Camerata's Guide To The Permanent Residence Process

[onthemoon]

1 hour ago, rimmae2 said:

1 hour is sufficient unless there is a queue.

 

Thank you!

[Naiyana]

I need to change my passport - I will do it in my home country. Would that be a problem when I’m entering Thailand? Or would it be better if I do it in my embassy in Thailand? And would I have to change the passport number in PR book and Alien book? 

Thank you!

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, Naiyana said:

I need to change my passport - I will do it in my home country. Would that be a problem when I’m entering Thailand? Or would it be better if I do it in my embassy in Thailand? And would I have to change the passport number in PR book and Alien book? 

Thank you!

 

If you have say 7 to 10 days before it's critical, suggest you send an English language e.mail to:

 

• Division1 Immigration (at) gmail.com

 

They usually respond within a few days and usually clear answers.

 

Good luck. 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

55 minutes ago, Naiyana said:

I need to change my passport - I will do it in my home country. Would that be a problem when I’m entering Thailand? Or would it be better if I do it in my embassy in Thailand? And would I have to change the passport number in PR book and Alien book? 

Thank you!

 

I renewed my passport while out of the country once and had no problem coming back to Thailand. I showed both the new passport and the old passport with the still valid non-quota immigrant visa along with the TM 17 with the valid endorsement and was stamped in without comment by the officer.

 

I got a new non-quota immigrant visa and a new endorsement a few weeks later and submitted both the new and old passports with my TM 17 and police book. I am not aware of any requirement for a PR holder to otherwise notify the Immigration Department when getting a new passport. Perhaps another PR holder can advise where there is such a requirement.

 

No need to make a special trip to the police station to update the red police book. 

 

 

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

 

I renewed my passport while out of the country once and had no problem coming back to Thailand. I showed both the new passport and the old passport with the still valid non-quota immigrant visa along with the TM 17 with the valid endorsement and was stamped in without comment by the officer.

 

I got a new non-quota immigrant visa and a new endorsement a few weeks later and submitted both the new and old passports with my TM 17 and police book. I am not aware of any requirement for a PR holder to otherwise notify the Immigration Department when getting a new passport. Perhaps another PR holder can advise where there is such a requirement.

 

No need to make a special trip to the police station to update the red police book. 

 

 

 

I have Thai PR (27 years) and replaced my Australian passport two or three times in that period, because of 10 year expiry / validity, but never tangled in any way with travel in and out, so I don't have any specific knowledge know about change of address / new passport number etc. 

 

But regarding the Red covered Police Registration book I'm aware that prompt update of address in the red book is not taken seriously, as long as the holder does the 5 year update.

 

I do this at the police city centre here in Chiang Mai muang, my Thai adult son always goes with me, the cop who handles this speaks good English and is very pleasant.

 

I was in Australia when the 5 year update was looming, my son went alone to the police centre with a copy of my red police book, explained to the same polie guy that there was difficulty to return to LOS because of Covid.

 

The police guy instantly said 'don't worry at all about that, just be sure you bring your dad t with the original book quickly after he does return, so we can do an update'.

 

Son responded 'but it maybe a year or more late'. Cop responded 'not a problem and he wrote a quick note in the copy of my red book and gave it back to my son. 

 

Police guy asked my son how old I was, son responded 78 yo.

 

Police guy responded 'we are aware that several very old foreigners are several years overdue to do their 5 year update, it's not a problem, but your dad has your help so please watch this and keep it updated.'

 

Son asked 'could I bring dad's red book and you speak to him on a LINE video chat?'.

 

Policeman man said 'i've never done that because the actual regulation says 'report in person', but maybe the regulation can be changed, however as per our discussion it's not a serious problem.' 

[Michael Hare]

3 hours ago, Naiyana said:

I need to change my passport - I will do it in my home country. Would that be a problem when I’m entering Thailand? Or would it be better if I do it in my embassy in Thailand? And would I have to change the passport number in PR book and Alien book? 

Thank you!

In my PR book and Alien book there is no mention of my passport number. The main thing is to have the reentry permit in your new passport if you are using that to reenter Thailand using your new passport. I am not sure how you can do that. I guess you depart from Thailand using your old passport with the rentry permit and then you get your new passport in your home country with no reentry permit. I think you then must show the old invalid passport at Thai immigration when you return, showing your reentry permit and the also new valid passport to actually enter. 

