Zebra Crossings: Action demanded but is it "locking the stable door after the horse has bolted"?

[webfact]

 

Thai media alluded to the Thai proverb about surrounding a pen after the cow has run away.

 

Or in English locking the stable door after the horse has bolted (acting too late after an event).

 

Thai Rath was reporting on the fallout from the case of the death of Chula opthamologist Waralak or Dr Kratai, killed on a Zebra Crossing in Bangkok on January 21st.

 

Her funeral was held last Wednesday as the man who killed her - Lance Corporal Norawich Buadok - went into the monkhood. 

 

He was allegedly speeding on his Ducati Monster superbike.

 

Chair of an accident prevention committee and DPM Prawit Wongsuwon ordered action.

 

"Big Den" - Gen Damrongsak Kittipraphas had a meeting and ordered all authorities nationwide to get tough.

 

Zebras were to have new lines, lights and markings. Strips to slow traffic were to be installed along with lights and CCTV.

 

Speed limits in built up areas around Zebras were to be changed to 30-40 kmph and to 60 kmph in areas outside cities.

 

A 20,000 baht monthly prize has been set up for members of the public filming law breaking at Zebras. 

 

The RTP have asked the public to be their eyes and ears. 

 

The talk is of Dr Kratai being the last fatality at a Zebra. 

 

Dr Thaejing Siriphanich who runs the Anti Drink Driving Foundation is starting a campaign, according to print media who reported on the issue at the weekend.

 

The symbol of this will be a fluffy rabbit - "Kratai" is rabbit in Thai, the nickname of the doctor who lost her life.

 

Thai Rath added that MoPH stats say that 6-8% of road fatalities were pedestrians in 2016-2018.

 

These stats suggested 800-1000 pedestrians died.

 

But when police stats are added the figure is more like 2,500 - 2,900 annually of which 900 per year are in Bangkok. 

 

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[yeahbutif]

Why not just put a police box on one side of the zebra ..with camara .just need a police who does his job ...or that could be the problem ...

[Dmaxdan]

36 minutes ago, webfact said:

Thai Rath added that MoPH stats say that 6-8% of road fatalities were pedestrians in 2016-2018.

 

These stats suggested 800-1000 pedestrians died.

Whilst it is important that all motorists have to abide by the rules, pedestrians have to play their part as well. For example, when crossing a road you should keep looking right and left at all times paying  particularly attention to the direction the traffic is supposed to be coming from. You never just stare straight ahead or as many do these days, at their phone.

 

 

[khunjeff]

52 minutes ago, webfact said:

The symbol of this will be a fluffy rabbit - "Kratai" is rabbit in Thai, the nickname of the doctor who lost her life.

Yes, having a cute mascot is always the first step ????

 

31 minutes ago, yeahbutif said:

Why not just put a police box on one side of the zebra ..with camara .just need a police who does his job ...or that could be the problem ...

At the zebra crossings near me, there are literally hundreds of violations every hour, even with pedestrian-operated traffic lights. On the rare occasions that police happen to be nearby, they pay absolutely no attention.

[MyFriend You]

Zebra Crossings??  They are Cross Walks, only Zebras in Thailand are in the Zoo's...........expensive but install a stop light woth a push button on either side to stop traffic, at each major crosswalk, repaint them all so they can be seen - when they repainted the ones in Pattaya, accidents went down "at those crosswalks".   but not the others.  Signs in Thai "STOPPING FOR PEDESTRIANS IS MANDATORY or a 5000 BANT FINE."

 

Peace

[Henryford]

Never too late, but what action, when even the Police ignore the rules. The best action would be to get rid of the ZCs.

[tomacht8]

They can make announcements as much as they want. Crosswalks are and will always be death traps here. I don't know why that is; it is either a question of mentality (the prevailing selfishness here: me first) or a missing gene, which leads to give a "weaker" road user right of way.

