15 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

That is what I said. All this running round in circles is making me dizzy.

 

There seems to be some people on here that don't understand the difference between an independence referendum and independence itself.

I am just waiting for all the Sexit headlines...

These things aren't done every few years, and we had one in 2014 and it was agreed it was once and for all.  I don't think a majority of Scots even want a referendum yet.  EU membership is not a central reason for another referendum.  It seems that the most fervent supporters of a Scottish referendum are extremists and foreigners.

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

And he was Australian, not Scottish as you claimed.

https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=forfar

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

The singer was Scottish.

 

23 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Scott was born in Forfar in Angus, Scotland, and spent his early years in Kirriemuir. Wikipedia

 

10 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=forfar

Yes, he was born in Scotland. But see your own link, he was Australian, not Scottish as you claimed.

Scotland and Eire free of the UK would be a beautiful thing. Next Wales,

 

Sure, if they allow a revote every 5  years, personally  they should get rid of that vile cow Sturgeon, she's  a  bludddy  narcissist, it's  an ugly fish as  well, maybe they should  all be harpooned.

37 minutes ago, Captain Monday said:

Scotland and Eire free of the UK would be a beautiful thing. Next Wales,

 

Then you can start  splitting all the counties up and end  up with 300  countries.

2 hours ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

Scotland does not need to use the GBP, in fact it would be better for them to setup a currency board where the currency is 100% backed by foreign reserves. 

I  once went to an English bank with a  Scottish 100 pound  note and they wouldn't accept it so it may as  well be a foreign currency.

9 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

Sure, if they allow a revote every 5  years, personally  they should get rid of that vile cow Sturgeon, she's  a  bludddy  narcissist, it's  an ugly fish as  well, maybe they should  all be harpooned.

 

8 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

Then you can start  splitting all the counties up and end  up with 300  countries.

 

5 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

I  once went to an English bank with a  Scottish 100 pound  note and they wouldn't accept it so it may as  well be a foreign currency.

Thanks for your well reasoned opinions.

15 hours ago, vogie said:

Everybody is assuming that Scotland does want independence and this is clearly not the case. The only people that want independence are the SNP, the Scots have clearly stated that they wish to remain within the United Kingdom and their wishes should be respected.

That was before Brexit, mate! It’s a totally different circumstance now! 

14 hours ago, herfiehandbag said:

Ah yes, Australian isn't he?

Still no doubt it was a lucrative bandwagon!

That’s a common misperception! He is and always has been American. His family moved to Australia in the late 60s when he was 12, which is where he started his career as an actor. He moved back to the US in the 80s or 90s.

2 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

That was before Brexit, mate! It’s a totally different circumstance now! 

Of course it is, it is also before the covid 19 outbreak, before the upper echelons of the SNP were found out about all these wrong doings and more importantly, Rangers winning the Scottish league. Brexit has made not a penny worth of difference to the SNP wanting independence, for this you can be assured. 

This is what the SNP was designed for, the mess since they have been in power it is clearly not to govern but to split the UK up. But it is not just the UK they are splitting up, they have divided Scotland itself, they are an utter shambles, and a disgrace. 

But as another poster has mentioned, rather succinctly I thought, isn't it amazing how many posters not from the UK have suddenly painted their faces blue and started waving the Saltire, I am still trying to work out why this should be, could you help me out here pacovl. 

 

10 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

Nope.

 

Dave Evans, 1973 to1974; Australian.

Bon Scott, 1974 to his death in 1980; Australian.

Brian Johnson, 1980 to 2016 and 2018 to date; English.

Axl Rose, 2016 (stand in for on tour for an ill Johnson); 2016.

Bon Scott was born in Scotland and later emigrated to Australia with his family when he was 8. 

3 minutes ago, vogie said:

Of course it is, it is also before the covid 19 outbreak, before the upper echelons of the SNP were found out about all these wrong doings and more importantly, Rangers winning the Scottish league. Brexit has made not a penny worth of difference to the SNP wanting independence, for this you can be assured. 

This is what the SNP was designed for, the mess since they have been in power it is clearly not to govern but to split the UK up. But it is not just the UK they are splitting up, they have divided Scotland itself, they are an utter shambles, and a disgrace. 