 

I always get my new passports mailed to me through the post from my home country. My embassy will not issue passports. 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

4 hours ago, scorecard said:

 

I have Thai PR (27 years) and replaced my Australian passport two or three times in that period, because of 10 year expiry / validity, but never tangled in any way with travel in and out, so I don't have any specific knowledge know about change of address / new passport number etc. 

 

But regarding the Red covered Police Registration book I'm aware that prompt update of address in the red book is not taken seriously, as long as the holder does the 5 year update.

 

I do this at the police city centre here in Chiang Mai muang, my Thai adult son always goes with me, the cop who handles this speaks good English and is very pleasant.

 

I was in Australia when the 5 year update was looming, my son went alone to the police centre with a copy of my red police book, explained to the same polie guy that there was difficulty to return to LOS because of Covid.

 

The police guy instantly said 'don't worry at all about that, just be sure you bring your dad t with the original book quickly after he does return, so we can do an update'.

 

Son responded 'but it maybe a year or more late'. Cop responded 'not a problem and he wrote a quick note in the copy of my red book and gave it back to my son. 

 

Police guy asked my son how old I was, son responded 78 yo.

 

Police guy responded 'we are aware that several very old foreigners are several years overdue to do their 5 year update, it's not a problem, but your dad has your help so please watch this and keep it updated.'

 

Son asked 'could I bring dad's red book and you speak to him on a LINE video chat?'.

 

Policeman man said 'i've never done that because the actual regulation says 'report in person', but maybe the regulation can be changed, however as per our discussion it's not a serious problem.' 

 

I've always been punctual with my 5-year check-ins with my police book. Last time I went, Mrs. Shrdlu came with me and asked the police officer what would happen if we were late making the report. I think she was a bit annoyed at my being so insistent on not missing the report date.

 

The officer said it was no big deal, but if it was more than a few months late, they might have to request the file from wherever they are kept offsite. If I understood correctly, the file is kept at a central storage location and only shipped out to the individual police stations a bit in advance of the expected reporting date and get shipped back after the date, apparently regardless of whether the report was made or not. 

[scorecard]

3 hours ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

 

I've always been punctual with my 5-year check-ins with my police book. Last time I went, Mrs. Shrdlu came with me and asked the police officer what would happen if we were late making the report. I think she was a bit annoyed at my being so insistent on not missing the report date.

 

The officer said it was no big deal, but if it was more than a few months late, they might have to request the file from wherever they are kept offsite. If I understood correctly, the file is kept at a central storage location and only shipped out to the individual police stations a bit in advance of the expected reporting date and get shipped back after the date, apparently regardless of whether the report was made or not. 

 My police file has been 'stored' at 2 locations:

 

- Bunglamung Police Centre and lock up (Pattaya / Chonburi)(where the red book was issued) and the file retrieved from a filing cabinet in that office on the date when I went in well in advance of the initial 1 year and again well in advance of the next 5 year reporting.

 

Later we moved to Chiang Mai. I went to the Bunglamung police centre, the officer retrieved my hanging from the same filing cabinet and said "I will prepare a standard letter about changing address to put n the envelop with the documents we are holding here, you must collect the envelope tomorrow and you have 7 days to report to the appropriate Police station in Chiang Mai and give them the envelope.

 

I reported to the Chiang Mai City Police Centre about 3 days later, and gave them the envelope. The Chiang Mai office scanned the documents quickly then took a new hanging file and put my name on the tab on the hanging file. He then said 'coming soon you will need to do the 5 year reporting update, do you want to do it today? I agreed and 10 minutes later the update all done.

 

Twice I've been back to the Chiang Mai Police Centre and both times the officer found my name in the red book then took the matching hanging folder / file from his filing cabinet. 

[rimmae2]

21 hours ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

 

I renewed my passport while out of the country once and had no problem coming back to Thailand. I showed both the new passport and the old passport with the still valid non-quota immigrant visa along with the TM 17 with the valid endorsement and was stamped in without comment by the officer.

