Never in the history of the world has anyone ever convinced anyone to love them, by telling them how they love them. But there is nothing else to do here.

 

At least I want her to know.

I texted her to ask what her mother thought of the Japanese objet d'art I gave her, this exquisite Japanese tea cup.

 

She: "It's too small, she wants bigger than that".

 

When the best isn't good enough for mama.

 

Oh well.

22 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

I texted her to ask what her mother thought of the Japanese objet d'art I gave her, this exquisite Japanese tea cup.

 

She: "It's too small, she wants bigger than that".

 

When the best isn't good enough for mama.

 

Oh well.

Are you getting the message yet? 

13 minutes ago, ChrisKC said:

Are you getting the message yet? 

 

Getting there.

Just now, Cameroni said:

 

Getting there.

I am sorry that a gift not actually intended for use is treated in that way. This time I am on your side if you are feeling indignant. 

25 minutes ago, ChrisKC said:

I am sorry that a gift not actually intended for use is treated in that way. This time I am on your side if you are feeling indignant. 

 

I'm not. I was just hoping the mother would like the cup, so when CM girl gave it to her, she'd get some credit for getting her something she liked. I have a feeling the relationship between CM girl and mother is not an easy one. The mother seems to have a major hold on her. She called her twice on two dates we were on.

 

 It just so happened she wanted a bigger tea cup, and to be fair this precious Japanese tea cup is not huge, it's normal size. Just beautifully decorated. It was so beautiful it was one of the few objects I took to Thailand.

 

Neither she nor her mother can know the meaning that cup has for me, or how expensive it is. It's a just a tea cup to them. No reason it should be anything else as far as they are concerned.

 

I'm not attached to things. I can buy another cup like this.

2 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

I'm not. I was just hoping the mother would like the cup, so when CM girl gave it to her, she'd get some credit for getting her something she liked.

 

 It just so happened she wanted a bigger tea cup, and to be fair this precious Japanese tea cup is not huge, it's normal size. Just beautifully decorated. It was so beautiful it was one of the few objects I took to Thailand.

 

Neither she nor her mother can know the meaning that cup has for me, or how expensive it is. It's a just a tea cup to them. No reason it should be anything else as far as they are concerned.

 

I'm not attached to things. I can buy another cup like this.

If she has opened it yet, the umbrella will be the wrong shape. Hang on before you send what will be an embarrassing love letter. 

Just now, ChrisKC said:

If she has opened it yet, the umbrella will be the wrong shape. Hang on before you send what will be an embarrassing love letter. 

 

She hasn't even mentioned the umbrella gift at all. She must have been so disappointed, she was speculating so much what this gift might be. When she found out it was an umbrella, it was probably a cold shower. She's not texted a word on it. Not thank you even. Nothing.

 

I think as we left it that she will get in touch with me about how we meet on Friday or Saturday, and it's her birthday, I will see how that works out. If she makes definite plans to meet with me, I'll take that as a sign of interest and may write something nice with her birthday gift. But if she doesn't come back, and I hear nothing about getting together Friday or Saturday, then I suppose she's basically saying "I'm really not interested anymore". Then a letter may not make sense.

22 hours ago, Cameroni said:

I don't ned to go to Big C at all....lol.

 

So I was ghosted, huh...Richard, Richard....tssssk.

 

From being ghosted to being a taxi driver !!!... 

 

Thats an impressive leap in the relationship !!!  -  I do wonder whats next ? she'll let you wash her 'sisters' car ?

Just now, richard_smith237 said:

 

From being ghosted to being a taxi driver !!!... 

 

Thats an impressive leap in the relationship !!!  -  I do wonder whats next ? she'll let you wash her 'sisters' car ?

 

You're not giving me enough credit, I was also allowed to carry her boxes.

 

I'll probably not be allowed to wash the car, as I didn't pay for her shopping.

10 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

She hasn't even mentioned the umbrella gift at all. She must have been so disappointed, she was speculating so much what this gift might be. When she found out it was an umbrella

Don't let this phase you. 

