Car companies breaking the law

[PFMills]

5 hours ago, jackdd said:

Why did you accept the car without the complete paperwork, if this is so important for you?

So much mis-understanding here.
 

If you want to register the vehicle yourself, you need the correct paperwork and at least one piece of paper you need will not be available on the day that you collect the car.

 

Most let the dealer do the registration and there is a financial incentive for him to delay as long as possible.

 

I hope that you are somewhat enlightened now.

[NanLaew]

On 4/14/2021 at 10:11 AM, Parsve said:

Toyota is thus not only deliberately violating current rules. They also force their customers to commit criminal acts and also expose their customers to the risk of being fined 10,000 baht and possibly, with the new system in terms of traffic offenses, even committing the buyer to a remark in their driving license.

TTD, do not punish the victims (car buyers), punish the criminals (car companies).

 

Ahhh, grasshopper....

[NanLaew]

<double post>

Edited April 15, 2021 by NanLaew

[Excel]

11 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

Ahhh, grasshopper....

shine on, shine off 

[gunderhill]

On 4/14/2021 at 10:11 AM, Parsve said:

There are no problems, they replied, there are those who wait for three months to register and most police do not care to check such things.

False, I waited 6  months for  plates got  stopped at 6  months fined 1000 baht for  no  plates, Wife  gave dealer a mouthfull then called  her  Police  friend who cancelled the ticket, Plates  arrived the next day, Police do check in BANGKOK, out  of  Bangkok didnt  have a problem in 6  months.

[gunderhill]

On 4/14/2021 at 1:14 PM, pedro01 said:

It's simple - you don't get busted for driving on a red plate nowadays

YES YOU DO, happened to me a  month ago, want to see the ticket? NOTE the fine was 1000baht, Wife  called  Police  friend and  he  got it cancelled  yet the "paid"  fine says 100  baht so someone doctored it at the Police payment dept and made it  out to be paid but we sure  didnt pay it.

Edited April 16, 2021 by gunderhill

[jackdd]

40 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

YES YOU DO, happened to me a  month ago, want to see the ticket? NOTE the fine was 1000baht, Wife  called  Police  friend and  he  got it cancelled  yet the "paid"  fine says 100  baht so someone doctored it at the Police payment dept and made it  out to be paid but we sure  didnt pay it.

The ticket says you drove without license plates.

[gunderhill]

47 minutes ago, jackdd said:

The ticket says you drove without license plates.

And the Op says that so I assume he had  none my bad

 

 "With three days left until we had our car for a month, I asked my wife to call Toyota and ask for our license plates"

[pedro01]

15 hours ago, gunderhill said:

YES YOU DO, happened to me a  month ago, want to see the ticket? NOTE the fine was 1000baht, Wife  called  Police  friend and  he  got it cancelled  yet the "paid"  fine says 100  baht so someone doctored it at the Police payment dept and made it  out to be paid but we sure  didnt pay it.

 

Well, that's me corrected - but 6 months is pushing it. 

 

A lot of people buy a car and keep the reds till the new year, so they can tell people the car is from the new year.

 

Was that 6 months the dealer delay? That's a helluva delay if so.

 

I guess your cop didn't get the memo!

 

You might want to not mention things like cop friends cancelling tickets here, loose lips, sink ships.

 

I believe the dealers have a finite number of reds too, anyone confirm?

 

I live in Bangkok and we have 2 cars so buy 1 every 2-3 years. Usually on reds in bkk 2 to 3 months per car.

Edited April 16, 2021 by pedro01

[NanLaew]

6 minutes ago, pedro01 said:

I believe the dealers have a finite number of reds too, anyone confirm?

Yes they do and they have to buy them from the Land Transport Office, hence the refundable deposit when you "borrow" them for your new car in lieu of the white plates.

 

About eight years ago, poorly painted number plates were a huge issue and the LTO's were hugely backlogged with issuing replacements on top of new ones. The dealerships had also run out of red plates. That caused a flood of illegal red plates (fake ones not bought from LTO's) that are still going the rounds.

[richard_smith237]

On 4/15/2021 at 1:32 PM, PFMills said:

So much mis-understanding here.
 

If you want to register the vehicle yourself, you need the correct paperwork and at least one piece of paper you need will not be available on the day that you collect the car.

 

Most let the dealer do the registration and there is a financial incentive for him to delay as long as possible.

 

I hope that you are somewhat enlightened now.

