Old man not to blame for death of teacher the kids called "angel", say locals

[balo]

3 hours ago, wcoast said:

Please do tell, are you the offspring of close family members?
If so I might consider your dilemma.

Calm down , this is a discussion forum , I would not be on that bike in the first place without a helmet for myself and my kids! 

 

 

[metisdead]

Troll posts and the replies have been removed. 

[Wiggy]

I just don't get it. Someone is lying dead in the road, someone that you just killed with your car and all you can think about is how to get away with it by trying to have another person take the blame. I don't think it can get much lower than this. These kind of people are sub-human. Grow a pair and do the time.

[hotchilli]

15 hours ago, HHTel said:

So you're saying that you should check that there is no idiot driving the wrong way.  When turning right, position yourself on the crown of the road and give way to ONCOMING traffic.  The car should not have been overtaking, and not so fast, and certainly not where there is a right turn (junction albeit a minor one).  Apart from the safety issue (no helmets and 3 riders), the bike was being driven correctly.

I wonder where some posters learned to drive!

While the teacher was in the correct position and doing everything correctly it doesn't mean you are safe from idiots... yes always check, check and check again before doing anything in Thailands roads.. if you value your life that is!

[metisdead]

An inflammatory post has been removed:

 

7) You will respect fellow members and post in a civil manner. No personal attacks, hateful or insulting towards other members, (flaming) Stalking of members on either the forum or via PM will not be allowed.
 

[tweedledee2]

17 hours ago, keith101 said:

In another video it is clear that the bike crossed to the right in front of the black pick up which was very clearly speeding so a combination of 2 wrongs resulting in the death of the teacher . 

   You could never be a forensic traffic accident investigator and it is obvious you cannot provide accurate eyewitness testimony of an incident. When you identify the black vehicle as a pickup, you definitely have impaired vision. 

  The driver of the black car is 100% at fault for this accident resulting in the mother's death. He was passing an unknown number of vehicles and driving way to fast in the wrong lane. For you to state that this mother making a legal right turn was responsible for her own death shows ignorance and lack of compassion on your part. 

  

[Aussieroaming]

I'm glad the old man has taken the rap, now they can lock him and the real driver up so that they have company.

[Burma Bill]

The old man may not be responsible for the accident but "taking the rap" for a younger man is perverting the course of justice (in the UK that is).

[Ctkong]

20 hours ago, sanemax said:

Shouldnt the bike driver had  checked to see whether there were any cars coming ?

Bike driver was long ahead in time standing at the middle of the road signaling to turn right. It was the black car driving on the overtaking lane that travel too fast to take evasive action . Black car driver may not have seen the bike while overtaking other cars.....

[Ctkong]

4 hours ago, Wiggy said:

I just don't get it. Someone is lying dead in the road, someone that you just killed with your car and all you can think about is how to get away with it by trying to have another person take the blame. I don't think it can get much lower than this. These kind of people are sub-human. Grow a pair and do the time.

Thainess culture . If you can get away, do it. Conscience be damned! 

[Ctkong]

19 hours ago, sanemax said:

I was asking a question , so, I wasnt "saying" anything , just asking a question .

You seem to be saying that she was correct in not looking behind her .

The result shows that to be the wrong thing to do 

She may be looking at rear view mirror but the view is limited and the back car may be in her blind corner when she looked. Who knows... 

[Ctkong]

19 hours ago, poanoi said:

someone with insufficient eyesight to see her intent overtook her,

alternatively he was so daft so he dont understand what a yellow signal means, , may even be that he didnt qualify for a driving license

and had no business on a public road whatsoever

Guy was just back from a party ( drink driving.?) , has a woman companion beside him, all contribute to his rash decision and bad driving. 

[Ctkong]

8 hours ago, balo said:

Life is not worth much in Thailand. 

 

Sadly that is the case . Like the traffic fines, thailand had not catch up to the reality of current monetary value . 

[connda]

20 hours ago, Thechook said:

It was in no way her fault, stop blaming her.