 

I got a new non-quota immigrant visa and a new endorsement a few weeks later and submitted both the new and old passports with my TM 17 and police book. I am not aware of any requirement for a PR holder to otherwise notify the Immigration Department when getting a new passport. Perhaps another PR holder can advise where there is such a requirement.

As per my experience. Another time the Non-Quota Immigrant Visa was stamped in a new replacement for my 2nd passport, whereas the existing visa was in 1st passport which I planned to replace (this was done at CW Immigration without any questions).

[stratocaster]

On 12/12/2023 at 1:58 AM, stratocaster said:

Just in case anyone has been waiting for the lowdown on easy PR, here is the meeting result. Of course as with all vloggers it was just a heap of clickbait. The 10minute meeting with his farang "lawyer" who is not a lawyer but the general manager of a law firm turned out to be an advert for the law firm detailing how for a monthly retainer they would smooth your stay in Thailand. PR was never mentioned. Out of interest, the vlogger claims he is entitled to PR because married to a Thai citizen for 15 years, he brings in and spends more money than the average Joe and he speaks Thai reasonably well.

Just to update, as of yesterday he has stated that in around 6 weeks time he has his first interview for PR.

[scorecard]

51 minutes ago, stratocaster said:

Just to update, as of yesterday he has stated that in around 6 weeks time he has his first interview for PR.

So 'he' is claiming Thai PR on the basis of:

- because married to a Thai citizen for 15 years, he brings in and spends more money than the average Joe and he speaks Thai reasonably well.

 

Nothing mentioned about having worked in Thailand for at least 3 consecutive years with a Thai work permit (WP) and that WP still valid, and proof or having submitted a Thai personal tax return for same period and proof that any tax payable had been paid.

 

Everything in my para immediately above is very relevant and is the normal core requirement to gain Thai PR.

 

It's been mentioned before there's a very small number of cases where other circumstances have also taken into consideration, but not 'I spend big every month'...

 

No doubt 'he' will be back with a full report of the meeting with the police committee.

[jayboy]

17 hours ago, stratocaster said:

Just to update, as of yesterday he has stated that in around 6 weeks time he has his first interview for PR.

 

Are you going to post a link?

[jayboy]

On 4/2/2024 at 5:36 PM, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

If I understood correctly, the file is kept at a central storage location and only shipped out to the individual police stations a bit in advance of the expected reporting date and get shipped back after the date, apparently regardless of whether the report was made or not. 

 

I would be amazed if this was the case, not least because it would require a degree of organization that is normally entirely absent.My impression is that the file stays at the relevant police station.

 

As an aside I would further suggest there is nothing in the police system that would lead to follow up on PRs who didn't do the 5 year renewal.It would however be noticed at Immigration if the PR wanted to travel abroad.But for the PR oldster who never travels I wonder if failure to check in every 5 years would be noticed at all.

 

 

[onthemoon]

17 minutes ago, jayboy said:

As an aside I would further suggest there is nothing in the police system that would lead to follow up on PRs who didn't do the 5 year renewal.It would however be noticed at Immigration if the PR wanted to travel abroad.But for the PR oldster who never travels I wonder if failure to check in every 5 years would be noticed at all.

FWIW I once forgot to renew, and it was several months later. I got fined a few hundred Baht (with receipt), no problem.

 

Another time when I wanted to renew my work permit and the renewal of the police book was due in three months, the labour department said I would have to extend the police book first, otherwise they can give only 3 months on the work permit. Hm.

 

I also think that Immigration checks the validity when I do my yearly visa/endorsement run to Chaeng Wattana.

[scorecard]

19 hours ago, scorecard said:

So 'he' is claiming Thai PR on the basis of:

- because married to a Thai citizen for 15 years, he brings in and spends more money than the average Joe and he speaks Thai reasonably well.

 

Nothing mentioned about having worked in Thailand for at least 3 consecutive years with a Thai work permit (WP) and that WP still valid, and proof or having submitted a Thai personal tax return for same period and proof that any tax payable had been paid.

 

Everything in my para immediately above is very relevant and is the normal core requirement to gain Thai PR.

 

It's been mentioned before there's a very small number of cases where other circumstances have also taken into consideration, but not 'I spend big every month'...

