Seems the Unvaccinated Topic hit home, 50/50 in response

[onthedarkside]

An off topic post unrelated to COVID vaccines and a comment on moderation post have been removed, along with ensuing replies to those. Also some more recent replies to previously removed posts.

 

 

[catturd]

16 hours ago, ozimoron said:

 

Pfizer is not banned in India. Both of these links are dated after yours. The Indian government refused to grant indemnity for Pfizer which is a standard practice for most countries.

 

https://www.business-standard.com/article/current-affairs/pfizer-s-coronavirus-vaccine-may-cost-less-than-rs-730-a-dose-in-india-121060901739_1.html

 

Naushad Forbes, past president of the Confederation of Indian Industry, is confident India will eventually grant manufacturers indemnity, “but we will do it at a leisurely pace,” he says. “I am unable to understand why there are these delays.”

 

https://fortune.com/2021/06/10/india-covid-vaccine-pfizer-indemnity-legal-lawsuit-protection/

 

Government sources have said the two US vaccine makers – Pfizer and Moderna – had laid out conditions of using sovereign assets as a guarantee, which is not acceptable to the Government of India.

 

https://www.indiatoday.in/coronavirus-outbreak/story/india-will-not-accept-pfizer-moderna-conditions-on-vaccines-1855591-2021-09-22

lol, ok, whatever you say.

 

The drug regulator said on its website its experts did not recommend the vaccine because of side effects reported abroad were still being investigated. It also said Pfizer had not proposed any plan to generate safety and immunogenicity data in India.

 

“Based on the deliberations at the meeting and our understanding of additional information that the regulator may need, the company has decided to withdraw its application at this time,” Pfizer said in a statement.

 

“Pfizer will continue to engage with the authority and re-submit its approval request with additional information as it becomes available in the near future.”

 

https://www.metro.us/pfizer-drops-india-vaccine/

[ozimoron]

16 hours ago, catturd said:

lol, ok, whatever you say.

The drug regulator said on its website its experts did not recommend the vaccine because of side effects reported abroad were still being investigated. It also said Pfizer had not proposed any plan to generate safety and immunogenicity data in India.

“Based on the deliberations at the meeting and our understanding of additional information that the regulator may need, the company has decided to withdraw its application at this time,” Pfizer said in a statement.

“Pfizer will continue to engage with the authority and re-submit its approval request with additional information as it becomes available in the near future.”

https://www.metro.us/pfizer-drops-india-vaccine/

India wanted separate studies done in India. Most other countries have granted the required indemnity which is standard practice.

 

Meanwhile, Moderna is available in India.

 

https://www.indiatoday.in/coronavirus-outbreak/story/moderna-vaccines-expected-to-reach-india-in-next-2-3-days-govt-1823171-2021-07-02

[onthedarkside]

Several replies to previously removed posts have also been removed.

 

[Danderman123]

2 hours ago, JustAnotherHun said:

And your point? Let the vaccinated who can catch and provide the virus walk around infected?

You have to accept that the virus will not disappear, no matter how many people are vaccinated. Life includes risks and ends with death.

If one wants to rule out even the last minimal risk, he will have to lock himself in permanently and avoid any social contact.

My point is to vaccinate everyone possible so the virus dies out, or is confined to small pockets.

 

Like measles. And smallpox. And Polio.

 

yeah, I get it. You want to give up, even if millions more die.

 

if you had you way,  new and nastier variants will emerge from unvaccinated  hosts, and you will blame the vaccine.

[Danderman123]

16 hours ago, catturd said:

lol, ok, whatever you say.

The drug regulator said on its website its experts did not recommend the vaccine because of side effects reported abroad were still being investigated. It also said Pfizer had not proposed any plan to generate safety and immunogenicity data in India.

“Based on the deliberations at the meeting and our understanding of additional information that the regulator may need, the company has decided to withdraw its application at this time,” Pfizer said in a statement.

