4 hours ago, Hunz Kittisak said:

fyi Big Jiew government only came to being in Nov 97. Before that it was the Banharn government which Thaksin was DPM briefly as coalition partner 

No, Chavalit or Big Jiew was PM during the Asian financial crisis in ‘97.

Chuan Leekpai became PM after it in Nov 97. 

Good old chinese gangster Shinawatra Clan. Money rules.

5 hours ago, JimCM said:

No, Chavalit or Big Jiew was PM during the Asian financial crisis in ‘97.

Chuan Leekpai became PM after it in Nov 97. 

My bad typo I meant Nov 96

after the elections on 17 Nov 1996 which Thaksin was not part of that government or even in parliament until August 1997

On 9/10/2025 at 9:21 AM, MikeandDow said:

Thaskin is a murderer in the eyes of the UN and  Other international human rights organizations he was resposible for over 2500 deaths 

 

And the army never murdered anyone ? 
A convicted drug trafficker sits in government ? 
The suspicious deaths of tourists and expats ?

On 9/8/2025 at 10:03 PM, Artisi said:

Seems someone didn't get the memo - he arrived back expecting a decision in his favour, someone is now deep in the xxxx other than Thaksin. 

 

Perhaps the powers-that-be are playing a "mo' money' ploy.  He might get a Bill Cosby deal: do a little time and then he is quietly released with no reason and little fanfare, never to be mentioned again until it's obituary time.

But the real gambit is no time at all, just the delay delay delay, American style.  

 

On 9/12/2025 at 11:48 AM, Hunz Kittisak said:

Haha now you are the one fudging the dates. 
He quit his cabinet post (DPM in charge of Bkk traffic)  in May 96 but retained MP seat. There was a cabinet reshuffle after that. 
So he was only an MP from May 1996 till Aug same year where he and. His party (PDP) quit the government altogether. Parliament was dissolved in Sept 96. 

He was not in government not even as an MP until August 97 which was AFTER the Thai baht was floated AFTER the financial crisis which was in July 97

 

fyi Big Jiew government only came to being in Nov 97. Before that it was the Banharn government which Thaksin was DPM briefly as coalition partner 

 

Wife of General Chavalit (Big Jiew - PM) was seriously engrossed in black magic etc., and often arranged massive / giant tables of various magic foods in front of parliament house along with various 'monks' etc., to perform magic rituals, to gain good luck etc., from the spirits. 

10 hours ago, geisha said:

And the army never murdered anyone ? 
A convicted drug trafficker sits in government ? 
The suspicious deaths of tourists and expats ?

think !!!!! who controls the army !! the PM does     we all know mr flour man is a convicted drug dealer convicted in OZ  but thai law says that does not count    suspicious deaths of tourists and expats yes need to be properly investigated  but this happens all over the world 

48 minutes ago, MikeandDow said:

suspicious deaths of tourists and expats yes need to be properly investigated  but this happens all over the world 

But 20x more in Thailand than in any western country.

8 hours ago, scorecard said:

 

Wife of General Chavalit (Big Jiew - PM) was seriously engrossed in black magic etc., and often arranged massive / giant tables of various magic foods in front of parliament house along with various 'monks' etc., to perform magic rituals, to gain good luck etc., from the spirits. 

That’s traditional Thai beliefs not black magic.

59 minutes ago, MikeandDow said:

think !!!!! who controls the army !! the PM does     we all know mr flour man is a convicted drug dealer convicted in OZ  but thai law says that does not count    suspicious deaths of tourists and expats yes need to be properly investigated  but this happens all over the world 

Don’t you believe in rehabilitation?
 

He did his time.

18 minutes ago, JimCM said:

Don’t you believe in rehabilitation?
 

He did his time.

nope            a leopard does not change his spots 

 he IS doing his time  not did his time

5 hours ago, MikeandDow said:

think !!!!! who controls the army !! the PM does     we all know mr flour man is a convicted drug dealer convicted in OZ  but thai law says that does not count    suspicious deaths of tourists and expats yes need to be properly investigated  but this happens all over the world 

If you think the PM controls the army in Thailand then you’re as naive as they come. 
Thailand has experienced 22 coup attempts with 13 PMs overthrown. So much for PMs controlling the military 

8 minutes ago, Hunz Kittisak said:

If you think the PM controls the army in Thailand then you’re as naive as they come. 
Thailand has experienced 22 coup attempts with 13 PMs overthrown. So much for PMs controlling the military 

iam talking about who gives orders to the army about killing people just like thaskin who gave the order to kill 2500 people and who gave the order to the army in the tak bai indecent  the buck stops at the pm    not the army  

or are you saying thailand is under the control of the army not the pm and government  a stratocracy

