Problem with increasingly aggressive & violent wife

[john donson]

On 7/1/2023 at 3:54 PM, JammG said:

She is not on drugs but I couldn't say about mental health issues but I think she gets a kick out of it. We haven't got on for a while & she spends a lot of time on a webcam chat site called camfrog talking to other men, not that I'm bothered. That's why I said to speak to a lawyer about how we can separate & both look after our son but she is not interested in speaking about anything. 

I have got to the point where I am just going to leave, I can't afford to run two apartments so she will have to look after herself but apparently there are no child abduction laws in Thailand so I can just leave & take my son with me and then take it from there.

when I went to my w-europe embassy

 

they were clear, if I managed to get my child out of TH and back to home country, I would stand trial in home country for... abduction of my child...

 

so better inform you well

 

menopause or just another psycho that played the long game

 

divorce at amphur gives you ZERO rights, except FORCED to leave the country within 7 days after you informed immigration

 

as always the comments are full of keyboard warriors... oh you should never have...blabla, very useful information, NOOOT

 

[john donson]

On 7/1/2023 at 4:16 PM, JammG said:

Yes it is definitely deliberate and she is not involved with anyone else because she is at work all day. But I will not leave my son, like I said if I leave I will take him with me. I was just interested to hear if anyone else had ever been in a similar situation and what happened.

at work, so she says

 

mine pretend to work late or late office meetings...

 

you probably cannot leave TH anyway  with your kid, as airport immigration will ask a letter from amphur signed by the mother and her telephone number...

 

time to get real...

 

if you cannot afford a 2nd condo, you also don't have a million for elite

 

so, realistically... time to say goodbye to the kid...

 

[RedCardinal]

5 hours ago, NORDO said:

If your son has a passport and you are legal parent, take him and go back to your home country, before she goes off the deep end.   If she follows you, then you can report her to your local authorities and they will protect the child.

Clearly written with zero knowledge of how dimly most countries (esp. developed) look on international child abduction.  The Hague Convention provides a robust framework to hold international child abductors responsible.  Not to mention, obvious lack of experience of a single parent trying to take a 4yo child through Thai airport Immigration without the other parent's consent (regardless of passport issuing country). 

 

Follow this advice and you're running a reasonable risk of ending up in prison and/or losing access to your child.  

[glegolo18]

On 7/1/2023 at 2:05 PM, JammG said:

Any sensible replies are welcome & thanks in advance. 

As soon as a partner lose respect for the other one, it is time to leave, and leave without hesitence and maybe even not saying goodbye, especially here in Thailand. Do not be a whimp... there is no past to weep over, it is just a lousy future, if you continue this crappy journey.....

 

Like Paul Simon sang and maybe still sings; "still crazy after all these years"???

L E A V E....

Edited July 3, 2023 by glegolo18

[bannork]

Have you talked to her parents?

[paddypower]

4 hours ago, thailand49 said:

Of course that is a generalization from your own experience. Most lawyers are as you say especially big egos readon we joke the only good lawyer is a dead one. But in the end you pay their bill you make the decision obviously when it came to investment you made the wrong choice so blame yourself and not all. On this guy topic he isn't investing I say international first and foremost to the English is good enough so it can be explain to him what he should do and expect. If money is the object only and he wants to go cheap get a Thai lawyer who can't communicate what is happening just want the money where does that leave him yes in the dark wondering!

This isn't investing or big ego it is dealing with a child life that itself you should remove yourself from the topic since you more concern about your own bad experience. 

very true, the custody of the child come first. conseqqqqquently he needs a lawyer with a track record of success. All I am saying is (if you can ignore our groups  experience with 4 sets of international lawyers) - he should find the lawyer who will win him custody. Thai or international is irrelevant. what is relevant is that he and the law firm can communicate effectively).

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by paddypower
spell

[Sigma6]

On 7/1/2023 at 9:05 AM, JammG said:

I have spoken to her about divorce before but she only wants to go to the amphur without any lawyer present and refuses to talk to anyone about it.

