The best country for expats to relocate to has been named

[Hummin]

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

But even then it makes little sense. Or do all working expats have the same goals, like to live in the same climate, speak the same language, etc.? 

Easy answer yes, they need pretty much the same basic things related to work and family things. But for me retired, no kids, the basic things narrows down quite a bit for my needs. 

 

Warm country, safety for living and travelling around, interesting activities,  a woman and comfortable living costs.

 

[Hummin]

16 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

But even then it makes little sense. Or do all working expats have the same goals, like to live in the same climate, speak the same language, etc.? 

Easy answer yes, they need pretty much the same basic things related to work and family things. But for me retired, no kids, the basic things narrows down quite a bit for my needs. 

 

Warm country, safety for living and travelling around, interesting activities,  a woman and comfortable living costs.

 

[OneMoreFarang]

34 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

My goal was always to earn as much money as fast as I could, so I could retire.

I like to live a good life while I am working. Money has to be ok but I wouldn't move to most other countries even if I would make double the money. So just we two seem to have very different ideas about the best place.

[OneMoreFarang]

35 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Easy answer yes, they need pretty much the same basic things related to work and family things.

No. I.e. when I arrived in Thailand I was young and healthy and I didn't have any wife or kids around me. I wanted to be able to work a little and enjoy the nightlife every night. I don't expect that is what most expats are looking for.

And I am obviously just one example. I know another single guy who moved from Thailand to work in the USA. Personally I would never do that but it seem that is what he wanted. Up to him. But there is no "best".

[alyx]

9 hours ago, simon43 said:

I also did this before relocating to Turkey.  I found that ALL countries using the Euro were more expensive than countries not using it, although of course, there was variation in living costs between those euro countries.

 

For example, look at this comparison between Fethiye, Turkey (where I now live), and Corfu, Greece, which is also a popular destination for retirees:

 

https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Turkey&country2=Greece&city1=Fethiye&city2=Corfu

 

Rent prices in Corfu are 115% higher than in Fethiye

Restaurant prices are 419% (!!) higher than in Fethiye

Grocery prices are 240% higher than in Fethiye

 

The difference is staggering - no problem of course if you have the cash......

Well, you cannot compare Corfu, Mykonos or Santorini to Fethiye. It would be like comparing Miami, Florida  to Lake Charles, Louisiana.

Although Athens would not on your list, considering the choice you made, you would be surprised by the low cost of living. I spend more in Thailand than in Greece, by all means and I am referring to basics.

[simon43]

3 hours ago, alyx said:

Well, you cannot compare Corfu, Mykonos or Santorini to Fethiye. It would be like comparing Miami, Florida  to Lake Charles, Louisiana.

Although Athens would not on your list, considering the choice you made, you would be surprised by the low cost of living. I spend more in Thailand than in Greece, by all means and I am referring to basics.

I have zero idea as to the difference between Miami and Lake Charles....  I'm not from the USA.  

 

Anyway, it certainly looks fine to me - photo taken this afternoon.

 

 

Places like Athens were never on my list of potential choices.  I don't like cities.  I did compare places in Crete with Turkey, but the cost of living difference was still very high.  Why should I pay 10 euros for an inexpensive meal in Crete when the same meal costs me 2.14 Euro in Fethiye? (prices according to numbeo). 

[Grecian]

3 hours ago, simon43 said:

I have zero idea as to the difference between Miami and Lake Charles....  I'm not from the USA.  

 

Anyway, it certainly looks fine to me - photo taken this afternoon.

 

 

Places like Athens were never on my list of potential choices.  I don't like cities.  I did compare places in Crete with Turkey, but the cost of living difference was still very high.  Why should I pay 10 euros for an inexpensive meal in Crete when the same meal costs me 2.14 Euro in Fethiye? (prices according to numbeo). 

What's your experience of prices on the ground Simon?

Because of high inflation are those numbeo prices correct?

