Question for the Techies.

[Tanoshi]

27 minutes ago, Moonlover said:

Move the router, plug in a LAN cable. Job done. 

Easier said than done, but an option.

 

124 download speed is fine, it's the principal that your paying for a service your not receiving.

 

I took the issue up with the shop (point of sale) and their customer services in Bangkok.

It was absolute news to them that you got less than half the advertised speed when using wi-fi.

If the speeds your purchasing can only be achieved with an ethernet connection, why not tell you so and why doesn't the installer advise and fit an ethernet cable.

This information could also make a difference of where to locate the router in the first instance.

[Boomer6969]

40 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Foreign language to a non techie   ????

For heavens sake!

Affordable WIFI MESH package

 

In the future I'll abstain trying to make sense. 

 

 

[1FinickyOne]

1 hour ago, Tanoshi said:

for those who are not techies when an internet provider offers a service you expect what you pay for.

Really? Why? 

 

I am not a techie either... but I suspect both of us have been around long enough to understand advertising... they will advertise something when used at its optimal point... [your mileage may vary]  [with a name like Smuckers, it has to be good] [grow hair, eat all you want] the list is endless.. but I would assume that there are some individual factors in my home and location that might vary -  

 

I don't see that you were deceived.. most things work better when plugged in... my tv doesn't work at all if not plugged in... and my computer is old and doesn't run as fast as it used to either... 

 

surely you have some street sense at this point in life - life is disappointing enough w/o high expectations from advertising... 

 

 

[Tanoshi]

16 minutes ago, robblok said:

It could also be your computer that is not good enough.

3 month old gaming PC. Cost 35,000 baht.

Same speed returns on new 5G mobile.

Not my equipment - perhaps theirs.

[robblok]

3 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

3 month old gaming PC. Cost 35,000 baht.

Same speed returns on new 5G mobile.

Not my equipment - perhaps theirs.

Who knows I mean the graphical card in my computer alone cost 26.000bt  Nvidia Gforce 3080 So I am not that impressed with your 35.000 bt pc. My PC's are usually 100k  or more (ex monitors).

 

But if you got a 3 month old gaming PC then its highly likely that your WIFI is good (at least one would think that it has good WIFI). 

 

Then the problem could be the router, usually the routers supplied is not that great and they don't have the best stuff.

 

If your willing to spend money then maybe get someone to help upgrade your router. 

 

 

[Tanoshi]

3 minutes ago, 1FinickyOne said:

I am not a techie either... but I suspect both of us have been around long enough to understand advertising... they will advertise something when used at its optimal point... [your mileage may vary]  [with a name like Smuckers, it has to be good] [grow hair, eat all you want] the list is endless.. but I would assume that there are some individual factors in my home and location that might vary -  

Aah! So you'd be perfectly happy if the 12 month extension (as advertised) and you paid for was only issued for 5 months then?

The point is if at the point of sale these finer details are advised to the purchaser, then you can plan accordingly.

When the sales assistants and customer services advisors aren't even aware of these issues, what chance has the customer got of making decisions.

I know this is Thailand, but ...........

 

[Tanoshi]

3 minutes ago, robblok said:

Then the problem could be the router, usually the routers supplied is not that great and they don't have the best stuff.

 

If your willing to spend money then maybe get someone to help upgrade your router. 

As said, I think the router is the issue.

It's rented, so if it's not capable to put out somewhere need the speed on wi-fi as advertised, then it's for True to upgrade for free - that's exactly what I'm trying to establish before making a complaint.

[robblok]

4 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

As said, I think the router is the issue.

It's rented, so if it's not capable to put out somewhere need the speed on wi-fi as advertised, then it's for True to upgrade for free - that's exactly what I'm trying to establish before making a complaint.

They guaranteed cabled speed just like any other company. So i doubt you get an upgrade. You can always ask but its still not a good one.

 

Personally i say invest in one of your own though it depends a bit on how many users you have how much you use. I got multiple computers and laptops and phones and some tablets in the house. So for me a good router with better memory and processor was important. 

 

If for you its just that computer and a phone then maybe a better router from them is enough.

[Dagfinnur Traustason]

2 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

300 down to 124 seems excessive.

Not at all.

[GarryP]

1 hour ago, AlfHuy said:

So my advice is keep your provider's  router/access point disable its WIFI and plug in one of those MESH systems. Make sure every cable and device supports Cat 8. Enjoy the shopping, look for a MESH that has a dedicated backhaul channel, the AX/AC choice is a bit more difficult. I am likely to go for AC now, as AX is still expensive and these things have a short life expectancy.

