Anti-graft agency probing rice deals, links to Thai ministers

[Old Man River]

Not YL. I doubt she would personally be involved in this. Others. We wait and see.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Basil B]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

I also heard claims that the money was loaded by friends as his bank accounts had been frozen by the Yingluck administration, it was a legitimate business reason to want to purchase adjacent land to the family farm when it came up for sale.

Of course there were many stories started by the PTP muck spreader.

[pattayaorganic]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

unless you are aware of some law that I am not, I fail to see any legal issue with purchasing land from donated money. There are a million possible legitimate reasons for this and none of them are even an ethical violation.

On the other hand, using tax payer money, fraud, deceit and painted as poor management breaches many laws.

To put these two on the same level, exposes a level of ignorance or bias or both that is beyond reasonable.

[Chris Lawrence]

Like most fraudsters, they think they are smart but get caught when the audit is done. Why don't Govt. insist on audits at the beginning?

"Facing graft probes in connection with the rice-pledging scheme are ex-PM Yingluck Shinawatra, ex-commerce ministers Niwatthamrong Boonsongpaisan, Boonsong Teriyapirom and Yanyong Phuangrach and former deputy commerce minister Poom Sarapol." Maybe a bit early, but how did they do it in their positions? Must have had a few hundred eyes watching them?

If convicted, they need to go to goal .

[robblok]

Like most fraudsters, they think they are smart but get caught when the audit is done. Why don't Govt. insist on audits at the beginning?

"Facing graft probes in connection with the rice-pledging scheme are ex-PM Yingluck Shinawatra, ex-commerce ministers Niwatthamrong Boonsongpaisan, Boonsong Teriyapirom and Yanyong Phuangrach and former deputy commerce minister Poom Sarapol." Maybe a bit early, but how did they do it in their positions? Must have had a few hundred eyes watching them?

If convicted, they need to go to goal .

Most fraudsters get caught not because they are smart but because they are greedy. As part of my training I studied fraud (accountancy training). Most of the time if fraud is small it wont get picked up but people want more and more and it gets bigger and bigger.

For instance instead of destroying the tickets of a movie reselling them (collusion of two employees) as long as they keep it to 1 or 2 people a movie nobody will notice (if they play it right) but once they start to go large they get caught.

Same as selling your own candy in the shop where you work and not registering it.. stock is complete.. just a small drop of turnover.. but once when done too large people get caught.

The moment people get greedy they loose out and get caught.

[billd766]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

Can you remember who brought that claim as I have forgotten.

[Thai at Heart]

Like most fraudsters, they think they are smart but get caught when the audit is done. Why don't Govt. insist on audits at the beginning?

"Facing graft probes in connection with the rice-pledging scheme are ex-PM Yingluck Shinawatra, ex-commerce ministers Niwatthamrong Boonsongpaisan, Boonsong Teriyapirom and Yanyong Phuangrach and former deputy commerce minister Poom Sarapol." Maybe a bit early, but how did they do it in their positions? Must have had a few hundred eyes watching them?

If convicted, they need to go to goal .

Most fraudsters get caught not because they are smart but because they are greedy. As part of my training I studied fraud (accountancy training). Most of the time if fraud is small it wont get picked up but people want more and more and it gets bigger and bigger.

For instance instead of destroying the tickets of a movie reselling them (collusion of two employees) as long as they keep it to 1 or 2 people a movie nobody will notice (if they play it right) but once they start to go large they get caught.

Same as selling your own candy in the shop where you work and not registering it.. stock is complete.. just a small drop of turnover.. but once when done too large people get caught.

The moment people get greedy they loose out and get caught.

This is why agribusiness is often so bent.

a. The volumes are massive

b. The purchase is done in cash.

c. The purchased product is split into many varied grades for sale

d. Products are commoditised and cannot be inspected easily.

e. Sale prices are arbitrarily set by neogtiation.

f. The product goes through some value added processing to be ready for sale.