 

 

[big dendrobenaes]

23 minutes ago, Henryford said:

Never too late, but what action, when even the Police ignore the rules. The best action would be to get rid of the ZCs.

zc's work in the UK ozzz new zealand. ZA......HK macau.....and many many other countries do they NOT ??????

only here a big problem

[Jerno]

The RTP have asked the public to be their eyes and ears.   Because they are too lazy to do their job. Pathetic. 

[herfiehandbag]

1 hour ago, TunnelRat69 said:

Zebra Crossings??  They are Cross Walks, only Zebras in Thailand are in the Zoo's...........expensive but install a stop light woth a push button on either side to stop traffic, at each major crosswalk,

Tell you what, you call them crosswalks - we understand what you mean. But the majority of English speaking countries have been calling pedestrian crossings marked by black and white stripes painted on the road "Zebra Crossings" for many many years and for extremely obvious reasons ; and we will go on calling them by an accepted, long used and universally (and internationally) understood name, if you don't mind!

[trainman34014]

What needs to change is Thai Driver's 'Attitude'.    Now; whoever could achieve that would be more than an average Hero !

 

When i first met my Wife to be 20 years ago she gave me a few pointers for living in The Land of Scams and one of the things she said was 'The biggest problem in Thailand is People's 'Attitude'. '   How right that proved to be and nothing has changed down the years; so they can do what they like with the Zebra Crossings but whatever they do it won't change the 'Attitude' problem !

[alien365]

I give it a month and this will have all blown over for normality to resume. I'd love to be wrong, but...

[RayOday]

When did Prawit last drive. He has most likely been farting into the back seat of his chauffered limo for years. Thailand is a road death failure! How many years has Thailand been in the top 5 road deaths per capita globally? I know that there are socio economic issues in the comparison due to issues like 1 accident 12 dead in a minivan yet that is a result not a point of comparative discussion in mitigating reality. The Thai government is out of its depth and the metrics prove it. There needs to be structural change in ownership and execution which links engineering, police, and health without any political experts getting in the way by visiting the carnage to show interest. A commission should be set made up of only 1 high ranking government official and global experts in road safety. That's right, the politicians who have no results like Prawit, should get out of the way and spend the money up front to reduce deaths, injuries, and downstream burdens to the health and welfare costs of the nation. Prayuth and Prawit are a failure in making a difference in road engineering, education, qualification, safety programs, and most importantly enforcement. I have been driving around Thailand daily for the past 3 months and I am certified by a western governments department of transportation to teach road safety through defensive driving programs.  I am horrified at what I see on the roads despite road improvements in many provinces. I see zero enforcement except for registration (money collection) and in a few cases truck overweight inspection which is absolutely necessary. Top heavy pickups are upside down at even the thought of rainfall, and most pickups speed and think nothing of crossing lane lines illegally. I see solid no pass solid lines where they shouldn't be painted and passing lines with no line of sight. I see lao kho passengers 3x falling off moving motorbikes with police checkpoints not 50 meters away. Not 1 officier raised their head from their mobile phones. The Thai police are improving but not in road safety or enforcement. The checkpoint method is a failure unless it's only for smuggling.

One of the global leaders in accident prevention, the Liberty Mutual Institute or some other 3rd party, globally recognized source of excellence, should be hired to conduct an countrywide audit and submit the recommendations to a select panel which holds public hearings as to the issues and mitigation necessary to move the needle from 2nd to last place to top 5 in safety per year. Does anyone know a government stated goal that is measurable, realistic, owned, and time-bound to changing the current state? I don't. So much talk and no results. Given recent news they should start a model program in the province with the highest death and injury rate per capita and absolute values. I fear nothing will be done. "All things proceed in their circle and thus the empire is complete".

Edited January 31, 2022 by RayOday

[scorecard]

49 minutes ago, trainman34014 said:

What needs to change is Thai Driver's 'Attitude'.    Now; whoever could achieve that would be more than an average Hero !

 

When i first met my Wife to be 20 years ago she gave me a few pointers for living in The Land of Scams and one of the things she said was 'The biggest problem in Thailand is People's 'Attitude'. '   How right that proved to be and nothing has changed down the years; so they can do what they like with the Zebra Crossings but whatever they do it won't change the 'Attitude' problem !