On 9/12/2025 at 11:08 AM, Hunz Kittisak said:

From wiki 

 

 

Although generally regarded as relatively clean and honest when compared to other Thai administrations, Chuan's government found itself plagued with corruption scandals and rumours. Key cases of corruption included:

• Rakkiat Sukhthana, Health Minister, was charged with taking a five million baht (US$125,000) bribe from a drug firm and forcing state hospitals to buy medicine at exorbitant prices. After being found guilty, he jumped bail and went into hiding.
• Suthep Thaugsuban, Minister of Transport and Communications, whose brokering of illegal land deals caused the fall of the Chuan 1 government, was linked to abuse of funds in setting up a co-operative Surat Thani Province.^[17]
• The "edible fence" seed scandal, in which massive overpricing of seeds distributed to rural areas happened. The Deputy Minister of Agriculture was forced to resign.^[18]
• The Salween logging scandal, where up to 20,000 trees were felled illegally in the Salween forest in Mae Hong Son. Some of them turned up in the compound of the Democrat party's office in Phichit Province.^[18]
• Sanan Kajornprasart, Interior Minister, as well as eight other cabinet ministers were found to have understated their declared assets. Sanan was later barred by the Constitutional Court from politics for five years.^[19]
• Chuan himself was found by the National Counter-Corruption Commission to have undeclared shareholdings in a rural cooperative

same same but different 🤣

He was by far the least corrupt PM, which led to his downfall.

It would be impossible to become PM without being corrupt.

On 9/13/2025 at 11:35 PM, geisha said:

The suspicious deaths of tourists and expats ?

Such as? 

On 9/12/2025 at 11:48 AM, Hunz Kittisak said:

Haha now you are the one fudging the dates. 
He quit his cabinet post (DPM in charge of Bkk traffic)  in May 96 but retained MP seat. There was a cabinet reshuffle after that. 
So he was only an MP from May 1996 till Aug same year where he and. His party (PDP) quit the government altogether. Parliament was dissolved in Sept 96. 

He was not in government not even as an MP until August 97 which was AFTER the Thai baht was floated AFTER the financial crisis which was in July 97

 

fyi Big Jiew government only came to being in Nov 97. Before that it was the Banharn government which Thaksin was DPM briefly as coalition partner 

I’m not fudging anything. As I said, I can’t remember exact dates, so checked a government website, which I believe more than Wikipedia.

I was living in Bangkok then and it was often talked about his part in the Tom Yam Kung affair, when he became unusually rich. I keep old newspapers and will look through them when I’ve time.

On 9/13/2025 at 11:55 PM, bendejo said:

But the real gambit is no time at all, just the delay delay delay, American style. 

Who got "no time at all, just delay..."?

On 9/14/2025 at 10:27 AM, BritManToo said:

On 9/14/2025 at 9:46 AM, MikeandDow said:

suspicious deaths of tourists and expats yes need to be properly investigated  but this happens all over the world 

But 20x more in Thailand than in any western country.

An interesting stat.  Doubtless pulled from somewhere dark and musky.

15 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

An interesting stat.  Doubtless pulled from somewhere dark and musky.

Issued by the British foreign office, and the Australian foreign office.

Not currently discoverable on Google

 

But The Nation Thailand says .........

Just for Brits ......... Thailand Vs Spain 15 Vs 1

Deaths in Thailand 6 per 100k

Deaths in Spain 4 per 1000k

https://www.nationthailand.com/international/30342099

1 hour ago, RobKray said:

I’m not fudging anything. As I said, I can’t remember exact dates, so checked a government website, which I believe more than Wikipedia.

I was living in Bangkok then and it was often talked about his part in the Tom Yam Kung affair, when he became unusually rich. I keep old newspapers and will look through them when I’ve time.

Thaksin was already very rich prior to his entry into politics. You can dig for those facts too 

Thaksin introduced policy corruption, changing laws to benefit his own businesses.

Different to the previous offenders who would demand kickbacks from projects.

He was also authoritarian, any criticism of him meant that newspaper or TV station received no government contracts for advertising state projects. 

He sued anyone who criticised him in detail, using his wealth and Thai laws to intimidate critics.

He was very divisive, a corrosive feature for a national leader. I remember him saying that whichever province voted for his party would receive the national budget first. Other provinces would have to wait. 

He also stated democracy was not his goal, as has been evident by his family's stranglehold on the Pheu Thai party. 

No democracy there.