Believe me, I know. Proper multinational commodities selling and processing firms move their accountants around very very regularly.

Edited July 14, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[Benmart]

I would have thought that an investigation of these companies would have been absolutely routine.

All sounds very generic what they are looking for though. Unusually rich. I thought the shins were amply rich already.

Accumulation of wealth can be tracked via banking institutions, informants, money laundering trails, etc. It is tedious and time consuming. Let's hope the momentum continues and those found guilty are held to answer.

[Chris Lawrence]

Like most fraudsters, they think they are smart but get caught when the audit is done. Why don't Govt. insist on audits at the beginning?

"Facing graft probes in connection with the rice-pledging scheme are ex-PM Yingluck Shinawatra, ex-commerce ministers Niwatthamrong Boonsongpaisan, Boonsong Teriyapirom and Yanyong Phuangrach and former deputy commerce minister Poom Sarapol." Maybe a bit early, but how did they do it in their positions? Must have had a few hundred eyes watching them?

If convicted, they need to go to goal .

Most fraudsters get caught not because they are smart but because they are greedy. As part of my training I studied fraud (accountancy training). Most of the time if fraud is small it wont get picked up but people want more and more and it gets bigger and bigger.

For instance instead of destroying the tickets of a movie reselling them (collusion of two employees) as long as they keep it to 1 or 2 people a movie nobody will notice (if they play it right) but once they start to go large they get caught.

Same as selling your own candy in the shop where you work and not registering it.. stock is complete.. just a small drop of turnover.. but once when done too large people get caught.

The moment people get greedy they loose out and get caught.

Rob, I investigated 2 frauds, one for over $10 million and one $50,000+. Your right, they both got greedy. I am not trained in this area, but just had to sit down and follow the trail.

The reason why they got away with fraud, was very poor balance and checks.

I am just interested in what method these guys used in Government?

[Thai at Heart]

I would have thought that an investigation of these companies would have been absolutely routine.

All sounds very generic what they are looking for though. Unusually rich. I thought the shins were amply rich already.

Accumulation of wealth can be tracked via banking institutions, informants, money laundering trails, etc. It is tedious and time consuming. Let's hope the momentum continues and those found guilty are held to answer.

The money is not going to be sitting in Thailand. It will be offshore.

To be honest, no one wants the figures for rice companies investigated toooooo closely. A lot of this stuff is transfer priced out of the country, with profits sitting in Singapore and Hong Kong. Its always been that way.

[robblok]

Like most fraudsters, they think they are smart but get caught when the audit is done. Why don't Govt. insist on audits at the beginning?

"Facing graft probes in connection with the rice-pledging scheme are ex-PM Yingluck Shinawatra, ex-commerce ministers Niwatthamrong Boonsongpaisan, Boonsong Teriyapirom and Yanyong Phuangrach and former deputy commerce minister Poom Sarapol." Maybe a bit early, but how did they do it in their positions? Must have had a few hundred eyes watching them?

If convicted, they need to go to goal .

Most fraudsters get caught not because they are smart but because they are greedy. As part of my training I studied fraud (accountancy training). Most of the time if fraud is small it wont get picked up but people want more and more and it gets bigger and bigger.

For instance instead of destroying the tickets of a movie reselling them (collusion of two employees) as long as they keep it to 1 or 2 people a movie nobody will notice (if they play it right) but once they start to go large they get caught.

Same as selling your own candy in the shop where you work and not registering it.. stock is complete.. just a small drop of turnover.. but once when done too large people get caught.

The moment people get greedy they loose out and get caught.

Rob, I investigated 2 frauds, one for over $10 million and one $50,000+. Your right, they both got greedy. I am not trained in this area, but just had to sit down and follow the trail.

The reason why they got away with fraud, was very poor balance and checks.

I am just interested in what method these guys used in Government?

