ISRAEL IS AT WAR !

[freeworld]

Netanyahu: March 19 2015

 

''There will be no Palestinian state''

[Morch]

1 hour ago, simple1 said:

US Secretary of State Antony Blinken said on Saturday both Washington and Arab states believe the status quo of a Hamas-controlled Gaza cannot continue and that he has discussed with his Arab counterparts how to chart a better path forward towards a two-state solution.

 

Blinken: US, Arab states agree Hamas-controlled status quo in Gaza cannot continue (msn.com)

 

As far as I understand, that's one way of putting things - other reports suggest Arab representatives refused to discuss Gaza's future so long as the fighting goes on (linked elsewhere).

[paddypower]

4 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

This has already been discussed in great detail and numerous posts many pages ago, you should go and check

267 pages and i just joined the thread. Best to just ignore me if I'm adding nothing extra. 55

[Morch]

50 minutes ago, freeworld said:

Supporting killing of children is not good. How many more must die for you.

 

Hamas could stop this immediately - release hostages, surrender.

Hamas could protect them children - they do not allow them the safety of their tunnels.

You don't seem to have much of an issue with them sacrificing their own children.

[Nick Carter icp]

4 minutes ago, TimeMachine said:

It's looking like if Trump isn't thrown in jail he will continue on to win the presidency and I'm thinking he will be on the side of Israel quite strongly which will exacerbate the region fighting. Whereas he will  most likely settle down the Russian Ukraine dispute. Fair reasoning?

 

 

   Are you still thinking about Trump ?

[Bkk Brian]

1 minute ago, paddypower said:

267 pages and i just joined the thread. Best to just ignore me if I'm adding nothing extra. 55

Up to you, but maybe you should have researched a little better first:

 

Why Did Netanyahu Want to Strengthen Hamas?

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-11/ty-article/.premium/netanyahu-needed-a-strong-hamas/0000018b-1e9f-d47b-a7fb-bfdfd8f30000

https://archive.ph/s6BuA

[Morch]

34 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   No war crimes have been committed by Israel  though , so they would get a not guilty verdict in a trial .

   Hamas on the other hand have committed numerous war crimes , numbered in their thousands, tens of thousands even 

 

The first one is not a fact.

The second is.

 

[Morch]

28 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Whenever Israel is being criticized 'hamas apologists' comes up. Which is nonsense, no one is apologizing for what Hamas did on 7/10, but it is really easy on your conscience to simply dismiss Israeli misdeeds this way.

 

But you have no issues with the opposite leveled the other way around.

Have been at it, in the past, quite often, actually.

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

The first one is not a fact.

The second is.

 

 

  What  war crimes have been committed by Israel ?

[proton]

3 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Hamas could stop this immediately - release hostages, surrender.

Hamas could protect them children - they do not allow them the safety of their tunnels.

You don't seem to have much of an issue with them sacrificing their own children.

 

Hamas love kiddies being killed or even crying on top of rubble with a dirty face, great for their crude emotion twisting propaganda, which is all over the place. If only they put as much effort into protecting them rather than exploiting them there would not be as much collateral damage.

[freeworld]

3 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  What  war crimes have been committed by Israel ?

The UN inquiry are receiving reports and are investigating them.

 

''Commission of Inquiry collecting evidence of war crimes committed by all sides in Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories since 7 October 2023''

[Morch]

11 minutes ago, freeworld said:

Netanyahu: March 19 2015

 

''There will be no Palestinian state''

 

Wow, a single line quote, daring 8 years back without a source? Now that's what I call a winning argument, not to mention the in-depth insight on display.

 

Enjoy:

 

To Bar Ilan and back: Benjamin Netanyahu’s changing views on a Palestinian state

https://www.timesofisrael.com/to-bar-ilan-and-back-benjamin-netanyahus-changing-views-on-a-palestinian-state/

 

Netanyahu's election slogan in 2008 was about dismantling Hamas rule in Gaza. Not only this never happened, or attempted, Netanyahu even facilitated the transfer of Qatari funds to the Gaza Strip.

 

He says a whole lot of things. Kinda like Trump.

 

[Nick Carter icp]

Just now, freeworld said:

The UN inquiry are receiving reports and are investigating them.

 

''Commission of Inquiry collecting evidence of war crimes committed by all sides in Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories since 7 October 2023''

 

   What evidence do they have about Israel allegedly committing war crimes and what were they ?

