Pattaya Immigration New Visa Rules Changes

[Jingthing]

Well, for one reason, people are now reporting it is for real!

[Pattaya46]

Well, for one reason, people are now reporting it is for real!

People ? Where ? When ?

I read this full thread and no TV member has been yet asked for a copy of their ATM/Credit card...

The only "proof" is (yet) from Pattaya City Expat Club's newsletter :

"Further, a member that recently renewed his retirement visa at Pattaya Immigration confirmed that he was required to provide a copy of a card."

Sorry, but I will wait a little more than that to believe in this (ridiculous) request

[Jingthing]

Denial is not a river in Egypt.

[Mobi]

Such a long discussion for... nothing !

Not any info from the Immigration, from Sunbelt or even from the Bangkok Post,

but only an anonymous email of the "Pattaya City Expats Club's" newsletter !

Please be serious.

I do not understand why moderators did not close this thread long time ago already...

As long as people wish to post, and as long as it doesn't break any of the myriad Thai Visa rules, why on earth should it be closed? IMHO there are far too many threads closed already for no apparent reason.

If you think it's a load of old rubbish, then don't bother to read it.

Others have an interest in this matter.

I suspect that the whole thing came about because one maverick immigration officer asked one hapless farang for a copy of his credit card because he smelled some sort of rat in the farang's financial affairs and thought this would be a good way of establishing if he really had money.

Then the tale came to the ear of our esteemed honorary consul, who spends much of his day at immigration,(advising farangs and drumming up business), and thought that with a bit of embellishing, this would make a good headline for the local rag.

Time will tell, but in the meantime let's see if anyone else receives similar demands.

BTW I doubt whether anyone in immigration could give two hoots whether it breaches the rules of credit card companies to provide such information.

[Jingthing]

No, there are credible reports now. At least one officer in Jomtien is asking this.

[JetsetBkk]

Then the tale came to the ear of our esteemed honorary consul, who spends much of his day at immigration,(advising farangs and drumming up business), and thought that with a bit of embellishing, this would make a good headline for the local rag.

Shouldn't that read: "this would make a good headline for his local rag" ?

[SurfRider]

It's YOUR Credit Card and YOUR private data and YOUR responsibility to keep it confidential.

Whatever your bank says about offering it to anyone doesn't matter.

Immigration has no need for the data and has no right to your private information.

People following the endless diatribe on this issue should be crafty enough to find a way around the problem.

But what about the poor blockhead who hasn't followed this insane issue and stumbles into Pattaya Immigration one day to renew his Retirement Visa and is asked for his Credit Card?

He unwittingly and dutifully produces it from his wallet and exposes himself to flagrant identity fraud and serious financial loss and endless month or years of attempting to set the ship afloat once again?

Be prepared, don't expose yourself, and don't play their silly game!

[Jingthing]

I for one do not like it. But I would comply if demanded because I want the extensions. I would ask for the security code and last 4 digits to be blacked out, and so far reports are this is acceptable. So I am starting to feel this is more excitement than is warranted.

[Pattaya46]

But what about the poor blockhead who is asked for his Credit Card?

And what if he does not a Credit Card ?

It's not (yet) mandatory to enter/stay in Thailand.

I know several retired guys here in this case.

They only have an ATM card of a Thai bank, but with no name on it...

[hughden]

Then the tale came to the ear of our esteemed honorary consul, who spends much of his day at immigration,(advising farangs and drumming up business), and thought that with a bit of embellishing, this would make a good headline for the local rag.

Shouldn't that read: "this would make a good headline for his local rag" ?

It's not his paper. He is employed as the editor.

[stickyb]

Has anybody thought of or tried the idea of using 2 credit cards, photocopy back of one and front of the other?

[Jingthing]

Has anybody thought of or tried the idea of using 2 credit cards, photocopy back of one and front of the other?

I am sure that would be a deportable offense.

Anyway, my understanding is that a Thai bank ATM will do, and most of us have these, right?

[JetsetBkk]

Then the tale came to the ear of our esteemed honorary consul, who spends much of his day at immigration,(advising farangs and drumming up business), and thought that with a bit of embellishing, this would make a good headline for the local rag.

Shouldn't that read: "this would make a good headline for his local rag" ?

It's not his paper. He is employed as the editor.

"Managing Director" I read somewhere.

[SurfRider]

For whatever it's worth, I contacted American Citizen Services at the U.S. Embassy in Bangkok for their comment on the recently established practice of Pattaya Immigration requiring a copy of the front and back of a valid Credit Card when a Retiree renews a Retirement Visa.

My concern is that divulging this information lays the person open to possible Identity Theft and Credit Card Fraud, since various employees, non-employees, family members, couriers, etc. could gain access to this data and use it for nefarious purposes.