I have no idea what kind of methods they used, but it looks to me as if nothing was done before. They expected to be in power and stay in power to keep the inspectors out. Still its hard to prove fraud. I mean if these guys sold rice that was high grade and on paper low grade (so the company buying could later make a killing) then there is no direct money trail to the guy in the government (unless his bribe came in on an private account)

They would have to see that in a storage some good rice was missing and replaced by bad rice, then they have to connect that to a certain order. Now even if that is proven then it still needs to be proven the guy benefited.

*not saying that this is the case here just giving an example of how it can be hard*

[Thai at Heart]

Like most fraudsters, they think they are smart but get caught when the audit is done. Why don't Govt. insist on audits at the beginning?

"Facing graft probes in connection with the rice-pledging scheme are ex-PM Yingluck Shinawatra, ex-commerce ministers Niwatthamrong Boonsongpaisan, Boonsong Teriyapirom and Yanyong Phuangrach and former deputy commerce minister Poom Sarapol." Maybe a bit early, but how did they do it in their positions? Must have had a few hundred eyes watching them?

If convicted, they need to go to goal .

Most fraudsters get caught not because they are smart but because they are greedy. As part of my training I studied fraud (accountancy training). Most of the time if fraud is small it wont get picked up but people want more and more and it gets bigger and bigger.

For instance instead of destroying the tickets of a movie reselling them (collusion of two employees) as long as they keep it to 1 or 2 people a movie nobody will notice (if they play it right) but once they start to go large they get caught.

Same as selling your own candy in the shop where you work and not registering it.. stock is complete.. just a small drop of turnover.. but once when done too large people get caught.

The moment people get greedy they loose out and get caught.

Rob, I investigated 2 frauds, one for over $10 million and one $50,000+. Your right, they both got greedy. I am not trained in this area, but just had to sit down and follow the trail.

The reason why they got away with fraud, was very poor balance and checks.

I am just interested in what method these guys used in Government?

I have no idea what kind of methods they used, but it looks to me as if nothing was done before. They expected to be in power and stay in power to keep the inspectors out. Still its hard to prove fraud. I mean if these guys sold rice that was high grade and on paper low grade (so the company buying could later make a killing) then there is no direct money trail to the guy in the government (unless his bribe came in on an private account)

They would have to see that in a storage some good rice was missing and replaced by bad rice, then they have to connect that to a certain order. Now even if that is proven then it still needs to be proven the guy benefited.

*not saying that this is the case here just giving an example of how it can be hard*

The devil will be in the details of the grade marks. There are god knows how many export types and export grades of product.

Every area, every type and every quality has different prices. Proving the origin of paddy rice into processed rice is virtually impossible once its blended. So what you see as Pathum Thani grade A, could have god knows what rice in it from god knows where.

The only certification a client would have would be from the Thai govt and the buyers own random inspections. Its only when companies like CP make a massive effort to keep Hom Mali as pure Hom Mali that this mixing disappears.

[NeilSA1]

I see the court of Thai Visa has sat and pronounced the verdict already. For those who actually read the OP you may have noticed these qualifiers;

"probing alleged irregularities",

"to identify possible nominees",

"graft panel would also interrogate parents, spouses and children and other people linked to the five to see if there were any suspicions they could have acted as nominees".

"If there were evidence the five had become unusually rich"

"NACC could directly file petitions with the Supreme Court to prosecute them if it had suspicions that any of them had committed asset concealment or submitted a false asset declaration".

Me, personally?, I'll wait until they come up with something that's not an assumption.

Marvelous. Please wait...

Edited July 14, 2014 by NeilSA1

[Baerboxer]

I see the court of Thai Visa has sat and pronounced the verdict already. For those who actually read the OP you may have noticed these qualifiers;

"probing alleged irregularities",

"to identify possible nominees",

"graft panel would also interrogate parents, spouses and children and other people linked to the five to see if there were any suspicions they could have acted as nominees".

"If there were evidence the five had become unusually rich"

"NACC could directly file petitions with the Supreme Court to prosecute them if it had suspicions that any of them had committed asset concealment or submitted a false asset declaration".