 

Ok enlightened one... what is this ‘piece of paper’ you need that you don’t have when you collect the car ???

 

What exactly is the financial incentive?... enlighten us all..... 

[kekalot]

red plates they give you are supposed to look like this (from wikipedia)

 

 

"Trade plates carry a significant number of restrictions. Drivers with red plates must seek permission from authorities if they want to use the vehicle at night. Cars with red plates cannot be driven out of the province where the vehicle was registered at purchase. Drivers must ask for permission each time they want to travel outside the specified area. Documents must be in order, with the destination and the dates of travel. Red-plated cars are not allowed to use expressways. Drivers of cars with red plates must have all car-related documents, a proper driving licence, and ID card ready for checks at all times. Police officers are authorized to stop any car with a red plate to examine the car and the driver's documents even if no traffic offence has occurred.^[15]

 

Trade plates are made from pressed alloy, with a red background and black digits. Trade plates are one or two consonants and four digits long."

 

notice they are embossed and have that Thai seal at the bottom. they should also provide you a brown book that you are supposed to write in whenever you drive outside of registration province and  you are not supposed to be driving at night as mentioned above.

 

if your plates are not like the one above and/or do not have the seal then they are fake ones, also if you didn't get the brown book is a good indication

 

I got fake plates about 3/3 times only on new motorbikes so far (always the same dealer, mind you)

 

I knew about this issue and even went to the police station here to ask them if that was a legal plate or not but all they could talk about were my shoes and wouldn't even have a look at it.. when I showed them the a picture they said its no problem blabla. i left annoyed.

 

they aren't the ones that would stop me and fine me out of province, not having the green book, not having a brown book or driving at night (which I did a lot of)

 

anyways, regarding the holdup for plates, I asked the DLT directly and they said it was a dealership issue.. from what I understand they keep your money as long as possible in the bank to get interest on and then after 2-3-4+ months they register it as sold and THEN get the plates quite quickly.

 

I know this must sound like a conspiracy theory but the last time I bought a new bike they told me it would take 4 months to get the green book AND the plates which is was unacceptable for me. I was leaving for a trip across the country in 2-3 weeks.  I called their bluff and made myself to be a pain in the side to them, got people calling for me many times, went to the dealership repeatedly and being a general nuisance and then... magically, less than a week later they had my plates ready for me.

 

btw, my story has nothing to do with Toyota but it seems to be a popular move

Edited April 17, 2021 by kekalot

[kekalot]

forgot to add:

I was told and read a few times that you can apparently refuse to take the vehicle from them (after paying) until they provide paperwork/plates to you but I don't know how useful that move is.

Edited April 17, 2021 by kekalot

[Parsve]

13 hours ago, kekalot said:

"Trade plates carry a significant number of restrictions. Drivers with red plates must seek permission from authorities if they want to use the vehicle at night. Cars with red plates cannot be driven out of the province where the vehicle was registered at purchase. Drivers must ask for permission each time they want to travel outside the specified area. Documents must be in order, with the destination and the dates of travel. Red-plated cars are not allowed to use expressways. Drivers of cars with red plates must have all car-related documents, a proper driving licence, and ID card ready for checks at all times. Police officers are authorized to stop any car with a red plate to examine the car and the driver's documents even if no traffic offence has occurred.

I have read this to and saw it as a problem as we had to go to a hospital in the neighbor province and our car has red plates. My thai friends said, no problem. I was not sure, so we went to the local police office and asked, no problem said the officer, you not need to do anything, just go there. I asked him to write the statement down on a paper, sign and date it, and also put an official stamp on the paper. He refused. Finally I called the head office of Land transport office and they said the same thing, you can go there with no problem. 

 

So it seams like that at lest this restriction have been taken away. 

[pedro01]

18 hours ago, kekalot said:

red plates they give you are supposed to look like this (from wikipedia)

 

 

"Trade plates carry a significant number of restrictions. Drivers with red plates must seek permission from authorities if they want to use the vehicle at night. Cars with red plates cannot be driven out of the province where the vehicle was registered at purchase. Drivers must ask for permission each time they want to travel outside the specified area. Documents must be in order, with the destination and the dates of travel. Red-plated cars are not allowed to use expressways. Drivers of cars with red plates must have all car-related documents, a proper driving licence, and ID card ready for checks at all times. Police officers are authorized to stop any car with a red plate to examine the car and the driver's documents even if no traffic offence has occurred.^[15]

 

Trade plates are made from pressed alloy, with a red background and black digits. Trade plates are one or two consonants and four digits long."

