,500 baht ($44). The policy is only in effect from July until December this year to give the government time to study the issue before a longer-term solution can be applied"

 

https://apnews.com/article/indonesia-china-imports-duties-textiles-bd24d26daf70f0f4b917795095854455

 

Indeed, these countries also have to fear US trade restrictions, which is why Indonesia has just offered the US major concessions such as increasing trade with the US by 19 bililon USD. In fact Trump IS doing a brilliant job in persuading these countries to increase trade with the US.

 

 

 

Nice piece of cherry-picking from that article. You didn't note the article also said that Indonesia tried a major restriction on imports last year and had to seriously revise it due to manufacturers complaints about gummed about supply lines.  Indonesia, in fact, Indonesia has a long history of protectionism. And the article closes with this:

"As such, the imposition of the tariffs is unlikely to disrupt the mutually beneficial aspects of bilateral ties between Beijing and Jakarta. China is currently Indonesia’s main source of imports, and its main market for exports, and a continued flow of trade and investment is a necessary component of the Indonesian government’s domestic economic agenda. In this sense, it makes sense to view the new tariffs as a means of adjusting the balance between domestic and international economic priorities, rather than as an expression of bilateral tensions."

https://thediplomat.com/2024/07/indonesia-announces-hefty-tariffs-on-chinese-made-goods/

 

The basic problem with Trump's tariff program implicit assumption that even if a country were to impose zero tariffs on US goods, that would somehow result in a trade balance of zero. These developing nations simply can't buy enough us stuff to make that happen. So the problem Trump is trying to solve won't be. And as for promises, they're promises.

And of course, China can react with policies of its own. It's already finally making serious moves to increase consumer consumption to reduce reliance on exports.

[jas007]

Yes another act of desperation by the Chinese.  Do they seriously think they can threaten the entire Western World? Western leaders are already in talks with the Trump administration.  They want to make a deal, and they'll get a deal.  And slowly, China will be forced to negotiate.  That's coming sooner than many people seem to think

[sandyf]

14 hours ago, SunnyinBangrak said:

Did you even notice this thread title? China threatening other nations that take up the demand. Are they threatening out of love or fear? Please think for yourself in this matter.

Please tell us what Trump is threatening out of, GREED?

His greed to be the global bully boy knows no bounds.

Time the Americans woke up and saw what is coming down the pipe.

[SLOWHAND225]

10 hours ago, Bannoi said:

Trump is a bully and generally speaking most people (and countries) despise bully's so on this one I'm with China.

 

What Trump has done to America's allies is despicable we now increasingly see the USA under Trump not as an ally but more of an advasary and certainly not an ally we can trust, the USA is very soon going to find itself with very few if any friends if Trump wants to isolate the USA from the rest of the world he can have it.

 

It's not just countries I for instance positively will not buy American or American brands if I can possibly find an alternative.

 

On my own that is of no importance at all but there are millions just like me and there is only one man if you can call him a man that is responsible for all this.

 

Bully ? Oh you poor, poor babys have got your feelings hurt. How pathetic.

These Allies you speak of, did they have their hand out while claiming to be our allies ?  Yes they did, every single one of them. So they do not have our best interest at heart.  For far to long we've given and not gotten anything in return for far too long, they are far more concerned about the loss of revenue. 
Truth is, we don't need them. Liberals started us down this path 90 yrs ago and with any luck we can start to correct this behavior.
Will there be pain along the way, of course there will, we're ready for it.

[placeholder]

3 minutes ago, jas007 said:

Yes another act of desperation by the Chinese.  Do they seriously think they can threaten the entire Western World? Western leaders are already in talks with the Trump administration.  They want to make a deal, and they'll get a deal.  And slowly, China will be forced to negotiate.  That's coming sooner than many people seem to think

You may not have noticed Scott's Bessent's remark to the effect that countries don't necessarily have to actually sign a deal. Just indicate that they're willing to do one. And your comment that "Do they seriously think they can threaten the entire Western World?" is particularly clueless. Why can't they? After all, Trump actually has threatened the entire world, East & West.

[placeholder]

2 minutes ago, SLOWHAND225 said:

 

Bully ? Oh you poor, poor babys have got your feelings hurt. How pathetic.

These Allies you speak of, did they have their hand out while claiming to be our allies ?  Yes they did, every single one of them. So they do not have our best interest at heart.  For far to long we've given and not gotten anything in return for far too long, they are far more concerned about the loss of revenue. 
Truth is, we don't need them. Liberals started us down this path 90 yrs ago and with any luck we can start to correct this behavior.
Will there be pain along the way, of course there will, we're ready for it.

Who exactly is the "we" who are ready for it? Americans? You think that the majority of Americans are willing to endure a lot of economic pain? Is that what Trump campaigned on?

[Cameroni]

15 minutes ago, placeholder said:

These developing nations simply can't buy enough us stuff to make that happen. So the problem Trump is trying to solve won't be. And as for promises, they're promises.

And of course, China can react with policies of its own. It's already finally making serious moves to increase consumer consumption to reduce reliance on exports.

 

Well, Indonesia has just announced that it will increase trade with the US by 19 billion and ease restrictions on US products. Obviously this is in response to Trump's tariffs in an effort to ameliorate US tariffs in the future. Clearly nations are trying to buy more American "stuff" now that Trump is issuing tariffs like confetti.

 

As for China increasing domestic consumer consumption to reduce reliance on exports, everyone knows the extent to which the Chinese overproduce everything. Even housing within China has been overproduced to such an extent that millions of condos are standing empty, ghost towns are all over the place and Chinese house prices are falling. China can't help herself, overproduction is in her DNA, why do you think it is the world's leading export power house? Do you seriously think a domestic market with a PPP that is 79th in the world, ie clearly one of the poorer developed nations, will be able to absorb the monumental Chinese overproduction by itself? I doubt it veyr much.

