Elderly Swiss cyclist killed in hit-and-run in Sattahip district

[Seppius]

In the UK they were always pushing stuff like this

[richard_smith237]

3 hours ago, steven100 said:

it wouldn't matter how bright the rear lights were ..... I'd never ride a bike here, and at night '  ....  10 x worse ..

it's just to dangerous ....   and in the rain '     crickey   !

 

I won't ride a Motorcycle at night, or in the Rain here - unless absolutely necessary, for the very reasons you allude to. 

 

BUT... any driver hitting a motorcyclist from the rear in the cases is wholly in the wrong. 

This doesn't help the Op in any way, but measures to deal with such issues need to be address.

 

Thailand needs to take a proactive action rather than being lazy and taking a reactive response. 

 

- Any driver leaving the scene of an incident - charged severely for leaving the scene (a more significant charge than DUI).

- Any driver involved in an incident tested for Alcohol and drugs. 

- 100% no exclusions - everyone treated the same, same penalties.

 

The message has to be 'put out there' that drivers are 100% responsible for their actions and the only way to get this message across is to put the fear into them that the will be charged IF breaking any laws, the greatest of which would be to 'escape' the scene. 

 

Currently escaping the scene gives drunk drivers time to detox....   this legal loophole of being able to report oneself within 24 hours enables drink drivers to such a degree it is perhaps a major underling / root cause of a lot of evening, late night and early morning 'incidents' (I'm reluctant to call them accidents because when a drunk driver gets in a car, its no long an accident, its a criminal incident and should be treated as such).

 

 

 

 

[brianthainess]

7 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

You have lots of experience cycling in Pattaya area? how much do you do?

 

The reason i ask is on this forum people like giving advice with no or little experience, i notice it mostly with cycling and motorbike threads or even nutrition threads, fat people giving advice 555

No I drive a car, and have experience of Cyclists just like you, that are hard to see, with the amount of traffic around. 

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

5 hours ago, Old Croc said:

It's always fine until it's not.

It's quite possible for one person to ride, or drive, on Thailand's roads for decades without incident, but that doesn't mean those roads are safe statistically.

It just means you won the lottery on what are proven to be among the most dangerous traffic conditions on the planet. 

The strict rules and at times over policing, in our home countries can be irksome, but Thailand's alternative of virtually nil policing of road rules and drunk driving until after an accident, means you need luck to survive the carnage. 

Riding a bicycle "on Sukhumvit Road, in the Sattahip district of Chon Buri, late on Sunday night" is pushing your luck.

walking feels more dangerous 

 

That depends where you are I think.... 

 

I recall riding from central Bangkok to Wat Khlong Toey Nok Pier and taking a small boat across to Bang Kachao.... 

 

The ride was perilous...  It was the motorcyclists which were the worst... A moto-taxi actually overtook me, then slammed on the brakes in front of me to drop of their passenger, I slammed on the anchors and the bike slipped away from under me...  remaining on my feet luckily..  The moto-taxi's were extremely helpful and the guy apologetic - they don't ride deliberately badly, its just the way they ride, without consideration or care for anyone else. 

 

It was when I was riding along one of the roads towards the port I realised how perilous my situation was... Huge lorries passing me and they are not passing with a decent gap, they were 1-2 feet away....  one wobble, one bit of bad road, on snag of the front wheel on grading and I'm on the ground....   head perilously close to 10's of tonnes of crushing weight on a wheel - squashed head... 

 

Nope...  no thanks... Next time I went across to Bang Krachao it was with the family - we drove to the ferry... took the bikes across on a mini-adventure, but even then, on the quiet roads over there some of the vehicles (mainly delivery box pickups), pass at speeds I consider too fast for the road, at distances too close when the guy give far wider space....

 

IMO - Thailands roads users, certainly in the busier metropolitcan areas are just not mature enough to allow for safe riding.

 

I think I if were 'up country' somewhere a lot quieter, it might be an extremely pleasant way to get around on a daily ride, stop off at a few mom & pop cafe's on the way, have a bite for breakfast etc... make friends...   Could be lovely....  until the d-head in the Box Pickup loaded up on Kratom screams into while reading his phone.... 

 

 

 

 

 

[Liverpool Lou]

3 hours ago, brianthainess said:

So according to her he was riding in the right lane. 