Isnt this all thats required for a divorce? so it means she's willing to divorce.
You wish to contest custody, maybe if you talk about she will let you look after the kid

[xtrnuno41]

Some reasons were mentioned, like menopause and drugs.

And I thought my self , maybe she had a brain attack or even maybe a cancer growing, brain tumor. A brain attack can happen and you dont instantly know about it. Or dementia could also start kicking in.

Busy in chatting on line with men.

Never the less still above things can be working, but also long time passed issues can come up and now activated in brain, somehow, resulting in bad behavior. You never know how the brain, thoughts are working.

Had a college, after several promotions, lost his job. At the same time he was in a divorce. I thought he was quite rational. However decided to commit suicide. Really incredible and not understandable, however pop goes the brain.

 

I ve met people, changing on a severe blow of the head and vulnerable to that. Even were in coma, but changed a lot.

 

I wouldnt care about anyone telling me what to do and leave WITH son.

Maybe you can handle, but your son will be damaged. Get out, stay, kick her out. Get new locks and finish all.

I ve met also quite some weird situations, but had to finish it myself and go on again. No fun, but a necessity. 

The future is not written, anything can happen. So wouldnt worry about that, you are living now! Think about your visa and how to handle that if you are on a married visa! Way more important for you and your son.

[atpeace]

The OP seems to have no savings and is not making much money.  Not an insult - just stating my thoughts without really knowing him.  His options are limited and don't bolt with the kid unless you are sincerely worried she may harm him physically.

 

Living on the edge financially with a wife that is mentally unstable has to be terrible.  I would leave and get your head back together and start over.  Have a plan about the kid that works for you but in the end "get out".  My gut is also telling me that there is much more to this story...

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

On 7/1/2023 at 3:54 PM, JammG said:

apparently there are no child abduction laws in Thailand so I can just leave & take my son with me and then take it from there.

I don't know about whether what you say above about child abduction laws in Thailand is correct or not. Where are you getting that advice from?

 

But, either way, while I understand your concern about the safety of your son, I'd be more than a little worried about a farang parent suddenly taking off with a Thai child absent the permission/consent of the Thai mother/parent?

 

I believe, history here tends to suggest that the Thai authorities tend to give custody preference to the Thai mother over the farang father, at least as a starting proposition. And I'd be worried you mind ultimately find yourself in jail were the mother to object to you unilaterally leaving with the son and go to the police about it.

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[thailand49]

3 hours ago, paddypower said:

very true, the custody of the child come first. conseqqqqquently he needs a lawyer with a track record of success. All I am saying is (if you can ignore our groups  experience with 4 sets of international lawyers) - he should find the lawyer who will win him custody. Thai or international is irrelevant. what is relevant is that he and the law firm can communicate effectively).

 

Then you should have just said that the first time. 

Let me clarify something in regards to the use of the word International and to be clear a generalization from my own experience being here close to twenty years. 

When it comes to lawyers in Thailand I been around lots of them and I wish there wasn't ever a need.

In the beginning my luck maybe curse I had a bunch of problems Thailand not being my country like everyone I didn't come looking for trouble but never the less I ran into it.  I try my best to go with the system got recommended a pretty big Thai law firm no problem communicating  but the case took a bit too long for my taste in the end through my own contact found out the lawyer had play both side although in the end the case was taken over with a new International firm with some top Thai Lawyers the case was won. As for the old lawyer it didn't go well for him. I once even got a list of Lawyers from my Embassy I went down the list and interview each one in the end next time I went back to the Embassy for business I let one of the top representative I spoke to better burn that damn list there wasn't one Thai lawyer on the list worth talking too. 

Years now through family in HK,  connections in Thailand I use a particular firm it is International with plenty of Thai lawyers who I can communicate and very satisfied so not all related International is bad.  Although I haven't met a Thai Lawyer worth the time of day not working for a International firm I'm still open to always listening and giving them a chance as you noted results is what matter whether they hang a International label on their door I agree track record and results is what matters especially in this case. 