To be honest, when on a motorcycle it scares the living s**t out of me to make that exact kind of turn she was making.  You have to stop close to the centerline and then you have to worry about cars in your own lane hitting you from behind, worry about oncoming cars crossing the centerline and hitting you, and then worry about morons deciding to pass you on the right when you're making a right hand turn and hitting you.  To the guy who is blaming the victim for 'not looking', hey man, maybe she should have looked above her too to make sure that she wasn't garrotted by a CCTV cable hanging down at throat level, I'm sure you'd blame her for that too.
The only thing this woman can be faulted for is not wearing a helmet.
That's why I primarily drive my car now even for short hops around the village.  If I make a right hand turn in my car and stop to wait for oncoming traffic, the guy in back of me has a wall of metal to contend with so unless they can squeak though the space to the left of the car they have to stop and wait.  But the average Thai car driver who considers motorcycle drivers to be of low status will not even bother to slow down for a motorcycle stopped in the lane making a right hand turn.  Having cars blow by you at 50 or 60 kph or more while you're stationary while waiting to make a turn is absolutely unnerving - and in this crazed country - it's deadly.

[Chris Renaix]

22 hours ago, poanoi said:

just be quiet, the bike driver did no wrong,

she positioned herself at the right place, she gave signal well in advance,

then comes the car overtaking as many as he can including the bike driver turning right

Right!  And, no overtaking allowed on a crossroad, common sense basically.

[sanemax]

29 minutes ago, connda said:

To the guy who is blaming the victim for 'not looking', hey man,.................................. 

No one has blamed the victim though .

IMO that she should look behind her when crossing a road, you think that she did the right thing and that she  should not not have looked behind her when crossing a road .

   We just have different opinions .

It was 100% the car drivers fault though

[OZJAY]

This is why I constantly check my rear mirrors whilst riding my motorbike. Always expect the worst on Thai roads.

[Mad mick]

car involved appears or looks as if driver was overtaking on wrong side of road just observing this video mmm RIP sad for her kids ,

[balo]

4 hours ago, sanemax said:

IMO that she should look behind her when crossing a road, you think that she did the right thing and that she  should not not have looked behind her when crossing a road

I agree , and also its a bit like being a pedestrian in Thailand trying to cross a road , you need to look left, right , left , right , left right , always be prepared for traffic in both directions.  

 

Same when I'm on my bicycle , I never change direction until I'm 100% sure no vehicles are coming from behind. Looking in both directons at the same time is not possible , but it only takes an extra second to look both ways . 

[MaxYakov]

On 11/7/2018 at 4:20 PM, sanemax said:

I was asking a question , so, I wasnt "saying" anything , just asking a question .

You seem to be saying that she was correct in not looking behind her .

The result shows that to be the wrong thing to do 

Yes. Must clear lanes in both directions when making a right turn across a lane, but easy to neglect to check for unexpected passing traffic from the rear. Also, passing in an intersection is a bad idea and illegal in my country. I witnessed a similar accident on my soi where the roles were reversed - a car was turning right into a parking lot and collected a motorbike that was simultaneously attempting to pass the car (a whole line of them, actually).

 

IMHO, both operators were in the wrong. There was a flagman, but he had focused on only the opposing traffic and not flagging traffic in both directions. Of course the motorbike had misread the situation and was speeding as well - like the speeding car driver in this incident.

Edited November 8, 2018 by MaxYakov

[cookieqw]

The family claimed they did this because they feared that the son would be in worse trouble as he had just been to a party.

 

And they were worried that insurance would not pay up if they said that he was the driver so his dad owned up instead.

 

can they get away with this in thailand.

 

[cookieqw]

On 11/7/2018 at 8:06 AM, keith101 said:

In another video it is clear that the bike crossed to the right in front of the black pick up which was very clearly speeding so a combination of 2 wrongs resulting in the death of the teacher . 

where video pls

 

[cookieqw]

14 hours ago, OZJAY said:

This is why I constantly check my rear mirrors whilst riding my motorbike. Always expect the worst on Thai roads.

they will not grant a licence if you dont do the lifesaver in UK

[grego49]

On 11/7/2018 at 4:17 PM, HHTel said:

So you're saying that you should check that there is no idiot driving the wrong way.  When turning right, position yourself on the crown of the road and give way to ONCOMING traffic.  The car should not have been overtaking, and not so fast, and certainly not where there is a right turn (junction albeit a minor one).  Apart from the safety issue (no helmets and 3 riders), the bike was being driven correctly.