Me, personally?, I'll wait until they come up with something that's not an assumption.

What and then deny it if they do?

[scorecard]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

I see the court of Thai Visa has sat and pronounced the verdict already. For those who actually read the OP you may have noticed these qualifiers;

"probing alleged irregularities",

"to identify possible nominees",

"graft panel would also interrogate parents, spouses and children and other people linked to the five to see if there were any suspicions they could have acted as nominees".

"If there were evidence the five had become unusually rich"

"NACC could directly file petitions with the Supreme Court to prosecute them if it had suspicions that any of them had committed asset concealment or submitted a false asset declaration".

Me, personally?, I'll wait until they come up with something that's not an assumption.

How wonderful, the conscience of the world.

You of course never recognize that there are plenty of details already released.

Also true of course ultimately innocent until proven guilty.

[Baerboxer]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

"But Suthep"

Another red troll diversion.

wow.. what a true blue numpty your are! Anything that disagrees with your thought patterns is a "red troll"? So justice for some but not for others is what you're saying, right? Dimwits like you start wars.

Your insults to other posters intelligence must come close to getting your posts removed for insulting them. Read the forum rules sometime.

This post is about former PTP leaders, the rice scheme and possible corruption.

Introducing Suthep could be taken as trying to divert the thread away from the possible criminal guilt of PTP cabinet members.

You could have equally asked when they will get around to trying to extradite fugitive Thaksin to serve his sentence and face the other 15 charges. They do need to investigate these "claims" as the 15 are already waiting his court appearance.

Or maybe pursue the investigation on Tarit for land encroachment or Chalerm for avoiding import tax on cars or both of them for abuse of power? Or maybe pursue questions on the large Budget apparently spent by CAPO or the passport illegally issued to the criminal fugitive Thaksin.

Plenty to go at without even mentioning Suthep.

[Robby nz]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

"But Suthep"

Another red troll diversion.

wow.. what a true blue numpty your are! Anything that disagrees with your thought patterns is a "red troll"? So justice for some but not for others is what you're saying, right? Dimwits like you start wars.

My thought process was on the topic on hand and you in your red diversion, which was a poor attempt to defend your heros was nothing but a troll.

I would suggest that if you have proof that Suthep bought land with donated money then you should take that proof to the police, NACC or the military or all three otherwise it is just a PT rumor in an attempt to discredit him.

If you have nothing to add to the actual topic then it would be a great idea if you stopped posting .

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

He said some sacks were infested with weevils and at one stage the inspection team - which included military officers - had to flee a warehouse after being swarmed by weevils.

From the description, it sounds like a few more than "some sacks" were probably infested by weevils, especially if they're "swarming" people walking around the area.

Has anyone else noticed lately, a lot of the grocery stores/supermarkets seem to be having regular discount sales on various of their Thai rice products? Seems much much more common right now than it was a few years in the past. Probably because there are tons and tons of old, infested, decaying rice sitting around getting old.

Unfortunately, even some of the supposedly "good" and higher-level brands of Thai jasmine rice we've bought in the markets lately have turned out of have weevils.

[Robby nz]

I would have thought that an investigation of these companies would have been absolutely routine.

All sounds very generic what they are looking for though. Unusually rich. I thought the shins were amply rich already.

That's what Thaksin said wasn't it, but he lied.

He couldn't help himself he had to cheat and steal to increase his wealth even though he didn't need to.

If he had been honest he would have been a great man and a great PM and probably still PM to this day with the country being years ahead of where it is now.

Look where his theft and corruption has got him, and dragged his family and cronies along behind.

And worse still look what it has done to the country.

I would have thought this type of investigation should have been ongoing ages ago. Why haven't the NACC done anything about it, if they are trying to get Yingluck for dereliction of duty? How on earth are they going to discover nominees of people in rice companies? Every single large rice company has a family member who is part of the agriculture ministry, or an MP, or in local government. It is the very nature of Thai businesses like Rice to have massive connections on ALL political parties, if they can. If they want to find corruption in rice, they need to look in Singapore where they bulk of the profits from these exports sits. You think the money from rice really gets accumulated at the port in Bangkok? Hardly.

