Less Western Expats arriving than ever before and a significant fall in working Western expats now in Thailand

[zzaa09]

2 minutes ago, DrTuner said:

Thais and pride in work? Yes they do have it, they take pride in jerryrigging <deleted> in the least amount of time possible and getting a few satangs for it. Quality does not enter into the equation at all.

.....sabai sabai

[talahtnut]

3 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

Zero pride and par for the course in Thailand. Endless amounts of Thai false pride everywhere one looks. But hardly any true pride and honor and expertise. 

 

The whole country is 'an empty suit' so to speak. 

That's a bit harsh, you can get anything in Thailand

if you have the money.

Many a pot has been won on 'an empty suit' if you

can afford the bluff, and Thailand seems to be winning.

Clever old UK is a 'busted flush' and doesn't have a

clue, its gonna fold for cert.

Expertise? try the Military Hospital Bangkok.

Give me Thailand any day.

[garyk]

26 minutes ago, talahtnut said:

That's a bit harsh, you can get anything in Thailand

if you have the money.

Many a pot has been won on 'an empty suit' if you

can afford the bluff, and Thailand seems to be winning.

Clever old UK is a 'busted flush' and doesn't have a

clue, its gonna fold for cert.

Expertise? try the Military Hospital Bangkok.

Give me Thailand any day.

Years ago I bought an truck here.  

A couple of years ago the radiator blew and warped the head and did some damage in other areas.  I asked around and was pointed to a local garage. I took a chance and said just fix it.

I am still driving the same truck. I saw that guy completely disassemble the engine and put it back together. I was certain it would never run again. haha  Every time I get in it and start it I am amazed... ????

On a side note, I was in a climbing accident in Colombia. I had to be operated on in a small town in the valley. I was amazed at the quality of care there. Amazing and dirt cheap. 

Edited December 16, 2018 by garyk

[talahtnut]

34 minutes ago, garyk said:

Years ago I bought an truck here.  

A couple of years ago the radiator blew and warped the head and did some damage in other areas.  I asked around and was pointed to a local garage. I took a chance and said just fix it.

I am still driving the same truck. I saw that guy completely disassemble the engine and put it back together. I was certain it would never run again. haha  Every time I get in it and start it I am amazed... ????

On a side note, I was in a climbing accident in Colombia. I had to be operated on in a small town in the valley. I was amazed at the quality of care there. Amazing and dirt cheap. 

I believe farang usually underestimate everyone.

Commonly known as a Superiority Complex.

Edited December 16, 2018 by talahtnut
addition

[garyk]

9 minutes ago, talahtnut said:

I believe farang usually underestimate everyone.

Yup, I agree. I used to be the worst of the lot.

[DrTuner]

30 minutes ago, talahtnut said:

I believe farang usually underestimate everyone.

I think many farangs here are satisfied with mediocre quality or think getting laid easily balances the scales. Same as newbies thinking khaopad at khaosarn is oh so healthy and delish and exotic. 

 

Once you compare apples to apples, say f.ex. electricians in Germany vs Thailand, it becomes apparent where the quality lives.

[spidermike007]

12 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I'm not Thai.

I'm suggesting the espoused traditional western values are invented by the elite to control the many.

The elite obey none, and the many waste their lives following rules invented to control them.

 

Similarly, the Thai feudal 'core principles' are created by those that rule to oppress those that don't.

The Thai elite don't obey their own rules either.

 

I'm OK with the way they are, they way they work, the way they live, and can fit in with those around me.

I have no need to judge them from my entitled white high moral tower.

 

If you don't like the way the Thai population behave, I suggest you move somewhere more to your liking.

I didn't like the way the Brit population behaved, so I moved, and IMHO it's much better here than in the UK.

 

Nearly every time one of us makes an observation or a complaint, someone who has devoted less than two moments to contemplating a reply, says something really inane like "if you don't like it here why don't you move, or go back to your country". Really? 

 

If the elite back in the US invented pride in work, craftsmanship, and a job well done then kudos to them. They were onto something!

 

Most of the posts on this forum are observations or complaints. I would say if they bother you so much, find another forum!

[spidermike007]

12 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

So, is your goal with these frequent arguments to suggest that there really is no right and wrong, in your view? 

