The Real Problem With Keeping 800K In Thai Bank

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, watcharacters said:

 

You mean around  middle to latter  70's?   Or more recently?

Cyprus?

[wgdanson]

1 hour ago, rumak said:

Well,  finally a person using common sense.   Just do it  ????     

For those that don't want to go this route...well,  there are other choices.

Yes there is. 65k a month into a Thai bank from abroad, FTT transfer. Spend as much of it as you want.

[JLCrab]

39 minutes ago, garyk said:

1 hour ago, JLCrab said:

one of the big advantages here compared to USA is the ability to arrange for long-term in-home care so one can remain relatively independent.

That is available in the states and subsidized if needed???

This kind of info shows the lack of knowledge...

Below are some national average costs for long-term care in the United States (in 2016). Average costs for specific states are also available.

$225 a day or $6,844 per month for a semi-private room in a nursing home

$253 a day or $7,698 per month for a private room in a nursing home

$119 a day or $3,628 per month for care in an assisted living facility (for a one-bedroom unit)

$20.50 an hour for a health aide

$20 an hour for homemaker services

$68 per day for services in an adult day health care center

https://longtermcare.acl.gov/costs-how-to-pay/costs-of-care.html

[jacko45k]

4 hours ago, Isaan Alan said:

BKK bank accepted no responsibility for bad advice, 

I don't think it was bad advice. An FD is immediately accessible, with loss of interest. Admit not as easy as a Savings account with an ATM/ Debit card, or transfers via internet or mobile banking. It's a difficult IO the bank can't control!

[graemeaylward]

These days if you cannot afford to leave 800,000/400,000 thb in the bank all year and every year, you probably don't have enough money to live in Thailand.
 
 

If I had that sort of money, I might just have been able to live in UK! Most pensioners over 65 years old from UK have a State Pension which, despite paying into for 48 years, is less than 25000 baht per month, ( and is taxed) plus whatever pension their employment pension pays upon retirement! I use the income method which requires nothing to be tied up in a bank! Retiring to Thailand should not be limited to the wealthy few!


Sent from my X98 Plus II (C2D6) using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[natway09]

At fear of repeating myself,

If you are not prepared to invest 800,000 in an interest bearing  Thai bank account to enable you to live here then you should't be

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, Just Weird said:

You need to research better when you are trying to justify your claims!  Out of those that you linked to only one (the counterfeit card report) related to the thread and your original assertion alleging problems for foreigners! 

 

The subject is and was safety of funds held in Thai bank accounts, not whether Thais or farangs are the owner of those accounts.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

8 minutes ago, natway09 said:

At fear of repeating myself,

If you are not prepared to invest 800,000 in an interest bearing  Thai bank account to enable you to live here then you should't be

 

Ahh.... so on behalf of Thai Immigration, you want to eliminate the monthly income qualification method? And all the other country nationals who still get to use Embassy income letters alone. Because all those folks aren't depositing 800K in a Thai bank account. Great idea!!!

Edited February 4, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 hours ago, Pattaya46 said:

BTW agree with others that in most cases of "money disappeared" I have read about, the thief is a family member or friend 

Not when the police end up arresting the bank staff for theft or other crimes... which is basically the entire set of case I posted about earlier. Those variety are relatively commonplace, and I'm sure we only end up hearing about a small portion of them via the news...

 

The kind you're talking about, I wasn't posting on or addressing at all. They're an entirely separate category of issues.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 hours ago, Just Weird said:

"MANY"?  I don't think so, two or three, maybe, over several years.  And no rational reason to suggest that reimbursements weren't made when the bank was at fault.

 

And no factual basis in most of the cases I posted on indicating if, when and how much reimbursement was made by the banks to the victims in those cases.  That issue seems to be rarely addressed in the news reports on bank employee crime kinds of cases... Why that is, I don't know...

 

[happy chappie]

The real reason for not keeping 800,000b in a bank for years or decades is inflation at a soaring level.800,000b this year will be worth 770,000b next year,740,000b the year after and nearly 700,000b the year after.what will happen is immigration will decide that 800,000b isn't enough and put it up to 1 million because every farang has a money tree.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

6 hours ago, Pib said:

Happens all over the world. And if you discount social media posts that often leave out important details and many times are one-side details (like periodically seen in ThaiVisa), the number of times you see stories in news media is quite low in this country of 68 million people with probably around as many bank accounts.
 

 

Don't agree... Almost all of the cases I posted on above were not from social media reports but rather from regular news media reports... And I could have gone back and pulled many more... It wasn't meant to document EVERY past case of Thai bank employee criminal activity.... Just an illustrative sampling from recent years.

[bkk6060]

19 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Cambodia, you only need $300 for a 1 year retirement VISA, if over 55.

Philippines, you only need the extension fees for up to 3 years, any age.

Vietnam, you just need the extension fees.