 

No doubt 'he' will be back with a full report of the meeting with the police committee.

I'll add another point.

 

I've heard PR holders say that 1 day over the 5 year requirement to update the Red Police book will bring cancellation of PR / will mean the local police cancel your PR status.

 

This is not correct. PR status is 'controlled' by a special team within the RTP - the Thai Immigration Bureau. Other police (e.g. local police including a policeman who does the red book update at selected police stations) do not have the authority or responsibility to cancel PR.

 

Also the local police including a policeman who does the red book update at selected police stations doesn't have any official line of communication with the Thai Immigration Bureau. I asked about this when I returned to LOS well over he 5 year period after the Covid- 19 situation had reduced and travel in and out had become much easier. The local police guy indicated clearly that late update of the red book (regardless of Covid- 19) was not reported to the Thai Immigration Bureau and there is no process to do that.

 

As already mentioned he also told me and my adult Thai son that the police who handle the red book update are well aware that there's several very old farang who are always very late to do the update and/or haven't done the 5 year update for many years.

 

He said clearly, 'this is not a problem, we don't follow up on these cases, they could be fined (very small fine) but I (police guy) have never done that, and it has no affect on the PR status of the foreigner.

 

He did also mention that he was aware that foreigners must get an exit and r-entry stamp in their passport before they travel abroad but that was an Immigration office function and not a police matter. 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

7 hours ago, jayboy said:

 

I would be amazed if this was the case, not least because it would require a degree of organization that is normally entirely absent.My impression is that the file stays at the relevant police station.

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, I find it a bit surprising as well, but the officer definitely said something about having to retrieve files and I thought he referred to somewhere other than the local station. I could have misunderstood part of his explanation and it has been a few years now since that conversation, so I hold out the possibility I may have misunderstood or don't remember exactly what he said.

[kiwiaussie]

On 4/3/2024 at 2:13 PM, stratocaster said:

Just to update, as of yesterday he has stated that in around 6 weeks time he has his first interview for PR.

yep, a link to this vlog would be great if possible.  

[scorecard]

On 4/4/2024 at 4:10 PM, kiwiaussie said:

yep, a link to this vlog would be great if possible.  

 

Hope we see some details, could be interesting.

[stratocaster]

Regarding a link to the person claiming he is entitled to PR due to being "rich" and married to Thai. I have been reluctant to say who it is as he is an eight year veteran of Thailand who has a very limited knowledge of things Thai. His site is notime2besad. But I must warn you that you will have to trawl through 29 minutes of drivel per vlog to extract 1 minute of his reasoning for PR. The strangest thing is that he pays a retainer of 700 baht a month to a Bangkok law firm so I would assume they are advising him accordingly. Or do they know the back door to PR?

For you to understand his knowledge of things Thai his last vlog stated he is going to Bangkok to get his US passport translated to Thai so that he can be added to his FIL's house blue book. He also mentioned that his Falang friends house is available for sale with a 90 year lease.

[scorecard]

15 hours ago, stratocaster said:

Regarding a link to the person claiming he is entitled to PR due to being "rich" and married to Thai. I have been reluctant to say who it is as he is an eight year veteran of Thailand who has a very limited knowledge of things Thai. His site is notime2besad. But I must warn you that you will have to trawl through 29 minutes of drivel per vlog to extract 1 minute of his reasoning for PR. The strangest thing is that he pays a retainer of 700 baht a month to a Bangkok law firm so I would assume they are advising him accordingly. Or do they know the back door to PR?

For you to understand his knowledge of things Thai his last vlog stated he is going to Bangkok to get his US passport translated to Thai so that he can be added to his FIL's house blue book. He also mentioned that his Falang friends house is available for sale with a 90 year lease.

700Baht a month retainer to a Bkk law firm. 

 

Sounds strange to me. A law firm will charge 700Baht to say hello. 

Lawyers charges are outrageous, I joined a company in Bkk, the admin. manager told me the company had received a bill for 210,000Baht from a law firm to get me a work permit. I was well aware of the WP process and charges from my previous positions. I called the law firm and asked why 210,000Baht?

 

Answer:  because

1). Has to be a qualified lawyer to submit the WP application docs at the labour ministry This is NOT correct.

