Not sleeping well

[BE88]

I started a year ago with an aniseed tea which I take occasionally to help me get back to sleep.

[Elkski]

On 2/27/2024 at 3:04 AM, sirineou said:

I have not been checked, but One good thing no snoring , ot at least that's what the wife said when I asked her.  I Will be back in the US this spring where my medical insurance is , and will have it checked. 

Check your policy because overnight sleep tests are under major diagnostics and not covered under my plan.   It maybe less expensive to get a sleep atudy done in Thailand.   

I've been putting it off for over a year now.  I think my poor sleep issues started with covid. 

[Hummin]

10 minutes ago, Elkski said:

Check your policy because overnight sleep tests are under major diagnostics and not covered under my plan.   It maybe less expensive to get a sleep atudy done in Thailand.   

I've been putting it off for over a year now.  I think my poor sleep issues started with covid. 

A sleep apnea app can give you a good enough screaning how your sleep is.

 

I do have a polar watch monitoring my sleep as well, and gives a ok result with rem sleep puls activity and how many times you are awake.

[advancebooking]

On 2/27/2024 at 3:14 PM, sirineou said:

Melatonin 3mg for the mast month before that I was taking 12 mg and was told it was too much, also I had noticed increased levels of aggression   and irritation . as I am sure  the moderators in this forum had noticed also 

And was told that it could be a result of taking too much melatonin . I still think it is because of my latent a-hole tendencies are becoming more pronounced as I get older  

Anyway down to 3 mg an hour before sleep.

Magnesium Glycinate 1000 mg a couple of hours before I go to sleep . 

 

 

1000mg of Mag G is a lot. NHS website for the uk says 300mg maximum a day for your age group. 

[advancebooking]

On 2/27/2024 at 4:39 PM, Sunmaster said:

Waking up at 5? That's perfect. Use that time to do a meditation routine and your life will improve on all levels. 
You think you are being handed lemons, so make a nice lemonade out of them. 😉

 

If Ive never meditated before how do I do that? thanks

[sirineou]

9 hours ago, advancebooking said:

If Ive never meditated before how do I do that? thanks

You repeat the ancient Indian "owata "chant several times , it brings the  calmness that only this inner truth can provide. 

So Repeat at least three times

Owata dopa Yam 

owata dopa Yam

Owata dopa Yam

 

See what lack of sleep does to one's sense of humor? 

Edited March 1 by sirineou
typo

[TroubleandGrumpy]

12 hours ago, advancebooking said:

If Ive never meditated before how do I do that? thanks

That is the time to take your medications - ideally with a glass of warm milk. IMO dDont take any medications after 2/3pm - at breakfast is best.

 

My advice to all is to only have a small breakfast, big lunch, small dinner - and no snacks or alcohol after 6pm.  Only eat when you are hungry - if you aint hungry, dont eat and drink water - and a desire for food is not hunger. Your body aint 40 anymore - it struggles to 'manage' things when you overload it with food and/or alcohol - especially during sleep. Yes alcohol will shut you down so to speak, but you will not sleep well. 

[shdmn]

I have exactly the same problem as OP. Good to know I am not the only one.  I've been tested for sleep apnea and snoring and it's not that.  I don't need to get up to pee that often either. Tried some of the suggestions here by eating a banana before bed and taking a melatonin.  Didn't really help.  The biggest annoyance is waking up several times at night then often not being able to fall back asleep.

 

I found that getting some direct sunlight (no sunglasses) first thing in the morning (before 9am) helps me a little bit.  I read that it helps to reset your circadian clock.  I also quit drinking coffee completely and avoid any other caffeine beverages.  Both those seem to help a little bit as well.  Especially when it comes to taking a nap in the afternoons, which I also recently started doing.  It is still a problem sometimes though.  Taking some diphenhydramine early in the morning when I wake up and can't get back to sleep seems to work pretty well.  That's not a long term solution though.

Edited March 1 by shdmn

[shdmn]

13 hours ago, advancebooking said:

If Ive never meditated before how do I do that? thanks

The easiest for beginners is to breath in and count on exhale.  Do that up to 4 then repeat.  Only focus on that and nothing else.  I use that to help me take a nap in the afternoon.  It's technically not supposed to be used for that but that is what often happens to me when I do it.  If you get really good at it and can totally clear your mind, without falling asleep, then it gives you the some of same benefit as sleep.

Edited March 1 by shdmn

[shdmn]

On 2/27/2024 at 9:55 PM, Sheryl said:

It may be enough for you but would definitely not be for most people.

 

Sleep requirements are very, very individual.

 

Number of hours needed per night do tend to decrease with age. I'm needing 1-2 hours less now than when I was young. But that still puts me at 7-8 hours.

This has been my experience as well.  I used to need at least 8-9.  Now I can get by with 7-8.  Six is ok sometimes but I will often feel like a nap in the afternoon if I only get that.

