Water heater installation, what could go wrong ?

[myjawe]

hello, after renovating bathroom I have to put back the water heater, but I forgot to take photos, maybe you could confirm that this is correct ?

Water heater is Stiebel Eltron.

 

- 2 electric cables from condo main electric box are connected into a switch to cut electricity

- 2 electric cables from heater connect to this switch

- Earth / Ground connect to the available hole in water heater

 

Anything else ? If I am not sure about the cable colors in the water heater, what could go wrong if I do not connect the 3 cables to the correct place in the heater ? It will just break the machine ?

 

Also, bathroom does not have any electric socket for an hair dryer, so can i just connect a cable (and socket) to the heater or to the switch ? Or maybe it's not the correct way to proceed ?

 

Thank you for your help / confirmation.

 

 

 

 

[scorecard]

"- Earth / Ground connect to the available hole in water heater."

 

I'm not an electrician but I suggest you check well that the plug on the cable coming out of the heater has 3 pins, inside the plug the 3 wires are all connected to pins (3 in total / correct colouring) and also ensure that the earth wire is actually earthed, it is properly / securely connected to an earthing rod or whatever.

 

As said, I'm not an electrician, far from it, but several times I've had buddies assume the earthing connections are fully completed then discovered the earth wire in fact goes nowhere, in other words it provides no protection whatever.

 

I'm sure the real sparkies will be along soon to comment more.

 

Good luck.  

[Crossy]

Don't forget to connect the water

 

Generally, it doesn't actually matter which way round live and neutral are, modern appliances don't care. Of course it's best to connect correctly, black is usually live, white neutral.

 

The ground/earth is important, Thai electricity IS the same as the rest of the known universe (despite what many a local sparks will tell you), make sure that green (hopefully) wire really does go to a ground rod somewhere.

 

Outlets in bathrooms can be a serious safety hazard. Certainly do not connect it directly to the shower supply. Do you have an outlet on the other side of the wall or in an adjacent room you can spur off? Also, a bathroom outlet must be RCD protected, do you already have a Safe-T-Cut or other form of earth leakage breaker in your distribution board? If not consider installing one.

 

[Beggar]

I always connect live and neutral correctly. Otherwise something that seems to be switched off still can be under power. I never care about cable colors but always check myself what is the live and what is the neutral wire. 

[Beggar]

In respect of putting the water heater and a hair dryer to the same switch. Both could be switched on at the same time. So you have to make sure that the cable going to the switch supports this wattage and also make sure that the fuse protecting this cable fits. 

[David B in Thailand]

Stiebel Eltron water heaters should come with a helpful template and instructions. You can consider getting help from the Stiebel Eltron "PC" that might be at your local home builders merchants, Global House, Homepro or Thaiwatsadu. 

[jumbo]

https://www.manualslib.com/

 

[crazykopite]

For the sake of a few baht get a competent electrician it’s a 5 minute job if your going to do it yourself switch off the main fuse in your box as for putting in a socket make sure you buy one that has a waterproof cover on it water and electricity do not like each other .

[crazykopite]

I spent 5,000 baht on a Safe T protector and boy there have been times when it has been helpful especially if you have bad electric coming into your property living on an island we can get many power cuts that I turn burn out computers , TVs and so on . Never be a skin flint when it comes to electricity treat it as the number 1 item in your property .

[atyclb]

https://www.stiebeleltronasia.com/index.php?op=product-index&cid=6

 

https://www.e-tankless.com/electric-tankless-installation.php

 

https://www.gotankless.com/Tempra-Installation.pdf

[NanLaew]

18 minutes ago, crazykopite said:

For the sake of a few baht get a competent electrician...

Get a what now?

[Snackbar]

What’s the model number?

 

Most S Electron w/h’s are fitted with a 30 A ELCB

[lopburi3]

On 5/17/2019 at 5:17 AM, Crossy said:

Don't forget to connect the water

And to the correct side - recently had off-brand unit installed by contractor with input on output - does not work well that way.  I had removed both hot/neutral from breaker box while they worked and they only connected hot at first so when they connected neutral and still did not work they were sure unit bad.