2). Because the labour staff will not do the negotiation stage with anybody except a qualified lawyer. This is rubbish, there is no negotiation; the applicant passes the well explained criteria or not.

3). Law firm has to send a draft English version of the WP results to their office in Singapore to get a final letter in English. I casually spoke with the staff of the law firm in Bkk and mentioned the Singapore stuff. The lady responded 'that's not true, we don't do that and there's many Thai lawyers on staff who write perfect English. The response letter to the client (my company / me) is a standard letter and there's many old letters in English on the lawyers files to copy from. 

 

I refused to authorize the payment of 210,000Baht and indicated I would pay 5,000Baht and we would never use this law firm again. I also said I had made an appointment to visit the Thai Lawyers council to complain.

 

Suddenly the bill changed to 50,000Baht. I refused and said 'We will pay 3,000Baht and no more and any further offers I will reduce to payment even further. 

 

We paid 3,000Baht and then discovered a business agent who charges 2,500Baht to get the initial WP and 2,000Baht for renewals.

 

I did report the 210,000Baht law firm to the Thai Lawyers Council, They  acknowledged my letter and said they would investigate and call me. A few days later they did call and shared that they had discovered my WP was a 100% standard case with no justification for any additional charges.

 

The Law Council guy agreed the 210,000Baht figure was outrageous, but he shared they have no standard charges, individual law firms can charge what they like.

 

Law council guy also mentioned they had removed the name of the 210,000Baht law firm from their 'recommended' list and had informed the 210,000Baht firm their membership of the Law council had been permanently cancelled. 

 

700Baht a month retainer sounds like a fantasy story to me. 

[onthemoon]

6 hours ago, scorecard said:

700Baht a month retainer to a Bkk law firm. 

 

Sounds strange to me. A law firm will charge 700Baht to say hello. 

Lawyers charges are outrageous, I joined a company in Bkk, the admin. manager told me the company had received a bill for 210,000Baht from a law firm to get me a work permit. I was well aware of the WP process and charges from my previous positions. I called the law firm and asked why 210,000Baht?

 

Answer:  because

1). Has to be a qualified lawyer to submit the WP application docs at the labour ministry This is NOT correct.

2). Because the labour staff will not do the negotiation stage with anybody except a qualified lawyer. This is rubbish, there is no negotiation; the applicant passes the well explained criteria or not.

3). Law firm has to send a draft English version of the WP results to their office in Singapore to get a final letter in English. I casually spoke with the staff of the law firm in Bkk and mentioned the Singapore stuff. The lady responded 'that's not true, we don't do that and there's many Thai lawyers on staff who write perfect English. The response letter to the client (my company / me) is a standard letter and there's many old letters in English on the lawyers files to copy from. 

 

I refused to authorize the payment of 210,000Baht and indicated I would pay 5,000Baht and we would never use this law firm again. I also said I had made an appointment to visit the Thai Lawyers council to complain.

 

Suddenly the bill changed to 50,000Baht. I refused and said 'We will pay 3,000Baht and no more and any further offers I will reduce to payment even further. 

 

We paid 3,000Baht and then discovered a business agent who charges 2,500Baht to get the initial WP and 2,000Baht for renewals.

 

I did report the 210,000Baht law firm to the Thai Lawyers Council, They  acknowledged my letter and said they would investigate and call me. A few days later they did call and shared that they had discovered my WP was a 100% standard case with no justification for any additional charges.

 

The Law Council guy agreed the 210,000Baht figure was outrageous, but he shared they have no standard charges, individual law firms can charge what they like.

 

Law council guy also mentioned they had removed the name of the 210,000Baht law firm from their 'recommended' list and had informed the 210,000Baht firm their membership of the Law council had been permanently cancelled. 

 

700Baht a month retainer sounds like a fantasy story to me. 

Outrageous, but there must be people who pay this amount otherwise they wouldn't try.

 

For PR lawyers, I have heard that they charge THB 100,000 per case. Since they cannot do anything but ask you for the documents you can get the list in English free from Immi), and you have to get the docs by yourself anyway, I keep offering my services. So far, nobody has paid, maybe I need a law degree for credibility? 🤣

 

Anyway, THB 700/month would not be worth it for any lawyer, because the charges for writing the invoice and doing the tax accounting in a law firm is probably more than that. So, I am not convinced of that person's credibility.