But as another poster has mentioned, rather succinctly I thought, isn't it amazing how many posters not from the UK have suddenly painted their faces blue and started waving the Saltire, I am still trying to work out why this should be, could you help me out here pacovl. 

 

Doesn’t matter. When they had the vote back in 2015 or whenever it was the UK was still part of the EU and now it is not anymore which dramatically changed the circumstance and therefore the Scots should have the right to another vote whether they want to be part of the UK or the EU! 
 

If Brexit hadn’t happened then I’d be on your side of the argument, but it did happen! Therefore your “they already had a vote and now the losers don’t like the outcome and now want to vote again and again until they get what they want” argument doesn’t make sense at all! 

8 hours ago, youreavinalaff said:

Would that be the day before independence or the day after? I'm afraid there would be a catch 22 situation there.

 

Besides, in this scenario they have walked away with nothing. How can one set up a currency with nothing?

Maybe the EU would lend it to them?

14 hours ago, vogie said:

New circumstances.????????????????????????

I think that the First Minister lying, with-holding evidence and repeating over a hundred times that she didn't know anything in an inquiry could be best described as "new circumstances" don't you? That believe you me is a game changer, she and a lot of disciples are on a hiding to nothing, only one in three Scots now believe that NS has been entirely honest.

That is a nice example for the meaning of the word "deflection trial"...????

20 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

Doesn’t matter. When they had the vote back in 2015 or whenever it was the UK was still part of the EU and now it is not anymore which dramatically changed the circumstance and therefore the Scots should have the right to another vote whether they want to be part of the UK or the EU! 
 

If Brexit hadn’t happened then I’d be on your side of the argument, but it did happen! Therefore your “they already had a vote and now the losers don’t like the outcome and now want to vote again and again until they get what they want” argument doesn’t make sense at all! 

Yes it does.

 

They voted to remain in the UK. No ifs, no buts, no perhaps.  It was fully understood by all parties that it was a "once in a lifetime decision".

 

As part of the UK (because they had voted to remain in the UK, no ifs, no buts, no perhaps

remember) they then took part in a UK wide vote on EU membership. That referendum produced a UK decision that the UK would leave the EU. No ifs, no buts, no perhaps.

 

As for those commenting from beyond the UK, (especially from Europe -  enthusiastically advocating the dismemberment of the UK) I can't help wandering what the reaction would be if the Walloons in Belgium, or Schleswig Holstein, were to demand independence from their respective countries;they are after all territories whose national affiliations were decided or imposed long after Scotland and England were brought into union.  We already know what happened with Catelonia in Spain!

 

 

 

8 hours ago, stevenl said:

And he was Australian, not Scottish as you claimed.

Scott was born in Scotland and moved to Australia at the age of 8. He might have taken Australian citizenship down the road, but his ancestry is definitely Scottish! 

8 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

Nope. 
 

The last vote was when the uk was in the EU. 
 

Against the will of the majority of Scots that is no longer the case. 
 

New circumstances, new vote. 
 

Why is that such a problem I wonder. 

You obviously are missing the point...Scotland is part of the UK!!!

8 minutes ago, herfiehandbag said:

Yes it does.

 

They voted to remain in the UK.

 

As part of the UK (because they had voted to remain in the UK remember) they then took part in a UK wide vote on EU membership. That referendum produced a UK decision that the UK would leave the EU.

 

No, it doesn’t! Again, when they voted whether to stay in the UK the UK was still part of the EU and now the UK is not in the EU anymore! Big difference. Also, during the Brexit vote the Scots were against leaving! 

9 hours ago, stevenl said:

Thanks, looks like so far you're the only one.

One is enough to defeat your comment!

4 minutes ago, Jimbo53 said:

You obviously are missing the point...Scotland is part of the UK!!!

So what?! That doesn’t mean that they have to be alright with how the UK voted in the Brexit issue! The Scots were clearly against leaving and just because they voted in 2014 to stay in the UK when the UK was still part of the EU doesn’t mean that they want to keep staying in the UK, now that it has left the EU! Hence new vote! 
 

If the company you work for gets taken over by a new owner and the working and payment conditions worsen considerably for you, you sure as hell wouldn’t like it if you wanted to leave and the new owner said, well, you wanted to work here back in the day and now you’re gonna suck it up and stay! 