Unfortunately, Thaksin is a businessman who only understands winning and losing. Even in that escapade he won massively by being granted a license. He is incapable of walking the middle path of politics. You need to do more reading about the role of 97, and why it inspired him to get into politics in a bigger way. His basic distrust, even hatred of the Dems and their control of businesses in the country, meaning that basically everything is Bangkok centric in the country.

I don't fear for economic future of the country, it will sort itself out, I fear for where does Thailand go next. Other than Thaksin, there are no figureheads for the people to follow. There is NO ONE who resonates with the poor at all. Thailand was running around for 30 years building the Eastern Seaboard and Bangkok and forgot there is a damn big country out there. That was not Thaksin's fault.

You should take your obviously vast knowledge of the political connections in the rice industry to the NACC they would probably be very thankful for your input, with proof of course.

No need to make excuses for Thaksin he turned out to be a greedy crook when there was no need as he was already rich.

Sure the country will carry on forward however the rice scheme will have ongoing negative implications for several years into the future that will slow any growth and will impact worst on the main rice growing areas of the country, the central plain, the north and northeast.

[The Deerhunter]

probing alleged irregularities in the rice-pledging scheme's financial transactions to identify possible nominees linked to five former ministers under investigation

Just as Thaksin hid his wealth with his maid and chauffeur, the authorities want to identify who is accepting money for these five ex-officials. I was just reading an article about the accounting firm Price Waterhouse-Coopers (google 'bringing the fraudsters to book') and their methods of discovering corruption within companies. I think it would be worthwhile to employ them to check all related government computers (for even erased data and emails) to find out who was involved with whom and who got what from/for whom.

http://www.pwc.com/th/en/consulting/forensic/investigations-and-forensic-accounting.jhtml

PwC....more scandals of their own than you could poke a stick at. Tyco? Yukos. Satyam. A very long list of others.

Warning, warning red troll diversion do not bite.

What no..........."But, but, but, but, but Suthep???????????????" LOL

Hate to show my ignorance but I assume thaese are all previous Dem govt ministers, in which case so be it is there is evidence. But if PTP were so great, efficient & squeaky clean, they should have have been the ones investigating those names, not Prbkk a TVF poster suggesting it to us now. But, as you say, let us not be sidetracked. Let them get on and deal with the allegations against government that brought the house of cards down first, shall we? Who knows, maybe they are all honest & squeaky clean. Yeah, right!!!

Edited July 14, 2014 by The Deerhunter

[Thai at Heart]

I would have thought that an investigation of these companies would have been absolutely routine.

All sounds very generic what they are looking for though. Unusually rich. I thought the shins were amply rich already.

That's what Thaksin said wasn't it, but he lied.

He couldn't help himself he had to cheat and steal to increase his wealth even though he didn't need to.

If he had been honest he would have been a great man and a great PM and probably still PM to this day with the country being years ahead of where it is now.

Look where his theft and corruption has got him, and dragged his family and cronies along behind.

And worse still look what it has done to the country.

I would have thought this type of investigation should have been ongoing ages ago. Why haven't the NACC done anything about it, if they are trying to get Yingluck for dereliction of duty? How on earth are they going to discover nominees of people in rice companies? Every single large rice company has a family member who is part of the agriculture ministry, or an MP, or in local government. It is the very nature of Thai businesses like Rice to have massive connections on ALL political parties, if they can. If they want to find corruption in rice, they need to look in Singapore where they bulk of the profits from these exports sits. You think the money from rice really gets accumulated at the port in Bangkok? Hardly.