 

You are aware of the Thai 12 core principles. These are principles that THAIS say are important to them. Yet, most do not follow - as written about by prominent Thais. 

 

Below are a few with boldings. What say you now of this? 

 

2. Honesty, sacrifice, and patience with positive attitude for the interest of the public

 

6. Maintaining moral, integrity, well-wishes upon others as well as being generous and sharing

 

8. Maintaining of discipline; respecting laws and the elderly

 

11. Keeping physical and mental strength, unyielding to the evil power or desires, having sense of shame over guilt and sins in accordance with the religious principles;

 

12. Putting the public and national interest before one’s own

Of all those principals, I would say alot of Thais have the second half of number 2 down to a pat. They are some of the most positive people I have ever encountered, anywhere in the world. That is a delight to be around. And very patient too. Don't see much of those qualities in the US these days. 

[spidermike007]

12 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

So, is your goal with these frequent arguments to suggest that there really is no right and wrong, in your view? 

 

You are aware of the Thai 12 core principles. These are principles that THAIS say are important to them. Yet, most do not follow - as written about by prominent Thais. 

 

Below are a few with boldings. What say you now of this? 

 

2. Honesty, sacrifice, and patience with positive attitude for the interest of the public

 

6. Maintaining moral, integrity, well-wishes upon others as well as being generous and sharing

 

8. Maintaining of discipline; respecting laws and the elderly

 

11. Keeping physical and mental strength, unyielding to the evil power or desires, having sense of shame over guilt and sins in accordance with the religious principles;

 

12. Putting the public and national interest before one’s own

Of all those principals, I would say alot of Thais have the second half of number 2 down to a pat. They are some of the most positive people I have ever encountered, anywhere in the world. That is a delight to be around. And very patient too. Don't see much of those qualities in the US these days. 

 

14 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Dishonesty is an essential part of all business dealings, assuming to want to make a decent profit/living.

I'm just pointing out the 'boomer working-class morality' of our parents was not necessarily the right way (or the only way). In many ways, they misled and lied to us in order to turn us into soulless worker drones for the capitalist system.

 

 

I could not disagree more adamantly. If you are running your business Trump style, where money is the top priority and service, reputation, fulfilling a contract in such a way as to insure repeat business and customer satisfaction mean nothing, then money is always going to be the motivating force. But I think many of us have demonstrated that a job well done is a job worth doing and treating your clients or customers with respect and honesty is a damn fine way to live and prosper. Granted, you will not make as much money as the dishonest Lightweights, but you can make a good living that way. And what value can you put on genuine pride and living a life full of win win deals?

[spidermike007]

14 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Who is to say your parents were right?

 

Oh they were right. Of all the things they taught me growing up, I have derived more fulfillment and satisfaction from doing a job well and being honest and just with my customers, than few other things in life. One can make all the excuses in the world for lying and cheating as a lifestyle. That will never make it right. 

 

Prior to Newton, men used to argue about the non existence of gravity. Did that prevent an apple or a coconut from falling on their heads?

 

Despite what some charlatans say, truth really is truth. There are some principals in life that simply embody truth. They can't be denied. 

[thenoilif]

I feel that this article is the result of a misconception that was created by the young entrepreneur boom that took place post 2008 financial crisis and the boom of the Chinese market that followed. It coincided with the mass sell-off that we saw in the tourism sector that continues on today that resulted in the destruction of many of Thailand's natural land resources and the closing of several beaches for the sake of sustainability.

 

All of that money was sunk into countless cookie-cutter Aussie cafes and San Fransico style bistros. How many speakeasy bars selling 500 baht Old Fashions does one need? 

 

Now that the local investment money has dried up, so has the western 'consultant' trend. They can now be found in Vietnam and Taiwan.

 

 

 

[marcusarelus]

9 hours ago, DrTuner said:

I think many farangs here are satisfied with mediocre quality or think getting laid easily balances the scales. Same as newbies thinking khaopad at khaosarn is oh so healthy and delish and exotic. 

 

Once you compare apples to apples, say f.ex. electricians in Germany vs Thailand, it becomes apparent where the quality lives.