“Pfizer will continue to engage with the authority and re-submit its approval request with additional information as it becomes available in the near future.”

https://www.metro.us/pfizer-drops-india-vaccine/

When Pfizer is approved in India, will you post it here?

[ozimoron]

 

 

NEW DELHI, Sept 21 (Reuters) - India's government will not buy COVID-19 shots from Pfizer (PFE.N)/BioNTech (22UAy.DE) and Moderna (MRNA.O), three government sources told Reuters, mainly because domestic output of more affordable and easier-to-store vaccines has jumped.

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/india/india-govt-wont-buy-pfizer-moderna-vaccines-amid-local-output-sources-2021-09-21/

[onthedarkside]

I think the India debate here has run it's course, so let's try to get back onto generally related topics and/or things with a bit more relevance to this particular forum.

 

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said:

What studies show the effectiveness of segregating unvaccinated especially those who have a previous infection and have better protection than vaccinated people with no prior infections?I haven't seen any and if there are none on what grounds do they implement the restrictions?Logic?Guesses perhaps?Or do people just feel safer because they still don't feel safe even when triple jabbed?Are there any vaccines against paranoia?If you are so fearful of the world then don't go out in it but don't try and shut me out of it because of your fear.Based on average deaths by hunger and hunger related illnesses 18 million have died of these causes during this pandemic which is worse than the 6 million covid because 6 million of these are children and there's alway been a cure for this which is as simple as feeding these people.

How do you suggest these studies be conducted?

[Scott]

10 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said:

What studies show the effectiveness of segregating unvaccinated especially those who have a previous infection and have better protection than vaccinated people with no prior infections?I haven't seen any and if there are none on what grounds do they implement the restrictions?Logic?Guesses perhaps?Or do people just feel safer because they still don't feel safe even when triple jabbed?Are there any vaccines against paranoia?If you are so fearful of the world then don't go out in it but don't try and shut me out of it because of your fear.Based on average deaths by hunger and hunger related illnesses 18 million have died of these causes during this pandemic which is worse than the 6 million covid because 6 million of these are children and there's alway been a cure for this which is as simple as feeding these people.

I am not sure what hunger has to do with this other than as a deflection.   Covid is a serious disease and has had a major impact on nearly every corner of the world.   To a large extend, both hunger and Covid can be addressed, one with food and the other with vaccines, masking and social distancing.   

 

I highly doubt it would be effective to actively segregate all people who aren't vaccinated.  That is especially true as the virus changes and evolves into something that is at least somewhat milder.  However, I find it interesting that those who are adamant about not being vaccinated and not wearing a mask want everything to return to normal, when it won't as long as we have to fight the virus, put up with onerous employee absences due to illness and all the other things that negatively affect our safety, health and economic well being.  

 

 

 

 

 

[JustAnotherHun]

10 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

My point is to vaccinate everyone possible so the virus dies out, or is confined to small pockets.

 

Like measles. And smallpox. And Polio.

 

yeah, I get it. You want to give up, even if millions more die.

 

if you had you way,  new and nastier variants will emerge from unvaccinated  hosts, and you will blame the vaccine.

To compare the vaccination against measles, polio and smallpox with Covid shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. If compare, then compare it to vaccination against flu.

 

 If the Covid vaccines are so protective, where will those "million more" deaths come from? Just vaxx the vulnerables again and again and again. Then they are save, according to the propaganda.

 

New variants? Ever heared about escape mutations?

[FarFlungFalang]

2 hours ago, Scott said:

I am not sure what hunger has to do with this other than as a deflection.   Covid is a serious disease and has had a major impact on nearly every corner of the world.   To a large extend, both hunger and Covid can be addressed, one with food and the other with vaccines, masking and social distancing.   

 

I highly doubt it would be effective to actively segregate all people who aren't vaccinated.  That is especially true as the virus changes and evolves into something that is at least somewhat milder.  However, I find it interesting that those who are adamant about not being vaccinated and not wearing a mask want everything to return to normal, when it won't as long as we have to fight the virus, put up with onerous employee absences due to illness and all the other things that negatively affect our safety, health and economic well being.  