Unfortunately, Thaksin is a businessman who only understands winning and losing. Even in that escapade he won massively by being granted a license. He is incapable of walking the middle path of politics. You need to do more reading about the role of 97, and why it inspired him to get into politics in a bigger way. His basic distrust, even hatred of the Dems and their control of businesses in the country, meaning that basically everything is Bangkok centric in the country.

I don't fear for economic future of the country, it will sort itself out, I fear for where does Thailand go next. Other than Thaksin, there are no figureheads for the people to follow. There is NO ONE who resonates with the poor at all. Thailand was running around for 30 years building the Eastern Seaboard and Bangkok and forgot there is a damn big country out there. That was not Thaksin's fault.

You should take your obviously vast knowledge of the political connections in the rice industry to the NACC they would probably be very thankful for your input, with proof of course.

No need to make excuses for Thaksin he turned out to be a greedy crook when there was no need as he was already rich.

Sure the country will carry on forward however the rice scheme will have ongoing negative implications for several years into the future that will slow any growth and will impact worst on the main rice growing areas of the country, the central plain, the north and northeast.

I talk from experience of having worked in a rathe large multinational agribusiness in Thailand for quite a few years. Go off and google the history of the banks in Thailand, then go off and google the major families in the Democrat parties, and then look up connections to agriculture.

You might learn something. The rice mess if gone and dusted as far as rice buyers are concerned probably. They have bought most of what they are going to buy from the stocks already, and are moving on.

I don't know anyone has proven that the Shins got one satang out of the rice mess. Maybe you should enlighten the NACC yourself.

[The Deerhunter]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

I am not sure if that got any traction anyhere except from red trolls casting a hook on TVF. Pipkin will know. Watch this space.

[The Deerhunter]

I would have thought that an investigation of these companies would have been absolutely routine.

All sounds very generic what they are looking for though. Unusually rich. I thought the shins were amply rich already.

That's what Thaksin said wasn't it, but he lied.

He couldn't help himself he had to cheat and steal to increase his wealth even though he didn't need to.

If he had been honest he would have been a great man and a great PM and probably still PM to this day with the country being years ahead of where it is now.

Look where his theft and corruption has got him, and dragged his family and cronies along behind.

And worse still look what it has done to the country.

I would have thought this type of investigation should have been ongoing ages ago. Why haven't the NACC done anything about it, if they are trying to get Yingluck for dereliction of duty? How on earth are they going to discover nominees of people in rice companies? Every single large rice company has a family member who is part of the agriculture ministry, or an MP, or in local government. It is the very nature of Thai businesses like Rice to have massive connections on ALL political parties, if they can. If they want to find corruption in rice, they need to look in Singapore where they bulk of the profits from these exports sits. You think the money from rice really gets accumulated at the port in Bangkok? Hardly.

Unfortunately, Thaksin is a businessman who only understands winning and losing. Even in that escapade he won massively by being granted a license. He is incapable of walking the middle path of politics. You need to do more reading about the role of 97, and why it inspired him to get into politics in a bigger way. His basic distrust, even hatred of the Dems and their control of businesses in the country, meaning that basically everything is Bangkok centric in the country.

I don't fear for economic future of the country, it will sort itself out, I fear for where does Thailand go next. Other than Thaksin, there are no figureheads for the people to follow. There is NO ONE who resonates with the poor at all. Thailand was running around for 30 years building the Eastern Seaboard and Bangkok and forgot there is a damn big country out there. That was not Thaksin's fault.

He could have been the great leader but he went over to "the dark side."

P.S. Actually, BTW it is no ones fault that Port Bangkok and the eastern Seaboard are more convenient for major manufacturing for export of big things like cars, trucks tractors, refrigerators etc than Chiang Mai, Khon Kaen or Pitchit. Keeping your internal transport costs low is a great way to remain competitive with smart people overseas who do keep their industry competitive. PPS. If that were Thaksoin's goal why was the main triunk service not upgraded & double-tracked to improve internal transport instead of postulating bullet-trains? Sorry: Rhetorical question. Sorry. Back to the post, but had to answer that.