What do I need a quality electrician for?  House wiring?  That's a handyman 100 baht an hour.  Germany 3300 baht per hour.  I can check his work and have my 100 baht an hour guy re do anything I don't like.  I had 5 cleaners/maintenance people in Sunday.  8 hours and they brought gas powered cutting tools for the tree and weed trimming.  The ladies detail cleaned the inside/widows and the men outside.  Great job and my dog got new sand in her play place and they killed 2 Malayan pit vipers outside my walls.  How much 5 German cleaners for an 8 hour day bringing their own tools and fill dirt?  I paid 2700 baht.  Anybody who thinks khaopad is healthy is mentally off not a newbie.  Speaking of German quality what about brunhilda?  I'll enclose a photo.  Now you tell me about quality

[Fex Bluse]

34 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Of all those principals, I would say alot of Thais have the second half of number 2 down to a pat. They are some of the most positive people I have ever encountered, anywhere in the world. That is a delight to be around. And very patient too. Don't see much of those qualities in the US these days. 

I agree which is why I didn't bold it. Thais, on average, are positive and patient as ever. And, from being here so long, I have improved my patience considerably.

 

Their positivity has not influenced mine, though, as I see their version of it as somewhat of a negative characteristic. Alot of their positivity comes from their fatalistic mindset. They believe that actions cannot much influence fate, so they make little attempts to effect improvement/change. That's my guess, anyway. 

 

I would rather be less happy and more useful, but that is my Protestant heritage, I imagine. 

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎8‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 7:59 PM, webfact said:

A huge 75% of expats say they own a car (rising to 88% in Hua Hin) and also 1 in 2 claim to own a house or villa, with 1 in 5 owning a condo.

I guess not many teachers answered the survey then!

Not surprising about Hua Hin as when I was there the public transport was useless and way too expensive.

I could not have survived in Lamphun without a m'bike, as only motocy taxis there.

 

It's no surprise that western expats are leaving, given the apparent fact that they just don't want us in LOS, and do everything they can to make it as difficult as possible to stay.

For my last extension I had given up with the madness, and paid an agency to obtain it for me. Expensive but I kept my sanity.

[Nyezhov]

21 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

What do I need a quality electrician for?  House wiring?  That's a handyman 100 baht an hour.  Germany 3300 baht per hour.  I can check his work and have my 100 baht an hour guy re do anything I don't like.  I had 5 cleaners/maintenance people in Sunday.  8 hours and they brought gas powered cutting tools for the tree and weed trimming.  The ladies detail cleaned the inside/widows and the men outside.  Great job and my dog got new sand in her play place and they killed 2 Malayan pit vipers outside my walls.  How much 5 German cleaners for an 8 hour day bringing their own tools and fill dirt?  I paid 2700 baht.  Anybody who thinks khaopad is healthy is mentally off not a newbie.  Speaking of German quality what about brunhilda?  I'll enclose a photo.  Now you tell me about quality

Is that Madonna??????????????????????????

[ReMarKable]

10 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

I agree which is why I didn't bold it. Thais, on average, are positive and patient as ever. And, from being here so long, I have improved my patience considerably.

 

Their positivity has not influenced mine, though, as I see their version of it as somewhat of a negative characteristic. Alot of their positivity comes from their fatalistic mindset. They believe that actions cannot much influence fate, so they make little attempts to effect improvement/change. That's my guess, anyway. 

 

I would rather be less happy and more useful, but that is my Protestant heritage, I imagine. 

I wonder if it is true that Thais don't believe actions affect fate.  Buddhist hold that positive actions can increase karma and a positive reincarnation.  There are also many of my nephews and other folk going to university to improve their life and those of their parents.  So some certainly see the virtue of taking action through education or other means to improve their lot financially and spiritually.

[overherebc]

46 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

What do I need a quality electrician for?  House wiring?  That's a handyman 100 baht an hour.  Germany 3300 baht per hour.  I can check his work and have my 100 baht an hour guy re do anything I don't like.  I had 5 cleaners/maintenance people in Sunday.  8 hours and they brought gas powered cutting tools for the tree and weed trimming.  The ladies detail cleaned the inside/widows and the men outside.  Great job and my dog got new sand in her play place and they killed 2 Malayan pit vipers outside my walls.  How much 5 German cleaners for an 8 hour day bringing their own tools and fill dirt?  I paid 2700 baht.  Anybody who thinks khaopad is healthy is mentally off not a newbie.  Speaking of German quality what about brunhilda?  I'll enclose a photo.  Now you tell me about quality

Never mind the quality, feel the width.

