Trump vows to end ‘madness’ of EV push

[Social Media]

 

Former President Trump is vowing to end the “madness” of the Biden administration’s push for electric vehicles — a likely appeal to voters in the swing state of Michigan.

In a pair of Truth Social posts Monday evening, Trump took aim at the electric vehicle industry and President Biden’s push for more electric vehicles. With this opposition to electric vehicles, Trump is likely trying to persuade Michigan voters to support him over Biden, who carried the swing state in 2020.

“The Great State of Michigan will not have an auto industry anymore if Crooked Joe Biden’s crazed concept of ‘all Electric Cars’ goes into effect,” he wrote in the Truth Social post. “CHINA WILL TAKE IT ALL, 100%. United Auto Workers, VOTE FOR TRUMP. Get your leaders to ENDORSE ME, I WILL KEEP ALL OF THESE GREAT JOBS, AND BRING IN MANY MORE. CHOICE IN SCHOOLS, AND CHOICE IN CARS!!!”

In 2021, Michigan was home to more than 175,000 auto manufacturing jobs, according to a report from nonprofit research center Mackinac Center for Public Policy. While that number is still higher than any other state, the report noted it’s also only 37 percent of the jobs Michigan had at its peak.

The Biden administration has pushed to boost electric car sales, with the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) predicting that two-thirds of new car sales could be electric by 2032 under a new proposal released by the administration earlier this year. Last week, the Energy Department announced plans to invest $12 billion into converting auto manufacturing facilities into plants for hybrid and electric vehicles.

 

FULL STORY

[BritManToo]

Trump has a lot of common sense!

Those batteries are all sourced from China.

I remember they laughed when he told the Germans not to rely on Russian gas.

Giving your enemies power over your country is never a smart move.

Edited September 6, 2023 by BritManToo

[Chomper Higgot]

Trump thinks he can outsmart market forces.

 

[Tug]

Ahh trump what a gem (not) aren’t a lot of ev built here to qualify for the tax deduction?

[Jingthing]

Better to end the madness of that insurrectionist traitor being allowed on voting ballots!

[thaibeachlovers]

Another reason to vote Trump.

[Chomper Higgot]

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Another reason to vote Trump.

What because you too believe he can outsmart market forces or because he’s telling you what you want to hear regardless of his promise being impossible to deliver?

[JonnyF]

I'm no fan of Trump but he's bang on the money here.

 

Chinese manufactured EV's are not the answer to the dubious claims of the eco warriors. Even if the doomsday cult of climate alarmism had some merit (which it doesn't), switching from mining for gas/coal to mining for precious metals (and then charging the batteries made of those precious metals with electricity primarily generated from gas/coal) is a ridiculous concept.

 

[LosLobo]

20 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Trump has a lot of common sense!

Those batteries are all sourced from China.

I remember they laughed when he told the Germans not to rely on Russian gas.

Giving your enemies power over your country is never a smart move.

You need to keep up, Biden is addressing those very issues.

 

Common Sense Biden who 'walks the talk' will 'make available $3.5 billion in funding to expand domestic manufacturing of batteries for electric vehicles'.

 

Biden-Harris Administration Announces $15.5 Billion to Support a Strong and Just Transition to Electric Vehicles, Retooling Existing Plants, and Rehiring Existing Workers | Department of Energy

[retarius]

Just end the subsidies for EVs. That will stop EVs dead in their tracks. EVs are not that much good for the environment and the CO2 savings are minimal at best. Also from the point of view of the child labour and exploitation, they are an abomination. You are just changing one set of bad environmental issues for others ie despoliation of the planet in the search for rare earths.

[Tug]

20 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

What because you too believe he can outsmart market forces or because he’s telling you what you want to hear regardless of his promise being impossible to deliver?

He’s not American he can’t vote but he does his best to undermine America and support comrade putin

35 minutes ago, LosLobo said:

You need to keep up, Biden is addressing those very issues.

 

Common Sense Biden who 'walks the talk' will 'make available $3.5 billion in funding to expand domestic manufacturing of batteries for electric vehicles'.

 

Biden-Harris Administration Announces $15.5 Billion to Support a Strong and Just Transition to Electric Vehicles, Retooling Existing Plants, and Rehiring Existing Workers | Department of Energy

Touché mr bendeho that Joe Biden is one remarkable far sighted president or as I like to say one magnificent old duffer!im planning on taking advantage of that ev tax credit and get one as our second car once I exhaust the tax credit for installing solar on my San Diego house.my electric bill went from 300+$ per month to 19$ this month (with the ac running 12 hrs per day)sweet!!!

