Bank staffer arrested after siphoning tens of millions of baht from Pattaya expats

[erikjcyoung]

I had an ATM card with a VISA facility on it on Standard Chartered Bank and it was stolen. So I went to their head office to report it stolen and they confirmed 375,000 Baht had been spent on the card in a gold shop. They refused to refund me unless I went to the gold shop and obtained receipts for the fraudulent purchases. I went to the gold shop but the gold shop owner explained how was he to know which exact purchases related to the fraud and he could not give me receipts. The Standard Chartered Bank has not refunded me to this day which is a serious breach of their contract with VISA International which states card holders who are victims of fraud MUST be refunded as quickly as possible failure to do this can result in your arrangement with VISA International being terminated.I suppose I should report them to VISA International why should I be nearly 400,000 Baht out of pocket?

[CLW]

15 hours ago, onebir said:

Suggests weak accounting controls in Thai banks?

But hoards of staff and supervisors in each bank branch, unable to check what's going on.

Not to mention internal audits of account movements

[SupermarineS6B]

Ha ha........ And this is why i wouldn't put 800,000 bht into a Thai bank to apply for a visa....... Do you honestly think they've now got a cat in hells chance of getting their money back  ?    That's a big NO....... I've always just had enough in the account to cover costs for two months, that's enough temptation, even more temptation in these hard times...... I don't like to say it....... Told you.....

[Cranky]

Just another story of being robbed in Thailand, lost count of how much I've been robbed of over the years and in how many creative ways.  Just add it to the cost of living and budget for it.  If it's in Thailand, it's at risk.  I did an online transfer once to someone, 50k, and when I checked a few days after the money had gone somewhere totally different, no recourse whatsoever.  

[Golden Triangle]

5 minutes ago, CLW said:

But hoards of staff and supervisors in each bank branch, unable to check what's going on.

Not to mention internal audits of account movements

 

With regards to the levels of staff in a branch, always loads milling around but I don't see a junior member of staff questioning a manager or anyone for that matter even if they suspected dodgy goings on, that's just how it works here.

[SupermarineS6B]

9 hours ago, Don Chance said:

What joke, why would anyone bother trying to retire in Thailand?

 

You are going to get ripped off, arrested, discriminated against, attacked, punched in the face, canceled visa, cheated out of your rent deposit, pushed off your condo balcony, catch HIV from your GF after she changes the deed to your house and in the end the bank will steal your money and say tough luck farang!

You forgot the last one....... "Go home and get some more money then come back".........

[xylophone]

7 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Since it stemmed from one of their employees, a manager at that, I would very much hope so. 

Banks would be covered by "liability insurance" which covers them for such things as this, well at least it does in the real world!

[tonray]

7 hours ago, ChipButty said:

My wife doesn't trust the Thai banks, so if she doesn't then I don't.

That's likely because she has an unlimited credit line at The Bank of Farang

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, RJRS1301 said:

Not in the world of business I have been in .

They are a safety stops and required by law to sign off on annual reports for direcctors and shareholders

Funny, auditors are renowned for not finding fraud, last one that comes to mind Patisserie Valerie

Edited February 3, 2021 by scubascuba3

[tonray]

26 minutes ago, Cranky said:

I did an online transfer once to someone, 50k, and when I checked a few days after the money had gone somewhere totally different, no recourse whatsoever.

If you used the wrong account number then that would be true, otherwise no.

[Regyai]

I see an onslaught of salivating brown shirts clamouring to to feeding frenzy 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

16 hours ago, dabhand said:

Bank info is in this Thaiger report if OK to post.

 

https://thethaiger.com/news/pattaya/hundreds-of-investors-caught-in-massive-kasikorn-bank-branch-fraud-in-pattaya

 

 

This kind of thing has happened before, and probably will happen again in the future, with criminal siphoning of funds from depositor accounts in Thai banks and co-ops.... And good luck in getting the bank(s) to take responsibility for the crimes that have occurred.

 

Whatever system of checks and controls they have in place obviously is not sufficient. And it certainly doesn't help with the item in the above-linked article talking about the manager not wondering why every month long queues of people were showing up to see the alleged thief.

 

BUT... at the same time, anyone living in today's world who thinks a bank is legitimately going to be offering 3.5 percent interest on deposits PER MONTH is literally asking to be taken for a ride. People also are responsible for exercising at least a reasonable degree of prudence in their financial affairs.

 

Edited February 3, 2021 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

BTW, I think it's worth noting re the current situation:

 

AFAIK, the government's Thai Deposit Protection Agency and its supporting law -- designed to protect Thai bank depositors from losing their funds in the event a bank fails similar to the U.S. FDIC  -- does NOT protect their deposits against financial fraud/crime by other parties including bank employees.