Thai chicks can be a little cold at times, this is because Thai men use these lovely girls. She's just a little confused with your generosity and hospitality. 

Slow down, you may be confusing her. 

Hang in there, I'm sure she will come around. The good ones take a little longer. 

 

3 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

Don't let this phase you. 

Thai chicks can be a little cold at times, this is because Thai men use these lovely girls. She's just a little confused with your generosity and hospitality. 

Slow down, you may be confusing her. 

Hang in there, I'm sure she will come around. The good ones take a little longer. 

 

 

I almost feel as if she is testing me. Like "Let's see if we just go to Big C what will that be like, if he'll still be interested then.".

 

But after I didn't pay for the shopping and we went to KFC I really noticed a change in demeanour. It's not as if the shopping in Big C was so great, but things got a bit quiet after KFC. I really wonder what that was about.

 

If it was her "emergency" message, that I didn't pay for the shopping, or because I talked of flying with her to Bali. It did seem like something turned a switch.

 

Maybe she's just under a lot of pressure at home. I don't know. But she's not texting a lot now either.

11 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

She hasn't even mentioned the umbrella gift at all. She must have been so disappointed, she was speculating so much what this gift might be. When she found out it was an umbrella, it was probably a cold shower. She's not texted a word on it. Not thank you even. Nothing.

 

I think as we left it that she will get in touch with me about how we meet on Friday or Saturday, and it's her birthday, I will see how that works out. If she makes definite plans to meet with me, I'll take that as a sign of interest and may write something nice with her birthday gift. But if she doesn't come back, and I hear nothing about getting together Friday or Saturday, then I suppose she's basically saying "I'm really not interested anymore". Then a letter may not make sense.

 

Next time you buy her something, give her a choice...

 

"would you like this exepnsive necklace, or should I go fv<k myself ?"  -   because thats the clear message she is sending you.

 

By this stage - in your shoes I'd plan to meet her at the top of Doi Suthep for an amazing surprise and just not bother turning up...  She's playing you for an absolute mug and her indifference is not only innocent ignorance of the situation, its actively rude.

 

 

 

I had a mate who played the game well..

Had an absolute stunner stringing him along… 

They planned a date, she cancelled, planned another and she was over an hour late and didn’t even apologise.  The date went well and she ended up staying together.

She called the next day they planned another date – something came up and he cancelled, they planed another date he was an hour late.

She gave him two barrels – You f** me then cancel the date then turn up late to the next ?..  he smiled and walked away and caught up with his mates in the bar.
 

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

I am going to write love letter to her

 

Write her a poem instead, more tender, thoughtful.

 

This is good.

 

Cameroni wandered in the rain, clutching a Japanese teacup for luck,

while C.M. twirled her umbrella like life was never stuck.

They ended up at KFC, laughing over crispy bliss—

and somewhere between the fries and fortune, he stole one perfect kiss.

5 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

I almost feel as if she is testing me. Like "Let's see if we just go to Big C what will that be like, if he'll still be interested then.".

 

But after I didn't pay for the shopping and we went to KFC I really noticed a change in demeanour. It's not as if the shopping in Big C was so great, but things got a bit quiet after KFC. I really wonder what that was about.

 

If it was her "emergency" message, that I didn't pay for the shopping, or because I talked of flying with her to Bali. It did seem like something turned a switch.

 

Maybe she's just under a lot of pressure at home. I don't know. But she's not texting a lot now either.

 

The 'Mother thing' - its total BS...   until you actually see her Mother at the house - don't buy it.

Odds are she's living with a group of others girls (she calls sisters) - all playing the same game with guys or who are friends with a 'real job'.

 

She was using you instead of paying for a taxi to Big-C to get some supplies.

The tea-cup is a daft red-herring - something that came into her head that you clung onto.

 

She's doesn't care for the umbrella - it means nothing to her, its not something expensive. 

 

She didn't believe you about Bali - she's been strung on by punters too many times - its not happening until it happens.

 

There is no 'family' birthday party, she'll just be hanging out with her housemates - probably going out to a club or a bar - she wants to keep her options open = no plan with you.

