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14 minutes ago, matchar said:

The Atto 3 seems a bit outdated now that the competition is heating up.

 

Apparently BYD didn't even make the top 20 for the latest motor show bookings:

Real registration numbers tell a much different story, and let's stick to BEV, as ICEV are still the most sold, though losing market share every month.

 

As stated on the other thread, you'd have to be nuts to not at least look at BEV, before plopping your hard earned money down for an under performing, overpriced, low tech, expensive to maintain ICEV.

 

Conversation to continue here ...

https://aseannow.com/topic/1246109-ice-vs-ev-the-debate-thread/page/102/#findComment-19707043

 

40 minutes ago, matchar said:

The Atto 3 seems a bit outdated now that the competition is heating up.

 

Apparently BYD didn't even make the top 20 for the latest motor show bookings:

BYD, amongst others, don’t release the booking figures until after the show is finished.

11 hours ago, matchar said:

The Atto 3 seems a bit outdated now that the competition is heating up.

 

Apparently BYD didn't even make the top 20 for the latest motor show bookings:

 

Per note codes in other reporting BYD is one of the companies "not" reporting sales numbers during the show.  More companies are going this route of only reporting numbers at the end of the event "or even not at all." .

 

13 hours ago, matchar said:

The Atto 3 seems a bit outdated now that the competition is heating up.

 

Apparently BYD didn't even make the top 20 for the latest motor show bookings:

 

They probably haven't released figure yet.

As I have booked the AION UT, I did some research on GAC AION, as on internet GAC is less known than BYD or MG.

 

GAC is a state owned company with EV global brands AION and Hyptec and joint-ventures with Toyota and Honda, primarily for the Chinese market. GAC Toyota has just launched the bZ3X EV [  https://carnewschina.com/2025/02/01/gac-toyota-bz3x-ev-with-620-km-range-will-launch-on-march-3rd-in-china/ ].

They have 2 type of customers, the ride hailing [e.g. AION S and ES], which is declining, and the end consumer [AION V, Y Plus, Hyptec]. Although they produce AION V in Thailand, they decided to import the AION UT, likely due to unknown demand and excess factory capacity in China. AION UT is not selling as well as the Geely Star Wish. One of the reasons is that GAC decided to produce more of the UT 400 model instead of the cheaper UT 300 [not available in Thailand]. 

 

GAC makes their own batteries, the Magazine Battery 2.0 [ https://autonews.gasgoo.com/m/70030001.html ]. The latest in the AION V has 400V 3C fast charging, 4,000 cycles, is module repairable and can suppress thermal runaway if punctured or twisted. For what it's worth, GAC is planning solid state batteries in 2026 [ https://cnevpost.com/2024/04/12/gac-to-equip-hyper-evs-with-all-solid-state-batteries-in-2026/ ].

 

Chinese users of the AION V are satisfied with the driving capabilities and suspension, even though the rear has a torsion beam, which is characteristic to all AION models [S, V, Y Plus and UT].  Also the ADAS lane keeping is more precise than peers, maybe because GAC is investing heavily in Robotaxi's [ https://www.metal.com/en/newscontent/103085517 ].

 

On the downside, GAC still have too little dealerships and expertise  in Thailand. They say they will extend with 80 this year, but no concrete plans yet where [ https://kyodonewsprwire.jp/release/202503256247 ]. On facebook I can gauge not enough expertise on AC maintenance.

 

Testdrive AION UT by German car reporter:

 

Magazine Battery 2.0:

 

 

 

Quote

 

Source: https://www.dongchedi.com/article/7487239887775629858

 

In terms of lane keeping function, Aion UT demonstrates higher accuracy. It uses advanced sensor technology and precise algorithms to more accurately identify lane lines and make more timely and smooth corrections when the vehicle deviates from the lane. Compared with some models of the same level, Aion UT's lane keeping assist system performs better in dealing with complex road conditions, such as curves and unclear road markings. This is due to GAC Group's heavy investment in the research and development of intelligent driving technology and its technical accumulation, which enables Aion UT to provide a more reliable lane keeping experience.

 

 

 

Deepal E07

 

https://autolifethailand.tv/official-price-changan-deepal-e07-thailand-jan2025/

 

Saw one of these in the flesh today, very striking in the grey colour.

