Myanmar to introduce permanent residence system for foreigners

[impulse]

Gotta say, it's fun to read the guys with 20,000 posts griping about how hard it is to stay as a tourist in Thailand.

I suspect if you were to plot the amount of money spent by an AVERAGE tourist on their first day in Thailand, second day, and on up to their 365th day, (then their 3,650th day) you'd get a curve that crosses the cost/benefit line somewhere around 30 days, and that Thailand is pretty smart in letting just about anyone in for 30 days and making it progressively harder to stay longer as a "tourist".

Now, that's an average tourist. I'm not talking about the super tourists here on TV... They contribute to make Thailand a better place day in and day out.

I have nothing against long stay foreigners, I am one. But let's face it- 1 year or 10+ years isn't tourism. It's something else. And every country in the world has different criteria for staying longer than for a bona fide tourist.

As for Myanmar, I'll hold off until someone who's lived there for 5 years under their new and improved program says it's safe to go in the water...

Edited January 18, 2014 by impulse

[Somtamnication]

yes, all the predictable moans about 'how hard thailand is'.

Myanmar, while holding alot of promise, is 'going to do' a lot of things. Don't hold your breath.

Also remember, this is a country which doesn't recognise the residency and citizenship rights of the Rohingya peoples who have been there generations. You reckon a country like this is going to hand out PR like candy floss to a bunch of dross who can't even qualify for a non-immigrant visa to Thailand?

You're dreaming if you are.

You are a Thai national. I expected that answer from you. You think only a "bunch of dross" are the only ones who would benefit from a PR campaign in Myanmar? Not all of us are sex tourists!

[Arkady]

As Vietnam, Laos, Phillipines, Cambodia and now Myamar are all seeing the positive side of expats and tourism, one can count on said countries will do anything to steal away the expats and tourists from Thailand.

And while those countries are trying to woo the expats, Thailand is trying to do the opposite.

Yes, but how easy is it to obtain permanent residence in those countries? I have never heard of a farang getting PR in any of them, although I have come across a number of farang shysters who claimed they purchased Cambodian nationality for US$30,000 (probably costs more now).

China recently announced an easier route to PR for those working in the tech sector only. For others it is virtually impossible. In Singapore you can get it but need to be the type of person they want (i.e. Chinese). My friend, a farang, was rejected there, despite earning big bucks, without being given reason and his local wife had to use a connection in the ruling party to get it for him - sound familiar. I have no idea about PR in Malaysia but they operate a very nice 10 year renewable retirement visa scheme there (Malaysia My Second Home) for those who can afford it, allowing you to buy land, work part time, import a motor duty free and bring your own domestic servant. India, like Singapore, is racist and discriminates against foreigners who are not of Indian origin. Hong Kong is probably the only place in the region where PR is obtainable based on clear criteria and given out in a transparent way, as in the West, but that is only because they inherited the rules from the British.

[samran]

yes, all the predictable moans about 'how hard thailand is'.

Myanmar, while holding alot of promise, is 'going to do' a lot of things. Don't hold your breath.

Also remember, this is a country which doesn't recognise the residency and citizenship rights of the Rohingya peoples who have been there generations. You reckon a country like this is going to hand out PR like candy floss to a bunch of dross who can't even qualify for a non-immigrant visa to Thailand?

You're dreaming if you are.

You are a Thai national. I expected that answer from you. You think only a "bunch of dross" are the only ones who would benefit from a PR campaign in Myanmar? Not all of us are sex tourists!

eh? Cause I am a Thai national I therefore have an automated predictable response for everything? Get real.

The bunch of dross I was referring to was the moaners on threads like this who come out with the predictable 'see, see, Thailand is really going to get it now...." in response to a vague news article and then go onto complain about how 'hard' Thailand makes it for them cause they have no real reason to stay beyond their 30 day visa run. They are the same type of people who sincerely beleive that they are the sole source of foriegn currency into Thailand.

Of course there are plenty of people here who aren't sex tourists. Tonnes of long term expat employee's, entrapaneurs, those married to a local. None of these people find it especially hard to maintain their visa's, which was my original point.

Edited January 18, 2014 by samran

[TechnikaIII]

Beware Thailand... while you are tightening your laws on immigration, Myanmar will be hot on your heals ready to mop up many farangs that you piss off.

Must be tempting for those who are pissed off with visa runs or trying to find 400,000 baht every year.

The article only says there will be a permanent residence system for foreigners. It does not say what the conditions for obtaining residency will be.

Might be the same as with Thailand.

I doubt that very much, after all Burma was part of our commonwealth, I hope the UK will be one of those exempt from visas. Good for you Myanmar !

I hope USA citizens will be exempt from visas. Time to develop Myanmar.

USA citizens ... time to 'develop' Myanmar ??

More likey RAPE Myanmar, and polute it with everything from Mac-style fat-foot, and that cats piss you call coffee? (I'm refering to Star*ucks, just in case you are wondering) .. and then your bullshit missionaries. Give us a break!

The USA has raped, and is continuing to rape so many countries, interfering with politics, ripping out the natural resources, timer, oil etc, because the poor little 'under developed' country coundn't pay the bill for the highways and the energy plants, that they didn't need in the first place, all of which have been installed by US companies, of course. Geeee, fancy that, hey?

[uptheos]

There will be a lot of face saving by Thailand, so its possible that Thailand wont follow ...

I really do hope that Thailand will give expats the same rights as Soi Dogs

Well, soi dogs are at least Thais. Some of the expat scum I have had the displeasure of seeing, ugly meat-heads on the way from Immigration entry points, heading straight to the bars .... You can be sure that the slovenly, disrespectful attire of so many these 'tourists' and whatever expats, fuels a political agenda to eradicate them.