[stevenl]

8 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

But you have no issues with the opposite leveled the other way around.

Have been at it, in the past, quite often, actually.

I do, but they don't personally attack me. 

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, stevenl said:

I do, but they don't personally attack me. 

Who personally attacked you when you responded to me?

[Wobblybob]

Just now, paddypower said:

quite true that ''some Palestinians'' hate Israel. But a slim majority do not support Hamas, altho' it misleads many into terrorism. Eradicate Hamas (but how?) but don't destroy a civilization that has been subjected to colonialism and apartheid for a century. That is not even the main issue, which is the little known fact about why Netanyahu helped fund Hamas. I suggest, with respect, that you inform yourself about something has been censored by most of the western press (excepting the Guardian). If you wish, here are 2 pro-Israeli news sites that : Haazar.com and <https://www.indiatoday.in/world/story/israel-helped-funnel-qatar-money-to-fund-hamas-netanyahu-palestinian-state-gaza-war-2456157-2023-11-01> .

The facts are that Hamas started this war, killed babies, anally gang raped women so bad they bled before they were slaughtered, killed whole families, burnt families to death and the rest of the sadistic crimes.

Israel gives the Palestinians a warning as to where they intend to bomb so they can move to safety, it is not the fault of the Israeli's if Hamas are using them as a human shields, Israel first concern is the safety of their own citizens.

What is Israel supposed to do give them a slap on the wrists and say 'that was naughty, don't do it again'!

[Morch]

6 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

  What  war crimes have been committed by Israel ?

 

 

You made a blanket claim that no war crimes were committed by Israel. Since there's no clear information yet on all actions etc. hard to see how you can support this. Given the sheer scope of operations, it's probable that there were at least some violations, at the very least. I'm not invested in the claim Israel did commit war crimes, for the very same reason.

 

 

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, freeworld said:

The UN inquiry are receiving reports and are investigating them.

 

''Commission of Inquiry collecting evidence of war crimes committed by all sides in Israel and Occupied Palestinian Territories since 7 October 2023''

 

I get it you don't do links, but even that one liner is about collecting evidence, rather than matters being decided.

[paddypower]

12 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Up to you, but maybe you should have researched a little better first:

 

Why Did Netanyahu Want to Strengthen Hamas?

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-11/ty-article/.premium/netanyahu-needed-a-strong-hamas/0000018b-1e9f-d47b-a7fb-bfdfd8f30000

https://archive.ph/s6BuA

read it, previously - thank you ! - one of my favourite, reasonably unbiased sources. This is a very moving Interview (podcast) with a truly extraordinary Israeli - who shows his commitment to peace, despite Hamas murdering his daughter. I wish more people would read some of the positive thinking that is available to read or listen to, on news sites like Haaretz.com - and not just the hatred. https://www.haaretz.com/.../0000018b-861f-df47-a3df...    I was quite surprised to the article on the Indiatoday, but I have not evaluated its objectivity yet.

[Bkk Brian]

Just now, paddypower said:

read it, previously - thank you ! - one of my favourite, reasonably unbiased sources. This is a very moving Interview (podcast) with a truly extraordinary Israeli - who shows his commitment to peace, despite Hamas murdering his daughter. I wish more people would read some of the positive thinking that is available to read or listen to, on news sites like Haaretz.com - and not just the hatred. https://www.haaretz.com/.../0000018b-861f-df47-a3df...    I was quite surprised to the article on the Indiatoday, but I have not evaluated its objectivity yet.

ok, as mentioned all previously discussed so won't bother expanding

[Morch]

5 minutes ago, stevenl said:

I do, but they don't personally attack me. 

 

Maybe they see your views as closer to theirs.

I don't recall you ever expressing much issues with posters fully invested in the Palestinian side's narrative the way you do with opponents.

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, Morch said:

 

 

You made a blanket claim that no war crimes were committed by Israel. Since there's no clear information yet on all actions etc. hard to see how you can support this. Given the sheer scope of operations, it's probable that there were at least some violations, at the very least. I'm not invested in the claim Israel did commit war crimes, for the very same reason.

 

 

 

   Have there been any allegations of War crimes by Israel and what were those allegations and what were the alledged war crimes ?

 

[Morch]

Just now, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Have there been any allegations of War crimes by Israel and what were those allegations and what were the alledged war crimes ?

 

 

Plenty of allegations made. That's routine. When the dust settles, there's usually much less to actually chew on. You're welcome to check many links provided on this topic and parallel ones as to that. I don't believe you're not aware of this, so why waste time?