She was not reported as saying that in that link.

[MikeUdon]

55 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Early to bed, early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise and all that nonsense.

Well, I go early to bed. Around 8 PM usually (only when there is a F1 race then I can commit myself to stay awake longer 🙂 )But I have been doing this since I am a child. I am 63 now, and it's still the same. I guess it has something to do with the 'internal clock'. It is what it is. Does it make me healthy or healthier? I don't think so. I usually get up at 2 AM. What is the benefit? I feel tired at latest at 10 AM again and have to take a nap. Did it make me wealthy? Definitely not. Does it make me wise? This is up to others to decide. It's a biological thing. Not a decision you can make.

[Liverpool Lou]

3 hours ago, brianthainess said:

It appears she must have side swiped him as he was riding in the right right lane. Going by the statement the woman driver gave.

Where is the part in which she says that he was in the right  hand lane?

[NoDisplayName]

19 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

Currently escaping the scene gives drunk drivers time to detox....

 

I was under the impression it allowed the driver to drink more, and then claim he was sober during the accident, being so scared that he needed a half bottle of whiskey to calm his nerves.  The idea being it's now impossible to prove he was drunk BEFORE he ran off and hid in mom's basement.

[brianthainess]

6 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Where is the part in which she says that he was in the right  hand lane?

I'll let you scroll through all the replies and find the story link from another source that another member posted, as obviously you couldn't be bothered.

[Expat68]

25 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

That depends where you are I think.... 

 

I recall riding from central Bangkok to Wat Khlong Toey Nok Pier and taking a small boat across to Bang Kachao.... 

 

The ride was perilous...  It was the motorcyclists which were the worst... A moto-taxi actually overtook me, then slammed on the brakes in front of me to drop of their passenger, I slammed on the anchors and the bike slipped away from under me...  remaining on my feet luckily..  The moto-taxi's were extremely helpful and the guy apologetic - they don't ride deliberately badly, its just the way they ride, without consideration or care for anyone else. 

 

It was when I was riding along one of the roads towards the port I realised how perilous my situation was... Huge lorries passing me and they are not passing with a decent gap, they were 1-2 feet away....  one wobble, one bit of bad road, on snag of the front wheel on grading and I'm on the ground....   head perilously close to 10's of tonnes of crushing weight on a wheel - squashed head... 

 

Nope...  no thanks... Next time I went across to Bang Krachao it was with the family - we drove to the ferry... took the bikes across on a mini-adventure, but even then, on the quiet roads over there some of the vehicles (mainly delivery box pickups), pass at speeds I consider too fast for the road, at distances too close when the guy give far wider space....

 

IMO - Thailands roads users, certainly in the busier metropolitcan areas are just not mature enough to allow for safe riding.

 

I think I if were 'up country' somewhere a lot quieter, it might be an extremely pleasant way to get around on a daily ride, stop off at a few mom & pop cafe's on the way, have a bite for breakfast etc... make friends...   Could be lovely....  until the d-head in the Box Pickup loaded up on Kratom screams into while reading his phone.... 

 

 

 

 

 

I cycle around my small city every day, 🛒, pay bills, eating out, in an evening sometimes calling for a beer 

[richard_smith237]

16 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Where is the part in which she says that he was in the right  hand lane?

 

It was in this part LL... 

 

Quote: [This woman reported that on Sunday night, she was driving her car from Pattaya to her home in Huai Yai Subdistrict. She didn’t spot the foreigner riding his bicycle in the right lane while driving at high speeds, so she crashed into him violently. She drove home first, out of fear and shock, and then called the police and offered to surrender the next morning]

 

 

The impact on the drivers side windscreen indicates the bicyclist was to the right side of the car upon impact. 

The state of the rear wheel of the bicycle indicates the cyclist was struck from behind. 

 

It seems to add up that the cyclist was riding in the right hand lane and and driver simply didn't see him with tragic consequences. 

 

It would appear that the cyclist had lights (or it looks like a rear-light)....    this, it can be assumed that the driver simply was not paying attention... (on the phone ?)... 

 

 

4 hours ago, anchadian said:

Speeding, unable to see, leaving the scene.  That'll be B500 fine and try to remember to pay a visit to Specsavers.