 

http://www.dpa.or.th/site/index

 

PS - The DPA used to have a quite good EN version of their website. But right now for some reason, I can only find/see an entirely TH version.

 

 

[Rimmer]

Troll and off topic posts removed

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I guess this could play out two different ways basically:

 

1. the alleged thief was depositing their funds into actual K bank accounts, and then playing games from there.  In which case, the bank clearly would be responsible (at least IMHO).

 

or

 

2. the alleged thief was keeping the funds himself in some fashion and concocting some elaborate fraud of fake passbooks and account statements scheme. In that case, he clearly was doing so as an assistant manager of the bank and what's more doing so on bank premises and on his work/employment time....  In that case also, to me, the bank clearly ought to be on the hook.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

BTW, I've tracked these kinds of cases for a long time here in Thailand... and it's worth mentioning...

 

Even if the majority or all of the victims in this particular case are non-Thais, Thais themselves are by no means immune from becoming victims of bank employee fraud/theft from their accounts.

 

There have been LOTS of such cases in the past, and at times for very substantial lost sums...  The employee thieves who engage on this kind of conduct will steal from whomever they can, regardless.

 

[Slain]

Kasikorn closed my account two months ago, probably because of inaction. I did not have too much in it, as I rarely used it.

Would have been more professional if they had contacted me before they did close it though.

[mberbae]

It's my understanding that Thai Banks do not have to bond ( insure ) their employees.

If an employee embezzles customers funds, the bank is not liable and it is up to the

account holder to press charges and go after the corrupt employee.

[ronaldo0]

When I look at my uk bank accounts everything looks fine and so clear and getting anything is very easy if I need a document or similar . When I look at my Thai bank websites and account pages the detail is awful . I gave up on most and now use scb as their mobile app is fairly good , but when I compare their website and login on a device to that of a uk bank it is like night and day . The amount of times I tried to do things that should have been so easy in a branch with Bkk bank and just got told I was wrong or cannot was insane so I gave up using them. 

[Jingthing]

2 hours ago, GAZZPA said:

I would think if they invested in a legitimate bank scheme and that lost money they have obviously lost money, however if an employee of the bank is siphoning off their money surely the bank would return this to them?

 

I'm not sure. Perhaps they thought they were putting their money into a legitimate bank account but they weren't. Instead of an act of God it was an act of fraud with shades of Ponzi 

[scubascuba3]

34 minutes ago, Slain said:

Kasikorn closed my account two months ago, probably because of inaction. I did not have too much in it, as I rarely used it.

Would have been more professional if they had contacted me before they did close it though.

how much was in there? 

[scubascuba3]

27 minutes ago, mberbae said:

It's my understanding that Thai Banks do not have to bond ( insure ) their employees.

If an employee embezzles customers funds, the bank is not liable and it is up to the

account holder to press charges and go after the corrupt employee.

Where did you get this from? 

[JustAnotherHun]

Hey guys, my honorable colleague from Kasikorn sadly seems to be out of business for a while.

If you are still interested in low-risk investments garanteeing a monthly return of 7,8%, just send me your money. 

[ttrd]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

BTW, I think it's worth noting re the current situation:

 

AFAIK, the government's Thai Deposit Protection Agency and its supporting law -- designed to protect Thai bank depositors from losing their funds in the event a bank fails similar to the U.S. FDIC  -- does NOT protect their deposits against financial fraud/crime by other parties including bank employees.

 

http://www.dpa.or.th/site/index

 

PS - The DPA used to have a quite good EN version of their website. But right now for some reason, I can only find/see an entirely TH version.

 

 

If I remember correct it cover only 1m tbh per customer (not per account) so if the bank file for bankruptcy and you have 10m in the bank only 1m will be refunded - with other words to be safe you must split your 10m over 10 different banks.

 

Anyway, this particular situation is different and will not be covered by the bankruptcy fond. Here one is probably dependent on the bank itself wanting to take a responsibility - in whole or in part, but I doubt it ...

[scubascuba3]

1 minute ago, ttrd said:

If I remember correct it cover only 1m tbh per customer (not per account) so if the bank file for bankruptcy and you have 10m in the bank only 1m will be refunded - with other words to be safe you must split your 10m over 10 different banks.

 

Anyway, this particular situation is different and will not be covered by the bankruptcy fond. Here one is probably dependent on the bank itself wanting to take a responsibility - in whole or in part, but I doubt it ...