 

Sounds interesting.

Mesh

AX

AC

Sounds very interesting. I shall have to look into this. 

[robblok]

11 minutes ago, GarryP said:

Sounds very interesting. I shall have to look into this. 

Would certainly be good if you have only need of WIFI and not too many devices in the house.

 

I use a lot of internet from multiple devices. Then the memory in the router and processor speed starts to count. But only if you got a top of the line internet package.

 

So if you have a normal package and not too many devices then this will be great.

 

Provided that your computers / devices have the higher WIFI settings.

 

You remove the limitations from the router its WIFI then if your devices are good enough it will yield faster speeds.

 

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000005725/network-and-i-o/wireless.html

[1FinickyOne]

42 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Aah! So you'd be perfectly happy if the 12 month extension (as advertised) and you paid for was only issued for 5 months then?

The point is if at the point of sale these finer details are advised to the purchaser, then you can plan accordingly.

When the sales assistants and customer services advisors aren't even aware of these issues, what chance has the customer got of making decisions.

I know this is Thailand, but ...........

 

it's not just Thailand - I was on chat over an hour, 4 different people w/Amazon and all I wanted to do was find out what I needed to do to replace a battery in a 10 yr old kindle... they still gave me no answer...

 

customer service is not likely going to be able to tell you what speed you might get if you use wifi and go 17' from the router, around one door and through a hallway... if you expect that level of service, I would guess you are going to be paying a small fortune for it... 

 

I think you got frustrated as us non-techies can... and maybe are taking out your anger inappropriately... getting upset w/people who cannot give you a precise answer as there is none available... if you want to be upset, seems like you are doing a good job of it. I only hope that you are not taking it out on people, yes they are people, and customer service is only their job, who could not have possibly answered the question, especially since you probably did not ask it until after.. 

 

And the apples to oranges comparisons [paying for visa] aren't going to help you much - if that is what you are using for logic... 

 

The job of salespeople is to sell you a product, not educate you on its obvious limitations... 

 

Did you ask what the speed would be if you are not connected and 17' away and around one corner w/a closed door? - - or you just incorrectly assumed it would be the same as being connected... and assume it is their job to ask you all kinds of questions... that is not their job.. I am not techie either but I assumed my speed will not be as good on wifi... I don't check or care that much, but in the past, my speed has also varied on different days and times... and I don't get angry when my lack of knowledge is the cause of the problem. 

 

As a non techie, in your situation, I would just find this a learning experience... though it seems obvious to me that the further away you go, the weaker the signal... and I don't think rational thought would require someone to explain this... 

 

 

[seajae]

the speeds are for your connection to the provider only not for anything outside Thailand, if you use the providers speed test they are at the correct speed but as soon as you use one that is not in Thailand the speeds drop considerably and that was my computer being connected by ethernet,  wifi is not as fast though but do not expect top speeds from any international connections/sites

 

[Croma]

Can you post a photo of your Router, and model numbers?  (cover any passwords and user logins!) 

Obviously TRUE is providing the correct service, but perhaps not the correct tools. 

From that we should be able to establish if your accesspoint is not good enough or if we should troubleshoot something else. 

My Wifi access point provided by True can hit 450mbps~  I wonder if we have the same model. 
 

[Tanoshi]

42 minutes ago, 1FinickyOne said:

As a non techie, in your situation, I would just find this a learning experience... though it seems obvious to me that the further away you go, the weaker the signal... and I don't think rational thought would require someone to explain this... 

That isn't the issue though, I'm aware the farther away you are you get signal strength drop, until eventually no signal.

True installed the line and router. They could see where my PC was, but at no time did they offer any advice reference connection by ethernet or wi-fi as being significantly different. If they had done so, I would have directed them to install it elsewhere. 

Where they chose to fit it was probably dependant on the length of cable they had left on a roll.

 

Anyway I have found the cause.

It is the router and True are upgrading it tomorrow. 

 

Many thanks for your answers.

[Tanoshi]

10 minutes ago, Croma said:

Obviously TRUE is providing the correct service, but perhaps not the correct tools. 

You hit the nail on the head.