If your goal is a sad 3rd world retired life, I guess those places are a good option..

Edited February 4, 2019 by bkk6060

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

6 hours ago, Benroon said:

Did you miss the SMS part ? 

 

Nope... But not everyone does the SMS notifications, because they falsely believe like some posters here continue to argue that their funds in Thai banks are safe and they have nothing to worry about....

 

The fact that there are so many cases of  Thai bank employees getting arrested for account pilfering and various kinds of theft, along with all the other kinds of financial theft and fraud that occur here, ought to be the clearest reason why signing up for SMS alerts is a necessity, especially if someone's keeping substantial funds on deposit.

 

 

Edited February 4, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[happy chappie]

2 hours ago, Thaidream said:

The fraud I am talking about is the kind in which a bank employee actually steals the money from your account.  It has happened so many times in Thailand that it would be impossible to even remember the number- the banks eventually return your money after months of investigation. the times this happens in the USA is few and far between.

 

In 1996-1997 Banks in Thailand literally went broke as some of their officers lent out money to customers who never should have had a loan- huge amounts- of course with a kickback to the officers.  The whole system almost crashed.  The exchange rates plummeted- nice if one was remaining in Thailand but for those of us still working- I lost $21,000 repatriating dollars. You want to learn about Thai banks- google Rakesh Saxena and Bangkok Bank of Commerce and also Finance One.

It still happens today- want to get a mortgage- the Bank Officer will approve your loan for a 'fee'.  The system is rife with corruption.

 

As far as security- there is always a way around a computer system but most US banks are capable of adjusting quickly to an attack on their systems- Thai banks are still using outdated systems in their ATM machines.

 

As far as Nationalization- doubt that is an issue but Thailand manipulates it's currency constantly based on the whims of those in power and whether they have enterprise abroad and need a positive exchange rate.  the Thai Baht at present is way overvalued but will continue being manipulated until the power brokers decide they have used the people's money enough and then the peons will be given a taste with rates following real values.

 

You or whomever can leave your money in a Thai bank if you want- but I will never trust Thai banks again as I know exactly how they work and I have experienced it first hand. Most will be lucky and won't be affected , except by poor exchange rates. 

Well said.banks here are a joke and the staff are a joke who don't even know what they are doing half the time.the horror stories of theft and incompetence are beyond belief.

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

If a persons goal is a sad 3rd world retired life, I guess those places are a good option..

How much happiness do most pensioners have?

In the UK most can't even afford to heat their homes in the winter.

I'm happy enough just to be warm every day.

Edited February 4, 2019 by BritManToo

[Thingamabob]

No problems after 35 years. This is much ado about nothing. Best you go and live somewhere else if you're not comfortable with the rules here.

[freedomnow]

You can open a stock broking account for a second layer of protection when its not needed to be in the bank rest of the year ?

[Thingamabob]

15 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

How much happiness do most pensioners have?

In the UK most can't even afford to heat their homes in the winter.

I'm happy enough too be warm every day.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 minutes ago, freedomnow said:

You can open a stock broking account for a second layer of protection when its not needed to be in the bank rest of the year ?

 

Under the new/latest rules for retirement extensions, 400K of the required 800K has to be kept in the same bank account yearround. So there's no longer any option to pull ALL of one's funds.

 

[marcusarelus]

59 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

The subject is and was safety of funds held in Thai bank accounts, not whether Thais or farangs are the owner of those accounts.

Kind of makes senses to talk about Farang accounts with SMS notification.  Since we are all Farangs.

[marcusarelus]

26 minutes ago, happy chappie said:

Well said.banks here are a joke and the staff are a joke who don't even know what they are doing half the time.the horror stories of theft and incompetence are beyond belief.

I have doubled my money in Thai banks during the last 20 years with no problems and now have a number of accounts at different banks all with SMS notification.  There are no horror stories for Farang with a modicum of intelligence.  You would have to be blind, deaf, dumb and mentally challenged to have a problem in my experience.  How many bank accounts have you had in Thailand that you have had problems with or are you only spreading gossip about Farang accounts that have had a problem?

[marcusarelus]

8 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Under the new/latest rules for retirement extensions, 400K of the required 800K has to be kept in the same bank account yearround. So there's no longer any option to pull ALL of one's funds.

 

I think you can pull your funds and apply for a new visa.  I don't think it has been determined that it will be checked more than once a year at extension renewal time. 

[murraynz]

6 hours ago, Saladin said:

It would be quite normal for a retiree who has been paid a salary or wage all his or her working life to keep 800K in a bank for 5 or 6 months, or indefinitely. But business people would never tie up their money by loaning it to a bank. They keep it working through investments in real estate, shares, business, etc. So although they might be good for the 800K it costs them money to have it sitting idle in a bank.  

all correct, but surely 800k is not huge money to a retiree ??