 

FEMALE DRIVER SURRENDERS AFTER FATALLY CRASHING INTO SWISS MAN

 

CHONBURI – According to police officers at the Na Jomtien Police Station in Chonburi Province, the driver of the car that struck the 73-year-old Swiss tourist’s bicycle has now surrendered.

 

On February 26, Mrs. Saranya, 49, of Huai Yai Subdistrict, Bang Lamung District, Chonburi Province, travelled to Na Jomtien to report to the police. She admitted that she had hit a foreigner’s bicycle.

 

She drove the car involved in the accident so that police officials could investigate it. It was a red Mazda, and the front window on the driver’s side was scratched by broken glass.

 

https://www.khaosodenglish.com/news/2024/02/26/female-driver-surrenders-after-fatally-crashing-into-swiss-man/?fbclid=IwAR1HaT6-V1FDNrov4HBtHIGQnA1w3OXDLx9iQd0xqUPvKReMCPmFgrkRz2A

 

[bristolgeoff]

Did he have lights on the bike riding a bike at night not a good idea.Anytime you are at the bottom of the chain of transport.Riding a push bike here is to be avoided really

[atpeace]

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

walking feels more dangerous 

Might feel like it but it isn't. 

 

Cycled all over Thailand and  more than 12k annually.  in 2015 after a near fatal accident ( extremely painful ) which was my third in Thailand that I broke at least 1 bone, I vowed to never to ride again.  Cycling in any country is dangerous because of random dangerous variables.  In Thailand the dangerous variables are substantially higher.  Monkeys, dogs, drunk motorcyclists, Chinese tourists that like to take pictures on road bends, random road work without signage....

 

Pattaya roads are probably safer than the mountain roads where I had almost all my bad accidents.  If you're the type that can control your ego and not push the speeds and isn't erratic in traffic then maybe it can be done safely.

[Liverpool Lou]

18 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

It was in this part LL... 

 

Quote: [This woman reported that on Sunday night, she was driving her car from Pattaya to her home in Huai Yai Subdistrict. She didn’t spot the foreigner riding his bicycle in the right lane while driving at high speeds, so she crashed into him violently. She drove home first, out of fear and shock, and then called the police and offered to surrender the next morning]

 

 

The impact on the drivers side windscreen indicates the bicyclist was to the right side of the car upon impact. 

The state of the rear wheel of the bicycle indicates the cyclist was struck from behind. 

 

It seems to add up that the cyclist was riding in the right hand lane and and driver simply didn't see him with tragic consequences. 

 

It would appear that the cyclist had lights (or it looks like a rear-light)....    this, it can be assumed that the driver simply was not paying attention... (on the phone ?)... 

 

 

 

I stand corrected. Thank you.

[Liverpool Lou]

35 minutes ago, brianthainess said:

I'll let you scroll through all the replies and find the story link from another source that another member posted, as obviously you couldn't be bothered.

Found it. Thanks for your "help".

[scubascuba3]

7 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Might feel like it but it isn't. 

 

Cycled all over Thailand and  more than 12k annually.  in 2015 after a near fatal accident ( extremely painful ) which was my third in Thailand that I broke at least 1 bone, I vowed to never to ride again.  Cycling in any country is dangerous because of random dangerous variables.  In Thailand the dangerous variables are substantially higher.  Monkeys, dogs, drunk motorcyclists, Chinese tourists that like to take pictures on road bends, random road work without signage....

 

Pattaya roads are probably safer than the mountain roads where I had almost all my bad accidents.  If you're the type that can control your ego and not push the speeds and isn't erratic in traffic then maybe it can be done safely.

also riding in groups helps

[GarryP]

2 hours ago, transam said:

Dangerous drivers 'behind' you are rarely spotted, especially on a bicycle......😋

Wrong. I have a rear view mirror on my bike and check it constantly. Whether car, motorcycle or bicycle, I always drive or ride defensively, i.e. checking the actions of other road users, and anticipating the possible idiotic actions of other road users such as pulling out of side roads without checking whether there is oncoming traffic (which seems to be a speciality here), etc.  

[transam]

2 minutes ago, GarryP said:

Wrong. I have a rear view mirror on my bike and check it constantly. Whether car, motorcycle or bicycle, I always drive or ride defensively, i.e. checking the actions of other road users, and anticipating the possible idiotic actions of other road users such as pulling out of side roads without checking whether there is oncoming traffic (which seems to be a speciality here), etc.  