[Formaleins]

Check your cable size, I would run minimum of 6mm sq. if under 20 feet and better 8mm or even 10mm if it is a longer run with high current.

[finnishmen]

first need know what size heater have wattage, then need instal residual current circuit breaker.

third you need connect hot wire, L, neutral wire N, and ground wire green-yellow. go to ground outside house. long copper rod to ground.  wattage rules say what size cable you need use. under 3500W used 1 first have cable size, second have same AWG american wire standard, last have max current to cable. uxI volt x current is wattage.

[Snackbar]

As I said, most Electrons are fitted with an RCD, depends on the model. If you read the op - ‘....put back the water heater...’

[lagarto]

for your own sake  brother every time l buy electric house appliances always request for installation service in many cases base on the amount of purchase you get it for free or pay very little compare with the risk you taking doing it yourself even if you feel you are smart enough to do it, if you don't know the wiring in the new place, don't touch it. Electricity + water the perfect ingredient for disaster.

[atyclb]

39 minutes ago, lagarto said:

for your own sake  brother every time l buy electric house appliances always request for installation service in many cases base on the amount of purchase you get it for free or pay very little compare with the risk you taking doing it yourself even if you feel you are smart enough to do it, if you don't know the wiring in the new place, don't touch it. Electricity + water the perfect ingredient for disaster.

 

 

soo true. you as the buyer do not risk electrocution during installation, just electrocution taking shower.

[lopburi3]

39 minutes ago, lagarto said:

for your own sake  brother every time l buy electric house appliances always request for installation service in many cases base on the amount of purchase you get it for free or pay very little compare with the risk you taking doing it yourself even if you feel you are smart enough to do it, if you don't know the wiring in the new place, don't touch it. Electricity + water the perfect ingredient for disaster.

Not always a good plan here as many doing electrical work have less than a clue.  And very few will actually connect or test a ground wire.  

[xtrnuno41]

Best way to protect as Crossy said, I ll say, MUST have a RCBO in your electric cabinet.

 

If you think you are REAL qualified to work with electric and handy, you can do it yourself.

However with your question, no offense, it looks you dont really know.

Switch off the main power switch, yha ok you are out of power.

Know what you are doing and think twice, before acting.

Otherwise dont even think about it, let someone do it for you, QUALIFIED !

One tiny little error can cost you your life.

 

With your plan to connect inside the heater, an additional wire for a socket, you will be making changes in the housing which can be very dangerous.

You modify the housing and then water could get in.

You need a watertight coupling to fix in the housing for preventing water to get in the housing.

Besides you will have a clamped cable running over your ceiling to the socket, you just renovated it! 

 

I wouldnt recommend it and better look to make an additional wire for the socket straight to the electric box. OK more difficult as you are in a condo.

Too bad you didnt think about it before renovation.

I would forget about the socket over there and dry hair somewhere else. Live with it, its not a big deal, but your health is.

[Beggar]

6 hours ago, crazykopite said:

For the sake of a few baht get a competent electrician it’s a 5 minute job if your going to do it yourself switch off the main fuse in your box as for putting in a socket make sure you buy one that has a waterproof cover on it water and electricity do not like each other .

It is very hard to find a competent electrician here. Best is you understand yourself what needs to be done and tell him. It is not that complicated.

 

A friend of mine asked a "professional" electrician to install a Stiebel Eltron Water heater with 10 kw. The "professional" always installed water heaters with up to 6 kw. He didn't even look at the heater rating. Result was that the cable got very hot and the circuit breaker switched always off. His comment was that the completely new water heater has a problem. 

 

Other example - all my outside aircon units were installed with the phases turned around and so even if they are not running you will get an electric shock if you touch them and so on... 

[lopburi3]

1 hour ago, xtrnuno41 said:

I wouldnt recommend it and better look to make an additional wire for the socket straight to the electric box.