[secondtime]

On 12/13/2021 at 8:15 PM, Jerno said:

Canada's great place, but housing costs in any major city is horrific.  Average house price in Toronto is over CA$1,300,000.  Try that as expat on a pension or retirement savings.

I think New Zealand, Australia and Canada are meant to be the best retirement destinations for autocrats who stole a lot of money and want to give their children foreign citizenships. 

[bkk6060]

Cost of living is one thing but you want to keep your life and money.

Mexico and Costa Rica are 2 of the biggest cartel controlled, scam rip off crime laden countries I have ever been.  Check out the recent shootings on the beaches and crime sprees in Cancun and other areas and murders are rampant.

Much much worse then Thailand.

Edited December 15, 2021 by bkk6060

[thaibeachlovers]

On 12/14/2021 at 2:15 PM, Jerno said:

Canada's great place, but housing costs in any major city is horrific.  Average house price in Toronto is over CA$1,300,000.  Try that as expat on a pension or retirement savings.

and it's cold. Why would anyone voluntarily retire to such a cold place?

[Hummin]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

and it's cold. Why would anyone voluntarily retire to such a cold place?

Skiing, hiking, climbing, hunting, fishing, canoe, kayak, outdoor life? And this list is for working expats not retirement!

Edited December 16, 2021 by Hummin

[simon43]

6 hours ago, Grecian said:

What's your experience of prices on the ground Simon?

Because of high inflation are those numbeo prices correct?

So far, I haven't been shocked by prices, rather the contrary.  With the rate of inflation etc, converting my $ into local currency buys me more and more ????  Typically, I spend $2.00 on a meat wrap with salad at a cheap restaurant.  I don't smoke or drink etc, so can't comment about that, but see many local people drinking beer, so guess it's cheap.  My internet is about $50 per month for unlimited data. When I buy yogurts, bread, crackers and fruit at the local supermarket, it totals between $4-$5 equivalent.

[JustAnotherHun]

Reading the posts in this thread I get the impression, that cost of living is the main point for to be named as the "best country".

If beer is cheap, human rights, the rule of law, freedom of speech, transparency do not matter and hardcore dictators like Erdoghan are ok.

According to that, North Korea could be the best country to retire, if the prices ar low enough.

Amazing.

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, JustAnotherHun said:

Reading the posts in this thread I get the impression, that cost of living is the main point for to be named as the "best country".

If beer is cheap, human rights, the rule of law, freedom of speech, transparency do not matter and hardcore dictators like Erdoghan are ok.

According to that, North Korea could be the best country to retire, if the prices ar low enough.

Amazing.

The governments of every country are irrelevant to my life.

Leave me alone, and I won't be joining any revolution.

 

Human rights appear to fall broadly into two categories,

1. giving other people my money.

2. giving other people advantages over me.

 

As a white male Brit, who is given nothing by anyone, I can do without that thanks.

Edited December 16, 2021 by BritManToo

[JustAnotherHun]

6 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Human rights appear to fall broadly into two categories,

1. giving other people my money.

2. giving other people advantages over me.

Your knowledge about the meaning of human rights seems to be a bit limited ????

[KhunLA]

6 minutes ago, JustAnotherHun said:

Reading the posts in this thread I get the impression, that cost of living is the main point for to be named as the "best country".

If beer is cheap, human rights, the rule of law, freedom of speech, transparency do not matter and hardcore dictators like Erdoghan are ok.

According to that, North Korea could be the best country to retire, if the prices ar low enough.

Amazing.

Name a country that has 'human rights' as it's priority.  I left the USA, after they, and the rest of the 'good moral' countries joined in, and starting invading and occupying sovereign countries (Iraq & Afghan) for NO reason, simply because they could.  Killed, direct or indirectly about 1 million people and displaced even more millions.

 

Can't fight the tyranny, under any name, so it's me me me situation.  No different than shopping, I have no allegiance, give me the best product for fair price, and I'm going with that.

