What about us? Furious retirees/expats in Thailand slam proposals to attract wealthy foreigners

[GammaGlobulin]

8 hours ago, Thunglom said:

I've met so many foreigners in Thailand who have lived here for decades and yet till know nothing about the country.

I have met foreigners in Thailand who believe the World is flat.

 

Two foreigners I met in Thailand believed that one or another government was injecting tracking devices into their arms.

 

Some foreigners believe in UFOs from Pleiades.

 

Yet, they know very little about the Dark Side of the Moon.

 

[MajorTom]

They should demand an IQ test. If you are over 100 you don't qualify. Can be sorted with agent but not recommendable. It can be very frustrating.

[The Cipher]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

 

IMO no farang will understand the Asian mind any more than men will ever understand the female mind, no matter how many years they spend studying them.

But do you believe that Asian immigrants or Asians born in Western countries can understand Western minds?

[GammaGlobulin]

Rather than some sort of arbitrary financial hurdle, why not just base entry to Thailand on IQ?

 

For example, before one steps off the plane in BKK, one should be able to prove the Pythagorean theorem, or various other proofs.

[relax33]

18 hours ago, JustAnotherHun said:

Really? When should that have been so? in the 1950s?

In the 90s, Thai Air was named as one of worlds best airlines. Same with Singapour Air. 

Precisely, but it took ages, possible after 2005 for main stream western media to swallow their pride n recognize the fact that Asian airlines r superior.
But that is understandable as the West was of course once superior in many things n people n countries have pride n this has to be respected .
Cathay Pacific n Singapore airlines among others  had been repeatedly voted as the world's best airlines
Several US Airlines used to say they are the best in the world n would reply with the caveat " don't ever compare us to the Asian Airlines "  when prompted ...
 

[Neeranam]

24 minutes ago, The Cipher said:

But do you believe that Asian immigrants or Asians born in Western countries can understand Western minds?

Abdul Rangers drinks Buckfast, so definitely can understand the Glaswegian mind.

 

Edited September 17, 2021 by Neeranam

[relax33]

16 hours ago, Thunglom said:

I was a frequent flyer with Thai airways from 1998 to 2005 and they were DREADFUL.

You are right, many Asian Airlines do have some down years where their service were not up to par, but the market usually forces them to "wake up their idea " n improve.

Of cos sometimes, user experience may vary due to "one off" incidences too ..
Have quite a few female friends complaining that Singapore Airline stewardesses were unfairly (ahem) offering a far better flight experience to male passengers ...

Took Qantas once n asked for a coke n was really dumbfounded when the flight attendant replied with the words "Follow Me" ...  ha
That was really a classic reply n is one of those that stays in the memory, bet u would surely get better service when going into any 7-11 .. 

[Artisi]

1 hour ago, StevieAus said:

I don’t know what your definition of cheap is or whether you have obtained treatment from a government hospital where compared with what you would pay as a private patient in Western countries it is very cheap.

I can also see a specialist doctor seven days a week at a top Chiang Mai Hospital for 500 baht about $AUS 22.00

The cost in Sydney these days depending on the speciality is $AUS 300- 400

That is after visiting a GP for a referral and waiting for an appointment no visits on a weekend.

You just confirmed my comment, it's not free nor cheap by Thai standards when a local can get treated for B35. 

 

[Neeranam]

23 minutes ago, relax33 said:

Have quite a few female friends complaining that Singapore Airline stewardesses were unfairly (ahem) offering a far better flight experience to male passengers ...

They also offer a better service to alcohol drinkers. I complained after the guy next to me was continually asked if he wanted another beer, while I, and my lemonade, were ignored. 

[relax33]

11 hours ago, thaibook said:

Quite so, been to such an autonomous zone in northern Burma.  The Chinese are more ruthless and more corrupt than the Thais so of course they have acquired land.

Actually, the people that the Chinese fear most are the Russians
China has a huge population of really hardworking people . The resulting competition forces most of the ordinary folks to get out of their comfort zone to take additional risks just to stay ahead of the competition or to survive in their line of business ..
Its an even playing field where no one (including the Chinese)  have any inherent advantage . All it needs is lots of hard work, the willingness to suffer, the ability to assimilate into the local culture n do what it takes to survive (eg like paying bribes to the powers that be when in TL) , the willingness to liquidate all assets back home (if required) n to risk losing everything when seeking out ...

[relax33]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

 

IMO no farang will understand the Asian mind any more than men will ever understand the female mind, no matter how many years they spend studying them.

no need to study when it comes to the female mind,  just pay $ will do  ...   ha
U will still end up mostly having to pay however long you spend "studying" ...

Edited September 17, 2021 by relax33

[Chris.B]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

I've met many to; I think the problem is that they don't learn the language. Quite simply, you can't understand the culture of a country if you don't learn the language. 

If I were in charge of immigration, I'd have a Thai language test for yearly visa extensions.  There is no excuse for immigrants being illiterate, full stop.