[gamb00ler]

I just tested my home setup with 2.4GHz, 5GHz and ethernet cable.  The 5GHz throughput pretty much matched that of the ethernet cable.  The 2.4GHz connection was about 60% less.  My desktop is in a separate room 6m from the router but almost line-of-sight through a doorway.  Very little competition for bandwidth in our home.

 

So make sure you're using the 5GHz unless a couple of concrete/brick walls separate router from computer.  In that case you should test both 5 and 2.4 and pick the best.

Edited January 22, 2021 by gamb00ler

[GarryP]

3 hours ago, robblok said:

Would certainly be good if you have only need of WIFI and not too many devices in the house.

 

I use a lot of internet from multiple devices. Then the memory in the router and processor speed starts to count. But only if you got a top of the line internet package.

 

So if you have a normal package and not too many devices then this will be great.

 

Provided that your computers / devices have the higher WIFI settings.

 

You remove the limitations from the router its WIFI then if your devices are good enough it will yield faster speeds.

 

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000005725/network-and-i-o/wireless.html

Now you are going over my head. My package is AIS Fibre 500/500. At any one time the most connections we have is 2 smart phones, 2 laptops and 2 TVs. 

[1FinickyOne]

19 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

They could see where my PC was, but at no time did they offer any advice

They are installers - not advisors... a sure way for them to get in hot water would be to try to advise a farang and have the farang get angry... how good is your Thai?

 

I just hope you have not been abusive to customer service people who are trying to help you through your misunderstanding... 

 

glad you got it resolved. 

[Tanoshi]

13 minutes ago, 1FinickyOne said:

They are installers - not advisors... a sure way for them to get in hot water would be to try to advise a farang and have the farang get angry... how good is your Thai?

Actually your advised that the installer will advise on the best position for the router having assessed where and how many devices you may have.

 

16 minutes ago, 1FinickyOne said:

I just hope you have not been abusive to customer service people who are trying to help you through your misunderstanding... 

Not all all, it was a very educational 3 way discussion between the technician, customer services and myself.

As usual what transpired is that the left hand never talks to the right hand in Thailand.

Various departments not communicating with each other and exactly who is responsible for what.

 

25 minutes ago, 1FinickyOne said:

glad you got it resolved. 

They've reevaluated our whole package deal now and can offer the new 1Gigatex mesh router (fibre optic cable) and save us 400 baht on our current monthly payment plan. (Internet/TV/Mobile).

[suzannegoh]

With ISPs providing connections to the internet as fast as they are now it's often then case that the WiFi within a user's house is the limiting factor in the speeds that can be obtained.  I can see your point that ISPs should probably highlight that fact but, on the other hand, to be surprised by that suggests technical illiteracy far beyond the norm.

[Glaswegian2]

On 1/22/2021 at 9:59 AM, Tanoshi said:

My internet provider is True.

I pay for the 300/100 download upload service.

 

I recently had issues with the internet, which resulted in a technician visiting my home.

After he finished, I did a speed test resulting in 124/100, far from the 300 speed I pay for.

I'm told by True that's because I'm using wi-fi and not a ethernet cable.

Indeed if I connect an ethernet cable from the router I obtain the 300 download speed.

 

I did a little internet research which did not agree with the information given by True.

The router is approx 10' away from my PC, but in an adjacent room, although it's open plan (no doors in-between).

I asked a local techie who stated in his opinion the wi-fi output from the router was at fault.

 

What kind of drop should you expect when using wi-fi as opposed to an ethernet cable.

300 down to 124 seems excessive.

It's not my PC, I get the same speed results using my new 5G phone.

 

Are True trying to make excuses, or am I expecting to much.

Opinions appreciated.

 

 If True are making excuses, then 3BB are as well. When they arranged to sell me a Wi-Fi router they didn't  tell me I could expect only half the bandwidth. Neither did they tell me that Wi-Fi six is just round the corner and I would need a new wifi card. Thais always seem to have acute communication problems; I guess it's a function of living in the Third World, where very few people actually seem to give  a damn, especially if you're not  another Thai. Anyway after accepting a new router to cope with the 1 Gb speed, and not able to get it, I told them to take it back and reinstall the old Router, which had 4x1Gb ethernet ports.  I then installed my own cat7 ethernet cable. Functioning pretty well now and it only cost about 700THB. I regularly get more than 800 Mb and sometimes get more than 1GB.