[SLOWHAND225]

1 minute ago, placeholder said:

Who exactly is the "we" who are ready for it? Americans? You think that the majority of Americans are willing to endure a lot of economic pain? Is that what Trump campaigned on?

Critical thinking is important, you should try it.  Surely even you understand in this context that "We" would be the Americans that voted for him. 

[spidermike007]

I absolutely despise the CCP and I'm normally highly critical of them, but Trump has made an enormous strategic mistake by going after them, and he is just starting to pay the price, which is going to be a lot more than he can afford.

 

I think any country that's in a position to just SAY NO to America, they should, as they are not a reliable ally, and he is a completely ridiculous, and insufferable arrogant clown. 

[placeholder]

2 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Well, Indonesia has just announced that it will increase trade with the US by 19 billion and ease restrictions on US products. Obviously this is in response to Trump's tariffs in an effort to ameliorate US tariffs in the future. Clearly nations are trying to buy more American "stuff" now that Trump is issuing tariffs like confetti.

 

As for China increasing domestic consumer consumption to reduce reliance on exports, everyone knows the extent to which the Chinese overproduce everything. Even housing within China has been overproduced to such an extent that millions of condos are standing empty, ghost towns are all over the place and Chinese house prices are falling. China can't help herself, overproduction is in her DNA, why do you think it is the world's leading export power house? Do you seriously think a domestic market with a PPP that is 79th in the world, ie clearly one of the poorer developed nations, will be able to absorb the monumental Chinese overproduction by itself? I doubt it veyr much.

Do you understand that the biggest car market in the world is China's? 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/257660/passenger-car-sales-in-selected-countries/

 

How do you square that with your assessment of the Chinese economy?

Your simplistic use of statistics fails to account for the fact that much of China's population lives in relative poverty. But also that much of its population does not.

 

[John L.]

Under the U.S. Constitution, only Congress can pass new tariff laws, so the president cannot raise or change tariffs on his own authority. He may impose duties without Congress only if he declares a national emergency—most often under Section 232 of the Trade Expansion Act of 1962, which allows action when imports threaten national security or critical industries. Even then, those emergency tariffs are temporary and subject to legal review, underscoring that long‑term trade policy still depends on collaboration between the legislative and executive branches.

 

He thinks he is over the law.

[Cameroni]

Just now, spidermike007 said:

I absolutely despise the CCP and I'm normally highly critical of them, but Trump has made an enormous strategic mistake by going after them, and he is just starting to pay the price, which is going to be a lot more than he can afford.

 

 

You mean "payiing" the price as in watching Indonesia announce they will increase trade withe the US by 19 billion and ease restrictions on US goods? Looks like Trump's tariffs are working very well.

 

2 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

I think any country that's in a position to just SAY NO to America, they should

 

No country is in that position, alas, since the American market is the richest in the entire world and every country wants a piece of that market. Hence, rather than saying NO they are lining up to say how they want to buy more US products and give the US better trade access, now that Trump's tariffs are threatening their trade with the US.

[Lacessit]

14 minutes ago, SLOWHAND225 said:

 

Bully ? Oh you poor, poor babys have got your feelings hurt. How pathetic.

These Allies you speak of, did they have their hand out while claiming to be our allies ?  Yes they did, every single one of them. So they do not have our best interest at heart.  For far to long we've given and not gotten anything in return for far too long, they are far more concerned about the loss of revenue. 
Truth is, we don't need them. Liberals started us down this path 90 yrs ago and with any luck we can start to correct this behavior.
Will there be pain along the way, of course there will, we're ready for it.

The American public's ability to endure economic pain is on a par with their ability to tolerate military pain. You are pulling out of Ukraine without even having a single pair of boots on the ground.

 

You are ready for it? About as ready as a turkey is for Thanksgiving.

[placeholder]

17 minutes ago, SLOWHAND225 said:

Critical thinking is important, you should try it.  Surely even you understand in this context that "We" would be the Americans that voted for him. 

Well will I was wondering was who appointed you the spokesperson? And the question you didn't answer remains:

You think that the majority of Americans are willing to endure a lot of economic pain? Is that what Trump campaigned on?

[Cameroni]

2 minutes ago, John L. said:

Under the U.S. Constitution, only Congress can pass new tariff laws, so the president cannot raise or change tariffs on his own authority. He may impose duties without Congress only if he declares a national emergency—most often under Section 232 of the Trade Expansion Act of 1962, which allows action when imports threaten national security or critical industries. Even then, those emergency tariffs are temporary and subject to legal review, underscoring that long‑term trade policy still depends on collaboration between the legislative and executive branches.

 

He thinks he is over the law.

 

Complete nonsense, Trump is well within the law: Even members of the House of Representatives conceded that this power to impose tariffs was given to the executive. Even those who want to take that power away from Trump agree it was given to him:

 

 

“It’s time that Congress restores its authorities here,” Bacon said on CBS News over the weekend. “We gave some of that power to the executive branch, and I think in hindsight, that was a mistake.”

 

The Constitution expressly grants Congress the “power to lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises…” and also “To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations… .”

But during World War I, Congress began to cede some of that authority when it gave the president power to regulate trade with enemies.

After the Smoot-Hawley tariff bill helped deepen the Great Depression, lawmakers in 1930 began the process of giving power over tariffs to presidents.

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2025/04/08/politics/tariffs-trump-power-constitution-congress/index.html

 

[Rimmer]

An unattributed conspiracy theory has been removed