Edited March 1 by shdmn

[puck2]

On 2/27/2024 at 5:34 PM, Lacessit said:

IMO the OP is definitely over-medicating for sleep.

 

He needs to change his mindset. Worry less about sleeping to a pattern. I nap in the morning or afternoon if I feel sleepy.

 

I do take a Codiphen ( drowsy antihistamine ) on average once a week if I feel I really need a good night's sleep. I have exercise routines. I avoid alcohol.

 

Being unable to sleep is frequently the product of an overactive mind. My trick in dealing with that is to manufacture pleasant fantasies to pass the time, it's surprising how often that will lead to normal sleep.

 

Hope this helps.

 

It's my idea, too.

Overmedicating - against sleeping problems - will also produce more health problems, because all pills etc. have side effects you cannot control.

 

Stop reading aggressive comments here in AN or elswhere. Search a funny film or nice articles in the internet.

 

If that all doesn't work, start counting quietly  (in your brain):

twenty one, twenty two, twenty three ..... . Next morning you can't remember exavctly when you stopped counting the numbers. But it deflected your attention from thinking about problems. It worked for me!

[Sunmaster]

14 hours ago, advancebooking said:

If Ive never meditated before how do I do that? thanks

There are many ways and techniques. I will tell you a simplified technique I've been using for the last 5 years.

1) Time: the best time is early in the morning. The mind is fresh and not yet filled with plans and worries. Try to start a morning routine and keep doing it every day. 20 minutes is enough to start with. You can also do a short session just before going to sleep. It frees the mind and helps you to have a good sleep. Plus, you know the saying..."The last thought at night, is the first thought in the morning."

2) Place: Find a quiet and cozy spot in your house. You can decorate it if you like, so that it will remind you of the task at hand. 

3) Technique: Sit down on a comfortable pillow. Wear loose clothing. You can sit in the lotus position (difficult) or half-lotus position (easier). If you're not the youngest anymore, you may sit on a chair with your feet planted on the ground and your arms relaxed on your legs.
Now close your eyes. Take a few deep breaths, it will help relax the body. You can set your intention for the session now...for example "I'm here to observe my mind." I always start with a few sentences of gratitude.
So the first "obstacle" is the position of the body. Your aim is to find a neutral position. Sometimes you will notice your upper body leaning forward or backwards. Simply find your neutral position again. In time this will get less and less.
Next is the breath. Simply observe how you breathe in and out. Don't try to control it. It will be challenging at first, but this too will get easier with practice. You will notice that thoughts will take away your attention again and again. No problem, simply go back to the breath. The breath will be your anchor that keeps you from going off in the distance, jumping from one thought to another.
I also use a mantra in conjunction to the breath. (HONG when inhaling, SOO when exhaling). You could try later on.

It's important that you do this regularly, every day. 
Do what you can, the best way you can.
Let me know if you have any questions. 

[Gecko123]

Cilantro root tea has a really sedating and calming effect. 

[helloagain]

On 2/27/2024 at 2:31 PM, sirineou said:

66 years old and for the past year I have not been sleeping well. I don't eat after six, I take multivitamins , B1 complex, melatonin and Magnesium.

I also often take Benadryl which gives me 7-8 hours of sleep.

If I don't take Benadryl 6 -7 hours  Usually interrupted by  1 hour half way through, which is why I always have a book on my nightstand.  . 

I am aware of the health benefits of  a good night's sleep , but also apprehensive about long term Benadryl use, 

I understand that as we age our sleep patterns change, and I am sure I am not the only one with this issue.

So I wonder how do you deal with such issue. I would appreciate and would consider any advice. 

Hope this helps, I normally go to bed at 9.30 pm, last night I woke & got up at 10 mins before midnight. normally wake up at 2 or 3am. I sleep again around 6am for an hour. Normally have a morning kip & again around 3pm for an hour. Yes thats why I dont sleep through I gues. I am 70. But very early morning I watch a serial that my thai wifes not interested in, or surf for our tv programs. 

[sirineou]

2 minutes ago, helloagain said:

Hope this helps, I normally go to bed at 9.30 pm, last night I woke & got up at 10 mins before midnight. normally wake up at 2 or 3am. I sleep again around 6am for an hour. Normally have a morning kip & again around 3pm for an hour. Yes thats why I dont sleep through I gues. I am 70. But very early morning I watch a serial that my thai wifes not interested in, or surf for our tv programs. 

It's a pain in the ass waking up in the middle of the night with the wife sleeping and having to to keep quite, I normally read for an hour or two utili  I get to the point where what I read does not go in my brain and I have to re-read passages to understand them, and I know I am at the point where I can sleep again, I close my eyes and think about what I read to keep my mind from racing and before you know it I am asleep again,

I was just concerned that I was not getting enough sleep. bit now that I see that most people in our age bracket are experiencing similar sleep issues, I feel a little better.  