If they are applying for a visa extension they are non-immigrants. So it is illogical to require someone to learn the language if they are not being allowed to immigrate into the country.

 

[Neeranam]

3 minutes ago, Chris.B said:

If they are applying for a visa extension they are non-immigrants. So it is illogical to require someone to learn the language if they are not being allowed to immigrate into the country.

 

 If they have multiple 1-year extensions, they are immigrants. I guess it depends on your definition of the word. Generally, non-immigrants don't want to become Residents or Citizens. Those I am talking about want to be Residents or Citizens. Obviously non-immigrants like foreign students wouldn't need to pass a test. 

[relax33]

On 9/15/2021 at 8:45 PM, Noah K said:

I really do have to comment on this topic because it has been on my mind for a long time. I live in MaeJo, and my wife and I are building a house in Mae Rim. I am retired, I love Thailand, and spend my pension here. I'm not a millionaire, but I spent close to five million baht in the last year alone. I also help the local economy everyday. I am not a big Lotus, or Seven fan. I don't do McDonalds, KFC, or Burger King. Aren't these folks rich (money) enough? The real richness in life here are the local people that open up a little store, roadside grill, or restaurant where you can sit down and enjoy a great lunch for just 45 baht. I shop the local open air markets for all my fresh veggies and fruits and to enjoy the aroma of the many foods being cooked and sounds of the crowds enjoying their night out. It also helps me learn to speak Thai better, but at 64 it is a lot slower going than I would like. When I renew my retirement visa in February 2022, I will have a yellow book, and pink card, a Thai driver's license for a car as well as a motorbike, medical insurance, a bank account, a home and a healthy retirement income. There are literally tens of thousands of retirees like myself which is why Asean Now is writing about us and why we need to express ourselves. I don't get involved in the student protests, but I understand why they are protesting. I don't have a say in Thai politics, but my Thai friends sure do have an opinion, and well, it's not very glowing. All I can say is that hopefully our voices will be heard because together we spend millions, if not billions of baht each year, and most of us consider ourselves law abiding citizens of Thailand even though we were not born here. The people they are talking about for 10 year visas will come and spend millions of dollars yes, but only if they see a way to make a profit. They won't live here or spend money in the local economy. They will come, make a bundle, and live anywhere they want, so many places for the very wealthy. If you add up the tens of thousands of retirees already living here and spend their money in the local economy, it beats anything these wealthy folks can offer. So when they finally see our side, offer us a permanent resident status, more retires like myself and others will also come to retire here as well. It really is a win-win for everyone.

Good point, history says that you guys will be accommodated n valued
Guess TL is only trying to do what Marketing books call "Product Differentiation" to increase the income stream for the economy.
This is very logical n is similar to what anyone in biz will do .
Its like buying or downloading a computer game where you have options to buy add-ons , special accessories , expansion packs etc thereafter ...
U can basically still enjoy the game without buying additional stuff but your user experience will of cos technically improve if you have them ...

N of cos we cannot fault anyone for offering a better user experience for people who pay more right  ...  especially if it serves a greater good to boost the economy for the benefit of the general population in these dire times ...

Edited September 17, 2021 by relax33

[Chris.B]

10 hours ago, Thunglom said:

There are MANY foreigners living here - especially Brits who don't have sufficient or even any health insurance - once treated for a pre-exisiting disease insurance companies may then refuse future cover. Being a retiree this is a particularly acute pron=blem and one that potentially costs the Thai state money.

If older retirees were offered reasonably priced health plans and not refused cover because of age or because they have an existing condition, I am sure more would take up health insurance.

 

[Chris.B]

22 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

 If they have multiple 1-year extensions, they are immigrants. I guess it depends on your definition of the word. Generally, non-immigrants don't want to become Residents or Citizens. Those I am talking about want to be Residents or Citizens. Obviously non-immigrants like foreign students wouldn't need to pass a test. 

No, a non-immigrant 'O' visa is still a non-immigrant visa no matter how many extensions are granted.

 

[Rampant Rabbit]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I've met many to; I think the problem is that they don't learn the language. Quite simply, you can't understand the culture of a country if you don't learn the language. 

If I were in charge of immigration, I'd have a Thai language test for yearly visa extensions.  There is no excuse for immigrants being illiterate, full stop.

so theyve  supported a  wife  kids and all the relatives for 20 years helped in the local  community and local kids  homes taking them for days  out but as they cant speak Thai they should be chucked out?

[Rampant Rabbit]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

They also offer a better service to alcohol drinkers. I complained after the guy next to me was continually asked if he wanted another beer, while I, and my lemonade, were ignored. 

When I  fly  all drinks are  free.

[Rampant Rabbit]

2 hours ago, GammaGlobulin said:

Rather than some sort of arbitrary financial hurdle, why not just base entry to Thailand on IQ?

 

For example, before one steps off the plane in BKK, one should be able to prove the Pythagorean theorem, or various other proofs.

or Pi to 2000 places backwards whilst  standing on your head eating spaghetti thru a straw maybe....just a  thought.