[placeholder]

43 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

I'm no fan of Trump but he's bang on the money here.

 

Chinese manufactured EV's are not the answer to the dubious claims of the eco warriors. Even if the doomsday cult of climate alarmism had some merit (which it doesn't), switching from mining for gas/coal to mining for precious metals (and then charging the batteries made of those precious metals with electricity primarily generated from gas/coal) is a ridiculous concept.

 

What's ridiculous is the fact that you compare mining material for batteries to mining for fuel. Unlike fossil fuels, you don't need to continuously mine to feed a battery, do you? Batteries are also highly recyclable. And they are lasting far longer in autos than originally predicted. Also, they are finding a second life in energy storage systems for the grid.  The scarcity is so pronounced that the biggest problem facing battery recycling facilities is that they aren't receiving enough batteries to recycle.

 

And the argument about batteries using fuel generated from fossil fuels is also faulty.

 

YSE Study Finds Electric Vehicles Provide Lower Carbon Emissions Through Additional Channels

With new major spending packages investing billions of dollars in electric vehicles in the U.S., some analysts have raised concerns over how green the electric vehicle industry actually is, focusing particularly on indirect emissions caused within the supply chains of the vehicle components and the fuels used to power electricity that charges the vehicles.

But a recent study from the Yale School of the Environment published in Nature Communications found that the total indirect emissions from electric vehicles pale in comparison to the indirect emissions from fossil fuel-powered vehicles. This is in addition to the direct emissions from combusting fossil fuels — either at the tailpipe for conventional vehicles or at the power plant smokestack for electricity generation — showing electric vehicles have a clear advantage emissions-wise over conventional vehicles.

https://environment.yale.edu/news/article/yse-study-finds-electric-vehicles-provide-lower-carbon-emissions-through-additional#:~:text=But a recent study from,from fossil fuel-powered vehicles.

 

Also, there is a huge installed base of power generated by fossil fuel. But the percentage of power provided by wind and solar is rapidly increasing. Now if you know of a magic spell that can transform fossil fuel power plants into recyclable sources, please share that with the world. 

[BritManToo]

52 minutes ago, LosLobo said:

You need to keep up, Biden is addressing those very issues.

 

Common Sense Biden who 'walks the talk' will 'make available $3.5 billion in funding to expand domestic manufacturing of batteries for electric vehicles'.

 

Biden-Harris Administration Announces $15.5 Billion to Support a Strong and Just Transition to Electric Vehicles, Retooling Existing Plants, and Rehiring Existing Workers | Department of Energy

Didn't know they mined Lithium in the USA.

[placeholder]

46 minutes ago, retarius said:

Just end the subsidies for EVs. That will stop EVs dead in their tracks. EVs are not that much good for the environment and the CO2 savings are minimal at best. Also from the point of view of the child labour and exploitation, they are an abomination. You are just changing one set of bad environmental issues for others ie despoliation of the planet in the search for rare earths.

As noted above your argument about EVs being just as polluting as ICE vehicles is false. And the CO2 savings ae substantial. You'll also be happy to know that the use of cobalt is being sharply cut back because of improvements in Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries which don't contain cobalt.   And Tesla has announced that it will be producing magnets that have no need for rare earths. Also, you don't seem to recognize the drastically bad effects that ICE vehicles have on air quality and human health. 

[placeholder]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Didn't know they mined Lithium in the USA.

They do. Currently just one small in Nevada. However, another is on the way:

https://www.eenews.net/articles/silicon-valley-of-lithium-nevada-mine-breaks-ground/

 

But the Salton Sea has huge potential via big lithium deposits and available geothermal energy. It alone could provide enough lithium to power the US and have left over a significant capacity to help supply the world with lithium.

https://insideclimatenews.org/news/26082023/salton-sea-lithium-mining-california/#:~:text=The aquifers near the Salton,a geothermal energy waste product.

 

Already, lithium is being extracted from other geothermal sites:

 

https://www.brgm.fr/en/current-project/eugeli-lithium-extraction-geothermal-brines-europe

 

https://www.globalminingreview.com/environment-sustainability/15052023/watercycle-technologies-produces-lithium-carbonate-from-geothermal-brines-in-the-north-east-of-england/#:~:text=Watercycle Technologies Ltd%2C a UK,the North East of England.

