Illegally denying entry with a tourist visa or visa exempt at an airport?

[Lemsta69]

3 hours ago, Richard 2020 said:

"Or even inappropriate behavior of the traveler."

 

This "reason" is easy to make / find, isn't it???

being a whiny bi-atch falls quite nicely under that clause. immi should involve it more often ????

[Gottfrid]

2 hours ago, FriendlyFarang said:

Sounds like he is staying in Thailand for tourism purposes, so a tourist visa seems appropriate.

You do not need rules and laws to understand the difference in meaning of tourism and staying indefinitely/long stay. Just a portion of common sense.

Hence the different names for different visas/extensions, for different purposes.

Edited July 17, 2022 by Gottfrid

[FriendlyFarang]

Just now, Gottfrid said:

You do not need rules and laws to understand the difference in meaning of tourism and staying indefinitely/long stay. Just a portion of common sense.

Actually you need, because IOs may only deny somebody entry based on rules and laws.

He is asking about entry into Thailand, so obviously he has been out of Thailand, not an indefinite stay in Thailand.

[Gottfrid]

1 minute ago, FriendlyFarang said:

Actually you need, because IOs may only deny somebody entry based on rules and laws.

He is asking about entry into Thailand, so obviously he has been out of Thailand, not an indefinite stay in Thailand.

Sure, still common sense is enough, as I take it as it´s not the first tourist visa for the guy.

[Caldera]

No need to overthink it. Some Thai immigration officers are overzealous. Others take advantage by offering services to alleviate the situation crested by their overzealous colleagues. Some might even be clever enough to be overzealous and enterprising at the same time.

 

As for made up reasons, they know they can get away with it.

 

Corruption plus no rule of law at work.

[chuang]

2 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

That is not corruption, you need to go to school

What school can he goes ????

[JoseThailand]

4 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

That is not corruption, you need to go to school

Look up the definition of corruption in a dictionary.

[BritTim]

8 hours ago, sandyf said:

The legal grounds are exactly that, Thai immigration law.

It is your responsibility to be aware of the applicable laws so why are you asking?

With visa exempt, Immigration have pretty much full discretion on whether to grant you entry. They take the place of consular officials in deciding whether you satisfy the appropriate conditions. On the other hand, Immigration is not supposed to have discretion over whether people should be admitted if they have a visa. When they invent their own reasons for denying entry to those with tourist visas, they are specifically violating Section 12 of the Immigration Act.

[DrJack54]

5 minutes ago, BritTim said:

When they invent their own reasons for denying entry to those with tourist visas, they are specifically violating Section 12 of the Immigration Act.

So what about continuous entries using visa exempt via air. 

 

[JoseThailand]

5 hours ago, FritsSikkink said:

Try to make you buy insurance is their job. If you say no thanks i don't need one, problem solved, you still get the account. 

I said exactly that, but was shown the door. That's why I had to complain to her bosses and make her lose face.

[FriendlyFarang]

8 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

So what about continuous entries using visa exempt via air. 

 

Obviously approved by the Thai government, if the Thai government wouldn't like it they would just limit it, the same way visa exempt entries through land borders are limited.

[Lemsta69]

7 minutes ago, JoseThailand said:

I said exactly that, but was shown the door. That's why I had to complain to her bosses and make her lose face.

ser, you have an attitude problem and clearly don't belong here in LOS. please book a one-way ticket to Utopia asap. 

[Olmate]

28 minutes ago, JoseThailand said:

I said exactly that, but was shown the door. That's why I had to complain to her bosses and make her lose face.

0k.Just you then????

[JoseThailand]

30 minutes ago, Lemsta69 said:

ser, you have an attitude problem and clearly don't belong here in LOS. please book a one-way ticket to Utopia asap. 

The attitude should be - we are just stupid farangs here, we have only one right, which is to pay everyone around, shut up and smile.

 

Or is complaining only reserved to Thai people? They love it so much and complain about almost everything.

Edited July 17, 2022 by JoseThailand

[JoseThailand]

7 minutes ago, Olmate said:

0k.Just you then????