'Attitude', yes and I would add: values and morals, and respect...

 

My Thai son did the last several years of high school in Singapore and had regularly visited Singapore, often for 2 or 3 weeks at a time, before he went there for HS so he knew how things work quite well.

 

He strongly admired the general attitude of respect for law and order which a very large % of Singaporeans possess. This was reinforced by several lectures/discussions at HS every year by different branches of the S'pore police.

 

He returned to LOS and started HS. He asked one of his uni buddies to slow down and to stop at red lights.

 

Result, buddy never spoke to him again after a strong lecture (in front of the buddies father) about 'I do what I want' and nobody/no law can tell me what to do'.

 

Later he met a girl (same uni course) and he started to teach her to drive; uppermost was understanding / respecting the law/ respecting other road users etc.

 

His GFs older sister (ignorant loud woman) intervened and told my son to 'stop it, there are no road laws in Thailand because it's up to you. If you don't want to stop you don't have to because nobody can tell you what to do'. 

Edited January 31, 2022 by scorecard

[onekoolguy]

I want to stop for all people in crosswalks and try to do so. However the problem is that almost no one expects you to stop? With closely following traffic you risk being hit from behind. If you do stop on a multilane road and everyone else does not stop the person crossing is in grave risk as per the doctor who was hit recently.

The other thing is that most people crossing the street are aware of these dangers and even when I  stop they often refuse to cross fearing that others will not stop? 

This is an education and enforcement problem that will not be solved easily.

[wombat]

even if the light said walk....would you? ....i sure dont without checking both ways.

 

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, onekoolguy said:

I want to stop for all people in crosswalks and try to do so. However the problem is that almost no one expects you to stop? With closely following traffic you risk being hit from behind. If you do stop on a multilane road and everyone else does not stop the person crossing is in grave risk as per the doctor who was hit recently.

The other thing is that most people crossing the street are aware of these dangers and even when I  stop they often refuse to cross fearing that others will not stop? 

This is an education and enforcement problem that will not be solved easily.

Understood, and my appraoch to this is:

 

- Look for signs indicating pedestrian crossings

- When noticed, start to slow down

- If needed pump the foot brake enought to turn the red rear of car stop lights on and off.

- When near the crossing if need be slow down even more, again with pumping the rear red lights.

- By this stage the car behind me have also slowed down, but of course other lanes probably haven't and of course the cars in my lane may choose to chance lanes.

 

Far from perfect strategy but it makes me feel I've at least tried and hopefully means I'll never actually hit a crossing pedestrian.

Edited January 31, 2022 by scorecard

[Eric Loh]

4 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Understood, and my appraoch to this is:

 

- Look for signs indicating pedestrian crossings

- When noticed, start to slow down

- If needed pump the foot brake enought to turn the red rear of car stop lights on and off.

- When near the crossing if need be slow down even more, again with pumping the rear red lights.

- By this stage the car behind me have also slowed down, but of course other lanes probably haven't and of course the cars in my lane may choose to chance lanes.

 

Far from perfect strategy but it makes me feel I've at least tried and hopefully means I'll never actually hit a crossing pedestrian.

I would normally turn on the hazard lights and slow down as I approach the zebra crossing if I see pedestrians waiting or crossing. The flashing lights are easily noticeable to slow/stop the cars behind. 

[BostonRob2]

4 hours ago, TunnelRat69 said:

Zebra Crossings??  They are Cross Walks, only Zebras in Thailand are in the Zoo's...........expensive but install a stop light woth a push button on either side to stop traffic, at each major crosswalk, repaint them all so they can be seen - when they repainted the ones in Pattaya, accidents went down "at those crosswalks".   but not the others.  Signs in Thai "STOPPING FOR PEDESTRIANS IS MANDATORY or a 5000 BANT FINE."

 

Peace

Thang Maa Lai = crossing horse striped. Maybe you don't read Thai.

[scorecard]

8 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

I would normally turn on the hazard lights and slow down as I approach the zebra crossing if I see pedestrians waiting or crossing. The flashing lights are easily noticeable to slow/stop the cars behind. 