If my understanding of the reports that I've read & heard about this practice from people who have been through it so far at Pattaya Immigration is correct, it does not mesh with the story that Pattaya Immigration gave to Bangkok-ACS. I have indicated what I believe to be the suspicious information.

The response from Bangkok-ACS appears below.

Date: Thu, 08 Nov 2007 15:32:33 +0700

From: Bangkok ACS

Subject: RE: New Questionable Immigration Practice

Sir,

We have contacted the Thai Immigration Bureau head office on Soi Suan Plu, where an immigration officer informed us that her office does not require retirees to submit a copy of their credit card. Applicants will need to show a bank statement or a bank book for an account that contains funds that suffice according to their regulations.

Pattaya Immigration informed us that they will ask for a copy of a credit card only for a case in which the applicant cannot provide a bank statement showing monthly income or a bank book that has enough funds. In this case, the applicant can give a copy of a credit card as a proof of their financial status. The officer suggested that the applicant should cross off any information that they think is crucial for fraud protection, i.e. 3 security digits and signature at the back of the card.

Therefore, retirement visa applicants should prepare their bank statement before going to renew their visa. If they can't, they should cross off important information on the copy of their credit card. Another alternative is to come to Bangkok to renew the retirement visa.

Regards,

American Citizen Services

[Maestro]

Thank you, SurfTrader, for having made the effort to obtain this official clarification from Immigration via the US embassy.

--

Maestro

[VBF]

Pattaya Immigration informed us that they will ask for a copy of a credit card only for a case in which the applicant cannot provide a bank statement showing monthly income or a bank book that has enough funds. In this case, the applicant can give a copy of a credit card as a proof of their financial status. The officer suggested that the applicant should cross off any information that they think is crucial for fraud protection, i.e. 3 security digits and signature at the back of the card.

Now it appears that Immigration are trying to help those who don't quite fit in to the existing requirements So this has gone from a major negative to a minor positive. Thanks Surftrader

[NewGuy]

I applied for a renewal of my retirement visa the other day in Jomtien. They took my photo, original of my embassy letter, original of the bank letter, photocopies of the bank book pages, photocopies of all non-blank pages in my passport, copy of my TOT bill (it shows my address in Thai), copy of my rental agreement. The Sgt. Major asked for an ATM card, the request was repeated by the woman sitting along side him. I had earlier opened up an account at a different Thai bank and got an ATM card, just in case I was asked for one. A front and back photocopy of it was then made. I signed all the photocopies. After paying my fee and waiting a day and a half (they were very busy that day and the computer was down when I went the next day) I picked it up today. I handed in my multiple re-entry permit form, passport and photo and paid the fee; this process took about 10 minutes before I walked out, happy to be legal for another year.

[wpcoe]

NewGuy, I think you might be the second first-hand report (see A Friends Response To The Immigration Request In Pattaya, Credit card request, post #57 for the other) to disprove the information in the ACS letter:

Pattaya Immigration informed us that they will ask for a copy of a credit card only for a case in which the applicant cannot provide a bank statement showing monthly income or a bank book that has enough funds.

To be clear, though, did your pension (verified by embassy letter) and savings (verified by bank letter) adequately cover the financial requirements for a retirement extension, i.e. B65,00/mo, B800k or a combo of both?

[lopburi3]

I suspect the key may turn out to be bank account showing foreign deposits on a regular basis or not for those using Embassy letter of income - but we don't have enough detailed reporting to know yet.

[Rooo]

I suspect the key may turn out to be bank account showing foreign deposits on a regular basis or not for those using Embassy letter of income - but we don't have enough detailed reporting to know yet.

They did check the deposit codes in my bank book,for example Siam Commercial Bank, a transfer from overseas will show as X1 .They underlined all these on the photo copies of the bank book.

[NewGuy]

Further to my earlier posting ....

My embassy letter stated that my monthly income was well in excess of 65,000 baht. My bank account had about 30,000 baht. All of the entries in the account were me depositing while in the country. I used to deposit 1,000 a month (can't remember why); now I only deposit my Bupa 10% refund cheques.

This year I had the feeling I was part of a production line; there wasn't the chatting and relaxed approached of past years. The Sgt. Major was totally focused on organizing the papers and in a worse mood than usual. At one point I was signing page after page, came to the originals I provided (which were followed by a couple of more pages to be signed), asked if I should sign the originals, and he grabbed the papers out of my hand.

Oh, well. Wonder what the rules will be next year.

[007]

Has anybody thought of or tried the idea of using 2 credit cards, photocopy back of one and front of the other?