Whatever. I had my account opened, got a personal phone call with apologies and felt like a boss. Btw, the branch I complained about was eventually shut down. I hope it's not because of me haha.

Edited July 17, 2022 by JoseThailand

[JimTripper]

If it happened to me I would tell them I needed to return to the hallway to use the phone/atm.

 

Just keep getting in que for a different officer. In the unlikely event they all ask for the money (or the original officer interferes and takes over the transaction) you would need to pay or fly elsewhere.

 

There's no real "why" here, it was just somebody stretching the rules and wanted a bribe for whatever reason.

 

This goes back to my vetting rule at any immigration line. There are usually several lanes. You need to glance at the officers and back a split second decision on who looks trustworthy and not just get in any line.

 

It's a vibe you get off them and it's not hard to do with some practice. Same thing you would do talking to someone on the steet or wherever. It could convey as someone you just feel you don't like, or someone not acting normally or looking irritated, or inappropriate smirk when handing back the passport to another traveler.  It's your intuition telling you something is wrong and using something you noticed as a tool to let you know.

Edited July 17, 2022 by JimTripper

[JoseThailand]

44 minutes ago, JimTripper said:

If it happened to me I would tell them I needed to return to the hallway to use the phone/atm.

You wouldn't have this option. They would take you to a separate area for interrogation, away from the main booths. And of course they wouldn't allow you to return to the hallway.

[JimTripper]

41 minutes ago, JoseThailand said:

You wouldn't have this option. They would take you to a separate area for interrogation, away from the main booths. And of course they wouldn't allow you to return to the hallway.

Did that really happen to you in Thailand and what was the outcome? Would be very rare.

 

If it did or ever happened anywhere you just pay and get out, sort the complaint later. You don't have rights, you could just rot in jail until the backed up court system figures out what to do months later.

 

I did have it happen to me in Mexico, but there were other people around, other guards, judge etc, not just one officer, and they gave me the option to choose what amount to pay for the "ticket".

Edited July 17, 2022 by JimTripper

[micmichd]

22 hours ago, JoseThailand said:

But why does this tourist visa allow up to 3-month stay? That's way beyond the normal 2-week holiday tourism you're talking about.

2 week holiday may be normal for you. In Germany you can legally claim 6 weeks holiday a year, and if you're smart you can extend it beyond that. 

[sghanchey]

On 7/17/2022 at 7:23 AM, Gottfrid said:

Yep, sure! However, that might just be the department that get 20 out of the hundred. Then everything goes wayward, right?

 

22 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

They can deny entry under chapter 2  section 12 of the immigration act.

"2. Having no appropriate means of living following entrance into the Kingdom."

See: Immigration Act B.E. 2522 English translation

Anyone who thinks the foreigners living in Thailand have "rights" isn't living in the same country as I am. And check around, Immigration officers around the world can deny entry to anyone they choose for reasons that they are not required to provide. In the U.S., a valid visa holder can be denied entry on arrival, and many are if Homeland Security determines that the traveler might stay illegally in the U.S. 

[ifmu]

On 7/17/2022 at 7:30 AM, Olmate said:

And you.declined! Why complain then! 

to stop future problems for others

[Olmate]

14 minutes ago, ifmu said:

to stop future problems for others

Been.known for ever.. Hardly a problem just say no thanx! 

[brianthainess]

On 7/17/2022 at 4:26 AM, JoseThailand said:

we should report it. 

Then do. on 1178.

[JimTripper]

1 minute ago, brianthainess said:

Then do. on 1178.

It's hard to fill out a form with a nightstick in your <deleted>.

[sandyf]

14 hours ago, BritTim said:

When they invent their own reasons for denying entry to those with tourist visas, they are specifically violating Section 12 of the Immigration Act.

That would have to be proven, you are going on the word of those that have probably tried to abuse the system.

[brianthainess]

On 7/17/2022 at 7:27 AM, JoseThailand said:

Sometimes reporting helps. I complained to the Bangkok Bank head office about a branch employee who tried to make me buy an insurance to open an account. The next day they they called me back from the branch, apologized and offered to open an account without an insurance.