 

 

 

 

 

When people are suffering from malnutrition their defences against disease is severely reduced making them more vulnerable so it has a lot to do with this and it's interesting that you view it as merely a deflection.Hunger mainly occurs in the poorer nations of the world and so they are more vulnerable to covid in my view.You say hunger can be addressed yet the worlds best efforts have failed to do so, so at this point in time it seems that it can't be addressed otherwise it would have been.The same applies to covid you say it can be addressed but it appears to me that it can't be addressed otherwise it would surely would have been addressed.At this time after the worlds best efforts to vaccinate as many people as possible deaths and hospitalisation are at their highest of the pandemic in some countries.(see link below)

It's not only those who choose not to be vaccinated that want to return to normal as many people who were vaccinated with the promise of a return to normal are asking to return to normal.

A lot of the onerous employee absenteeism is from the onerous quarantine requirement of close contacts and asymptomatic people which is causing disruption and are being systematically scaled back.

With the virus being airborne and floating down corridors of quarantine hotels infecting the previous negatively test occupants the mask and social distancing doesn't seem to have stopped the virus spreading just as many experts had predicted they said you might slow it down but you won't stop it.

You can continue to live in the belief that the virus can be stopped but I think I'll listen to what the health experts said which is the virus can't be stopped and it seems to me that they have been correct as the virus has continued to spread despite people's best efforts.

 

https://ourworldindata.org/vaccination-israel-impact

 

Edited February 15, 2022 by FarFlungFalang

[ozimoron]

4 hours ago, JustAnotherHun said:

To compare the vaccination against measles, polio and smallpox with Covid shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. If compare, then compare it to vaccination against flu.

 

 If the Covid vaccines are so protective, where will those "million more" deaths come from? Just vaxx the vulnerables again and again and again. Then they are save, according to the propaganda.

 

New variants? Ever heared about escape mutations?

The million more deaths could arise because omicron is so infectious. For a "mild flu" omicron has killed more people than the far deadlier delta. Most of the world is still unvaccinated and so anti vaxxers like you do the world a huge disservice by doing your utmost to convince people that vaccines do not prevent infections which is pure male cow exceta. The next variant which could easily be more deadly than omicron will most likely be incubated by an unvaccinated person.

 

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20220209/omicron-death-rate-higher-than-during-delta-surge

[ozimoron]

5 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

When people are suffering from malnutrition their defences against disease is severely reduced making them more vulnerable so it has a lot to do with this and it's interesting that you view it as merely a deflection.Hunger mainly occurs in the poorer nations of the world and so they are more vulnerable to covid in my view.You say hunger can be addressed yet the worlds best efforts have failed to do so, so at this point in time it seems that it can't be addressed otherwise it would have been.The same applies to covid you say it can be addressed but it appears to me that it can't be addressed otherwise it would surely would have been addressed.At this time after the worlds best efforts to vaccinate as many people as possible deaths and hospitalisation are at their highest of the pandemic in some countries.(see link below)

It's not only those who choose not to be vaccinated that want to return to normal as many people who were vaccinated with the promise of a return to normal are asking to return to normal.

A lot of the onerous employee absenteeism is from the onerous quarantine requirement of close contacts and asymptomatic people which is causing disruption and are being systematically scaled back.

With the virus being airborne and floating down corridors of quarantine hotels infecting the previous negatively test occupants the mask and social distancing doesn't seem to have stopped the virus spreading just as many experts had predicted they said you might slow it down but you won't stop it.

You can continue to live in the belief that the virus can be stopped but I think I'll listen to what the health experts said which is the virus can't be stopped and it seems to me that they have been correct as the virus has continued to spread despite people's best efforts.

 

https://ourworldindata.org/vaccination-israel-impact

 

The world is a lot more normal than a year ago only because of the high rate of vaccinations which have reduced the spread and protected against serious illness.

[JustAnotherHun]

I'm double vaxxed and boostered.