I wouldn't trust that scheme, somehow there will be an exception and they'll wriggle out of compensating

[hellohello123]

I have never lived in Thailand and if I were to , if the situation happened to me I'd expect the bank to fully refund me, but I guess this is the difference betweena  third world country vs a first world one

 

A few years ago  in my country 

My sim card suddenly become inactive ,

And my emails started getting notices of funds transferred from 2 accounts,  and were virtually emptied.

I called my phone provider and they told me someone had ported my number out to the UK

 

I was on the phone within a few hours, 

One bank said "we can't guarantee anything but check back later tonight, we think you will be pleasantly surprised" and hey presto

The other bank, I submitted a police report and within 2 weeks all funds returned.

 

Given it most likely it started with my phone getting compromised, which isn't the banks fault, I was super impressed 

Its almost as if the banks are embarrassed to admit they had a security breach 

 

I'm glad I had the backs of my back with me that time

 

Edit: a similar thing has happened to my parents a few years prior but with more $$$ and more accounts and more banks.

 

Some took a bit longer but all $$ returned with no fuss 

Great peace of mind for them

Edited February 3, 2021 by hellohello123

[OneMoreFarang]

6 hours ago, Oliver Holzerfilled said:

Westerners with a history of making sound financial decisions typically don't end up in Pattaya so this isn't surprising.

Please remind us, what nationality had the crook who probably stole all that money?

How did he end up in Pattaya?

It's so easy to put a label on all those "western" people in Pattaya.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

I wouldn't trust that scheme, somehow there will be an exception and they'll wriggle out of compensating

 

As said above, at best, it only applies if the bank where you have your deposit, up to the covered limit, actually fails financially and effectively goes out of business.

 

I only mentioned it above to note, that agency and law aren't going to apply or be of any assistance in this kind of situation.

 

There are a couple of other Thai government entities that might come into play in this kind of situation.
 

One, I haven't heard anything about or from in a very long time, which is probably not a good sign:

 

Financial Consumer Protection Center (FCC) through the Bank of Thailand:

 

"First, to serve as a one-stop service center for complaints handling and enquiries pertaining to financial products and services provided by the financial service providers under the Bank of Thailand’s supervision. FCC’s services also include providing information and advices regarding the matters under the Bank of Thailand’s purview such as banknotes, government bonds and debt securities as well as foreign exchange regulations.
      
Second, to equip consumers with financial knowledge in order to raise awareness and understanding of consumer rights and responsibilities, enable informed decision making, and avoid becoming victims of fraud."

 

https://www.1213.or.th/en/Pages/About-FCC.aspx

 

And second, Office of the Consumer Protection Board (OCPB):

 

 "To be the Central Organization for National Consumer Protection at International Level”

 

Missions

 

     " 1. To enforce the laws fairy and transparency for maximizing benefit of the consumer;

       2. To develop the laws and policies in consumer protection catching up with current situation;

       3. To establish consumer network, and cooperate among related authorities both public and private sectors;

       4. To disseminate knowledge to the consumer in order to create conscious in protecting their own rights."

 

https://www.ocpb.go.th/ewtadmin/ewt/ocpb_en/main.php?filename=index___EN

 

 

Edited February 3, 2021 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Jack Hammer]

From what I have read and been informed is that the employee from the bank scamming the people was using obsolete stationery and bank/pass books, making entries of the deposits/withdrawals in this stationery then hitting the bank books and deposit slips with the bank's rubber stamp making it look all official. I assume the employee would of had their desk drawer with funds for withdrawals. The customers were instructed to only deal with the offender.  It was not until one of the people being scammed went to another branch to make a withdrawal that the scam began to unfold. Scammer should of bolted out of Thailand when they conned bout 100 million Baht.  Personally I don't think the amount scammed will be anywhere near 50 million Baht.

I don't think the Bank will make restitution

[scubascuba3]

4 minutes ago, Bill Good said:

From what I have read and been informed is that the employee from the bank scamming the people was using obsolete stationery and bank/pass books, making entries of the deposits/withdrawals in this stationery then hitting the bank books and deposit slips with the bank's rubber stamp making it look all official. I assume the employee would of had their desk drawer with funds for withdrawals. The customers were instructed to only deal with the offender.  It was not until one of the people being scammed went to another branch to make a withdrawal that the scam began to unfold. Scammer should of bolted out of Thailand when they conned bout 100 million Baht.  Personally I don't think the amount scammed will be anywhere near 50 million Baht.

I don't think the Bank will make restitution

I'm not sure how he was able to update the fake passbook with fake entries, obviously a weakness in controls. Usually you just put the book in the machine/printer and it updates