Most of the soi dogs are better people.

I would hope that Myanmar will enforce a dess code for visitors, as Thailand used to.

"Dress code" ?? I see, you're one of those poor souls that misses the days of men slouched in a cane chair, wearing a rumpled white suit under a slow turning fan, clutching a gin and tonic in a dirty glass? Perhaps you're are the person in the "bombay bloomers" and solar topee?? Long white socks and white shoes escorting memsahib to the Gaut??

If you don't like what you see you could always close your eyes?

Dressing respectfully, say wearing a shirt, is not old colonial time. I remember a guy being turfed out of an immigration office in the 70s when he came in wearing a string vest. No you don't need the white suit and you don't need the colonial outfit, some basic manners enrich us all.

Was his name Oswald?

[theoldgit]

Whilst not wishing to stop people having a point of view on the topic in hand, can members try and not wonder too far off topic.

Just to remind members, this thread is about Myanmar's announcement that they are considering introducing a Permanent Residence system for foreigners.

[Time Traveller]

USA citizens ... time to 'develop' Myanmar ??

More likey RAPE Myanmar, and polute it with everything from Mac-style fat-foot, and that cats piss you call coffee? (I'm refering to Star*ucks, just in case you are wondering) .. and then your bullshit missionaries. Give us a break!

The USA has raped, and is continuing to rape so many countries, interfering with politics, ripping out the natural resources, timer, oil etc, because the poor little 'under developed' country coundn't pay the bill for the highways and the energy plants, that they didn't need in the first place, all of which have been installed by US companies, of course. Geeee, fancy that, hey?

Maybe you should ask the average Burmese person if they would like to have reliable electricity in their home before accusing American foreign investors of crimes against these nation. Did you know that Korean and Chinese and Japanese companies are all building - and have for many years - infrastructure in Burma as well? Do you really think that's any different from American foreign direct investment? And what has the Burmese government and corporations done to give their own citizens what they want?

The average person benefits from the building up of their countries by foreign - yes much is American - investment. It's only the politically motivated that spit out hatred because the foreign expertise just shows them up as phonies and inferior in front of their own citizens. Unfortunately, Technikalll, you sound like you're suffering an inferiority complex as well. Angry little man syndrome

[kranuan]

som nom na thailand

[simon43]

It should be noted that whilst their have been 'western' sanctions in place against doing business with Myanmar for a long time, (and only recently relaxed), these sanctions were never 'global'.

Many countries (China, Thailand, Singapore etc) have been trading with Myanmar for all this time, cstarting and investing in companies in Myanmar, importing and exporting products etc. The infrastructure is certainly lacking, but with the new investment and aid from western nations, this should (slowly) improve.

Possibly the most rapid improvement will be in the telecoms infrastructure, due to the recent issue of mobile network licences to major players in the telecoms sector.

So for hardened expats seeking a place to live/work/ retire, Myanmar could soon be on the list. Just need to create a retirement visa as well....

Simon

[impulse]

Interesting piece in Asia Times:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/SEA-01-230114.html

I'm not passing judgment about accuracy- I don't know enough. Just another data point...

[NeverSure]

I doubt that very much, after all Burma was part of our commonwealth, I hope the UK will be one of those exempt from visas. Good for you Myanmar !

I hope USA citizens will be exempt from visas. Time to develop Myanmar.

USA citizens ... time to 'develop' Myanmar ??

More likey RAPE Myanmar, and polute it with everything from Mac-style fat-foot, and that cats piss you call coffee? (I'm refering to Star*ucks, just in case you are wondering) .. and then your bullshit missionaries. Give us a break!

The USA has raped, and is continuing to rape so many countries, interfering with politics, ripping out the natural resources, timer, oil etc, because the poor little 'under developed' country coundn't pay the bill for the highways and the energy plants, that they didn't need in the first place, all of which have been installed by US companies, of course. Geeee, fancy that, hey?

Try to imagine Thailand and its people without foreign investment. And yes, much of it the US and Japan.

Now the US and Japan are pouring big bucks into Myanmar, planning a new deep sea port, buying huge tracts of industrial land...

And yes the Yangon area is the center of this now and it can't keep up with modern housing and other modern infrastructure. But it's coming. Give it time, and not too long.

In the meantime there are hundreds of other towns and cities in Myanmar that I know nothing about, but I'd like to.

[Arkady]

You'd think some of these countries would study Panama... well-known for wanting to ENCOURAGE foreign retirees and part-timers. In Panama, one can not only OWN property, but there are even incentives, like no property taxes for 20 years! Also, there is a special card that entitles the ex-pat to discounts on lots of purchases: 15% at many restaurants, and up to 40% on rental cars, hotels, shopping, bus and plane travel, etc. A foreigner is also allowed to import a car FREE of tax/duty every two years. Health care is good there, with many doctors being trained in USA since they owned the canal for so many years. One can only dream "The Land of Smiles" might actually study other countries and see how to make things better here... whether that is democratic and election reform, or how they treat foreigners who want to live here. Like I said, it's purely a dream... the skeptics among you saying Thailand will never set aside pride to study foreigners. But Rama V did it well, maybe there is still hope. But meanwhile, MYANMAR could vault, leap way ahead of Thailand by adopting a more Panama-style relationship to foreigners. Otherwise, maybe I'll brush up on my Spanish language and pay another visit to my Panama friends.

So when you moving to Panama then ? or are you not going as it costs more for a lady

Panama has a totally different approach and even sells citizenship. Hard to see Thailand ever moving in that direction. All central Americans can live and work anywhere in Central America. That means there are a lot of Nicaragua women available for hire in Panama.