Over time Immigration would become aware of this practice and would come up with other nonsense requirements, e.g. bank statements...

[JetsetBkk]

At one point I was signing page after page, came to the originals I provided (which were followed by a couple of more pages to be signed), asked if I should sign the originals, and he grabbed the papers out of my hand.

I think it helps if you turn up with all the originals already copied, and the copies already signed. He may have been irritated by having to wait for you. He may even have thought your question about signing the originals was "taking the p1ss".

[NewGuy]

Perhaps you are correct about how the question was taken; I was serious, though. I did bring all the copies except for the ATM card ones. If you don't have them you are quickly directed to the photocopy place just outside to the right.

[Gary A]

The last two times I used the income verification, the immigration officer made comments that the embassy letters sometimes did not tell the truth and it resulted in the forty question quiz for me. This year I have transfered 800,000 baht into my Thai bank account and I hope that aggravation has been eliminated. The BS about getting the letter translated and stamped and now the credit card thing tells me that they are discouraging people from using income for their visa extensions.

[Pattaya46]

the immigration officer made comments that the embassy letters sometimes did not tell the truth

Hi,

It's not something new

For France embassy by example, their stamp only means that the English translation is conform to the French original letter, not that the content of the original letter (pension proof) is true !

For USA embassy, their letter only confirm that YOU said that your income was of XXX US$, without any proof, and they do not verify this amount...

... that they are discouraging people from using income for their visa extensions.

I do agree. I would be not surprise if in the future they suppress the "using income facility" for visa extensions and only ask for the 800 kbaht solution.

[Screws]

It hasn't been reported by Pataya Expat Club - www.pattayaexpatsclub.com - so it can't be true. Come on guys, the website of the socalled Pattaya Expat City Club get a click boost by that breaking news. Who couldn't use that in a situation of tough competition ... Anyone know anything about this socalled club, that makes you believe in whatever they write, regardless of how unbelievable it actually is?

From the current PCEC Newsletter "We have been advised by Barry Kenyon that a gentleman requesting a one year Visa refused to provide a copy of his credit or any other similar card – and received instead a notice of deportation in 7 days."

PCEC is due an apology.

[Guderian]

http://www.pattaya2day.com/index.php?actio...ews&id=2631

See the letter entitled "Immigration taking a liberty"

Contrary to SurfTraders previous report (emanating from the US Embassy in BKK) that Jomtien Immigration only want a copy of your debit/credit card in the case that your financial status is dubious, the Editor of Pattaya Today - in a reply to a letter in the latest edition - seems to be saying that it is now a standard requirement, and that it is not even a new requirement! He also says that the card must be in your name, which I assume means that it has to have your name embossed on it. As the 300 Baht ATM debit cards we commonly use in Thailand do not have our names embossed on them, presumably we will not be able to use them (as Jingthing suggested and as I had been hoping)?

Note also that the author of the letter has contacted Visa and what their advice is.

I assume since Mr. Barry Kenyon has some management role in this newspaper, and is also "our man in Pattaya", i.e. the Honorary British Consul there, that he has had some input to the Editor's reply, even if he is not the Editor? Personally, I think that it is downright irresponsible of him to be treating this as simply another minor inconvenience in the long and arduous visa process. The reply from the credit card company is clear: "have nothing to do with such a scheme."

Here's the full text of the letter and reply:

Immigration taking a liberty

I really am put out by the story in Pattaya Today (November 1) that Pattaya immigration now requires applicants for one year retirement visas to present a photocopy of a valid credit card as part of the documents needed. I am absolutely sure this is against international law and the advice of my credit card company, Visa, is to have nothing to do with such a scheme. It is very open to abuse it seems to me.

Alan Farrell

Ed: Yes and no. Applicants and re-pplicants for the one year retirement visa need to photocopy the front and back of a current credit or debit or ATM card (bearing their name), but there is no objection if you ink out the sensitive data or security code. Immigration police have no interest in probing into your personal circumstance or spending your money. The regulation is just another piece of proof (in addition to a letter from your Thai bank and a separate one from your embassy) that you are in good financial standing. As a matter of fact, it is not really a new requirement as a similar scheme was in force some years ago when foreigners wanted an extension on 60 day tourist visas. Incidentally, the card you use may be issued in Thailand or overseas but must still be valid when you make your application.

[Jingthing]

Question:

Can you just show a COPY of the card? Do you have to also show the ACTUAL card?

[VBF]

Question:

Can you just show a COPY of the card? Do you have to also show the ACTUAL card?

And the critical question to which I cannot find an answer "What if you just don't HAVE a credit card, only a local ATM card that doesn't show your name"?

SCB cards are one example and I'm sure there are others.