[Yagoda]

25 minutes ago, TimeMachine said:

It's looking like if Trump isn't thrown in jail he will continue on to win the presidency and I'm thinking he will be on the side of Israel quite strongly which will exacerbate the region fighting. Whereas he will  most likely settle down the Russian Ukraine dispute. Fair reasoning?

 

Trump wont go to jail, and he will be on our side. There are MURDERED Americans and Americans being held hostage by barbaric neo Nazi terrorists. No weak wishy washy Democratic party bull<deleted> to get votes from ignorant anti semites.

 

I wish he was President now.

[freeworld]

11 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

I get it you don't do links, but even that one liner is about collecting evidence, rather than matters being decided.

From the UN website and gathered and investigated by qualified legal entities and persons.

 

Also from amnesty international,

 

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/10/damning-evidence-of-war-crimes-as-israeli-attacks-wipe-out-entire-families-in-gaza/

Edited November 5, 2023 by freeworld

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

Trump wont go to jail, and he will be on our side. There are MURDERED Americans and Americans being held hostage by barbaric neo Nazi terrorists. No weak wishy washy Democratic party bull<deleted> to get votes from ignorant anti semites.

 

I wish he was President now.

 

You mean the same Trump that just 2-3 weeks ago said them terrorists are very smart, denigrated Israel's leaders and so on? Trump is about Trump, nothing else.

 

You say 'weak', I see a whole lot of US Navy in place, drones over the Gaza Strip, and Hezbollah not daring to do much else than harass Israel. Iran nowhere in sight.

[Morch]

2 minutes ago, freeworld said:

From the UN website and gathered and investigated by qualified legal entities and persons.

 

Also from amnesty international,

 

https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2023/10/damning-evidence-of-war-crimes-as-israeli-attacks-wipe-out-entire-families-in-gaza/

 

Oh, that. Sure. But you are aware that Amnesty (even if one took them as seriously as you do) is not the arbiter of whether war crimes were committed, yes?

 

Gathering evidence is not the same as making allegations stick.

[Nick Carter icp]

3 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

Plenty of allegations made. That's routine. When the dust settles, there's usually much less to actually chew on. You're welcome to check many links provided on this topic and parallel ones as to that. I don't believe you're not aware of this, so why waste time?

 

  Posters keep making the claim of Israel war crimes, but no one seems to state what they actually are , I have asked many people many times to give an example of what the exact allegations are .

   Like, Hamas committed a war crime , taking hostages is a war crime and Hamas committed a war crime by taking hostages .

   Can someone now give a similar  example of alleged  Israel  war crimes ?

[paddypower]

6 minutes ago, Wobblybob said:

The facts are that Hamas started this war, killed babies, anally gang raped women so bad they bled before they were slaughtered, killed whole families, burnt families to death and the rest of the sadistic crimes.

Israel gives the Palestinians a warning as to where they intend to bomb so they can move to safety, it is not the fault of the Israeli's if Hamas are using them as a human shields, Israel first concern is the safety of their own citizens.

What is Israel supposed to do give them a slap on the wrists and say 'that was naughty, don't do it again'!

I'm not falling for that trick - where I post a photo off 3,700 (and counting) blown up Palestinian children to make a point. That is a facile form of debating. I don't argue with the facts you describe. they were horrific and never to be forgotten. look at the map of Gaza, relative to the whole region. It takes a warmonger, like Netanyahu (desperately trying to stay out of jail on multiple counts of corruption) to invent an offer which is impossible to accept.this is probably not too bright an idea. But the Israeli army is probably the greatest, well equipped fight force on the planet. That,, plus some of its 300,000 reservists are quite capable of invading the Gaza strip and kill all of the Hamas followers there, without carpet bombing the whole region.

[Yagoda]

2 minutes ago, Morch said:

 

You mean the same Trump that just 2-3 weeks ago said them terrorists are very smart, denigrated Israel's leaders and so on? Trump is about Trump, nothing else.

 

You say 'weak', I see a whole lot of US Navy in place, drones over the Gaza Strip, and Hezbollah not daring to do much else than harass Israel. Iran nowhere in sight.

Yep, that Trump. Hamas was smart and Israels leaders were asleep at the wheel. The truth hurts. Same as the Japanese at Pearl Harbour.

 

We can just agree to disagree about what the USA should be doing.