Perhaps best to dry hair outside of wet room.  Bedroom vanity is what we have always used.

[bankruatsteve]

Jeez.  An outlet in the bathroom is not a big deal.  I guess almost EVERY bathroom in the states has one.  If the circuit is not protected by RCD then a "GFCI" would be the choice.  Available in Thailand.  The receptacle can be sourced however it makes sense.  

[lopburi3]

2 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

Jeez.  An outlet in the bathroom is not a big deal.  I guess almost EVERY bathroom in the states has one.  If the circuit is not protected by RCD then a "GFCI" would be the choice.  Available in Thailand.  The receptacle can be sourced however it makes sense.  

It can be a very big deal when standing on wet tile in bare feet and have the normal hair dryer card fray or drop.  Yes circuit protection may save your life but it can be a nasty shock before it does.  Just no need to take the extra risk of using hair dryer in bathroom IMHO.  And yes I do have a protected outlet in bathroom for oral irrigator.   

[KC 71]

Mine is grounded,but if in doubt wear rubber sole flipflops [emoji106]


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[myjawe]

Thank you for replies. Heater is now installed as it was before. I didn't forget the earth / ground, but is there a way to check that it is really working ?

 

I never had any problem with this water heater, so I guess that earth is connected, but it's just a guess ????

 

There is a main switch in the condo, to cut all electricity, then another one outside condo in the room where are electric meters, but can you explain me clearly what is a RCBO or anything else that you have been talking about to make the installation even safer ? Is it really needed ? I never found any place with more than a switch near the water heater and a main switch in the condo to stop all electricity.

 

Thank you again for your help, you are great.

 

 

 

 

 

[Crossy]

19 minutes ago, myjawe said:

There is a main switch in the condo, to cut all electricity, then another one outside condo in the room where are electric meters, but can you explain me clearly what is a RCBO or anything else that you have been talking about to make the installation even safer ? Is it really needed ? I never found any place with more than a switch near the water heater and a main switch in the condo to stop all electricity.

 

Look for a switch or breaker with a "Test" button, that's a pretty good indication of an RCD / RCBO.

 

If you're not sure please post a photo of your distribution board.

 

 

[Beggar]

1 hour ago, myjawe said:

Thank you for replies. Heater is now installed as it was before. I didn't forget the earth / ground, but is there a way to check that it is really working ?

 

I never had any problem with this water heater, so I guess that earth is connected, but it's just a guess ????

 

There is a main switch in the condo, to cut all electricity, then another one outside condo in the room where are electric meters, but can you explain me clearly what is a RCBO or anything else that you have been talking about to make the installation even safer ? Is it really needed ? I never found any place with more than a switch near the water heater and a main switch in the condo to stop all electricity.

 

Thank you again for your help, you are great.

 

 

 

 

 

All these protective systems RCBO, ELCB meassure the amount of electricity that comes in and that goes back. If there is a discrepancy they will switch off because there must be a loss because perhaps you or something else creates an earth contact for instance. Any discrepancy will switch off. So often you can adjust the sensitivity to avoid problems. Most water heaters have an ELCB with a test button build in. 

 

One thing I want to add. You might ask what is the difference to a normal circuit breaker. These protect the cable from overload. They don't meassure flow discrepancies. They will hardly prodect people. 

[myjawe]

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

 

Look for a switch or breaker with a "Test" button, that's a pretty good indication of an RCD / RCBO.

 

If you're not sure please post a photo of your distribution board.

 

 

 

hello, I have no test button anywhere. Everything is working fine. Why adding something to the electric system, and what ? thank you so much.

 

 

 

 

 

[rwill]

21 hours ago, bankruatsteve said:

Jeez.  An outlet in the bathroom is not a big deal.  I guess almost EVERY bathroom in the states has one.  If the circuit is not protected by RCD then a "GFCI" would be the choice.  Available in Thailand.  The receptacle can be sourced however it makes sense.  

But the bathrooms in America are not designed for the whole floor to be wet.