[stratocaster]

Regarding the utuber going for PR he has posted an update today.

Scroll to 5 minutes to miss the drivel. He also has an interesting take on the new tax rules near the end. What annoys me is that people take life changing decisions on guys like this. His site has a link to the law firm he uses.

[scorecard]

On 12/19/2023 at 7:12 PM, jayboy said:

You should tell your friend to get a new agent because he is either dishonest or incompetent.As to the link you provided, the section on annual reporting to immigration is simply wrong:there is no such requirement.

 

Agreed.

 

Also note that https://www.thaiembassy.com is NOT a government agency. It's a commercial business which claims to assist with visas / claims to be knowledgeable re visas / PR etc. 

 

I repeat https://www.thaiembassy.com is not a government agency and it has no authority to approve anything.   

 

I wonder how they got permission to register the business name 'thaiembassy', if it is registered?

 

In regard to registering 'thaiembassy', 'thaiembassy.com' with google I guess that's possible (google doesn't care)  but it doesn't give the 'operator' any form of approval in Thailand in regard to visas, PR or anything else.  

 

As already mentioned the explanation re 'yearly reporting' on the thaiembassy site is both confusing and incorrect.

 

As stated by several members, approval for PR is for lifetime, therefore it doesn't have an actual expiry date. 

 

As stated, PR golders need to get an exit and re-entry stamp in their passport and in their PR book before they leave Thailand on business, on a holiday etc. 

 

You get an exit and re-entry stamp as you need it, there is no requirement to get this stamp every year. And the start date on the exit and re-entry stamp is the date this stamp was entered into the 2 books.

 

The exit and re-entry stamp Is NOT aligned to previous exit and re-entry stamps, and it's NOT aligned to the original date that the PR (Certificate of Residence) book was first issued.

 

PR holders need to get an exit and re-entry stamp as needed, before they depart Thailand.

 

PR holders can get the an exit and re-entry stamp for a single journey out and return or multiple journeys, for both versions the exit and re-entry stamp does have an expiry date.

 

This expiry date refer only to the exit and re-entry stamp. It DOES NOT refer to the actual approval of PR which doesn't have an expiry date because it's valid for lifetime. It does automatically cancel as a natural process when the PR holder dies. 

[Somtummm]

What happens to PR if house book registration and/or red book registration are canceled? 
 

I’m thinking about leaving Thailand (for some years at least). I’m currently registered under my landlord’s condo (house book/blue tabian baan and  police red book). Once I terminate my lease agreement and leave Thailand, I would also lose these registrations. 
 

What would this mean for my PR?

— Do they want to see the red police book every year I ask for the re-entry permit and endorsement? I know my landlord can remove me from his house book (blue tabian baan) but can he also force changes to my red police book? 
 

— Would there be a repercussions if I have a PR but am not registered in Thailand anywhere anymore? 
 

— is there any way to keep my PR without having to rent a condo or convincing someone to have me on their house book even though I’m actually not living there?

[smutcakes]

5 hours ago, Somtummm said:

What happens to PR if house book registration and/or red book registration are canceled? 
 

I’m thinking about leaving Thailand (for some years at least). I’m currently registered under my landlord’s condo (house book/blue tabian baan and  police red book). Once I terminate my lease agreement and leave Thailand, I would also lose these registrations. 
 

What would this mean for my PR?

— Do they want to see the red police book every year I ask for the re-entry permit and endorsement? I know my landlord can remove me from his house book (blue tabian baan) but can he also force changes to my red police book? 
 

— Would there be a repercussions if I have a PR but am not registered in Thailand anywhere anymore? 
 

— is there any way to keep my PR without having to rent a condo or convincing someone to have me on their house book even though I’m actually not living there?

 

As far as I am aware as long as you come back once a year to renew your entry permit, then all the other stuff is irrelevant.

[onthemoon]

6 hours ago, Somtummm said:

What happens to PR if house book registration and/or red book registration are canceled? 
 

I’m thinking about leaving Thailand (for some years at least). I’m currently registered under my landlord’s condo (house book/blue tabian baan and  police red book). Once I terminate my lease agreement and leave Thailand, I would also lose these registrations. 
 