[JonnyF]

11 minutes ago, placeholder said:

What's ridiculous is the fact that you compare mining material for batteries to mining for fuel. Unlike fossil fuels, you don't need to continuously mine to feed a battery, do you? Batteries are also highly recyclable. And they are lasting far longer in autos than originally predicted. Also, they are finding a second life in energy storage systems for the grid.  The scarcity is so pronounced that the biggest problem facing battery recycling facilities is that they aren't receiving enough batteries to recycle.

 

And the argument about batteries using fuel generated from fossil fuels is also faulty.

 

YSE Study Finds Electric Vehicles Provide Lower Carbon Emissions Through Additional Channels

With new major spending packages investing billions of dollars in electric vehicles in the U.S., some analysts have raised concerns over how green the electric vehicle industry actually is, focusing particularly on indirect emissions caused within the supply chains of the vehicle components and the fuels used to power electricity that charges the vehicles.

But a recent study from the Yale School of the Environment published in Nature Communications found that the total indirect emissions from electric vehicles pale in comparison to the indirect emissions from fossil fuel-powered vehicles. This is in addition to the direct emissions from combusting fossil fuels — either at the tailpipe for conventional vehicles or at the power plant smokestack for electricity generation — showing electric vehicles have a clear advantage emissions-wise over conventional vehicles.

https://environment.yale.edu/news/article/yse-study-finds-electric-vehicles-provide-lower-carbon-emissions-through-additional#:~:text=But a recent study from,from fossil fuel-powered vehicles.

 

Also, there is a huge installed base of power generated by fossil fuel. But the percentage of power provided by wind and solar is rapidly increasing. Now if you know of a magic spell that can transform fossil fuel power plants into recyclable sources, please share that with the world. 

You might want to check out what is involved in mining for metals for your precious batteries.

 

https://borgenproject.org/child-labor-in-cobalt-mines/

 

Recycling isn't as easy as your throwaway comment "Batteries are also highly recyclable" would suggest. It's an extremely complicated process even if the will is there to do it.

 

https://www.science.org/content/article/millions-electric-cars-are-coming-what-happens-all-dead-batteries

 

Of course, in many countries they won't even attempt the process and it will end up as landfill.

[BritManToo]

Just now, JonnyF said:

Recycling isn't as easy as your throwaway comment "Batteries are also highly recyclable" would suggest. It's an extremely complicated process even if the will is there to do it.

I've got 4 'fat' old 100ah lifepo4 batteries, can't find anywhere to take/dump them.

 

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, JonnyF said:

You might want to check out what is involved in mining for metals for your precious batteries.

 

https://borgenproject.org/child-labor-in-cobalt-mines/

 

Recycling isn't as easy as your throwaway comment "Batteries are also highly recyclable" would suggest. It's an extremely complicated process even if the will is there to do it.

 

https://www.science.org/content/article/millions-electric-cars-are-coming-what-happens-all-dead-batteries

 

Of course, in many countries they won't even attempt the process and it will end up as landfill.

Welcome on board the environment and human rights bus.

 

I look forward to reading your future support for environmental and human rights issues.

 

 

[LosLobo]

21 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Didn't know they mined Lithium in the USA.

You learn something new every day!

[bbko]

1 hour ago, JonnyF said:

I'm no fan of Trump but he's bang on the money here.

 

Chinese manufactured EV's are not the answer to the dubious claims of the eco warriors.

So a smart person would see the future and improve on what's available now and collect million$.

No one is saying the China is the only option when it comes to EVs.

[JonnyF]

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Welcome on board the environment and human rights bus.

 

I look forward to reading your future support for environmental and human rights issues.

 

 

Been on it for years. I have planted over 300 large trees on my farm in Korat and grow over 25 different types of fruit and vegetables, much of which is donated to local people. All organic.

 

What are you doing apart from trolling posts like the one above?

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Been on it for years. I have planted over 300 large trees on my farm in Korat and grow over 25 different types of fruit and vegetables, much of which is donated to local people. All organic.

 

What are you doing apart from trolling posts like the one above?

Sorry, I was simply welcoming your environmental and human rights input, now and future.

 

Well done with your tree planting/donations.

[placeholder]

2 hours ago, JonnyF said:

You might want to check out what is involved in mining for metals for your precious batteries.