I wonder where some posters learned to drive!

Probably learnt to drive in Thailand,,,,

[HHTel]

5 hours ago, cookieqw said:

they will not grant a licence if you dont do the lifesaver in UK

I'd never heard the term 'lifesaver' but I understand that they are 'shoulder checks'.  I've just looked at several vids and read a few reports from examiners.  The general consensus in an occasion like the accident shown is that a right shoulder check when on the crown is more hazardous than not doing it as it takes your attention from what's in front of you and has caused accidents.  Of course, in the UK it's highly unlikely to have a car coming up behind you on the wrong side of the road.  I agree that in Thailand it can happen.  All in all, I'm just confirming what others have said in that the m/cycle was driving correctly.

[MaxYakov]

22 hours ago, sanemax said:

No one has blamed the victim though .

IMO that she should look behind her when crossing a road, you think that she did the right thing and that she  should not not have looked behind her when crossing a road .

   We just have different opinions .

It was 100% the car drivers fault though

How could it be 100% the car driver's fault if, as you say, "she should [have looked] look[sic] behind her when crossing a road" (during her right-hand turn)?

[richard_smith237]

16 minutes ago, MaxYakov said:

How could it be 100% the car driver's fault if, as you say, "she should [have looked] look[sic] behind her when crossing a road" (during her right-hand turn)?

 

The deceased could have been sat on the floor in the middle of road for it matters... this was not an accident, it was a drunk 39 year old driving incredibly dangerously without any regard for anyone's safety over taking a series of cars at high speed in a busy and narrow soi in a built up area. 

 

The 39 year old drunk is 100% at fault. 

 

That said: IF the lady had taken greater precautions, wore a helmet, used her mirrors, looked over her shoulder there is a possibility she could have avoided the accident, the helmet may have prevented death - But not doing so does not in any way absolve the 39 year old drunk from 100% of the blame. 

 

 

 

[MaxYakov]

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

The deceased could have been sat on the floor in the middle of road for it matters... this was not an accident, it was a drunk 39 year old driving incredibly dangerously without any regard for anyone's safety over taking a series of cars at high speed in a busy and narrow soi in a built up area. 

 

The 39 year old drunk is 100% at fault. 

 

That said: IF the lady had taken greater precautions, wore a helmet, used her mirrors, looked over her shoulder there is a possibility she could have avoided the accident, the helmet may have prevented death - But not doing so does not in any way absolve the 39 year old drunk from 100% of the blame. 

 

 

 

First, in paragraph #1 you call this "not an accident". Then in paragraph #2 you say "she could have avoided the accident". So, was it or was it not an "accident"? And, BTW, it would have mattered if she had been sitting "on the floor" in the middle of the road, IMHO.

 

What did I say that made it my opinion that the 39 year-old alleged drunk driver should be absolved? Answer: Nothing.

 

My opinion is two motor vehicle operators - one sloppy (no helmet, three on motorbike, making a  right-hand turn probably without checking her 6 o'clock) and one reckless driver connect. The lesser vehicle lost out.

 

We don't know if the woman had not been drinking and/or what distraction(s) she was dealing with and/or her mental state. Nobody who has their act together (aka has full "situational awareness" - especially in Thailand) is going to purposely put themselves into the path of an incoming vehicle.

 

 

[sanemax]

4 hours ago, MaxYakov said:

How could it be 100% the car driver's fault if, as you say, "she should [have looked] look[sic] behind her when crossing a road" (during her right-hand turn)?

Because the driver shouldnt have been over taking and speeding , making it completely his fault .

  (No need to correct my posts, you shouldn't take your English teaching work home with you , leave that at the school gates)

[cardinalblue]

Her next stop is the incinerator at the local temple complex....

 

her focus is not to look behind her but for oncoming traffic as well as any traffic coming out of where she is turning into....

 

100% driver fault not driving to road conditions and not complying to road regulations....

 

not a serious or compliant culture so you have dicks goings every which way.....no correction any time soon....

Edited November 9, 2018 by cardinalblue