Agree, I've done the same, many times, when I tought it needed/usefull.

[BusyB]

1 hour ago, RayOday said:

 The Thai police are improving ...

In what way? I'm genuinely curious as to what you have seen in improvement. You appear to be a reliable source.

[hotchilli]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Her funeral was held last Wednesday as the man who killed her - Lance Corporal Norawich Buadok - went into the monkhood. 

Why is he in a temple and not in a prison for manslaughter?

[connda]

Zebra Crossings: Action demanded but is it "locking the stable door after the horse has bolted"?

Nope. I'd bet you that someone is mauled in a crosswalk on a daily basis.  What's needed it to report it every time it happens and keep banging on the issue until the government does something other than to spew hot air.

[overt2016]

I will wait and see how It take for my regular crossings to be repainted.

[kimamey]

4 hours ago, alien365 said:

I give it a month and this will have all blown over for normality to resume. I'd love to be wrong, but...

I hope you're wrong but I doubt it.  They had a crackdown shortly afterthe coup with the obligatory photo ops. 

Still a reminder can't hurt. 

[bangon04]

5 hours ago, hotchilli said:

Why is he in a temple and not in a prison for manslaughter?

"He was allegedly speeding on his Ducati Monster superbike." at least they have decided that he owned the bike himself.......??

[greeneking]

11 hours ago, TunnelRat69 said:

Zebra Crossings??  They are Cross Walks, only Zebras in Thailand are in the Zoo's...........expensive but install a stop light woth a push button on either side to stop traffic, at each major crosswalk, repaint them all so they can be seen - when they repainted the ones in Pattaya, accidents went down "at those crosswalks".   but not the others.  Signs in Thai "STOPPING FOR PEDESTRIANS IS MANDATORY or a 5000 BANT FINE."

 

Peace

These walks can make me very cross.  Is that what you mean?

Zebra crossings are observed better by cars, especially when supported by red traffic lights, but even here motorbikes think they do not apply to them.

[Boyn]

I lived in Hua Hin for a while my condo was across the road from the Bangkok hospital ,there was a proper traffic light pedestrian crossing and i would sit on my balcony and watch as farang waited for the light to change and then cross the road and 90%of thai drivers would just not stop,

there would be farangs jumping out of the way and shouting at the drivers.

How nobody was killed i dont know but its obvious that thai drivers have no idea what a crossing is.

[richard_smith237]

12 hours ago, TunnelRat69 said:

Zebra Crossings??  They are Cross Walks, only Zebras in Thailand are in the Zoo's...........expensive but install a stop light woth a push button on either side to stop traffic, at each major crosswalk, repaint them all so they can be seen - when they repainted the ones in Pattaya, accidents went down "at those crosswalks".   but not the others.  Signs in Thai "STOPPING FOR PEDESTRIANS IS MANDATORY or a 5000 BANT FINE."

 

Peace

Incredible... no one ever thought of that... no on any of the past ‘pedestrian crossing’ crack downs... 

 

In Pattaya the eventually turned them off..... 

 

 

How is a lowly policeman going to fine a hi-so businessman for not stopping to allow a street beggar to cross the road ???....   Cameras at the crossings ??? no one pays any of their fines anyway ??? We have stacks of speeding fines....  nothing is ever done about them. 

 

Thailand’s traffic is just too immature and uncivilised....   A foot bridge is the only option... 

 

It could be argued that those in wheelchairs can’t use them, but lets face it the vast majority of pavements (sidewalks) are simply unnavigable for anyone in a wheelchair anyway they can’t get to the crossings in the first place. 

 

A lot needs to be done - it starts with reeducating everyone and forcing a cultural shift through effective policing. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[richard_smith237]

6 hours ago, connda said:

Zebra Crossings: Action demanded but is it "locking the stable door after the horse has bolted"?

They've used the wrong idiom.....  In this case it should have been: Action demanded but ‘the elephant in the room won’t leave has instead invited nelly over to join him in laughing in the faces of policy makers’