 

 I know it sounds a bit gloomy, but my advice to anybody would be do not listen to "Tech support" people if they are in the pay of a company which is trying to make money out of you; they will inevitably see you in the  context of increasing their revenue rather than increasing your throughput. I'm not a skilled IT person but I found it more  beneficial to learn a little bit about the subject before talking to 3BB, I imagine you will be in the same boat with True; what you know doesn't have to be super duper detailed. Of course, then, you will have committed the unpardonable sin of not being a good little foreigner and doing as you're told. Heads they win tails you lose, I suppose, That seems to be the common refrain.

 

 

 Good luck, PM me if you think I can be of any more help.

 

 

Edited January 27, 2021 by Glaswegian2

[recom273]

20 minutes ago, Glaswegian2 said:

 

 If True are making excuses, then 3BB are as well. When they arranged to sell me a Wi-Fi router they didn't  tell me I could expect only half the bandwidth. Neither did they tell me that Wi-Fi six is just round the corner and I would need a new wifi card. Thais always seem to have acute communication problems; I guess it's a function of living in the Third World, where very few people actually seem to give  a damn, especially if you're not  another Thai. Anyway after accepting a new router to cope with the 1 Gb speed, and not able to get it, I told them to take it back and reinstall the old Router, which had 4x1Gb ethernet ports.  I then installed my own cat7 ethernet cable. Functioning pretty well now and it only cost about 700THB. I regularly get more than 800 Mb and sometimes get more than 1GB.

 

 I know it sounds a bit gloomy, but my advice to anybody would be do not listen to "Tech support" people if they are in the pay of a company which is trying to make money out of you; they will inevitably see you in the  context of increasing their revenue rather than increasing your throughput. I'm not a skilled IT person but I found it more  beneficial to learn a little bit about the subject before talking to 3BB, I imagine you will be in the same boat with True; what you know doesn't have to be super duper detailed. Of course, then, you will have committed the unpardonable sin of not being a good little foreigner and doing as you're told. Heads they win tails you lose, I suppose, That seems to be the common refrain.

 

 

 Good luck, PM me if you think I can be of any more help.

 

 

 

Yes, I had that - a really excellent young installer came round to the house after I wasn't getting the gigabit I had just upgraded to and said the GPON box I have could only handle 500mbs, apologised that there was nothing he could do, I would have to go to the shop and swap out this tiny GPON the size of a fag packet for a huge combo wifi router.

I went to the shop, got the router, installed it, ran speed tests. I called the helpline who sent the same young installer back with an older guy, who told me the router I had been given was only capable of 500mbs.

The older guy called the shop and I have never heard a Thai person rip into another as that guy did, he asked them why they gave us the old router - because they didnt have a proper router and they thought it was easier to fob off my wife with an old router than supply the correct thing. He didnt go ballistic but he coated the 3BB shop staff good and proper.

 

He went and got the correct router and installed it, putting it into bridge mode and gave me time to run all the tests and made sure I was happy, I bought them lunch that day.  A week later he returned with a second hand GPON box that they removed from a business premises and swapped out the router.

 

They aren't all monkeys with bamboo ladders, these guys do seem to understand and can communicate directly with the ISP team.

 

Wifi6 is a long way off isn't it? .. The routers are way more expensive, and we dont have the hardware to deal with it - there is plenty of life in a well set up, quality enterprise wifi system. 

 

 

[KannikaP]

On 1/22/2021 at 3:53 PM, GarryP said:

Now you are going over my head. My package is AIS Fibre 500/500. At any one time the most connections we have is 2 smart phones, 2 laptops and 2 TVs. 

It doesn't matter what is connected, it's how many are being used simultaneously which uses your WiFi.

[KannikaP]

On 1/22/2021 at 11:38 AM, robblok said:

Who knows I mean the graphical card in my computer alone cost 26.000bt  Nvidia Gforce 3080 So I am not that impressed with your 35.000 bt pc. My PC's are usually 100k  or more (ex monitors).

 

But if you got a 3 month old gaming PC then its highly likely that your WIFI is good (at least one would think that it has good WIFI). 

 

Then the problem could be the router, usually the routers supplied is not that great and they don't have the best stuff.

 

If your willing to spend money then maybe get someone to help upgrade your router. 

 

 

I don't think he was trying to impress you Robb.

[Glaswegian2]

2 hours ago, recom273 said:

Wifi6 is a long way off isn't it? .. The routers are way more expensive, and we dont have the hardware to deal with it - there is plenty of life in a well set up, quality enterprise wifi system. 