As one of very few companies, we've managed to have our medical staff get vaxxed and boostered by 99% up to now. Many many single talks were needed to reach that level.

In June and July 2021 I worked once a week in one of Southern Bavaria's vaccination centers. I did not count the shots I set but there were many.

If  morons call me an antivaxxer, so be it.

[Scott]

4 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

When people are suffering from malnutrition their defences against disease is severely reduced making them more vulnerable so it has a lot to do with this and it's interesting that you view it as merely a deflection.Hunger mainly occurs in the poorer nations of the world and so they are more vulnerable to covid in my view.You say hunger can be addressed yet the worlds best efforts have failed to do so, so at this point in time it seems that it can't be addressed otherwise it would have been.The same applies to covid you say it can be addressed but it appears to me that it can't be addressed otherwise it would surely would have been addressed.At this time after the worlds best efforts to vaccinate as many people as possible deaths and hospitalisation are at their highest of the pandemic.

It's not only those who choose not to be vaccinated that want to return to normal as many people who were vaccinated with the promise of a return to normal are asking to return to normal.

A lot of the onerous employee absenteeism is from the onerous quarantine requirement of close contacts and asymptomatic people which is causing disruption and are being systematically scaled back.

With the virus being airborne and floating down corridors of quarantine hotels infecting the previous negatively test occupants the mask and social distancing doesn't seem to have stopped the virus spreading just as many experts had predicted they said you might slow it down but you won't stop it.

You can continue to live in the belief that the virus can be stopped but I think I'll listen to what the health experts said which is the virus can't be stopped and it seems to me that they have been correct as the virus has continued to spread despite people's best efforts.

Hunger and malnutrition can be stopped.  It isn't because the international will does not exist to eliminate it. There has never been a concerted effort to end hunger.   The country with the highest death toll is the US and hunger is not a particularly big problem.  Your comparison is a deflection and an attempt to minimize the seriousness of Covid.  Hunger, on the other hand, has been with us since the beginning of recorded history.  

 

Even with a hit-and-miss approach by a few countries, world hunger has, indeed decreased:

After steadily declining for a decade, world hunger is on the rise, affecting 9.9 percent of people globally. ... The proportion of undernourished people in the world has declined from 15 percent in 2000-2004 to 8.9 percent in 2019.

 

https://www.actionagainsthunger.org/world-hunger-facts-statistics

 

Covid can be addressed, but it requires the cooperation of all involved and that hasn't been forthcoming, primarily for political reasons.   You dismiss the quarantine requirements as a primary cause, but without those the spread would have been exacerbated.  This is especially true with the original up through Delta.  Omicron appears to be more transmissible, but the period of asymptomatic spread appears to be less.   Again, it is a deflection and placing the blame on a legitimate and verified method of slowing the spread.  

 

The odds of stopping the virus are extraordinarily low.  Early on there was a possibility, but again, most attempts were undermined.  Any attempt at anything other than mitigating and controlling the spread is the most we can achieve, IMO.  

 

We are most likely a very, very long ways from any semblance of normal.  Pretty much every pandemic ended with a new 'normal', not the return to the old normal.  

 

 

 

[JustAnotherHun]

23 minutes ago, Scott said:

You dismiss the quarantine requirements as a primary cause, but without those the spread would have been exacerbated. 

[...]

Pretty much every pandemic ended with a new 'normal', not the return to the old normal.  

 

 

 

Not quarantaine is responsible for the problems everywhere and the rising hunger in the third world. Quarantaining the infected makes sense to stop or at least slow down outbreaks. The damage was done by shutting down whole economies temporarily.

If you compare countries with very strict lockdowns to the few without long lockdowns, you'll see not much difference in the success to fight the virus. Take Germany and Sweden as examples.

 

Which pandemics are you refering to that ended with a new normal?