What would this mean for my PR?

— Do they want to see the red police book every year I ask for the re-entry permit and endorsement? I know my landlord can remove me from his house book (blue tabian baan) but can he also force changes to my red police book? 
 

— Would there be a repercussions if I have a PR but am not registered in Thailand anywhere anymore? 
 

— is there any way to keep my PR without having to rent a condo or convincing someone to have me on their house book even though I’m actually not living there?

 

If I remember correctly, you have to show the Red Book as well as your Tabien Baan (house registration / blue book) during your yearly pilgrimage to CW to renew the re-entry permit (visa and endorsement). If you do not live in Thailand, you are not residing here permanently, so your PR cannot be renewed. I think that's fair enough.

[Somtummm]

20 hours ago, onthemoon said:

If I remember correctly, you have to show the Red Book as well as your Tabien Baan (house registration / blue book) during your yearly pilgrimage to CW to renew the re-entry permit (visa and endorsement).

As a tenant, I don’t have a Tabian Baan and I believe I didn’t have to show it when I went to CW for the re-entry permit and endorsement. 

 

20 hours ago, onthemoon said:

If you do not live in Thailand, you are not residing here permanently, so your PR cannot be renewed. I think that's fair enough

I don’t think a PR ever has to be renewed (thus the “P” in PR). As for the reentry permit and endorsement, I believe they only wanted to see the Red Book which in my case is still valid for 5 years. 
 

However, can my landlord force changes to the Red Book (which, unlike the Blue Tabian Baan which is his, he doesn’t have access to)? Could I still keep my PR valid for 5 years or would they find out that I don’t have a residence anymore (and what would happen in that case)?

[onthemoon]

41 minutes ago, Somtummm said:

As a tenant, I don’t have a Tabian Baan and I believe I didn’t have to show it when I went to CW for the re-entry permit and endorsement. 

 

OK. I don't know whether you have the Blue Book, we own the house. I always take all books with me when I go to CW.

 

41 minutes ago, Somtummm said:

 

I don’t think a PR ever has to be renewed (thus the “P” in PR). As for the reentry permit and endorsement, I believe they only wanted to see the Red Book which in my case is still valid for 5 years. 
 

However, can my landlord force changes to the Red Book (which, unlike the Blue Tabian Baan which is his, he doesn’t have access to)? Could I still keep my PR valid for 5 years or would they find out that I don’t have a residence anymore (and what would happen in that case)?

 

That's the point, the PR in Thailand is not permanent. If you leave the country without the visa and endorsement still valid on the day you return, the PR will be cancelled the moment you return. 

 

The landlord has nothing to do with the Red Book, and I don't remember whether I had to bring the Tabien Baan when I renewed it. Therefore, someone else has to answer this.

[Somtummm]

17 minutes ago, onthemoon said:

The landlord has nothing to do with the Red Book, and I don't remember whether I had to bring the Tabien Baan when I renewed it.

The police wanted to see the Tabian Baan. In fact, my previous landlord attended in person when I did the first Red Book and my current/new landlord attended in person when I moved to his condo. Thus I’m wondering whether a landlord could, for example, inform the police about me having moved out. They still wouldn’t have physical access to my Red Book but not sure whether the CW IB would find it in their system at some point. 
 

Maybe someone knows. 

[Arkady]

Things may have changed but what I recall from being a PR was that the tabian baan was not required to get the endorsements in the residence book and passport at CW, except when the residence book was filled up with exit and entry stamps and I had to get a new one.  This might never happen, if you only use e-gates at the airport. I am pretty sure the tabian baan was needed for renewal of the alien book at the police station, as they want verification that you reside in their precinct.

 

It is a legal requirement under the Civil Registration Act that you should have a tabian baan, as a Thai resident.  If your landlord removes you from his tabian baan and you don't transfer to another one, would that be notified to Immigration?  Given the lack of coordination between govt depts, that seems extremely unlikely. However, not having a tabian baan as PR is very unwise and could easily cause you problems. In the situation you can't get a landlord to put you on the tabian baan, I would advise trying to get on the tabian baan of a Thai friend.