 

She moved away from the kiss - because a kiss is romantic - she's not romantically interested in you.

 

She let you give her a kiss earlier on because she thought she might get more out of the evening - you were a taxi and she thought you'd pay for her shopping.

 

 

And you are right - she is testing you - but not from a relationship point of view - she's testing how much you'll pay out - are you worth keeping on as a plan B - covering costs... if you will be her 'sugar daddy' the end game here is for her to get an allowance and she's very likely on allowance already from other guys... 

 

Is she an 'escort' ?? not in the strict sense - but she very likely has sponsors and you are being evaluated fro that perspective.

 

 

 

14 minutes ago, Bacon1 said:

 

Write her a poem instead, more tender, thoughtful.

 

This is good.

 

Cameroni wandered in the rain, clutching a Japanese teacup for luck,

while C.M. twirled her umbrella like life was never stuck.

They ended up at KFC, laughing over crispy bliss—

and somewhere between the fries and fortune, he stole one perfect kiss.

 

 

As C.M. girl weaved her myth and lies, leaving Cameroni soggy and spent,
while his umbrella sagged like his luck, ignored, cracked and poorly bent.
He leaned in for a kiss that fizzled, she laughed and walked away,
and somewhere between the lies and lust, he got no luck, no joy, no play.

31 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

I almost feel as if she is testing me. Like "Let's see if we just go to Big C what will that be like, if he'll still be interested then.".

 

But after I didn't pay for the shopping and we went to KFC I really noticed a change in demeanour. It's not as if the shopping in Big C was so great, but things got a bit quiet after KFC. I really wonder what that was about.

 

If it was her "emergency" message, that I didn't pay for the shopping, or because I talked of flying with her to Bali. It did seem like something turned a switch.

 

Maybe she's just under a lot of pressure at home. I don't know. But she's not texting a lot now either.

Remember some chicks don't like nice guys, some chicks sadly, like the abuse and neglect. 

It's going to take time to work her out. 

Good luck 

 

26 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

The 'Mother thing' - its total BS...   until you actually see her Mother at the house - don't buy it.

 

Richard, I understand an abundance of caution. But you didn't talk to her yesterday. I asked her outright, "Is there any problem, any issue in your life, anything that concerns you". And she thought for a minute then said "Mother asked me to nurse her. She really wants that. But I don't want to give up my life for that, it would mean having to move to Chiang Dao".

 

If you had seen the look on her face, how she said it, you'd know the mother is very real.

 

She also went to the pharmacy asking for a pill box for her mother. i saw it. Again, this sick mother is real. 

 

29 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

The tea-cup is a daft red-herring - something that came into her head

 

She was looking for 30 minutes for this tea cup in Big C. It was a real issue.

 

30 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

She didn't believe you about Bali - she's been strung on by punters too many times - its not happening until it happens.

 

That could well be. Also the way I said it seemed almost jokingly, that didn't help my case.

 

30 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

There is no 'family' birthday party, she'll just be hanging out with her housemates - probably going out to a club or a bar - she wants to keep her options open = no plan with you.

 

I am almost 100% certain she will be going out at night, and partying with friends. She is a local who studied at Chiang Mai university, and it's totally unbelievable she'll just sit at home with her mother. She's going out with her sister and friends for sure. Maybe she didn' tmake firm plans yet, but it will happen.

 

32 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

She moved away from the kiss - because a kiss is romantic - she's not romantically interested in you.

 

I don't know, she was keen to get inside because she was holding heavy boxes and her mother had called her and chastised her being late. But yah, her interest is very low. To be honest I had the hope since she asked me to go to Big C that her interest was coming back up, but as she hasn't written at all today, until I did, it's clear her interest is still rather low.

 

33 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

she thought you'd pay for her shopping.

 

Yes, not paying for the shopping was a mistake. But it didn't feel right to pay. She'd cancelled a previous date, then just offered Big C. And those things were all for her mother, didn't feel right to pay. She never agreed to be girlfriend/boyfriend or be exclusive, so why would I take care of her that way?