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by thailand49

[pacovl46]

On 7/1/2023 at 9:05 AM, JammG said:

I live with my Thai wife and 4 year old son in a rented apartment in bkk & we was married at the local amphur, I have a situation now where my wife is becoming more and more aggressive and violent often breaking things in the apartment.

The police have been called before and they didn't do anything, not even looked at our smashed up room. Luckily I recorded the last time she went berserk on video and have taken pics & have i been to the police to record any incidents & have received reports. Actually the police have said to leave her if she keeps doing it.

 

I have spoken to her about divorce before but she only wants to go to the amphur without any lawyer present and refuses to talk to anyone about it. My son is scared of her outbursts as she often targets his toys a lot to break, anyway from speaking to people I gather there is no reason I can't take my son away from where we currently live for his safety.

She contributes very little to my son anyway, I pay for his schooling & everything else & she just works to pay off her depts.

I'm just wondering if there is anyone out there that has any advice or has experienced something similar, if I do take my son with me obviously I am worried about how she will react & what could happen in the future. 

Any sensible replies are welcome & thanks in advance. 

Divorce her because the chances of her improving her behavior are probably very slim and it's not worth the hassle. 

[sikishrory]

You should 100% be focusing on divorce and getting away.

I've been in similar situations where I've had to hide the knives or call security but not regularly like this.

Talk to a lawyer.

She don't like lawyer then too bad.

Also in these relationships sometimes you get stuck thinking you can fix it or oh I love her still etc.

Forget that.

Get out before she hurts someone.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 7/3/2023 at 7:30 PM, john donson said:

divorce at amphur gives you ZERO rights, except FORCED to leave the country within 7 days after you informed immigration

Depends on the extension.

 

I had non O based on marriage but extended based on retirement. No problem staying on after I got divorced, which I did for a year, with a few exits and re entries and one extension.

I didn't "inform" immigration as they would have it on record ( marriage and divorce ).

 

[thaibeachlovers]

On 7/4/2023 at 2:39 AM, sikishrory said:

You should 100% be focusing on divorce and getting away.

I've been in similar situations where I've had to hide the knives or call security but not regularly like this.

Talk to a lawyer.

She don't like lawyer then too bad.

Also in these relationships sometimes you get stuck thinking you can fix it or oh I love her still etc.

Forget that.

Get out before she hurts someone.

My takeaway on lawyers in Thailand is that a farang is more likely to pay a lot and get nothing for it. The only time I used a lawyer was for a will.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 7/3/2023 at 9:25 PM, glegolo18 said:

As soon as a partner lose respect for the other one, it is time to leave, and leave without hesitence and maybe even not saying goodbye, especially here in Thailand. Do not be a whimp... there is no past to weep over, it is just a lousy future, if you continue this crappy journey.....

 

Like Paul Simon sang and maybe still sings; "still crazy after all these years"???

L E A V E....

Reason leaves the room when "love" comes in. Don't underestimate the power of hope in keeping on with a toxic relationship.

 

[bannork]

I'm repeating myself but I'd like the OP to consider:

Can you talk to her parents, brothers or sisters about her behaviour?  

[JammG]

She has no contact with any family, I think her mum and dad are estranged, she has a brother I met once but she never contact with him. I have been reading the comments & guess I need to get more evidence & more advice. From the few lawyers I have spoken to they say that I am well within my rights to take my son out of the situation if I feel we are in danger. So I'm a bit perplexed by all the 'you are just a farang they will take her side' comments but as I said I shall keep gathering evidence and get as much advice as I can.

[glegolo18]

On 7/5/2023 at 6:56 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

Reason leaves the room when "love" comes in. Don't underestimate the power of hope in keeping on with a toxic relationship.

 

Yes, but I can NEVER understand all these guys that stay on in a relationship with a girl (falang or whatever girl) when she starts to get disrespectful. I strongly believe when that happens, out with the garbage and just leave and never looking back.... Have been there and done that, and never regreted a single thing... Best I ever did...

[Yellowtail]

Am I the only one not buying any of this? 