Are you the exception, can a rearview mirror stop you being rear ended by ANY passing car, I think not, unless you also have another set of eyes in the back of your head..........🤭

[atpeace]

4 minutes ago, bristolgeoff said:

Did he have lights on the bike riding a bike at night not a good idea.Anytime you are at the bottom of the chain of transport.Riding a push bike here is to be avoided really

That is a major problem.  There is a pecking order and it goes by size. Motorcyclist are expected to to avoid cars that merge into traffic  and cyclists have even fewer road rights in reality.  Why would cyclists ride side by side here is mind boggling.  To many die here in Thailand.    Sure it is legal but the reaper doesn't care.    I drive past cyclists doing the craziest things and it stresses me out.  

[Liverpool Lou]

2 minutes ago, transam said:

Are you the exception, can a rearview mirror stop you being rear ended by ANY passing car, I think not, unless you also have another set of eyes in the back of your head..........🤭

"...unless you also have another set of eyes in the back of your head..."

Possibly, after he's been hit hard from behind!

[GarryP]

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

That depends where you are I think.... 

 

I recall riding from central Bangkok to Wat Khlong Toey Nok Pier and taking a small boat across to Bang Kachao.... 

 

The ride was perilous...  It was the motorcyclists which were the worst... A moto-taxi actually overtook me, then slammed on the brakes in front of me to drop of their passenger, I slammed on the anchors and the bike slipped away from under me...  remaining on my feet luckily..  The moto-taxi's were extremely helpful and the guy apologetic - they don't ride deliberately badly, its just the way they ride, without consideration or care for anyone else. 

 

It was when I was riding along one of the roads towards the port I realised how perilous my situation was... Huge lorries passing me and they are not passing with a decent gap, they were 1-2 feet away....  one wobble, one bit of bad road, on snag of the front wheel on grading and I'm on the ground....   head perilously close to 10's of tonnes of crushing weight on a wheel - squashed head... 

 

Nope...  no thanks... Next time I went across to Bang Krachao it was with the family - we drove to the ferry... took the bikes across on a mini-adventure, but even then, on the quiet roads over there some of the vehicles (mainly delivery box pickups), pass at speeds I consider too fast for the road, at distances too close when the guy give far wider space....

 

IMO - Thailands roads users, certainly in the busier metropolitcan areas are just not mature enough to allow for safe riding.

 

I think I if were 'up country' somewhere a lot quieter, it might be an extremely pleasant way to get around on a daily ride, stop off at a few mom & pop cafe's on the way, have a bite for breakfast etc... make friends...   Could be lovely....  until the d-head in the Box Pickup loaded up on Kratom screams into while reading his phone.... 

 

 

 

 

 

The ice delivery pickup trucks, followed by the parcel delivery service providers such as Flash, Kerry, etc. are the worst in my neck of the woods in Issan. Drive at crazy speeds and overtake as close as they can to the slower vehicle. I just swear like eff at them. It's all I can do.  

[atpeace]

8 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

also riding in groups helps

I road with a fast group while in Pattaya and they were insane.  Don't want to name names but they were testosterone freaks and death found them soon enough after my last ride with them.

 

Groups are safer as you stated.  Having  fun responsibly and enjoying some coffee is a nice day out cycling.

[cdemundo]

18 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

It seems many foreigners try to live in a perfect world. Until one day they discover that the real world is far away from perfect.

 

Most Thai people wouldn't cross a street only because the light for pedestrians is green. They would pay attention even if there is a zebra crossing. Basically, no Thais use bicycles - the exception is the Lycra crowd. 

Many foreigners do all that. And then accidents happen. And then questions come up like: How could that happen?

 

My personal advice: Don't play the hero and have the sentence "he was right" on your gravestone.

 

You points are well taken but...

"Basically, no Thais use bicycles "

 

This depends on where you live I think.

I see a dozen riders a day in the hour that I am taking a walk.

 

Not the lycra crowd, old beater bikes that the lycra crowd wouldn't be caught dead on.

Among them are two young ladies who apparently work together, wear same uniform and ride one-handed holding umbrellas for sun protection, like something out of a Thai Mary Poppins.

Some of these bikes gotta be 40 years old with big old fenders on them and kickstands and baskets etc.