 

 

[Hummin]

1 minute ago, JustAnotherHun said:

Your knowledge about the meaning of human rights seems to be a bit limited ????

Coming from the British Empire, Commonwealth of Nations, Great Britain, United Kingdom, United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, and England, i can understand when it ends up as Brexit, it can be some kind of confusing with all this Human rights and so on

[BritManToo]

7 minutes ago, JustAnotherHun said:

Your knowledge about the meaning of human rights seems to be a bit limited ????

Seems I'm living in the real world, and you're living in a dream world.

I had no human rights when I was in the UK, but every woman and immigrant appeared to have plenty of them.

Edited December 16, 2021 by BritManToo

[JustAnotherHun]

Just now, BritManToo said:

Seems I'm living in the real world, and you're living in a dream world.

I had no human rights when I was in the UK, but every woman and immigrant had plenty of them.

If that where you're living in is the "real world", I'm more than happy that mine is different and less bitter.

Works quite well, maybe for both of us, so everything's fine ????

[tomazbodner]

On 12/14/2021 at 7:14 AM, ezzra said:

Top 10 countries for expats

1. Taiwan

2. Mexico

3. Costa Rica

4. Malaysia

5. Portugal

6. New Zealand

7. Australia

8.Ecuador

9. Canada

10. Vietnam

Taiwan is great until China invades...

[World Traveller2]

Agree with the tone of most posters of this thread, 'best *for what* and for whom'?

 

My wishlist is likewise different...

 

Priority I

- COSTS: cheap enough to live with some comforts on CAD1500 per month (accommodation, groceries, transportation, communication basics) [many, especially in South Asia], also Turkey

- VEGETARIAN: easy to eat out strictly veg dishes, doesn't have to be a veg restaurant per se [much of South Asia, not counting Bangladesh, and maybe Pakistan]

- MEDIUM-TERM: permits foreigners to stay six months at a time perpetually [not many anymore?]

 

Priority II

- SAFE: safe enough (too safe is police state, but actually I can live with a dictatorship if I benefit) [many, not Philippines]

- MEDICAL: doesn't have to be highest, just good enough and cheap enough [many, not Cambodia or Nepal, India excels. Turkey is a bit high]

- WOMEN 1: attractive to me [S E. Asia *not* Turkey]

- WOMEN 2: not adverse to condomless sex [Philippines]

- LANGUAGE: not difficult - Indonesia, Cambodia, and because of my academic background much of Northern India and Nepal. Eliminates staying long in Vietnam, Thailand, Laos etc due to tonal language]
 

Priority III

- CULTURE: Buddhist or Christian, or at least non-Islamic government [much of Asia, including Indonesia]

- P4P: good value and not difficult to find, less important to me than 15 years ago, but if a huge hassle/mammoth expenditure, no way [much of S.E. Asia, not Turkey]

- WOMEN 3: possible to find a much younger lover w/o marriage [Philippines, not India]

 

There are other factors also. So, in my case there is no perfectly suitable place. Pros and cons. But it has to be in Asia.

 

Basically, I probably will have to live three months in Nepal/Sri Lanka/India and three months in Vietnam/PPhilippine. My challenge is nostalgia. I liked many countries *15-30 years ago*

Edited December 16, 2021 by World Traveller2

[JustAnotherHun]

As soon as my son finishes highschool and is ready for university, I'll relocate from Thailand and SEA to - most likely - southern France, Spain, or Italy. Australia and New Zealand would be an option, if things turn to worse in the EU countries.

 

[dddave]

On 12/14/2021 at 8:51 AM, mfd101 said:

And then there's Surin. Ah Surin, nice one minute, boring the next, but safe except for the tropical diseases & the burglars.

Snakes.  You forgot the snakes.

 

I have a cousin who's lived in Ecuador nearly 5 years and still loves it.  