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 minute ago, marcusarelus said:

Kind of makes senses to talk about Farang accounts with SMS notification.  Since we are all Farangs.

 

I don't think most Thai bank employee thieves sit down and pick and choose whether to steal from Thai vs. farang accounts. They steal from accounts where they find money or sometimes where they have some knowledge of the particular account holder. Obviously, Thai accounts vastly outnumber expat bank accountss here, so Thais are going to be most of the fraud/theft victims that get reported in the news.

 

The fact those kinds of cases occur regularly here should be a sign to everyone that either workplace system controls in the banks to prevent that kind of theft aren't very good or effective, and/or the workforce involved doesn't have a very high standard of ethical/professional conduct -- which probably can be said about a lot of areas here.

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 minute ago, marcusarelus said:

I think you can pull your funds and apply for a new visa.  I don't think it has been determined that it will be checked more than once a year at extension renewal time. 

 

I've seen no sign that's going to be allowed under the new rules for retirement extensions of stay... How they're going to check on the maintenance of funds, I agree, hasn't been spelled out. But it's pretty darned clear that the new rule says 400K minimum yearround.

 

If nothing else, when someone goes to apply for their NEXT extension, if the officer can't see at least 400K maintained in the account for the past year as required, it's going to be trouble.

 

[marcusarelus]

6 minutes ago, murraynz said:

all correct, but surely 800k is not huge money to a retiree ??

When you can't pay to heat your room in the UK I guess it is. 

[marcusarelus]

7 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I don't think most Thai bank employee thieves sit down and pick and choose whether to steal from Thai vs. farang accounts. They steal from accounts where they find money or sometimes where they have some knowledge of the particular account holder. Obviously, Thai accounts vastly outnumber expat bank accountss here, so Thais are going to be most of the fraud/theft victims that get reported in the news.

 

The fact those kinds of cases occur regularly here should be a sign to everyone that either workplace system controls in the banks to prevent that kind of theft aren't very good or effective, and/or the workforce involved doesn't have a very high standard of ethical/professional conduct -- which probably can be said about a lot of areas here.

I think it's a sign that you are trying to bad mouth Thai banks.  1.  If you don't have SMS you are mentally challenged.  2.  What bank employee is going to steal money from a person who will be immediately notified?  3.  Thais don't like to mess with Farang.  If you don't know this you don't live in Thailand. 

[khunPer]

3 hours ago, Sheryl said:

I agree a FD would be the least hassle approach to this, though it will cost most of us some  lost interest/earnings on money that would otherwise be better invested (so of course would putting the money in a savings account). The problem is that  up until now not all IOs have accepted fixed deposits, some have insisted on only savings accounts that showed draw down of the funds.  Not an official rule, just one of those things some IOs did (and one could see their logic).  With the new rules they should allow it since the emphasis now is on not spending funds, but the problem is no one can say for sure unless TI issues documentation guidelines that specifically say FD.

 

I have to stop by my local Imm Office later this week on another matter and will try asking them if fixed deposits are acceptable but wish me luck in getting my meaning across.  My Thai isn't bad but  doesn't  extend much to banking terms and their English is close to nil.  I have never asked them before as had no reason to, the interest rates for FDs in Thailand being less than I can get elsewhere I only brought it what I was going to spend in the same year.

 

But I don't want to have to keep track of different required balances at different times of the year (remembering when to do a once yearly transfer-in was challenge enough, LOL!).  I also do not want to unnecessarily waste money on bank transfer fees. So just bringing in 800K once and parking it, for me, seems the least worst of the options, at least until rules for the combo method are clarified.

Yes, just keep 800k baht in an account, and leave them, is the most hassle free solution.

 

The "thing" with fixed deposits is, or rather was before, that the money shall be withdraw able at any time, which they are at most fixed accounts with loss of interest for the agreed period. But as you say, might de different between immigrations.

 

Where I stay it's possible, and I have for many years just "parked" 800k baht in a 12-month fixed account and withdrawing the annual interest, so it's always clean 800k baht, which makes it easy for the IO. I use another account with ATM for transfers and withdrawals, which I also include in the bank statement and show, so I can justify my living expenses. After the 15% withdrawal tax the 12-month fixed account pays around 10k baht a year in interest (1.5% p.a.). It's possible to claim the withheld tax back, I have however no experience, as I considered the about 1,800 baht for me not being worth the hassle and paperwork. Before "my" Immigration Office accepted Fund Books that could give a higher outcome than a fixed account, but as the value followed the marked, and was considered as "speculation", they stopped acceptance of that about a decade ago.

????

[fruitman]

I was thinking of opening an account at a Singaporean Bank, my Singapore friend recommended DBS or OCBC....they also give a much better interest than European banks...

 

Anybody has experience with those banks and using them in Thailand? DBS gives 3.5% interest

Edited February 4, 2019 by fruitman