But my neighborhood doesn't have much traffic and the Thai authorities (who ever they are) have blessed our neighborhood with many speed bumps so motorized vehicles go slow.

[GarryP]

19 minutes ago, transam said:

Are you the exception, can a rearview mirror stop you being rear ended by ANY passing car, I think not, unless you also have another set of eyes in the back of your head..........🤭

If I see a car driving behind erratically or very close to the verge, I pull over and get out of the way. BTW, a rear view mirror replaces the need for me to have eyes transplanted in the back of my head. 

 

FWIW, I am mostly cycling on country B roads, and red earth roads, where the amount of traffic is quite low. 

[atpeace]

2 minutes ago, GarryP said:

If I see a car driving behind erratically or very close to the verge, I pull over and get out of the way. BTW, a rear view mirror replaces the need for me to have eyes transplanted in the back of my head. 

 

FWIW, I am mostly cycling on country B roads, and red earth roads, where the amount of traffice is quite low. 

Off topic but most Thais run with traffic.  I'm an avid runner and this blows my mind.  Don't they want to see the cars that drive on the shoulders before they are crippled or die.

[transam]

1 minute ago, GarryP said:

If I see a car driving behind erratically or very close to the verge, I pull over and get out of the way. BTW, a rear view mirror replaces the need for me to have eyes transplanted in the back of my head. 

 

FWIW, I am mostly cycling on country B roads, and red earth roads, where the amount of traffice is quite low. 

Sorry, but I think you are making excuses because you ride a bike...🤔

Plus, there is no way you are checking your mirrors all the time, most folk use them when they are going to do something.

In my HGV driving test (53 years back) I had to look in both mirrors every 15 seconds, who does that......🤭

[NoDisplayName]

12 minutes ago, transam said:

Sorry, but I think you are making excuses because you ride a bike...🤔

Plus, there is no way you are checking your mirrors all the time, most folk use them when they are going to do something.

In my HGV driving test (53 years back) I had to look in both mirrors every 15 seconds, who does that......🤭

 

I, for one, does that, regardless of what "most folk" do.  Has served me well over 'bout a quarter million kilometers of riding in Thailand and China and Vietnam and Malaysia and Singapore and Myanmar and Laos and......

 

....and nearly as much in Australia and US and New Zealand and Germany and Czechoslovakia and Austria and France.....

 

and even in Italy, despite what "most people" did....

 

 

[richard_smith237]

9 minutes ago, transam said:

Sorry, but I think you are making excuses because you ride a bike...🤔

Plus, there is no way you are checking your mirrors all the time, most folk use them when they are going to do something.

In my HGV driving test (53 years back) I had to look in both mirrors every 15 seconds, who does that......🤭

 

I completely concur....  

 

 

Whenever we are riding a motorcycle of bicycle and another vehicle passes us without any incident...  its because they have noticed us and not through any additional observation or skill on our part.... We can position ourselves, well, ensure we have better visibility etc... but ultimately, when it comes down to the nuts and bolts of it, we are not 'mown down' because of one single reason - the driver of the passing vehicle saw us and manoeuvred around us... 

 

So those who are under the belief that they can have a rear-view mirror and can somehow take avoiding action to avoid a rear-impact are seriously over egging their riding observation and abilities to the point of being completely delusional. 

 

[atpeace]

3 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

I, for one, does that, regardless of what "most folk" do.  Has served me well over 'bout a quarter million kilometers of riding in Thailand and China and Vietnam and Malaysia and Singapore and Myanmar and Laos and......

I did myself and think it was OCD.  How many cycling accidents are caused by what is behind vs in front ?  I just went through the exercise of reflecting on my accidents.  100% were caused by things in front.

[transam]

8 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

I completely concur....  

 

 

Whenever we are riding a motorcycle of bicycle and another vehicle passes us without any incident...  its because they have noticed us and not through any additional observation or skill on our part.... We can position ourselves, well, ensure we have better visibility etc... but ultimately, when it comes down to the nuts and bolts of it, we are not 'mown down' because of one single reason - the driver of the passing vehicle saw us and manoeuvred around us... 

 

So those who are under the belief that they can have a rear-view mirror and can somehow take avoiding action to avoid a rear-impact are seriously over egging their riding observation and abilities to the point of being completely delusional. 

 

Thank you.........