 

34 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Is she an 'escort' ?? not in the strict sense - but she very likely has sponsors and you are being evaluated fro that perspective.

 

Interesting theory.

38 minutes ago, Bacon1 said:

 

Write her a poem instead, more tender, thoughtful.

 

This is good.

 

Cameroni wandered in the rain, clutching a Japanese teacup for luck,

while C.M. twirled her umbrella like life was never stuck.

They ended up at KFC, laughing over crispy bliss—

and somewhere between the fries and fortune, he stole one perfect kiss.

 

I thought about a poem as well. Maybe CC Cummings.

22 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

Remember some chicks don't like nice guys, some chicks sadly, like the abuse and neglect. 

 

I get the feeling that

 

A) She is a hyper-experienced dater and has game the likes of which men can only dream of

 

B) She is way too smart to enjoy abuse and neglect. I think it's the opposite, she is used to being extremely spoilt.

 

 

Still at first base or what?

 

When are we going to get to the meat and potatoes?

 

Where you start living together and start having arguments, and then start having meta arguments about how you argue and discussions about whether you're growing together or growing apart.

 

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

The 'Mother thing' - its total BS...   until you actually see her Mother at the house - don't buy it.

 

Richard, I understand an abundance of caution. But you didn't talk to her yesterday. I asked her outright, "Is there any problem, any issue in your life, anything that concerns you". And she thought for a minute then said "Mother asked me to nurse her. She really wants that. But I don't want to give up my life for that, it would mean having to move to Chiang Dao".

 

Translation: "Yes, you haven't offered me a monthly stipend... I'm tredding lightly to figure out how to get the best out of this situation financially"

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

If you had seen the look on her face, how she said it, you'd know the mother is very real.

 

As is figuring out how best to play you.

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

She also went to the pharmacy asking for a pill box for her mother. i saw it. Again, this sick mother is real. 

 

Or she wants one for her vitamins !

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

The tea-cup is a daft red-herring - something that came into her head

 

She was looking for 30 minutes for this tea cup in Big C. It was a real issue.

 

Great acting.

 

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

She didn't believe you about Bali - she's been strung on by punters too many times - its not happening until it happens.

 

That could well be. Also the way I said it seemed almost jokingly, that didn't help my case.

 

I hope you were joking - because if she says yes, then you plan the trip, pay for hotels, flights etc then she drops you for a higher paying plan a - you be back here confirming what you already confirmed on page 60 !!!

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

There is no 'family' birthday party, she'll just be hanging out with her housemates - probably going out to a club or a bar - she wants to keep her options open = no plan with you.

I am almost 100% certain she will be going out at night, and partying with friends. She is a local who studied at Chiang Mai university, and it's totally unbelievable she'll just sit at home with her mother. She's going out with her sister and friends for sure. Maybe she didn' tmake firm plans yet, but it will happen.

 

Sure it will - and if she has registered any romantic feelings for you - she'll be inviting you.

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

She moved away from the kiss - because a kiss is romantic - she's not romantically interested in you.

I don't know, she was keen to get inside because she was holding heavy boxes and her mother had called her and chastised her being late. But yah, her interest is very low. To be honest I had the hope since she asked me to go to Big C that her interest was coming back up, but as she hasn't written at all today, until I did, it's clear her interest is still rather low.

 

Rather low ??? - romantically non-existent - even dodging a peck on the cheek now - read the signs.

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

she thought you'd pay for her shopping.

Yes, not paying for the shopping was a mistake. But it didn't feel right to pay.

 

It wasn't a mistake - it showed clear boundaries - if you pay for her shopping, you'll be paying for everything for months, and on page 250 of this thread - you'll finally admit you've wasted a lot of money on a girl who lets you peck her on the cheek when she wants something.

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

She'd cancelled a previous date, then just offered Big C. And those things were all for her mother, didn't feel right to pay. She never agreed to be girlfriend/boyfriend or be exclusive, so why would I take care of her that way?