[fredwiggy]

On 7/1/2023 at 7:01 PM, JammG said:

Yes I'm on his birth certificate, some good questions so far. I don't know for sure she is at work all the time. My son is at school & I can work then & do some in the evening, I also have no intention of taking him out of Thailand I like it here, there are worse places to live.

My immigration status isn't a problem and I have already been to the police to document the various incidents, actually a question I would like to make is how do I press charges or make a prosecution at a police station? Because so far all the police have done is document the various incidents and given me a copy. Maybe I can have her charged for the smashed TV etc?

And yes she has picked up a knife before, as I say I think getting out and then dealing with the consequences after maybe the way to go. 

Best thing you could do is talk to her about letting you live elsewhere, not far away from her, with your son. Asking for the divorce and custody of your son and maybe offering her a counter offer if she's hesitant like a one time cash offer. She has to sign custody to you for that. Or just go to court and get a mutually agreed on divorce with joint custody is she doesn't want to sign over the child. You will have your own life, get to see your son, and keep documenting anything in case she still goes off. The police will not help you unless they are there and see something happening. Making a report that will be buried won't help until you go to court.  If there isn't a fight for the divorce or custody you don't have a problem. The judge will decide everything if there is any fight. The woman will get main custody unless it is proven she is hurting the child or doing drugs with him there. Cheating is very hard to prove and to a judge it doesn't make her a bad mom. You will get visitation of every weekend at least or whatever you can negotiate if you want more. As a foreigner you will be asked for child support. Since you like it here, this isn't a major problem.  I wanted custody of my daughter but my ex wasn't doing anything illegal as far as I knew so the judge gave her primary custody. I talked with 5 attorneys, including a farang, and they all said the same things. If you can settle this without an attorney, all the better. If you are not retired age, you will have to get a visa for a dependent, which you will because you have proof of being his parent. If you were retired, you could get a retirement visa to stay.

Edited July 7, 2023 by fredwiggy

[fredwiggy]

On 7/3/2023 at 7:12 PM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

I don't know about whether what you say above about child abduction laws in Thailand is correct or not. Where are you getting that advice from?

 

But, either way, while I understand your concern about the safety of your son, I'd be more than a little worried about a farang parent suddenly taking off with a Thai child absent the permission/consent of the Thai mother/parent?

 

I believe, history here tends to suggest that the Thai authorities tend to give custody preference to the Thai mother over the farang father, at least as a starting proposition. And I'd be worried you mind ultimately find yourself in jail were the mother to object to you unilaterally leaving with the son and go to the police about it.

 

As Britman mentioned, you both have custody and can leave anytime you want with your son, as long as you don't leave Thailand. My ex did it 4  times, and I had to file for a divorce to get my child back here. It's wrong, and is basically parental kidnapping, and if it was done in the US, you would go to jail and lose custody. Here they don't have the same justice system, and its prejudiced more towards women. In America, I fought for custody and won.

Edited July 7, 2023 by fredwiggy

[john donson]

On 7/7/2023 at 10:52 AM, glegolo18 said:

Yes, but I can NEVER understand all these guys that stay on in a relationship with a girl (falang or whatever girl) when she starts to get disrespectful. I strongly believe when that happens, out with the garbage and just leave and never looking back.... Have been there and done that, and never regreted a single thing... Best I ever did...

you must be a cold sociopath if you can just pretend your child never existed and leave not to be found, but hey, the forum is full of it....

[glegolo18]

4 hours ago, john donson said:

you must be a cold sociopath if you can just pretend your child never existed and leave not to be found, but hey, the forum is full of it....

I was merely responded to the post, which you can see, that talked about the people who live their selfdestructing lifes, and spend year after year in garbage-relationship, and never seems to have the power to get out....... The child is another thing, which either one of us know anything at all about....

[steven100]

On 7/3/2023 at 4:34 PM, bannork said:

Have you talked to her parents?

That would be a waste of time ,   what can they contribute  ?  nothing ....... they'll support her not the farang that's for damn sure.    they won't understand or speak an ounce of English anyway ..