The hospital 30 baht scheme was, and is, a great asset to Thailand but most of his other populist policies did nothing to lift the poor out of poverty. No real reform of institutions in spite of his huge majority at the time.

I remember the disappointment that NGOs, activists, reformists, all felt when his ministers were announced for his government at the turn of the millennium.  Billionaires, millionaires, nearly all of them.

A cabinet for the rich. 

He missed a real chance to reform Thailand, and under the best constitution Thailand has ever had , 1997.

Back to the present- if he gets out the slammer too soon, Pheu Thai and himself won't gain any popularity. He'll just be seen as the rich avoiding punishment as usual. 

In my view he's got to serve 6 months to a year to gain anything. If the election happens whilst he's behind bars, PT might gain some sympathy votes.

 

1 hour ago, bannork said:

I remember him saying that whichever province voted for his party would receive the national budget first. Other provinces would have to wait. 

No you don't. he's never been quoted as saying that.

On 9/14/2025 at 10:45 AM, MikeandDow said:

iam talking about who gives orders to the army about killing people just like thaskin who gave the order to kill 2500 people and who gave the order to the army in the tak bai indecent  the buck stops at the pm    not the army  

or are you saying thailand is under the control of the army not the pm and government  a stratocracy

The army ultimately obeys only one person.

 

1. It's not that simple (I will not detail for reasons you may guess). The military and the Dems certainly did not bury the investigation into the war on drugs to protect Thaksin.

2. Look at who was the army chief....

 

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2423190/thaksin-prawit-trade-blame-for-tak-bai-massacre

 

26 minutes ago, candide said:

The army ultimately obeys only one person.

 

1. It's not that simple (I will not detail for reasons you may guess). The military and the Dems certainly did not bury the investigation into the war on drugs to protect Thaksin.

2. Look at who was the army chief....

 

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2423190/thaksin-prawit-trade-blame-for-tak-bai-massacre

 

 I am well aware the history of Thaskins misdeeds  and who is in charge of the army and who was army cheif at the time of  tak bai indecent  its all there in black and white if you care to google   a cert few posters think thaskin is a hero  he is a man of evil  has not done anything for thailand or its people and dont give me the 30baht heath care it was not his idea   Thaskin has never wanted democracy all he wants is power so he can add the peoples money to his bank account, all he has given the Thai people is corruption  

3 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

No you don't. he's never been quoted as saying that.

I do remember, eat your own words, LL.

 

In his response to opposition and Pheu Thai Party leader Cholnan Srikaew's criticism of the budget, Prayut said his government did not practice favouritism like how the Thaksin government in the past threatened to make budgetary provisions only to provinces that elected the ruling party’s MPs.

 

https://www.nationthailand.com/in-focus/40016177

8 hours ago, RobKray said:

He was by far the least corrupt PM, which led to his downfall.

It would be impossible to become PM without being corrupt.

Going by that logic then it can be argued that Thaksin and the subsequent PMs related to him were also in the same vein which led to their downfall seems impossible for them to be PM too

7 hours ago, bannork said:

Thaksin introduced policy corruption, changing laws to benefit his own businesses.

Different to the previous offenders who would demand kickbacks from projects.

He was also authoritarian, any criticism of him meant that newspaper or TV station received no government contracts for advertising state projects. 

He sued anyone who criticised him in detail, using his wealth and Thai laws to intimidate critics.

He was very divisive, a corrosive feature for a national leader. I remember him saying that whichever province voted for his party would receive the national budget first. Other provinces would have to wait. 

He also stated democracy was not his goal, as has been evident by his family's stranglehold on the Pheu Thai party. 

No democracy there.

The hospital 30 baht scheme was, and is, a great asset to Thailand but most of his other populist policies did nothing to lift the poor out of poverty. No real reform of institutions in spite of his huge majority at the time.

I remember the disappointment that NGOs, activists, reformists, all felt when his ministers were announced for his government at the turn of the millennium.  Billionaires, millionaires, nearly all of them.

A cabinet for the rich. 

He missed a real chance to reform Thailand, and under the best constitution Thailand has ever had , 1997.

Back to the present- if he gets out the slammer too soon, Pheu Thai and himself won't gain any popularity. He'll just be seen as the rich avoiding punishment as usual. 

In my view he's got to serve 6 months to a year to gain anything. If the election happens whilst he's behind bars, PT might gain some sympathy votes.