 

The mother is a 'sick buffalo' not literally of course - but this is a very convenient excuse for having to 'not be available'... visit other areas... Soon there will be a 'hospital bill that needs paying' - and this is why you are kept in the picture - you'll be hit up soon enough.

 

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

3 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

Is she an 'escort' ?? not in the strict sense - but she very likely has sponsors and you are being evaluated fro that perspective.

Interesting theory.

 

You were convinced she was an escort a few days ago - and a tea-cup and pill box is all it took to change your mind !!! 

14 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

"Yes, you haven't offered me a monthly stipend... I'm tredding lightly to figure out how to get the best out of this situation financially"

 

Wow. I suppose worth considering that angle. It's a remote possibility all things considered.

 

14 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

I hope you were joking - because if she says yes, then you plan the trip, pay for hotels, flights etc then she drops you for a higher paying plan a - you be back here confirming what you already confirmed

 

Yah, I think Bali is shelved. Perhaps Ko Chang at most. Some kind of trip would be good.

 

14 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Soon there will be a 'hospital bill that needs paying' - and this is why you are kept in the picture - you'll be hit up soon enough.

 

If that happens I'd obviously be out. Even I'm not that dumb.

 

14 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

ou were convinced she was an escort a few days ago - and a tea-cup and pill box is all it took to change your mind !!! 

 

I really did lean towards that. But having seen her in person, Richard, I just cannot believe this girl is an escort. It doesn't mesh with all the other information. She emphatically said how Christianity is VERY important to her. That in a man she looks for loyalty, what escort talks like this? Her whole being screams good woman, nothing indicates "escort", I find it so unbelievable now. The mother story also is real, Richard, she was talking about how the mother cannot eat this, cannot eat that, that dialysis will start soon, the details were abundant and too much for a made up story.

If we meet again, I almost feel like clearing the air. Asking about who she went to Pino Latte with, if she is dating other guys, and what her intentions are.

 

But I fear it would be useless, she is adept at hiding things, and why would she speak clearly?

Fact is you NEVER know what is going on, until really revealed, with women but as well men.

In beginning time of meeting my first wife, all should be real good.

It was Friday, November, was going to see her for weekend. Then we still had real cold weather.

Stepped on my motor bike, evening, cold, wet snow and drove to her, just a 40km.

As a drowned cat, complete in cold, I got off motorbike.

First thing she said: "Why are you so late!"  Say what? OK let it be.

 

Same kind of story I red from a guy.

He was married with Thai girl , just before corona.  And was difficult to travel in those years. 2 years of agony.

Then he did go to her, full of excitement to see his wife. There was quite a time span in not seeing each other.

SO he traveled all the way, believe Konkhaen.

First thing she said, guess you know "Why are you so late". I really lmao. 

 

"My" Philippines woman, ffw, at one time made me member in group conference on phone.

Was thinking wtf? Didnt anticipate in it then, it was already done and on my phone.

Listened to what was said, so it was an American she had contact with. And he was also asking who I was.

So she said "Oh He was a business relation" What?!

Yeah was the end then for sure. Or she did it by mistake or on purpose. Never mind, the end.

 

The Thai woman now? 10 years now and I dont even know her. As she is older I have to consider menopause or her once work drove her out of her mind (burn out). After on early pension, she also immediately took up the care of mom ! Another issue is, maybe,  she doesnt have kids and in her mind it is running. A thing which can effect women very negative and intense. She never really opened up about it, even not when I suggested we adopt a child then. 

I think that could now also be a factor.

And didnt matter what I do, talk or what ever, but now something cracked in me.

Im every time talking to a mountain, but the mountain is very big. I stone cold even blunt tell her what is bothering me, but left ear in , right ear out. I try to live with imperfections, but there is a limit one time.

Already told her I will not come to Thailand to stay with her for 5 months and even living in her house.

Answer short sided "you are punishing me" 

me: "no , protecting myself, you punish me, coming to you. I told you what is bothering me"  

Strange is, as further she is away from the family, the better she looks. It is complicated.

I dont walk away easily, maybe my bad, but there are limits.