[FarFlungFalang]

1 hour ago, Scott said:

Hunger and malnutrition can be stopped.  It isn't because the international will does not exist to eliminate it. There has never been a concerted effort to end hunger.   The country with the highest death toll is the US and hunger is not a particularly big problem.  Your comparison is a deflection and an attempt to minimize the seriousness of Covid.  Hunger, on the other hand, has been with us since the beginning of recorded history.  

 

Even with a hit-and-miss approach by a few countries, world hunger has, indeed decreased:

After steadily declining for a decade, world hunger is on the rise, affecting 9.9 percent of people globally. ... The proportion of undernourished people in the world has declined from 15 percent in 2000-2004 to 8.9 percent in 2019.

 

https://www.actionagainsthunger.org/world-hunger-facts-statistics

 

Covid can be addressed, but it requires the cooperation of all involved and that hasn't been forthcoming, primarily for political reasons.   You dismiss the quarantine requirements as a primary cause, but without those the spread would have been exacerbated.  This is especially true with the original up through Delta.  Omicron appears to be more transmissible, but the period of asymptomatic spread appears to be less.   Again, it is a deflection and placing the blame on a legitimate and verified method of slowing the spread.  

 

The odds of stopping the virus are extraordinarily low.  Early on there was a possibility, but again, most attempts were undermined.  Any attempt at anything other than mitigating and controlling the spread is the most we can achieve, IMO.  

 

We are most likely a very, very long ways from any semblance of normal.  Pretty much every pandemic ended with a new 'normal', not the return to the old normal.  

 

 

 

I agree that theoretically it's possible to stop both but in practice it has proven to be beyond our capabilities and I'm not advocating that we give up trying.In my view vaccines are great and so is a previous infection which basically what a vaccine is, it's a type of previous infection that provides protection from the disease.

You say that my raising hunger is a deflection in an attempt to minimise the severity of covid yet I say it is an attempt to put it in perspective with other problems by comparing it with other global issues that are more devastating health impacts that receive less media attention.You state it's a deflection, you don't say it's your opinion but you state it as a fact without an argument to support your claim.You also say  that on the other hand hunger has been around since the beginning of recorded history, well I suspect that people have been having issues with viruses during the same period and I would hazard a guess that deaths from hunger and hunger related diseases has been causing more death during that time. 

Some countries have already returned to normal and despite you claim that we are a long ways from normal it only take a few words from our leaders to return us to normal, some may struggle with the idea of returning to normal but I think most people will get used to it pretty quickly.Image being normal again.Imagine embracing life with all it's risks and enjoying it as much as possible instead of cowering in fear and blaming others for one's misery.

Edited February 15, 2022 by FarFlungFalang

[Bkk Brian]

52 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

When people are suffering from malnutrition their defences against disease is severely reduced making them more vulnerable so it has a lot to do with this and it's interesting that you view it as merely a deflection.Hunger mainly occurs in the poorer nations of the world and so they are more vulnerable to covid in my view.You say hunger can be addressed yet the worlds best efforts have failed to do so, so at this point in time it seems that it can't be addressed otherwise it would have been.The same applies to covid you say it can be addressed but it appears to me that it can't be addressed otherwise it would surely would have been addressed.At this time after the worlds best efforts to vaccinate as many people as possible deaths and hospitalisation are at their highest of the pandemic in some countries.(see link below)

It's not only those who choose not to be vaccinated that want to return to normal as many people who were vaccinated with the promise of a return to normal are asking to return to normal.

A lot of the onerous employee absenteeism is from the onerous quarantine requirement of close contacts and asymptomatic people which is causing disruption and are being systematically scaled back.

With the virus being airborne and floating down corridors of quarantine hotels infecting the previous negatively test occupants the mask and social distancing doesn't seem to have stopped the virus spreading just as many experts had predicted they said you might slow it down but you won't stop it.

You can continue to live in the belief that the virus can be stopped but I think I'll listen to what the health experts said which is the virus can't be stopped and it seems to me that they have been correct as the virus has continued to spread despite people's best efforts.

 

https://ourworldindata.org/vaccination-israel-impact

 

People suffering from hunger is a lack of equity in the world due to unfair wealth distribution and many other factors including inequalities of social, political, and economic power. It has little to do with Covid and just a failed distraction.