[The Deerhunter]

I see the court of Thai Visa has sat and pronounced the verdict already. For those who actually read the OP you may have noticed these qualifiers;

"probing alleged irregularities",

"to identify possible nominees",

"graft panel would also interrogate parents, spouses and children and other people linked to the five to see if there were any suspicions they could have acted as nominees".

"If there were evidence the five had become unusually rich"

"NACC could directly file petitions with the Supreme Court to prosecute them if it had suspicions that any of them had committed asset concealment or submitted a false asset declaration".

Me, personally?, I'll wait until they come up with something that's not an assumption.

Legally, you are correct. Still, where there's smoke, there's fire.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Open up the closet of any large rice exporter and any thai politician and the smoke comes billowing out. You really think they are going to patch together the accounts of this stuff and find a cheque or a cash transfer somewhere saying "Pay. Y. Shinawtra"

I won't hold my breath. The fact they even have to say they are investigating means they haven't got a clue.

Perhaps. (You hope!!!)

[Alwyn]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

"But Suthep"

Another red troll diversion.

wow.. what a true blue numpty your are! Anything that disagrees with your thought patterns is a "red troll"? So justice for some but not for others is what you're saying, right? Dimwits like you start wars.

My thought process was on the topic on hand and you in your red diversion, which was a poor attempt to defend your heros was nothing but a troll.

I would suggest that if you have proof that Suthep bought land with donated money then you should take that proof to the police, NACC or the military or all three otherwise it is just a PT rumor in an attempt to discredit him.

If you have nothing to add to the actual topic then it would be a great idea if you stopped posting .

What are you, my dad? If you don't like what I'm saying then I suggest you stop posting or stop reading. The idea of an investigation is to find proof, right? This might well be a rumour, but not started by me - during the protests there was a post here about this. At the moment the notion that Yingluck is involved in the rice scam is a rumour too but the authorities are going to investigate to see if there's any grounds to this and if a prosecution is in order and rightly so. The moment I mention Suthep various numpties start throwing there toys out of the pram and say "prove it". That's the job of the investigators and as Suthep is quite well known for his dodgy land deals on land he could not possibly afford on his salary in his son's name, maybe there is basis to the "rumour" however distasteful that might seem to you

[Alwyn]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

"But Suthep"

Another red troll diversion.

wow.. what a true blue numpty your are! Anything that disagrees with your thought patterns is a "red troll"? So justice for some but not for others is what you're saying, right? Dimwits like you start wars.

Your insults to other posters intelligence must come close to getting your posts removed for insulting them. Read the forum rules sometime.

This post is about former PTP leaders, the rice scheme and possible corruption.

Introducing Suthep could be taken as trying to divert the thread away from the possible criminal guilt of PTP cabinet members.

You could have equally asked when they will get around to trying to extradite fugitive Thaksin to serve his sentence and face the other 15 charges. They do need to investigate these "claims" as the 15 are already waiting his court appearance.

Or maybe pursue the investigation on Tarit for land encroachment or Chalerm for avoiding import tax on cars or both of them for abuse of power? Or maybe pursue questions on the large Budget apparently spent by CAPO or the passport illegally issued to the criminal fugitive Thaksin.

Plenty to go at without even mentioning Suthep.

"Introducing Suthep could be taken as trying to divert the thread away from the possible criminal guilt of PTP cabinet members." Really? You think I might divert the investigators attention by a post here? People like you make me queasy and sick to my stomach. You read something you don't like as it is regarding one of your heroes and you begin to whine about it. I asked the question "I wonder if they will ever get around to investigating Suthep" And I have to say, the replies I got just show how insecure a lot of people are about there little favourite minion of the rich!

[Alwyn]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

Can you remember who brought that claim as I have forgotten.

I seem to remember reading about this here on TV.

[Thai at Heart]

I would have thought that an investigation of these companies would have been absolutely routine.

All sounds very generic what they are looking for though. Unusually rich. I thought the shins were amply rich already.