 

A beast of a car next to the S07 with its 21” wheels, bull nose front end and an unusual rear looking a little like a cross between a Cybertruck and an Aztec !!

 

Choice of RWD for 1.599m with 342 HP and a 6.7 second 0-100 or AWD for 1.999m with 598 hp and 3.96 seconds 0-100, current prices, normal price is +100k on both ), NMC battery chemistry on both.

 

Obviously very striking rear end is its main selling point. The rear glass window slides up over the roof to create the pick up visual and has the drop down tailgate with a small glass window as the top half which can disappear into the tailgate at the press of a button, indeed it is all electrically operated.

 

 

 

Not sure about driving with the tailgate down as the licence plate will not be on show, unless that swings down to be visible ?

 

With the rear end all closed it provides 524 ltrs of storage which, imho, is good but not groundbreaking, but an impressive 131 ltrs frunk.

 

Separating the cargo space and the rear seats is a panel with the top half glass and the bottom half plastic, electrically lower the glass panel, lower the rear seats and the plastic panel can also be lowered to provide a lengthy sleeping area.

 

Inside is the usual array of functionality v gimmickery , gear changes are via the right hand steering wheel stalk meaning the centre console is clear of buttons or switches.

 

Hopefully using the stalk to ( forgetfully) indicate right at speed won’t put you straight into reverse !!

Seems like changing the habit of a , driving, lifetime could be difficult !

Hopefully also the brown interior is not the only option for AWD, a black version is available only for RWD.

 

The 15.4” screen can be tilted towards driver or passenger ( not sure if these are the only two positions ? ).

 

A host of accessories available mainly aimed at camping.

 

10 year free internet access.

 

360° camera with full dashcam type recording on all 4 cameras when driving ( if that is what this means ):

Sentry mode.

 

Supports up to 240 kw DC charging.

 

The versatility of the rear end is definitely impressive, if you are into camping !!

 

Not for me but i do recognise the technology advances and the gadgetry is no doubt going to attract a crowd at the Show.

On 2/10/2025 at 2:07 PM, Bandersnatch said:

The bonnet and the 2 sections below it had a big dent in them while the Nissan had a broken tail light. 

 

 

We have just got back from the body repair shop who checked the car and will be ordering parts from BYD. I will do an update on how things progress.

 

 

As promised, here is a progress report:

 

The insurance company took 6 weeks to make a decision and authorise repairs, despite both parties being insured with them and the other party admitting full responsibilty.

 

They decided that the bonnet should be repaired but not the BYD logo panel below which had some deep scratches. Once the repair got underway it was discovered that BYD logo panel was damaged where it fitted to the car so had to be replaced. So 7 weeks after we first made the claim, the first BYD part was ordered. The car was now dismantled and we weren't sure how long we would be without the car while we waited for the part. Turns out we only had to wait a week, not bad for a car that has only been in country for a couple of months.

 

24 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

The insurance company took 6 weeks to make a decision and authorise repairs, despite both parties being insured with them and the other party admitting full responsibilty.

Now, that's down right terrible service (insurance coverage-wise).   Any idea as to why the insurance company took so   l....o.....n.....g   just to make the decision to begin repairs?   Like was it simply because it was an "electric car" issue, some legal detail not related to type of vehicle, maybe something related to the "1st year insurance that BYD pays for,"  etc.   Shame it took so long just to begin repairs.

2 hours ago, Pib said:

Any idea as to why the insurance company took so   l....o.....n.....g   just to make the decision to begin repairs? 

 

No idea but BYD Buriram did some chasing for us and that's the point we started seeing progress. I will of course be changing companies when the policy expires.

7 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

 

 

As promised, here is a progress report:

 

The insurance company took 6 weeks to make a decision and authorise repairs, despite both parties being insured with them and the other party admitting full responsibilty.

 

They decided that the bonnet should be repaired but not the BYD logo panel below which had some deep scratches. Once the repair got underway it was discovered that BYD logo panel was damaged where it fitted to the car so had to be replaced. So 7 weeks after we first made the claim, the first BYD part was ordered. The car was now dismantled and we weren't sure how long we would be without the car while we waited for the part. Turns out we only had to wait a week, not bad for a car that has only been in country for a couple of months.

 

So, to clear things up in my mind, did the car set in the repair shop for 8 weeks (7 weeks awaiting insurance company decision + 1 week of actual repair) or just 1 week in the shop?  