[BigStar]

2 hours ago, sirineou said:

It's a pain in the ass waking up in the middle of the night with the wife sleeping and having to to keep quite, I normally read for an hour or two

 

When traveling, I take along a portable MP3 player and earbuds, which could be light headphones. As needed, before sleep, or if waking in the middle of the night, I find that playing an audiobook at low volume puts me to sleep quickly; and the room stays dark, no lights or screens. If I don't manage to turn it off (it doesn't have a timer), it continues playing while I'm asleep. Maybe I should try sleep learning Thai, LOL.

Edited March 2 by BigStar

[sirineou]

On 2/29/2024 at 7:47 PM, Elkski said:

Check your policy because overnight sleep tests are under major diagnostics and not covered under my plan.   It maybe less expensive to get a sleep atudy done in Thailand.   

I've been putting it off for over a year now.  I think my poor sleep issues started with covid. 

Hmm.

Funny you would say that, but come to think of it my sleep issues also started some time after I got a mild case of Covid . before that I never had a sleep issue , or even ever thought about it, Sleep was just a natural thing like breathing. 

 Right after I read your post I googled it . and it turns out.

 "about 40% of people with Long COVID report sleep issues among their symptoms. Problems can include insomnia, daytime sleepiness, waking up several times a night, or not feeling refreshed in the morning "

https://covid19.nih.gov/news-and-stories/understanding-sleep-problems-long-covid#:~:text=Research suggests that about 40,feeling refreshed in the morning.

Not sure how that helps, but if long covid goes away after a while, there is also hope that this might go away if it is as a result of long covid

[Sunmaster]

On 3/1/2024 at 12:57 PM, Sunmaster said:

There are many ways and techniques. I will tell you a simplified technique I've been using for the last 5 years.

1) Time: the best time is early in the morning. The mind is fresh and not yet filled with plans and worries. Try to start a morning routine and keep doing it every day. 20 minutes is enough to start with. You can also do a short session just before going to sleep. It frees the mind and helps you to have a good sleep. Plus, you know the saying..."The last thought at night, is the first thought in the morning."

2) Place: Find a quiet and cozy spot in your house. You can decorate it if you like, so that it will remind you of the task at hand. 

3) Technique: Sit down on a comfortable pillow. Wear loose clothing. You can sit in the lotus position (difficult) or half-lotus position (easier). If you're not the youngest anymore, you may sit on a chair with your feet planted on the ground and your arms relaxed on your legs.
Now close your eyes. Take a few deep breaths, it will help relax the body. You can set your intention for the session now...for example "I'm here to observe my mind." I always start with a few sentences of gratitude.
So the first "obstacle" is the position of the body. Your aim is to find a neutral position. Sometimes you will notice your upper body leaning forward or backwards. Simply find your neutral position again. In time this will get less and less.
Next is the breath. Simply observe how you breathe in and out. Don't try to control it. It will be challenging at first, but this too will get easier with practice. You will notice that thoughts will take away your attention again and again. No problem, simply go back to the breath. The breath will be your anchor that keeps you from going off in the distance, jumping from one thought to another.
I also use a mantra in conjunction to the breath. (HONG when inhaling, SOO when exhaling). You could try later on.

It's important that you do this regularly, every day. 
Do what you can, the best way you can.
Let me know if you have any questions. 

One more small but important thing I'd like to add...

When we start to learn this new skill, the basic attitude should not be of "adding" something to our selves....more knowledge, more peace, new experiences, more happiness and so on.
It's actually the other way around. We hone these skills to learn to let go of the things we already have. The basic attitude is one of surrender, of giving up control. Attachments and desires are the very things that prevent us from accessing those qualities we crave for. 
The more we surrender to what is, the more we allow those qualities to emerge naturally. They are already there. They are just covered by the mental debris we've accumulated throughout our lives.

🖖

[TroubleandGrumpy]

1 hour ago, Sunmaster said:

One more small but important thing I'd like to add...

When we start to learn this new skill, the basic attitude should not be of "adding" something to our selves....more knowledge, more peace, new experiences, more happiness and so on.
It's actually the other way around. We hone these skills to learn to let go of the things we already have. The basic attitude is one of surrender, of giving up control. Attachments and desires are the very things that prevent us from accessing those qualities we crave for. 
The more we surrender to what is, the more we allow those qualities to emerge naturally. They are already there. They are just covered by the mental debris we've accumulated throughout our lives.\
🖖

Excellent advice and something all Expats should think about.  There is IMO no need to become delusional and think you are Thai/Buddha (like some Expats do), but it is great advice to let the things of the past stay in the past, and to not think about them too much today. They never fully go away, not should they as they are a part of you, but it is a constant 'activity' needed to keep yourself positive and living today, and not trhinking about the past. The past if full of regrets and delights (you can learn from), and the future is full of hope and concerns (you can plan for).  But today is all you can actually live in - and each and every one of them is a 'gift' - a gift that will one day be your last one - but not now, not yet.  As the lady said "Tomorrow is Another Day."