11 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

 

Then if we are such a burden give us a referendum.

Oh no wait. For some reason all you Brexiteers love the idea of sovereignty and taking back control but only when it suits your own purposes.

BTW. Have a look at the real figures. England is going broke and without Scotlands resources it will be even worse.

 

That is what the Brits of yesteryear were famous for occupying a country and stealing their resources to keep their economy going. The Dutch had the same tactics before. Take over a country steal its resources and keep them for their own profit. So not so strange that those Brexiteers who are also die hard nationalists and probably liked the empire are used too.

 

If Scotland is such a burden and can't make it financially then show the figures to the Scots and they will vote with reason just like the Brexiteers did. ????

 

Like everyone has mentioned before its funny that those who oppose it the most are the die hard Brexiteers / nationalists. Something about double standards and so on. 

 

But I understand its a bit hard to explain later to your grand children, grandpa why did you vote for Brexit did you not realize that it could mean trouble. Brexiteer anwser, sure we did but we wanted to deny the right we had to others so we could take our freedom without any problems. Its unfair that others would do the same we did. We did not think it could tear up the union we thought we could suppress this. Its unfortunate that our decisions caused this.. but really we did it for the UK... but there is no more UK how did you not see this comming... That was because.. eh.. do you want some pocket money and shall we never talk about this again...  ????

19 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

 

No, it doesn’t! Again, when they voted whether to stay in the UK the UK was still part of the EU and now the UK is in not in the EU anymore! Big difference. Also, during the Brexit vote the Scots were against leaving! 

And again, they voted to remain in the UK. They were, as voters in the UK, able to participate in the vote on leaving the UK. 

 

The city from which I come voted to remain in the EU. The rest of the county, and the majority county wide, voted to leave.  Exactly the same principle.

25 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

Doesn’t matter. When they had the vote back in 2015 or whenever it was the UK was still part of the EU and now it is not anymore which dramatically changed the circumstance and therefore the Scots should have the right to another vote whether they want to be part of the UK or the EU! 
 

If Brexit hadn’t happened then I’d be on your side of the argument, but it did happen! You and now want to vote again and again until they get what they want” argument doesn’t make sense at all! 

If Brexit hadn’t happened then I’d be on your side of the argument,

Thank you, you have hit the nail on the head and answered the question of why non UK citizens want the nationalists to have independence........... Revenge. 

10 minutes ago, robblok said:

That is what the Brits of yesteryear were famous for occupying a country and stealing their resources to keep their economy going. The Dutch had the same tactics before. Take over a country steal its resources and keep them for their own profit. So not so strange that those Brexiteers who are also die hard nationalists and probably liked the empire are used too.

 

If Scotland is such a burden and can't make it financially then show the figures to the Scots and they will vote with reason just like the Brexiteers did. ????

 

Like everyone has mentioned before its funny that those who oppose it the most are the die hard Brexiteers / nationalists. Something about double standards and so on. 

 

But I understand its a bit hard to explain later to your grand children, grandpa why did you vote for Brexit did you not realize that it could mean trouble. Brexiteer anwser, sure we did but we wanted to deny the right we had to others so we could take our freedom without any problems. Its unfair that others would do the same we did. We did not think it could tear up the union we thought we could suppress this. Its unfortunate that our decisions caused this.. but really we did it for the UK... but there is no more UK how did you not see this comming... That was because.. eh.. do you want some pocket money and shall we never talk about this again...  ????

Ah, another one of your perspicacious analysis of the prevalent political philosophy within the United Kingdom.

 

How can I explain to you: the British Empire has not to all intents and purposes  existed for over 60 years, gone, finished, history, no longer part of any political or national calculation!

 

Except it would seem in your obsessions!

16 hours ago, vogie said:

Everybody is assuming that Scotland does want independence and this is clearly not the case. The only people that want independence are the SNP, the Scots have clearly stated that they wish to remain within the United Kingdom and their wishes should be respected.

 

A 2nd referendum will confirm that one way of another.

Just now, Katipo said:

 

A 2nd referendum will confirm that one way of another.

Don't worry, 58 years is not too long to wait. ????????????

If they want, up to them, I could not care less

A resounding yes from me. I'm sick to death of their whinging.