 

 

 

No, it's here now. The M1 Macs have wifi cards which are compatible. The only reasons I didn't get a wifi6 card is my machine runs another OS, not Windows and I need to be careful of compatibility. I also want to transfer the boot partition to a NVME drive, installed on a PCIe card and I only have 1 PCI slot on my mobo. Not entirely trouble-free I will grant, but I will get there.

 

 

Edited January 27, 2021 by Glaswegian2

[Glaswegian2]

On 1/22/2021 at 3:12 PM, gamb00ler said:

I just tested my home setup with 2.4GHz, 5GHz and ethernet cable.  The 5GHz throughput pretty much matched that of the ethernet cable.  The 2.4GHz connection was about 60% less.  My desktop is in a separate room 6m from the router but almost line-of-sight through a doorway.  Very little competition for bandwidth in our home.

 

So make sure you're using the 5GHz unless a couple of concrete/brick walls separate router from computer.  In that case you should test both 5 and 2.4 and pick the best.

 

On my router. the 5ghz network is nowhere near the 1Gb ethernet.- even running all the family phones (and half the neighbours too I suspect) on the 2.4Ghz circuit and putting in a repeater only gets me about 500Mb *sigh*. Anyone want to buy a repeater? In my miscellany box ATM, together with a nifty UPS box small enough for the router (works amazingly well for a Chinese product - I swear by the Chinese products, they will lead the world in the next 10 years). And the ethernet connection consistently gets me 800Mb - close enough for rock 'n' roll.

Edited January 27, 2021 by Glaswegian2

[recom273]

23 minutes ago, Glaswegian2 said:

 

No, it's here now. The M1 Macs have wifi cards which are compatible. The only reasons I didn't get a wifi6 card is my machine runs another OS, not Windows and I need to be careful of compatibility. I also want to transfer the boot partition to a NVME drive, installed on a PCIe card and I only have 1 PCI slot on my mobo. Not entirely trouble-free I will grant, but I will get there.

 

 

 

Ahh, interesting - I didnt know that, thanks. I will be in the market for a M1 iMac when released.

 

I'm just took the plunge and bought a load of unifi kit, Im really impressed, most of my kit is hardwired anyway so im more excited about a 10GB internal network, but in the future it should be a matter of swapping out the access points to Wifi6. I dont think unifi have rolled out the wifi6 kit yet.

 

I haven't been paying so much attention to wifi6 routers, are they still way expensive?

Edited January 27, 2021 by recom273

[Glaswegian2]

1 hour ago, recom273 said:

 

Ahh, interesting - I didnt know that, thanks. I will be in the market for a M1 iMac when released.

 

I'm just took the plunge and bought a load of unifi kit, Im really impressed, most of my kit is hardwired anyway so im more excited about a 10GB internal network, but in the future it should be a matter of swapping out the access points to Wifi6. I dont think unifi have rolled out the wifi6 kit yet.

 

I haven't been paying so much attention to wifi6 routers, are they still way expensive?

 

Couldn't tell you, 3BB installed a new one but took it back when I insisted. Bloody cheek, install a new router which does exactly what the old router did unless I buy a new wifi card with all the compatibility issues that brings with it. Didn't even ask - just showed up at the front door with the new one. Typical Thai way of doing things.

[gamb00ler]

On 1/22/2021 at 2:12 PM, gamb00ler said:

I just tested my home setup with 2.4GHz, 5GHz and ethernet cable.  The 5GHz throughput pretty much matched that of the ethernet cable.  The 2.4GHz connection was about 60% less.  My desktop is in a separate room 6m from the router but almost line-of-sight through a doorway.

 

51 minutes ago, Glaswegian2 said:

 

On my router. the 5ghz network is nowhere near the 1Gb ethernet.- even running all the family phones (and half the neighbours too I suspect) on the 2.4Ghz circuit and putting in a repeater only gets me about 500Mb *sigh*. Anyone want to buy a repeater? In my miscellany box ATM, together with a nifty UPS box small enough for the router (works amazingly well for a Chinese product - I swear by the Chinese products, they will lead the world in the next 10 years). And the ethernet connection consistently gets me 800Mb - close enough for rock 'n' roll.

I WAS surprised when the 5GHz WiFi almost matched the wired link.  Now that I think about it...that's probably because the wired link was limited by the speed of the WAN link to the outside end point.

Edited January 27, 2021 by gamb00ler