[Rampant Rabbit]

13 hours ago, thaibook said:

a rich friend used to offer well dressed Thai women a weekend of shopping in Hong Kong.

And Emirates do a first  class  ticket for a  very good  price for that trip on the A380

[Rampant Rabbit]

On 9/15/2021 at 10:10 PM, ricardofel said:

Fortunately for me I got smart 8 years ago when I left. Lived in HuaHin for 2 years and Chiang Mai for 5 years. The corruption, the environment, 90 day reporting...enough! Sold my 26 rai, my house 9 months later and NO regrets. Sure..... America is not perfect, but life is very good and organic foods are real! 

Yeah but  tax  reporting is  awful,  follow  you round the world.

[Rampant Rabbit]

On 9/15/2021 at 8:11 PM, rumak said:

Play scrabble

I say steady on man!

[Neeranam]

19 minutes ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

When I  fly  all drinks are  free.

These were free but they seemed reluctant to give out their Sprite yet seemed Beer. I've seen this on several airlines, they prefer servicing the drunks. 

[Kadilo]

2 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

These were free but they seemed reluctant to give out their Sprite yet seemed Beer. I've seen this on several airlines, they prefer servicing the drunks. 

Probably hope they fall asleep sooner rather than later. 

[Neeranam]

24 minutes ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

so theyve  supported a  wife  kids and all the relatives for 20 years helped in the local  community and local kids  homes taking them for days  out but as they cant speak Thai they should be chucked out?

If anyone has supported their local Thai community for 20 years and can't speak Thai, they deserve a medal. How exactly can they go to community meetings and participate? 

[rumak]

22 minutes ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

I say steady on man!

hi rooster

[473geo]

And so it goes on!

Entrance to Thailand is easy, obtaining permission to stay is not too demanding and remember this applies to the majority of non Thai

Why is this not good enough for so many?

Why not just get on with life without seeking some 'special' recognition for all non Thai people who spend a bit of money in Thailand. 

The whole notion is ridiculous there are opportunities if you really do have the money! so let's ignore the invalid expectation of those who actually don't spend a great deal in the grand scheme of things, be happy with what you can achieve, accept that Thailand allows you the lifestyle of your choice, and quit moaning when process in place covers all non Thai 'aliens' not just those of you who appear to think your contribution is worthy of relaxed controls.

[Thunglom]

6 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I've met many to; I think the problem is that they don't learn the language. Quite simply, you can't understand the culture of a country if you don't learn the language. 

If I were in charge of immigration, I'd have a Thai language test for yearly visa extensions.  There is no excuse for immigrants being illiterate, full stop.

Language  is without a doubt an issue but I believe it's a case not a symptom.

Language tests are basically. form of fascism. However, it might be worth looking at why people don't learn the language and take steps to rectify that. I wouldn't trust the Thai authorities to imbue immigrants with Thai culture as they don't know themselves what that is.

My spoken Thai language is pretty good but my reading and writing is very bad. However I've spent a lot of time studying Thai culture and basic history and politics. Do I think everyone should be the same standard as me? Know - I also think that as a language education trainer, the chances of educating all expats to your standard is just pie-in-the-sky.

Expats around the world have similar problems and whilst one governments use language as part of immigration control (v. Australia white policy), it doesn't really help immigrant retirees who can find learning language quite hard. I think a self-awareness program would be more effective - run by immigrant organisations - ythere is no program for new arrivals to acclimatise themselves - when onfronted with Thai customs new to them, they frequently either dismiss them or don't take the seriously.

 

I think the educational background of many of the people who come to Thailand regardless of language leaves them ill-equipped to deal with th cultural differences and that is what needs to be addressed.

 

 

[Thunglom]

7 hours ago, Artisi said:

Why does it cost Thailand money, there is no free or cheap treatment for foreigners. 

It costs because it takes up healthcare resources....... many expats end up "terminally " ill in hospitals without sufficient insurance cover - the state then has to supply basic care until death and then funeral expenses.

They also have to supply emegncy care and then ed up moving patients from one hospital to another as the money turns out to be unrecoverable. Getting money back offf sea or injured foreigners is a big problem in Thailand.

Edited September 17, 2021 by Thunglom

[Thunglom]

5 hours ago, relax33 said:

You are right, many Asian Airlines do have some down years where their service were not up to par, but the market usually forces them to "wake up their idea " n improve.

Of cos sometimes, user experience may vary due to "one off" incidences too ..
Have quite a few female friends complaining that Singapore Airline stewardesses were unfairly (ahem) offering a far better flight experience to male passengers ...

Took Qantas once n asked for a coke n was really dumbfounded when the flight attendant replied with the words "Follow Me" ...  ha
That was really a classic reply n is one of those that stays in the memory, bet u would surely get better service when going into any 7-11 .. 

Thai airlines used to be run by the Airforce who didn't want the job. A Qantas pilot once told me that it was a miracle that Thai airplanes weren't falling out the sky every day.

Thy are just about broke now so won't be around muck longer anyway.