 

Your example of Israel, a country where even Thailand has overtaken in its vaccination coverage and where all you've done is look at the numbers without the data behind them which is:

 

"Israelis over 60 who are either unvaccinated or only partially vaccinated against COVID-19 died in significantly higher numbers last month compared to people in their age cohort who are fully vaccinated, according to official figures published by the Israeli Health Ministry.

The numbers show that while only approximately 12 percent of Israelis over 60 are either unvaccinated or partially vaccinated, together they account for 43 percent of COVID deaths in their age group in the previous month.

These numbers highlight once again the stark contrast between the vaccinated and unvaccinated as Israel grapples with the fifth wave of a pandemic that has killed more than 9,000 people since March 2020."

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/unvaccinated-vs-boostered-what-the-covid-death-toll-from-israel-reveals-1.10586137

 

Now take a look at the death numbers in Portugal the 2nd highest vaxxed country in the world.

 

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus/country/portugal

 

Why is it do you think that many countries in Europe are now leading the way in returning to near normal due to the immunity walls they've built with vaccinations?

[placeholder]

4 hours ago, JustAnotherHun said:

If you compare countries with very strict lockdowns to the few without long lockdowns, you'll see not much difference in the success to fight the virus. Take Germany and Sweden as examples.

 If you want to compare Sweden to the countries most similar to it, those would be Norway, Denmark, and Finland.

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus/country/sweden

[FarFlungFalang]

6 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

People suffering from hunger is a lack of equity in the world due to unfair wealth distribution and many other factors including inequalities of social, political, and economic power. It has little to do with Covid and just a failed distraction.

I say it's a comparison with a more severe cause of deaths with 3 times the number of covid deaths for some perspective and you say it's a failed distraction yet you fail to back up you claim without any form of argument so I'm inclined to dismiss your claim as a failed distraction on the grounds of lack of a coherent argument.When I compare 18 million deaths from hunger to 6 million deaths from covid I draw the conclusion that hunger is a bigger problem especially when 6 million of the deaths from hunger are children.

Yes it's true I didn't bother with taking into consideration why Israel is having more deaths after it's vaccination effort because my point was that it is suffering more deaths after its vaccination effort.I'll leave the explaining why this is so to you because you may feel it's important to do so.

[placeholder]

4 hours ago, JustAnotherHun said:

I'm double vaxxed and boostered.

As one of very few companies, we've managed to have our medical staff get vaxxed and boostered by 99% up to now. Many many single talks were needed to reach that level.

In June and July 2021 I worked once a week in one of Southern Bavaria's vaccination centers. I did not count the shots I set but there were many.

 

Actually, anyone who believes their uncorroborated claims have any dispositive value, might consider directing their headshaking at a party closer to home.

[Bkk Brian]

6 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

I say it's a comparison with a more severe cause of deaths with 3 times the number of covid deaths for some perspective and you say it's a failed distraction yet you fail to back up you claim without any form of argument so I'm inclined to dismiss your claim as a failed distraction on the grounds of lack of a coherent argument.When I compare 18 million deaths from hunger to 6 million deaths from covid I draw the conclusion that hunger is a bigger problem especially when 6 million of the deaths from hunger are children.

Yes it's true I didn't bother with taking into consideration why Israel is having more deaths after it's vaccination effort because my point was that it is suffering more deaths after its vaccination effort.I'll leave the explaining why this is so to you because you may feel it's important to do so.

Ok if you must compare, then the covid situation is suffering also with vaccine equity and if it had been distributed on a fairer basis and copyright patents not forced then the vaccination status throughout the world would have been far higher and the pandemic would be coming to an end faster and with less likelihood of further mutations.

 

The mutations so far have arisen either before vaccinations were available or in countries where covid vaccination was low.

 

Now lets get back to the subject which is covid and vaccinations/unvaccinated shall we?