Edited December 16, 2021 by dddave

[Fat is a type of crazy]

Delete

Edited December 16, 2021 by Fat is a type of crazy

[bendejo]

Does anyone else suspect that perhaps some of the people who responded to the poll don't know the difference between Taiwan and Thailand?  I've come across a few people who think Thai food comes from Taiwan.

 

 

[TropicalGuy]

On 12/14/2021 at 8:51 AM, mfd101 said:

So, Taiwan OK till the pre-invasion bombardment starts. Mexico has 7 of the 10 most-violent cities in the world. Costa Rica good & safe. Malaysia Portugal excellent. NZ boring but safe. Oz nice but expensive (across NSW, not just Sinnee, average house price is AUD 1,100,000). Ecuador mmmm till the next upheaval. Canada nice, chilly & expensive. Veetnaam splendid to visit but crime rates are high ...

 

And then there's Surin. Ah Surin, nice one minute, boring the next, but safe except for the tropical diseases & the burglars.

Nailed it mfd…. just change Surin for Kata ! Ha ????

[TropicalGuy]

44 minutes ago, JustAnotherHun said:

As soon as my son finishes highschool and is ready for university, I'll relocate from Thailand and SEA to - most likely - southern France, Spain, or Italy. Australia and New Zealand would be an option, if things turn to worse in the EU countries.

 

Spain & Italy my Dream Locations for Culture / Lifestyle having lived and worked there. Can’t afford it though & very happy semi- retired with my Thai Lady / Son in Phuket. They have stayed in Europe with me but would not handle relocation well.

[World Traveller2]

Re: crime

 

All I care about is violent crime and theft. I actually like a little corruption and white collar crime is not relevant to me.

 

Only countries I have spent a lot of time where I have been the victim of crime are Vietnam (snatch-robbed twice) and Canada (assaulted by a stranger - a First Nations minor using drugs - judge at her trial refused to make her, her family or community elders to pay me one cent in restorative justice, so I gave up on the system there - at least in Cambodia, victim's family is restituted).

 

Only country where I spent very little time but was snatch-robbed (plus several close calls) is Philippines. Generally, it seems Buddhist and Muslim countries are safer. Co-incidence?

 

Police states such as Cuba are very safe in my experience, as is Turkey.

 

I also like slightly cosmopolitan cultures or those which have a homogenous dominant ethnic group, rather than an ongoing issue with illegal mass immigration (Serbia for example - it creates a reaction from the far right, for one).  However immigration from bordering countries does have some advantages in P4P. Take Cambodia in the 1990s (from Vietnam) and Thailand also (Myanmar and Laos). Also, some problems too. I am nothing, if not a selfish opportunist

Edited December 16, 2021 by World Traveller2

[TropicalGuy]

On 12/14/2021 at 7:22 PM, Jingthing said:

So check out

Merida

Queretaro

Puerto Vallarta

Etc.

 

“ Insecure” ? Er no, it’s a completely Lawless Hell……

[BE88]

On 12/14/2021 at 1:31 PM, World Traveller2 said:

As someone who tried relocating to Malaysia, be advised that unless you stay in a ritzy *high* high rise, unless you want to wake up at 05:30 every morning for the rest of your life, reconsider. Also, as a foreign retiree we are forbidden from buying modest working-class row houses. And the most desirable place for me (Georgetown) with a large ethnic Chinese Buddhist population, had property prices beyond my means.

 

But nice people all over Malaysia, very flirtatious women (Muslim ones being the most keen), multi-ethnic cuisine, and better value medical care than Thailand. Plus proximity to first world Singapore and an easy lingo to learn.

 

In brief, unlike in Turkey the call to prayer is loud and ugly, and the connection between politics and religion is too cozy for my liking. Dubai in the Gulf is much less Islamic. Be warned.

Thanks for the information, I get up at 6 am already so it wouldn't be a big problem to wake up half an hour earlier, but it seems to me that you can't get a visa if you don't have a monthly income of $ 2500?