You are correct, when i mentioned it on this site, I was contacted e-mailed by a very helpful person quite high up in BKB, I was trying to help an extremely disabled friend open an account, he has MND and has lost the use of his hands, so no way could he sign any docs, so they refused him, even with thumbprint, a BIG SHOUT OUT to you sir. I finished responding with him at around 11 am at 4pm BKB staff turned up at MY house, I took them to see my mate about 3 days later with letter of residence Hey Presto he had an account opened with thumbprint. Again I would like to Sincerely thank you sir for your help, my mate was at his wits end until you sorted it.   

[Tony125]

On 7/17/2022 at 7:32 AM, JoseThailand said:

Because it's corruption. The bank doesn't want to lose a customer because of a corrupt employee.

In the bank case it's not coruption per se. The bank has told the clerks to promote the insurance by offering it to any customers opening an account. In many cases  expats will do it as it is easier than getting  a Thai person to recommend you or running down to get a letter from your embassy to verify your passport or address and in case for USA citizen paying $50 to do that.  I have had  clerks offer me the insurance or extra services when renewing a debit card. 

[scorecard]

On 7/17/2022 at 7:27 AM, JoseThailand said:

Sometimes reporting helps. I complained to the Bangkok Bank head office about a branch employee who tried to make me buy an insurance to open an account. The next day they they called me back from the branch, apologized and offered to open an account without an insurance.

Son had the same experience at one of the big Thai banks on 3 issues:

 

Son already had several savings acounts and wanted one more for a specific purpose. Bank officer stated:

 

- Compulsory to start an insurance befoe you can open new accounts.

- Compulsory to have an ATM card - Regulation supposedly issued by the Bank of Thailand. (Bank staff get a commission for every new ATM card they generate.)

- Customer must sign savings account application form with no details whatever on the form (name, address, Thai ID card etc., etc. ). Bank girl continued, it's a bank rule I cannot enter these details now, I must do it after the bank closes for the day.

 

Son walked out, went to the big Krung Thai branch nearby, new account opened in 5 minutes, forms all totally completed, no push to take insurance or take an ATM card.

 

Son walked out of Krung Thai impressed and now even more angry with his original bank/bank staff. He called the national call centre, the call centre lady asked 'where are you now?' Son responded 'standing on the footpath outside your bank'.

 

Call centre lady listened then politely asked son to please hold the line. A bank snr. quickly came on the line and apologized. Bank snr asked my son to please not hang up, to walk into the bank and insist on speaking to the manager.

 

Son held the line open, walked in and the local manager was waiting inside the door, obviously in panic. Son gave him his phone. Local manager now in even more panic.

 

Local mngr went to the desk on the errant bank officer, told her to instantly get up and wait for him in his nearby glass walled office. Mngr sat down and very quickly completed the transaction for the customer already sitting there.

 

Mngr then said to my son 'I will personally open the new a/c for you immediately'.

 

Son responded 'Never mind, I alredy have a new a/c at Krung Thai and I will go back there tomorrow to transfer all my funds to Krung Thai'.

 

Local bank mngr now in total panic. Son took his phone from the local manager and pressed the button for the speakerphone  facility, son and everybody within earshot now able to hear the bank HO snr.. berating the local manager. 

 

Son did transfer all his funds to Krung Thai. Girl from local original branch dismissed, she had apparently been reported a number of times. 

 

Snr HO guy called my son (my son is well known and well respected in the community) with extended apology.

 

He disclosed that the local manager had also been dismissed.

 

Why? HO was concerned that on several occasions the local manager could not be contacted. The incident with my son had sparked further checking of the local mngr. In fact mid afternoon on the day the 'new account' incident happened the local mngr could not be contacted. Further serious investigation revealed that he was playing golf. 

 

 

 

Edited July 18, 2022 by scorecard

[NoshowJones]

On 7/17/2022 at 7:30 AM, Olmate said:

And you.declined! Why complain then! 

What a silly answer. If any employee of any company in any country tries anything on of course they should be reported.

[FriendlyFarang]

2 hours ago, sghanchey said:

And check around, Immigration officers around the world can deny entry to anyone they choose for reasons that they are not required to provide.

Irrelevant what happens in other countries, in Thailand they can't (legally).