Do you buy America stock?

[cardinalblue]

I have lived 20 years comfortably over here living  on US stock dividends and bond interest....

 

so to the person who says US stocks are unattractive has an axe to grind...

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, cardinalblue said:

I have lived 20 years comfortably over here living  on US stock dividends and bond interest....

 

so to the person who says US stocks are unattractive has an axe to grind...

I've lived here 10 years comfortably on Australian stock dividends. Term deposits with banks before, Peer-to-peer lending now.

You evidently understand what you are doing in the US market very well. I don't. Horses for courses.

[gk10002000]

19 hours ago, cardinalblue said:

I have lived 20 years comfortably over here living  on US stock dividends and bond interest....

 

so to the person who says US stocks are unattractive has an axe to grind...

Love it Cardinal man.  I too have been investing for income from stocks and dividends, many of which are tax free and have stuff in my regular brokerage account, traditional IRA and Roth IRA.  Just hit 62 years of age and about to coast into semi retirement with > 60,000 USD income, and I have not even started social security yet.  So I am not rich but should be able to do a very comfortable retirement and have crossed the 1 Million dollar mark with no loans, no debts, etc.  Was planning on Thailand sooner than now, but work has been OK and I get to keep 35,000 in company matching 401k contributions if I stick around until October 1, so that is worth waiting form

[maxisrael]

NO 

[Jane Dough]

No, I don't buy American stock.

 

I use Knorr, Oxo if I can get it.

 

Rooster

 

 

[AgMech Cowboy]

On 4/17/2019 at 9:15 PM, wordchild said:

Not true ! Sadly

 

On 4/17/2019 at 9:37 PM, Oxx said:

 

You really don't have a clue, do you? Standard rate of withholding tax is 30% (even if you fill in the form).  In some jurisdictions, with certain brokers it's reduced to 15%.

I think you are the one without a clue. I've been investing thru UOB Kay Hian for 8 yrs and never paid any US tax. I file a form W8 BEN and that's it. 

[Oxx]

27 minutes ago, AgMech Cowboy said:

On 4/17/2019 at 9:37 PM, Oxx said:

 

You really don't have a clue, do you? Standard rate of withholding tax is 30% (even if you fill in the form).  In some jurisdictions, with certain brokers it's reduced to 15%.

I think you are the one without a clue. I've been investing thru UOB Kay Hian for 8 yrs and never paid any US tax. I file a form W8 BEN and that's it. 

 

You can continue to wallow in your ignorance, or you can click on the following link and learn the facts:

 

https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/06/nonusresidenttax.asp

https://ibkr.info/node/938

http://www.taxsummaries.pwc.com/ID/Withholding-tax-(WHT)-rates

 

You are paying tax.

 

[NightSky]

On 4/18/2019 at 1:52 AM, DaRoadrunner said:

Looks like you are talking about yourself there Oxx. Da Roadrunner has NEVER paid tax in the USA nor been asked to. Been investing on the NYSE for years.

Dividends on us stocks are taxed at source therefore you’ll never be asked to pay tax on those funds. You just don’t see the funds to begin with.

 

 

[statman78]

4 hours ago, gk10002000 said:

Love it Cardinal man.  I too have been investing for income from stocks and dividends, many of which are tax free and have stuff in my regular brokerage account, traditional IRA and Roth IRA.  Just hit 62 years of age and about to coast into semi retirement with > 60,000 USD income, and I have not even started social security yet.  So I am not rich but should be able to do a very comfortable retirement and have crossed the 1 Million dollar mark with no loans, no debts, etc.  Was planning on Thailand sooner than now, but work has been OK and I get to keep 35,000 in company matching 401k contributions if I stick around until October 1, so that is worth waiting form

gk,

Pretty much  the same with me.  I retired last year at age 62 and moved my 401K into an IRA along with taking my pension money and rolling that into my IRA.  My company froze our pension benefits about 10 years ago but still allowed the cash equivalent to grow.  I moved to Thailand debt free with a similar amount invested.  I now use an advisor and they are doing well for me.  The only difference is that my wife and I purchased several properties over the past 10 years in Thailand (all with cash).  We now have three properties that are generating income for us here in Thailand.  I have not decided yet about when I'll start drawing Social Security.

[The Theory]

I believe it is time to sell. 