????????

[garyk]

10 hours ago, DrTuner said:

I think many farangs here are satisfied with mediocre quality or think getting laid easily balances the scales.

Well, yea.. I think that is a given... ????

If not for that it would not make much sense living in Thailand... haha

[talahtnut]

1 hour ago, Nyezhov said:

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

 



Jeeze, where did you find a pic of my horny old Ex?

 

[Nyezhov]

I lived in Alaska. Bangkok is civilization.

[Jonah Tenner]

2 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

 

It ain't over 'til the fat lady sings....

Edited December 17, 2018 by Jonah Tenner

[BritManToo]

4 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

And what value can you put on genuine pride and living a life full of win win deals?

I don't know, but I do know you'll never be a Congressman or President.

[brling]

17 hours ago, BritManToo said:

 

 

If you don't like the way the Thai population behave, I suggest you move somewhere more to your liking.

 

The usual reply from our resident Thai apologist. Hates  to think of himself as a farang, but would LOVE to be a Thai. 

[BritManToo]

20 minutes ago, brling said:

The usual reply from our resident Thai apologist. Hates  to think of himself as a farang, but would LOVE to be a Thai. 

I've never had any interest in being Thai, or a citizen of any other 3rd world country.

If I had a free choice, I'd choose to be American.

If I had a choice of 2nd citizenship, I'd choose 1st as British and 2nd as American.

(If there was a choice of 'EU citizen' I might have chosen dual EU/American)

 

I don't label people by their skin colour, so it's true I don't view myself as a 'farang', but as a Brit.

As for being an apologist, not true, I see lots of stuff wrong in Thailand, but I can live with it.

I see a lot more wrong in the UK, things I can't live with, which is why I'm here and not there.

Edited December 17, 2018 by BritManToo

[stud858]

Things seemed to go downhill after the taksin saga. So maybe things will get better when the Tac man gets back in. Chin up.

[spidermike007]

4 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I don't know, but I do know you'll never be a Congressman or President.

 

Thank you. My sentiment exactly. Politics is for very dirty people. Only scum are attracted to life in politics at the national level. No integrity. No sense of fair game. And we know who is accelerating that trend.

[talahtnut]

52 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

Thank you. My sentiment exactly. Politics is for very dirty people. Only scum are attracted to life in politics at the national level. No integrity. No sense of fair game. And we know who is accelerating that trend.

I doubt you'd make Archbishop though.

[KhunFred]

4 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I've never had any interest in being Thai, or a citizen of any other 3rd world country.

If I had a free choice, I'd choose to be American.

 

Why on earth would a Brit want to be an American? You have HEALTHCARE!!!!

[KiChakayan]

5 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I've never had any interest in being Thai, or a citizen of any other 3rd world country.

If I had a free choice, I'd choose to be American.

If I had a choice of 2nd citizenship, I'd choose 1st as British and 2nd as American.

(If there was a choice of 'EU citizen' I might have chosen dual EU/American)

 

I don't label people by their skin colour, so it's true I don't view myself as a 'farang', but as a Brit.

As for being an apologist, not true, I see lots of stuff wrong in Thailand, but I can live with it.

I see a lot more wrong in the UK, things I can't live with, which is why I'm here and not there.

I chose to be Australian, and now, having had a German mum and a French dad, I am definitely AU/EU. AU first because in the years I was living there Australia had most things right. 

[garyk]

Since I am not in BKK very ofter I went to MBK and Paragon plaza today to people watch. I was curious.

 

MBK, about 30% or more Indian's I would guess,  20% Thai, not sure about the rest,  European's and others from other countryies? I only saw two or three I was sure from America or Canada. I stayed about 3 hours and wandered around.

 

Paragon Plaza, bingo!!!  Big step up in spending power. I would say about 40-50% Chinese. These people were spending money. Dressed very nice and in the shops. Not sure about the other nationalities, except they were not westerners from America or Canada IMO. 

 

So just in that area I would say Western tourists are a no show. 

 

To sum it up, Indian's and Europeans in MBK. Paragon plaza, Chinese spending the money. I was a bit surprised. 

 

Regards.