 

Are you sure Thaksin did nothing for the poor? He There are statistics that can be easily googled to support he did alleviate rural poverty. 
He improved their lives so much that after quarter of a century he is still remembered and beloved 

3 minutes ago, Hunz Kittisak said:

Are you sure Thaksin did nothing for the poor? He There are statistics that can be easily googled to support he did alleviate rural poverty. 
He improved their lives so much that after quarter of a century he is still remembered and beloved 

His village funds whereby members of the local council and their relatives (excuse my cynicism ) could borrow up to 10,000 baht each, did help mobile phone sales, promote lao khao consumption as well as gambling, and may have helped the industrious start a small business; but really 10,000 baht was hardly enough for most small businesses.

As I mentioned earlier, the 30 baht hospital scheme was his major success and, along with his populist policies, won the hearts of Issan people. 

I have had family in Issan since 1994 and it's undeniable the increase in material wealth over time. Back then most homes only had a motorbike, later on families got a tuk tuk or rather an Issan skylab. Then mobile phones arrived,

 nowadays every respectable home has to have a pick-up too.

But the instalments to pay off these items are invariably paid by family members working in the industrial estates around Bangkok, Chonburi, Rayong or abroad such as in S. Korea, etc.

Agricultural prices such as rubber, which Thaksin strongly advised Issan people to invest in, have collapsed for years now, whilst fertiliser just goes on getting more and more expensive.

 

43 minutes ago, Hunz Kittisak said:

Going by that logic then it can be argued that Thaksin and the subsequent PMs related to him were also in the same vein which led to their downfall seems impossible for them to be PM too

Thaksin is corrupt as hell!
Look at Bannork’s excellent reply to you above.

1 hour ago, bannork said:

His village funds whereby members of the local council and their relatives (excuse my cynicism ) could borrow up to 10,000 baht each, did help mobile phone sales, promote lao khao consumption as well as gambling, and may have helped the industrious start a small business; but really 10,000 baht was hardly enough for most small businesses.

As I mentioned earlier, the 30 baht hospital scheme was his major success and, along with his populist policies, won the hearts of Issan people. 

I have had family in Issan since 1994 and it's undeniable the increase in material wealth over time. Back then most homes only had a motorbike, later on families got a tuk tuk or rather an Issan skylab. Then mobile phones arrived,

 nowadays every respectable home has to have a pick-up too.

But the instalments to pay off these items are invariably paid by family members working in the industrial estates around Bangkok, Chonburi, Rayong or abroad such as in S. Korea, etc.

Agricultural prices such as rubber, which Thaksin strongly advised Issan people to invest in, have collapsed for years now, whilst fertiliser just goes on getting more and more expensive.

 

key stats with real figures to back up 

 

Key positive effects of Thaksinomics

 

Poverty reduction

• Declining poverty rate: Between 2000 and 2007, the national poverty rate decreased significantly, from 21% to 8.5%.
• Income growth: From 2001 to 2006, the average income in Thailand's rural and impoverished northeast region rose by 46%.
• Targeted development: The program included direct financial aid and microcredit schemes, such as the Village and Urban Revolving Funds, which allocated 1 million baht to each village for community-managed loans. This boosted small businesses and increased rural productivity. 

 

Economic performance

• Accelerated growth: Following the 1997 Asian financial crisis, Thaksinomics helped boost economic recovery. Thailand's Gross Domestic Product (GDP) grew at an average of 5.7% per year between 2002 and 2006. The economy saw growth in 2004 (6.1%) and 2005 (4.5%) fueled by strong exports and domestic consumption.
• Repayment of IMF debt: The country was able to repay its loans to the International Monetary Fund (IMF) two years ahead of schedule.
• Decreased public debt: Despite increased spending, public sector debt was reduced from 57% of GDP in 2001 to 41% in 2006. 

 

Social welfare

• Universal healthcare: The "30-baht program," introduced in 2002, provided subsidized, near-universal healthcare to all Thai citizens for a 30 baht (about 75 cents at the time) fee per hospital visit. This dramatically increased healthcare access, particularly for the poor.
• Infrastructure development: Thaksin's government invested heavily in public works projects, including new roads, public transit, and Suvarnabhumi Airport.
• Agricultural support: The government implemented a three-year debt moratorium for farmers, providing relief and stability to the rural poor. 

 

Economic strategy

• Emphasis on domestic growth: Thaksinomics shifted the focus from export-led growth to stimulating domestic demand and empowering the local economy. This included promoting small and medium-sized enterprises (SMEs).
• Marketing-focused branding: The administration sought to create a "brand economy," moving Thailand away from being just an original equipment manufacturer (OEM) for other countries. The "One Tambon One Product" (OTOP) initiative promoted locally made crafts and goods.