[Oxx]

1 hour ago, NightSky said:

Dividends on us stocks are taxed at source

 

Not quite if by "at source" you mean the company paying the dividend.  The company typically doesn't know anything about the investor's tax residence so can't apply different withholding tax rates.  The broker, however, does.

[ThaiFelix]

3 hours ago, Jane Dough said:

No, I don't buy American stock.

 

I use Knorr, Oxo if I can get it.

 

Rooster

 

 

Yeah I much prefer OXO.......available now from Villar.

[1FinickyOne]

Yes. Actually started,at a very early age. 

[NightSky]

29 minutes ago, Oxx said:

 

Not quite if by "at source" you mean the company paying the dividend.  The company typically doesn't know anything about the investor's tax residence so can't apply different withholding tax rates.  The broker, however, does.

I havn’t heared of anyone buying stocks directly from the companies you invest in, it’s always a broker or fund manager who is the source of the funds that pay you hence ‘taxed at source’ of funds.

 

Its a withholding tax if you want the exact terminology.

 

[Old Thai Hand]

I am fully invested in US stocks but pay very little tax as my investments tend to be in preferred shares whose dividends are treated as interest and therefore non-taxable. I do pay tax on straight equity investments, REIT's, CEF's, etc.

[Lacessit]

5 hours ago, Jane Dough said:

No, I don't buy American stock.

 

I use Knorr, Oxo if I can get it.

 

Rooster

 

 

It's quite heartening to see females that know their place in the scheme of things. Well done.

[Skeptic7]

Yes...and have done and continue to do quite nicely.

Am a US citizen though...and that makes a big diff. 

Also own smaller amounts of "foreign" stocks, including some Emerging Markets investments. 

Diversification.

[Oxx]

It amazes me how much Americans in particular suffer from home country bias when investing.  Of all the stock markets in the world, why would one assume that any particular one such as the US would perform best? It's irrational.

 

If we compare two ETFs, one representing the US (iShares Core S&P 500 ETF), the other Thailand (iShares MSCI Thailand ETF).  Both are traded in USD to make things simpler.  The 10 year annualised return of the US is 15.85%, of Thailand, 17.72%.  An extra 2% or so per year may not sound like a lot, but it adds up.  $100,000 invested in the US after ten years would have been worth $435,472.  The same invested in Thailand would have been worth $511,096.  (Data to the end of March, 2019.)

 

Of course, this isn't the whole story.  Whilst active management in large cap US stocks does very little to enhance returns, in less developed markets such as Thailand it can add significant value, so in practice the disparity could be greater.

 

Investing a bit in the US isn't necessarily a bad idea, but making it the bulk of one's investments is simply shooting oneself in the foot.
 

[AtoZ]

1 hour ago, Oxx said:

Of all the stock markets in the world, why would one assume that any particular one such as the US would perform best? It's irrational.

Because it does. And US is way more safe than 3rd world Asian country under military rule where you have no idea what numbers are real and what numbers are fabricated.

 

I'm not American btw

 

Also your own example

 

iShares Core S&P 500 ETF - 5 year annualised return = 10.86%

iShares MSCI Thailand  ETF - 5 year annualised return = 6.75%

 

iShares Core S&P 500 ETF - 1 year annualised return = 9.46%

iShares MSCI Thailand  ETF - 1 year annualised return = -7.56% (don't overlook the Minus)

 

And that's during 5 years when overall world economy is on fire. What will happen during depression?

[Thailand J]

30-40% of US S&P 500 sales is from overseas, that is enough diversification for me.

I'll stay with US stocks, invest in the biggest and the best companies in the world. Investing is not a contest, I don't have to bet on the fastest horse, as long as it is a winning horse.

Often when you compare two ETF's, results are different during different time spans, draw your own conclusion which is better.

 

 

 

[5633572526]

On 4/17/2019 at 9:37 PM, Oxx said:

 

You really don't have a clue, do you? Standard rate of withholding tax is 30% (even if you fill in the form).  In some jurisdictions, with certain brokers it's reduced to 15%.

Capital gains tax is 15% dividend if not reinvested is taxed the same as interest on your savings account. You don’t pay any tax on gains until you sell. My portfolio is up 16% so far this year so I am very happy with my US stocks and I don’t use a broker 

[Oxx]

15 hours ago, Thailand J said:

I'll stay with US stocks, invest in the biggest and the best companies in the world. Investing is not a contest, I don't have to bet on the fastest horse, as long as it is a winning horse.