 

notice they are embossed and have that Thai seal at the bottom. they should also provide you a brown book that you are supposed to write in whenever you drive outside of registration province and  you are not supposed to be driving at night as mentioned above.

 

if your plates are not like the one above and/or do not have the seal then they are fake ones, also if you didn't get the brown book is a good indication

 

I got fake plates about 3/3 times only on new motorbikes so far (always the same dealer, mind you)

 

I knew about this issue and even went to the police station here to ask them if that was a legal plate or not but all they could talk about were my shoes and wouldn't even have a look at it.. when I showed them the a picture they said its no problem blabla. i left annoyed.

 

they aren't the ones that would stop me and fine me out of province, not having the green book, not having a brown book or driving at night (which I did a lot of)

 

anyways, regarding the holdup for plates, I asked the DLT directly and they said it was a dealership issue.. from what I understand they keep your money as long as possible in the bank to get interest on and then after 2-3-4+ months they register it as sold and THEN get the plates quite quickly.

 

I know this must sound like a conspiracy theory but the last time I bought a new bike they told me it would take 4 months to get the green book AND the plates which is was unacceptable for me. I was leaving for a trip across the country in 2-3 weeks.  I called their bluff and made myself to be a pain in the side to them, got people calling for me many times, went to the dealership repeatedly and being a general nuisance and then... magically, less than a week later they had my plates ready for me.

 

btw, my story has nothing to do with Toyota but it seems to be a popular move

 

Them keeping your money in the bank to get interest is total nonsense.

 

Interest rates have been close to zero for years. They would make nothing

 

 

[pedro01]

18 hours ago, kekalot said:

forgot to add:

I was told and read a few times that you can apparently refuse to take the vehicle from them (after paying) until they provide paperwork/plates to you but I don't know how useful that move is.

 

That'd teach them!

[digbeth]

On 4/16/2021 at 11:21 PM, richard_smith237 said:

 

Ok enlightened one... what is this ‘piece of paper’ you need that you don’t have when you collect the car ???

 

What exactly is the financial incentive?... enlighten us all..... 

 

Typically, the 'registration kit' containing all the paperwork from the factory needed for registration is only released from the manufacturer's/factory to the dealership upon settling of the amount/start the recording of the debt to the factory by the dealership, hence the delay tactic.

 

You can drive off the dealership in a white plate car if you give them the right incentive, make them write down in the deposit paperwork that you'll only pay the full amount with the correct plate or registration kit for you to take down to DLT yourself. I've had cashier cheques made up and waved it to their face and went home until they get their stuff in order, but that also means that your brand new car is ready for collection sans registation in the courtyard that you could've driven home that day... a 4-5 weeks registration delay is acceptable for the (in)convenience.

[Liverpool Lou]

On 4/14/2021 at 12:16 PM, Ralf001 said:

 

So you do have other options (walking and bicycle) and yet YOU choose to break the law.

 

Edit to add, This line "Toyota is thus not only deliberately violating current rules. They also force their customers to commit criminal acts" would land you in hot water should Toyota choose to sue you for slander...... thats another law are breaking !!

"...should Toyota choose to sue you for slander..."

Libel.

[Liverpool Lou]

On 4/14/2021 at 12:58 PM, Parsve said:

As far as Toyota is concerned, in case they have made sure that the registration papers have been sent in on time, they can sue TTD because they are unable to fulfill what they say should apply.

What you are complaining about is nothing to do with Toyota Thailand, it's the dealer's fault, the dealer is not "Toyota".

[Liverpool Lou]

On 4/18/2021 at 7:52 PM, pedro01 said:

 

Them keeping your money in the bank to get interest is total nonsense.

 

Interest rates have been close to zero for years. They would make nothing

 

 

It's not total nonsense if the purchase money keeps the dealer's account out of the red.  Overdrafts incur debit interest.

[Ralf001]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

"...should Toyota choose to sue you for slander..."

Libel.

 

Oral vs written.

 

Pedantic.

[Liverpool Lou]

On 4/21/2021 at 1:39 PM, Ralf001 said:

On 4/21/2021 at 11:50 AM, Liverpool Lou said:

"...should Toyota choose to sue you for slander..."

Libel.

 

Oral vs written.

 

Pedantic.

Not pedantic, accurate.  Legally, two very different things.