That's what Thaksin said wasn't it, but he lied.

He couldn't help himself he had to cheat and steal to increase his wealth even though he didn't need to.

If he had been honest he would have been a great man and a great PM and probably still PM to this day with the country being years ahead of where it is now.

Look where his theft and corruption has got him, and dragged his family and cronies along behind.

And worse still look what it has done to the country.

I would have thought this type of investigation should have been ongoing ages ago. Why haven't the NACC done anything about it, if they are trying to get Yingluck for dereliction of duty? How on earth are they going to discover nominees of people in rice companies? Every single large rice company has a family member who is part of the agriculture ministry, or an MP, or in local government. It is the very nature of Thai businesses like Rice to have massive connections on ALL political parties, if they can. If they want to find corruption in rice, they need to look in Singapore where they bulk of the profits from these exports sits. You think the money from rice really gets accumulated at the port in Bangkok? Hardly.

Unfortunately, Thaksin is a businessman who only understands winning and losing. Even in that escapade he won massively by being granted a license. He is incapable of walking the middle path of politics. You need to do more reading about the role of 97, and why it inspired him to get into politics in a bigger way. His basic distrust, even hatred of the Dems and their control of businesses in the country, meaning that basically everything is Bangkok centric in the country.

I don't fear for economic future of the country, it will sort itself out, I fear for where does Thailand go next. Other than Thaksin, there are no figureheads for the people to follow. There is NO ONE who resonates with the poor at all. Thailand was running around for 30 years building the Eastern Seaboard and Bangkok and forgot there is a damn big country out there. That was not Thaksin's fault.

He could have been the great leader but he went over to "the dark side."

P.S. Actually, BTW it is no ones fault that Port Bangkok and the eastern Seaboard are more convenient for major manufacturing for export of big things like cars, trucks tractors, refrigerators etc than Chiang Mai, Khon Kaen or Pitchit. Keeping your internal transport costs low is a great way to remain competitive with smart people overseas who do keep their industry competitive. PPS. If that were Thaksoin's goal why was the main triunk service not upgraded & double-tracked to improve internal transport instead of postulating bullet-trains? Sorry: Rhetorical question. Sorry. Back to the post, but had to answer that.

Indeed. When they postulated how many workers they needed for the development, of course no one bothered to note that the plan was to empty isaan and transport a couple of million people to the eastern seaboard.

Go to Rayong. Half the people are from Khon Kaen, roi et and Udon.

[Alwyn]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

unless you are aware of some law that I am not, I fail to see any legal issue with purchasing land from donated money. There are a million possible legitimate reasons for this and none of them are even an ethical violation.

On the other hand, using tax payer money, fraud, deceit and painted as poor management breaches many laws.

To put these two on the same level, exposes a level of ignorance or bias or both that is beyond reasonable.

Are you aware of fraud? If you donate 1000 baht to support a cause and you discovered the money was not being used to support a cause but to buy a car, land, prostitute.. Would you not think that was fraudulent? Let me put it another way, if Thaksin had done the same how loud would you be shouting about it? The only ignorance here would be yours, whatever Thakin or his lackies do is fraud. Whatever Suthep or his lackies do is okay. How's your bias these days?

[Alwyn]

If they've done criminal activities or look as if they've been criminal in this they should rightly be investigated. I wonder if they'll ever get around to investigating the claims that Suthep bought land using donation money from the protests?

I also heard claims that the money was loaded by friends as his bank accounts had been frozen by the Yingluck administration, it was a legitimate business reason to want to purchase adjacent land to the family farm when it came up for sale.

Of course there were many stories started by the PTP muck spreader.

This is my whole point Basil. You heard money was loaded up to his bank account by his friends, other people heard different. What is the big issue here with investigating it. If it was Thaksin or one if his henchmen that had done this everybody would be shouting fraud etc. If the outcome was that what Suthep did was legitimate then all good and well and people (like me) can shut up, right?