Edited February 15, 2022 by Bkk Brian

[JustAnotherHun]

3 hours ago, placeholder said:

 If you want to compare Sweden to the countries most similar to it, those would be Norway, Denmark, and Finland.

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus/country/sweden

The point is not how geographicly close countries are to each other but to compare very strict and lasting lockdowns countries to those with none or short ones.

[ozimoron]

4 hours ago, JustAnotherHun said:

I'm double vaxxed and boostered.

As one of very few companies, we've managed to have our medical staff get vaxxed and boostered by 99% up to now. Many many single talks were needed to reach that level.

In June and July 2021 I worked once a week in one of Southern Bavaria's vaccination centers. I did not count the shots I set but there were many.

 

You're doing your utmost to spread disinformation to the effect that vaccines don't prevent infection.

 

 

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, FarFlungFalang said:

I say it's a comparison with a more severe cause of deaths with 3 times the number of covid deaths for some perspective and you say it's a failed distraction yet you fail to back up you claim without any form of argument so I'm inclined to dismiss your claim as a failed distraction on the grounds of lack of a coherent argument.When I compare 18 million deaths from hunger to 6 million deaths from covid I draw the conclusion that hunger is a bigger problem especially when 6 million of the deaths from hunger are children.

Yes it's true I didn't bother with taking into consideration why Israel is having more deaths after it's vaccination effort because my point was that it is suffering more deaths after its vaccination effort.I'll leave the explaining why this is so to you because you may feel it's important to do so.

First off, what makes your argument about hunger so nonsensical is that unless you can somehow prove that the money spent on fighting covid came from funds that would have been spent on fighting hunger, it's utterly immaterial. And given that the amount spent on fighting covid is miniscule compared to what is spent on, say weapons, why target covid spending at all?

 

Also, that figure of 6 million you cite is based on official govt figures. Epidemiologists know that this is a huge undercount.

It's more than double that.

https://covid19.healthdata.org/global?view=cumulative-deaths&tab=trend

 

Nor does it take into account the larger number of people who suffer from long covid. What's more, now it looks like that covid patients who are considered to have recovered,  are subsequently coming down with all sorts of cardiovascular illnesses at a rate much higher than the unafflicted.

 

[FarFlungFalang]

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Ok if you must compare, then the covid situation is suffering also with vaccine equity and if it had been distributed on a fairer basis and patients not forced then the vaccination status throughout the world would have been far higher and the pandemic would be coming to an end faster and with less likelihood of further mutations.

 

The mutations so far have arisen either before vaccinations were available or in countries where covid vaccination was low.

 

Now lets get back to the subject which is covid and vaccinations/unvaccinated shall we?

Do you know if mutations occur in vaccinated people with breakthrough infections?Has it been proven where the mutations originate?So far it seems that the origin of mutations is still a bit of a mystery it's seems to more of a guessing game at the moment.I suspect it's quite possible that mutation have just as much chance of occurring in vaccinated people so using the mutation argument as reason for being vaccinated is just an opinion and not based in scientific proof. 

[JustAnotherHun]

4 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Do you know if mutations occur in vaccinated people with breakthrough infections?

The term is "escape mutation".

[ozimoron]

5 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

Do you know if mutations occur in vaccinated people with breakthrough infections?Has it been proven where the mutations originate?So far it seems that the origin of mutations is still a bit of a mystery it's seems to more of a guessing game at the moment.I suspect it's quite possible that mutation have just as much chance of occurring in vaccinated people so using the mutation argument as reason for being vaccinated is just an opinion and not based in scientific proof. 

The lack of a positive does not imply a negative. There has been expert opinion that omicron likely occurred in an unvaccinated and untreated HIV patient. Since we do know that the viral load is lower in vaccinated people and is cleared more quickly it stands to reason that it is generally the case. That does not rule out the possibility but it does indicated the chances are much lower.

[ozimoron]

1 minute ago, JustAnotherHun said:

The term is "escape mutation".

Could you kindly provide us with a link instead of more anti vax rubbish please?