 

https://borgenproject.org/child-labor-in-cobalt-mines/

 

Recycling isn't as easy as your throwaway comment "Batteries are also highly recyclable" would suggest. It's an extremely complicated process even if the will is there to do it.

 

https://www.science.org/content/article/millions-electric-cars-are-coming-what-happens-all-dead-batteries

 

Of course, in many countries they won't even attempt the process and it will end up as landfill.

As I noted above, new improved Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries are making rapid inroads into the EV market. They don't use cobalt. And other technologies are on the way. And you ignore the issue of comparative harm. Where's you sympathy for the millions upon millions of urban dwellers whose health is brutally effected by emissions from EVs. Believe it or not, cities aren't exclusively inhabited by adults.

 

Chapter Seven - Traffic Emission Impacts on Child Health and Well-being

"Traffic-related primary pollutants known to impact health include highly respirable fine and ultrafine particles, diesel exhaust particles and gases, particle-bound metals and carcinogens including volatile organic compounds like benzene and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. Consistent and compelling scientific evidence suggests prenatal and childhood exposures to primary traffic emissions can cause onset and exacerbation of asthma, delayed lung function development, and childhood leukemia."

https://cfpub.epa.gov/si/si_public_record_report.cfm?Lab=CEMM&dirEntryId=348269#:~:text=Consistent and compelling scientific evidence,function development%2C and childhood leukemia.

 

 

As for that article from science. it's already badly dated. Here's something from the CEO of Redfern, the largest U.S. battery recycler:

 

We’re not profitable yet because we’re growing so quickly and we’re reinvesting and will be for quite a few years. But the actual operations of recycling these batteries, that is profitable today. There’s really a quite a hunger for these materials."

https://insideevs.com/news/564366/jb-straubel-battery-recycling-profitability/

 

 

Electric Car Batteries Lasting Longer Than Predicted Delays Recycling Programs

It’s clear that most EV batteries will outlast the vehicles they were installed in, and even then, they have a worthwhile second life before they need to be stripped down for recycling.

“At the end of the vehicle’s life—15 or 20 years down the road—you take the battery out of the car, and it’s still healthy, with perhaps 60 or 70% of usable charge,” said Thomas...

 It’s more sustainable to take the battery pack out of the car after 20 years, recycle the car, and reuse the battery.”

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2022/08/01/electric-car-batteries-lasting-longer-than-predicted-delays-recycling-programs/?sh=4b0ff8725332

 

[bendejo]

What madness you talkin' 'bout, boss?  You ain't makin' stoopid stuff up agin, are ya?

 

[JonnyF]

4 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Sorry, I was simply welcoming your environmental and human rights input, now and future.

Apology accepted.

 

4 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Well done with your tree planting/donations.

Thanks. Maybe you could follow my example and do something positive instead of pontificating on here all day? Just a thought....

[Walker88]

That's right, donny. We need more diesel ! More coal ! And those yearly car inspections that check for toxic emissions? Waste of money.

 

We all need to be able to chew the air we breathe. No grit, no spit ! Put THAT on a hat made in China.

[Chomper Higgot]

8 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Apology accepted.

 

Thanks. Maybe you could follow my example and do something positive instead of pontificating on here all day? Just a thought....

I do some things I regard as positive, I’ve mentioned them on this forum before, but got accused of ‘virtue signaling’.

 

So I don’t mention those things so much these days.

[LS24]

22 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Trump has a lot of common sense!

Those batteries are all sourced from China.

I remember they laughed when he told the Germans not to rely on Russian gas.

Giving your enemies power over your country is never a smart move.

 

Source Volt Resources.

 

This is just in US currently . Manufacture in Europe is amazing. So what you say about China being the source of all batteries holds no water.

 

 

[bbko]

2 minutes ago, LS24 said:

 

Source Volt Resources.

 

This is just in US currently . Manufacture in Europe is amazing. So what you say about China being the source of all batteries holds no water.

 

 

But but but Biden, Hillary, Obama, waaaaaa.

[LS24]

48 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Didn't know they mined Lithium in the USA.

New lithium mine in Belgium from European Minerals is about to float on the NASDAQ with an American SPAC to form critical metals. BMW have already signed an agreement for supply.

But to answer your question specifically. There is Lithium mining in the US right now. https://www.lithiumamericas.com/usa/thacker-pass/