It seems , it attracts me, lots of weird situations.

 

Your CM girl, bound for many years, school. Loads of people on phone, is status, the more "friends" you can show, the better it looks. ("my woman" has the same) , now freedom for her, but taking care mom a bummer. Exploding in making contacts and keep moving around fast? No time to waste? Mom still want to control? Must find a man before getting too old 30 years ?

People are strange. If they dont reveal, you ll never know and can have quite an impact..Leaving you flabbergasted.

 

You asked her and she gave away already a little. However there could be a thousand things more.

 

See some samples: Silvester Stallone almost divorced wife over a dog, Arnold Schwarzenegger divorced as he humped the maid, Clintons still together after he puts a cigar on a certain place of stagiair and more of course. Tom Brady divorced as he wanted to work longer.

Everything is possible with humans.

Also good when you read Richard Branson was heart broken after his wife died.

I sometimes really envy those people who can stay together for 35 years ! Till death do us part.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, xtrnuno41 said:

You asked her and she gave away already a little. However there could be a thousand things more.

 

This is so true. Like Celsius said, we only see the narrative that is put out for now, but behind the scenes the possibilities are undreamt of, what really motivates this person.

 

Clearly she is apprehensive about having to take care of her dying mother .But she can't escape that situation without looking like a heartless selfish traitor, and no girl wants to be seen like that. 

 

When I asked her how this will be resolved she just said in a resigned manner "I will deal with it when it happens". She is paralyzed, to afraid to even make a decision about it.

 

Maybe she even resents the person who controlled her life for so long, she said even in secondary school she was not allowed a boyfriend. Even now TWICE on separate dates the mother called her to control her, and she felt compelled to take the call even though she was with someone.

 

If she decides to nurse her mother she will be very unhappy. The psychological and physical toll will be terrible. The older sister can't help, as she workes in education. Her glittering CM dating life will die.

 

I got to know her better, yes, but I still only know pieces, like an Impressionist painting. 

 

Ultimately, if she is not attracted to me, if she does not want to be with me, I can't help her. She hardly texted today. Probably on a date again.

 

Maybe she is desperately trying to find someone to escape the situation with her mother, so she can marry and have a reason to live her life. Without a job,  without a husband, she has no reason.

 

All this is mere speculation, we don't really know what goes on behind closed doors.

8 hours ago, Cameroni said:

I texted her to ask what her mother thought of the Japanese objet d'art I gave her, this exquisite Japanese tea cup.

 

She: "It's too small, she wants bigger than that".

 

When the best isn't good enough for mama.

 

Oh well.

 

This is good news.

 

Maybe she wasn't talking about Japanese art....

 

Maybe she was talking about Japanese.

 

There is hope

22 minutes ago, Celsius said:

 

This is good news.

 

Maybe she wasn't talking about Japanese art....

 

Maybe she was talking about Japanese.

 

There is hope

 

There is no other option but to fly in Phuket girl.

 

CM girl wont' write tomorrow about meeting on her birthday on Friday or Saturday. I can feel it in my bones.

 

The girl is not really interested. Or else she would have written at least "thank you" for the umbrella, even if she was disappointed it was just an umbrella.

 

I must say I thought she had perfect manners, but this lack of formality is disappointing.

2 hours ago, Cameroni said:

Maybe she even resents the person who controlled her life for so long, she said even in secondary school she was not allowed a boyfriend. Even now TWICE on separate dates the mother called her to control her, and she felt compelled to take the call even though she was with someone.

 

Did she speak to the mother on the phone in front of you ? or, did she make an excuse to move somewhere quieter ? (where you were out of ear-shot ?).

7 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Did she speak to the mother on the phone in front of you ? or, did she make an excuse to move somewhere quieter ? (where you were out of ear-shot ?).

 

Yes, she spoke to the mother in front of me.

 

She was a little embarassed about it. No idea why she even took the call. 

 

I suppose if the mother is so sick, you always take the call as it could be the last. She never moved out of ear-shot ever. Also texted in front of me without hiding it.