2 hours ago, Pib said:

So, to clear things up in my mind, did the car set in the repair shop for 8 weeks (7 weeks awaiting insurance company decision + 1 week of actual repair) or just 1 week in the shop?  

 

Fortunately for us, the Prick Up Truck that reversed into our parked car at 7/11 did only cosmetic damage and we were able to continue driving the car. The fact that the accident happened within a few days of us getting the car rather soured the experience of getting a new car.

 

We were without the car for just over a week.

 

The main take away for me was: getting a replacement part for a newly launched BYD took only a week

 

 

12 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

The main take away for me was: getting a replacement part for a newly launched BYD took only a week

A few months ago when my Atto left rear turn light assembly needed replacement (not accident related...just some of the LEDs died) it took my BYD dealership in Bangkok almost two weeks to get a replacement assembly.  And the dealershp swore it came from the BYD main warehouse in Bangkok (i.e., the BIG BYD warehouse used to supply all dealerships in Thailand with spare parts) to include replacement traction batteries). 

 

I even bugged the dealership twice via visits during those two weeks asking when is the part arriving that is supposedly just across town as I live in and the dealership are also  in Bangkok.   I think the part actually had to come from China as in the dealership ordered from the Bangkok main warehouse and the warehouse didn't have it in stock for whatever reason so the warehouse ordered it from China....when arriving the main warehouse it was then reshipped to the dealership.   It just seemed my dealership was at the mercy of the main/BIG BYD warehouse in Bangkok in getting the part.

 

 

27 minutes ago, Bandersnatch said:

 

Fortunately for us, the Prick Up Truck that reversed into our parked car at 7/11 did only cosmetic damage and we were able to continue driving the car. The fact that the accident happened within a few days of us getting the car rather soured the experience of getting a new car.

 

We were without the car for just over a week.

 

The main take away for me was: getting a replacement part for a newly launched BYD took only a week

 

 

I feel you. The most excited i have ever been for a new car was my shiny new Subaru Impreza WRX. Within a week of taking delivery I was smashed in to at high speed by a pick up truck. It crushed cans of tomatoes I had in shopping bags behind the front seats (I had just come back from the supermarket). Car was concertinaed. It took eight months to fix - they literally had to stretch the chassis back out. In any other country it would have been a write off, and to be fair, I am sure today it would have been, but this was 20 years ago and Thailand was still the wild east.

Damage to a new car really sucks.

On 4/4/2025 at 2:32 PM, Andrew Dwyer said:

Deepal E07

 

https://autolifethailand.tv/official-price-changan-deepal-e07-thailand-jan2025/

 

Saw one of these in the flesh today, very striking in the grey colour.

 

A beast of a car next to the S07 with its 21” wheels, bull nose front end and an unusual rear looking a little like a cross between a Cybertruck and an Aztec !!

 

Choice of RWD for 1.599m with 342 HP and a 6.7 second 0-100 or AWD for 1.999m with 598 hp and 3.96 seconds 0-100, current prices, normal price is +100k on both ), NMC battery chemistry on both.

 

Obviously very striking rear end is its main selling point. The rear glass window slides up over the roof to create the pick up visual and has the drop down tailgate with a small glass window as the top half which can disappear into the tailgate at the press of a button, indeed it is all electrically operated.

 

 

 

Not sure about driving with the tailgate down as the licence plate will not be on show, unless that swings down to be visible ?

 

With the rear end all closed it provides 524 ltrs of storage which, imho, is good but not groundbreaking, but an impressive 131 ltrs frunk.

 

Separating the cargo space and the rear seats is a panel with the top half glass and the bottom half plastic, electrically lower the glass panel, lower the rear seats and the plastic panel can also be lowered to provide a lengthy sleeping area.

 

Inside is the usual array of functionality v gimmickery , gear changes are via the right hand steering wheel stalk meaning the centre console is clear of buttons or switches.

 

Hopefully using the stalk to ( forgetfully) indicate right at speed won’t put you straight into reverse !!

Seems like changing the habit of a , driving, lifetime could be difficult !

Hopefully also the brown interior is not the only option for AWD, a black version is available only for RWD.

 

The 15.4” screen can be tilted towards driver or passenger ( not sure if these are the only two positions ? ).

 

A host of accessories available mainly aimed at camping.