Often when you compare two ETF's, results are different during different time spans, draw your own conclusion which is better.

 

Biggest and best companies in the world? Like Enron? Lehman Bros.? Kodak? Sears? &c., &c..

 

Only 3 of the top 10 companies by revenue are American (Walmart #1, Exxon#9, Berkshire Hathaway #10).  Of the others, 3 are Chinese, 3 European, 1 Japanese.  Details at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_companies_by_revenue

 

That you wrote "US stocks, invest in the biggest and the best companies in the world" is typical of the blinkered attitude of Americans.  I guess it stems from being fed a steady diet of America's exceptionalism from birth:  unthinking nonsense such as "USA #1" and all that saluting the flag.

 

As for performance, clearly the longer the timespan considered, the better the indication of relative performance.

 

By using shorter timespans to date you're getting a very distorted picture of the performance of US markets which have recently been buoyed by Trump's tax cuts for wealthy corporations which has led to their buying back their own shares, boosting the price.  This is, of course, unsustainable.  Indeed, a change of regime could well see a reversal of the tax cuts for the wealthiest, leading to a fall in US stock values.

 

In any case, one would generally expect less developed markets to advance faster than a very mature one such as America - they've got plenty of (profitable) catching up to do.

[Thailand J]

 21 of the 50 companies in the link you posted are American.

 

The charts I posted earlier spanned 11 years.

 

 

 

[AtoZ]

3 hours ago, Oxx said:

In any case, one would generally expect less developed markets to advance faster than a very mature one such as America - they've got plenty of (profitable) catching up to do.

9 out of 10 Chinese or Thai companies would bankrupt in few years if the protection of no competition wouldn't exist anymore

 

they exist only because foreign competitors are not allowed to enter the market, and domestic growth won't be that much faster

[Oxx]

3 hours ago, Thailand J said:

 21 of the 50 companies in the link you posted are American.

 

So, 29 of the companies are not American.  That's clearly incompatible with "I'll stay with US stocks, invest in the biggest and the best companies in the world" if you're ignoring 3/5ths of the largest companies and many of the best (however that is quantified).

 

 

[Oxx]

2 hours ago, AtoZ said:

9 out of 10 Chinese or Thai companies would bankrupt in few years if the protection of no competition wouldn't exist anymore

 

they exist only because foreign competitors are not allowed to enter the market

 

So what? We're talking about investment, not morality.  And anyway, there are many American companies that would perform dismally if it weren't for the US' protectionist measures.  Same, same.

[AtoZ]

41 minutes ago, Oxx said:

 

So what? We're talking about investment, not morality. 

So what? Good luck investing in company that has no legs outside of the protection.

 

Growth prospects - limited to none.

[Thailand J]

3 hours ago, Oxx said:

6 hours ago, Thailand J said:

 21 of the 50 companies in the link you posted are American.

 

So, 29 of the companies are not American.  That's clearly incompatible with "I'll stay with US stocks, invest in the biggest and the best companies in the world" if you're ignoring 3/5ths of the largest companies and many of the best (however that is quantified).

 

Which country has the most big firms on that list? China is at distant second with 11.

 

i didn't say I invested in ALL the mega companies in the world. I invested in S&P 500, not every mega comapny in the world is in S&P 500 but everyone of the 500 is one of the biggest firms and the best (profitable).

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[moontang]

On 4/17/2019 at 8:54 PM, Oxx said:

Given the withholding tax on US dividends for foreigners, US stocks are generally unattractive.  And personally I don't want to pay a tax which goes to the US government to help fund its military-industrial complex and its overseas wars.  Far better options elsewhere.

and what exactly does the D stand for in EADS?

[Nyezhov]

On 4/17/2019 at 9:54 AM, Oxx said:

Given the withholding tax on US dividends for foreigners, US stocks are generally unattractive.  And personally I don't want to pay a tax which goes to the US government to help fund its military-industrial complex and its overseas wars.  Far better options elsewhere.

We love stocks and mutual funds in my family.  While my portfolio is not quite as fat as others. its alwys fun when Mommy Dearest complains about the Badger Hair dude and then I whip out her brokerage statement and tell her to just give it all back then. She quiets down and starts clipping coupons.

 

We dont mind paying taxes either, especially when we know we are buying bombs that may be needed to save the world again.