 

10 year free internet access.

 

360° camera with full dashcam type recording on all 4 cameras when driving ( if that is what this means ):

Sentry mode.

 

Supports up to 240 kw DC charging.

 

The versatility of the rear end is definitely impressive, if you are into camping !!

 

Not for me but i do recognise the technology advances and the gadgetry is no doubt going to attract a crowd at the Show.

 

saw this in person recently, you can drive with the rear window open but the tailgate must remain closed. Also it has a frunk. The model I saw had a price of 2 million baht.

 

31 minutes ago, gidz555 said:

 

saw this in person recently, you can drive with the rear window open but the tailgate must remain closed. Also it has a frunk. The model I saw had a price of 2 million baht.

 

Seen a few on the road - they are pretty striking.

EV's took the crown at this event - cant say I am all that surprised...... to add insult to injury, most of the big winners are from the car capitol of the world, leaving established companies behind.

And here's the expanded motor show sales chart.   What I was "kinda" surprised by was Toyota being displaced by BYD/Densa for the #1 sales spot.   I thought BYD would probably come in #2 again like the last motor show...but times are a'changing...and BYD has come out with a lot more models over the last year....more choices even to include HEV.   Then GAC AION and Deepal (electric car companies) coming in #3 and #4.   Honda then coming in #5.     

 

Toyota and Honda "might want to get their heads out of their ICEV hole" and get moving a lot faster on making BEVs.  Then again, maybe both of them have an awesome new traction battery and/or combustion engine "just around the corner" that will kill-off EVs---seems Toyota has been projecting such for years now.  (giggle, giggle)    

 

https://autolifethailand.tv/booking-motor-show-2025-46th/

This is another area China will utterly dominate.......or already does.

I was lucky enough to teach Chinese university students who had decided to study at universities in Australia.

We lived about 100km from Bejing on a university campus with about 65000 uni students all studying different things.

The first 3 months for everyone was military style training. Marching, PE, and general drilling. You could see on the vast parade grounds these students change from a rag tag mob into disciplined groups, all in step all moving to the same ThaiChi exercises.

Seeing thousands all progressing was beautiful to watch.

My main job was teaching Maths, but it's difficult to teach tallented, respectful smart people things that had already been drummed into them.

Chinese youngsters are so talented and committed and their parents working around the clock to get their kids into the best jobs.

Chinese can do anything and why they are so successful is no shock to me.

The only small problem I had was during a Bejing chapter HASH run, where we had some problemed runners dressed in Tutus staggering into the Forbiden City. Police said we'd be arrested if we did that.

All happy and we weren't (most of us) that stupid.

 

 

Hashers and bright… 🤪

17 minutes ago, HighPriority said:

Hashers and bright… 🤪

 

You only need half a mind

6 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

 

You only need half a mind

The max level to be accepted into AN!😂

1 hour ago, rough diamond said:

The max level to be accepted into AN!😂

ON ON

At the Motor Show BYD knew they had to lower the price of the Dolphin [ 499k / 599k ].  Otherwise the fight with the AION UT [ 49xk / 64xk ] would not have been so close.

 

The base model of the AION UT has more value [space, performance ] than the Dolphin base model at the same price.

The top model of the Dolphin is 50k cheaper and has more torque than UT top model, so this evens out the volume gains of the UT base model. 

 

Source: https://autolifethailand.tv/booking-byd-dolphin-gac-aion-ut-motor-show-2025/

Many agree that EVs need less maintenance than ICEVs. However you don't hear so often that some EV models need extra care of the AC system, more than with ICEVs especially in a hot climate as Thailand. Because these models use the same cooling system to cool the cabin as to cool the battery.

 

I would like to hear and learn from EV owners, who have driven more than 50,000 km, whether they had to clean their EV AC condenser or add refrigerant after driven a certain amount of km. Because their AC made more noise or the car's electricity consumption went up.

 

Please watch as a context these video's. Unfortunately in Thai, but turning subtitles on will help:

 

 

 

 

30 minutes ago, 4myr said:

Many agree that EVs need less maintenance than ICEVs. However you don't hear so often that some EV models need extra care of the AC system, more than with ICEVs especially in a hot climate as Thailand. Because these models use the same cooling system to cool the cabin as to cool the battery.

 

I would like to hear and learn from EV owners, who have driven more than 50,000 km, whether they had to clean their EV AC condenser or add refrigerant after driven a certain amount of km. Because their AC made more noise or the car's electricity consumption went up.

 

Please watch as a context these video's. Unfortunately in Thai, but turning subtitles on will help:

 

 

 

 

MG ZS, Not 50k, but 40k kms, and no maintenance at all, except air in tires & tire rotation at the 20k & 40k check ups.   We clean the in cabin air (PM2.5) filter ourselves, since having a dog, and they have a silly charge to swap it out.  Too easy to do ourselves.

 

Don't think they've done anything, maybe top up brake fluid or window fluid.  Nothing noted anyway, and supposedly they check a long list of things.  All done within 15-30 minutes, except when tires rotated.

 

Check ups every 10k kms, and maybe 4 more to go, maybe, per 8 yr warranty requirement, since we're not racking up the kms like we used to.  Cost <฿2k per check up, and in line with MG's estimated service charge cost in promo, when purchased.

Have a 2023 BYD Atto....a little over 36K kilometers and almost 18 months old....haven't noticed any decrease in A/C cooling performance or increase in noise level....nor increase in fuel/electrons consumption.  Fuel consumption indicator has stayed between 12.6 to 12.8 KWH per 100Km....mostly 12.7KWH/100Km like it's at right now. 

 

Typically the only time the A/C is significantly used to help cool the glycol/water running thru the traction battery cooling plate (as well as the drive motor, radiator, etc)  is on "hot, very sunny" days after driving continuously for around an hour which has given the battery enough time to heat-up enough to require the A/C to assist with the traction battery cooling.    At all other times it's predominately the radiator/heat pump system doing the traction battery glycol/water cooling.   The A/C starts assisting in the traction battery cooling effort in the 35-38C  battery temp ball park on my Atto....that's not ambient temp but the temp of the battery.   The ambient/air temp could be 40C or more but the traction battery could still be significantly lower than that if the car hasn't been drove continuously for around 45 minutes causing the battery to heat-up from current flow....like it had been setting all night in your carport and then you jump in the car a 1pm/hot mid day to do a brief trip which is not a long enough time to cause the battery temp to heat-up significantly due to the battery's BIG thermal mass.

 

EV batteries have such a BIG "thermal mass" it takes them a while to heat-up after cooling completely down like setting overnight....typically just doing daily local drives like say 40Km back and forth to do groceries runs, drop family off, a short drive to work, etc., does not cause the battery to heat-up enough to require cooling above and beyond normal radiator glycol/water cooling capability...the A/C is almost totally used to cool the cabin and not needed to help cool the battery except after running the EV continuously for around 45-60 minutes.  The heat pump system on BYD vehicles works really well for cooling purposes here in Thailand...can't speak to how well it would work to "heat" the car in a cold/snow environment which I'm not expecting to ever see in my Thailand driving.

 

I base this on monitoring OBD2 data that gives extensive battery temperature info (there are 10 temperature probes in my Atto's 60.5KWH traction battery on monitored by OBD2)  Atto extended range and it's pretty obvious when A/C cooling kicks in for the battery.   Below is an OBD2 data snapshot while I was AC/7KW home wall charging my Atto about an hour ago....just before the sun had went down.  As you will see the battery is receiving 6.25KW  of charge with the average traction battery temp of 34C.  That "average" consists of 10 different temp probes spaced every 12 or 14 blade batteries in the Extended Range Atto 127 blade battery pack of 60.5KWH.   And the temp of the water running thru the drive motor was still 55C as I had just finished a 120Km round trip to the mother-in-law's house.    And just because the drive motor is showing a 55C glycol/water temp that does not mean the temp of the glycol/water in the traction battery's cooling plate is 55C due to how the heat pump system system works.....the battery's glycol//water temp was around 34C as in this case the A/C was not running/assisting in the cooling....the magic of a heat pump system.

 

 

18 hours ago, Pib said:

the A/C is almost totally used to cool the cabin and not needed to help cool the battery except after running the EV continuously for around 45-60 minutes. 

Thanks Pib for providing so much detail, this is really interesting. I wonder if the other chines brands also have such sophisticated cooling options as BYD. I see a lot of complaints about Neta V mechanics and aircon, but nothing about battery cooling. This makes me think, they might just not have it.