Police reform may be easier than everyone thinks

[webfact]

Absolutely hopeless as it may seem, the critical state of the Thai police deserves one last try. And who says the last, desperate measure has to be extremely tough, costly or divisive?

 

This week has seen rock bottom. Just when the country thought nothing would beat the Kamnan Nok incident, the most powerful men in the force have been accused, directly or indirectly, of involvement in massive and systematic bribe taking. In a matter of months, the badly-tainted image of the Thai police has been blown up apparently beyond repair.

 

Newscasters and commentators are in unison about the force being rotten to its core. They all agree while “good apples” are out there, the bad ones have been too dominant and unstoppable. Transfers and promotions are less and less on merits, and corrupt practices are feeding on themselves.

 

Bad bosses are making initially-good subordinates corrupt. Good bosses are getting overwhelmed by bad subordinates. Worse still, those with the disease are spreading it to politicians, reporters, community leaders, and finally the Thai society as a whole.

A traffic offender feeling the urge to “settle” charges right on the spot because it would be cheaper and more convenient is an early symptom.

 

According to well-known lawyer Sittra Biabungerd, there are too many bribe-taking opportunities nowadays.

 

Illegal Indian immigrants selling nuts need to pay bribes, so do truck drivers, employers of visa-less foreign migrants, owners of entertainment venues that violate age limits or closing times, operators of Thai massage parlours offering “special” services, underground gambling racketeers and so on.

 

by Tulsathit  Taptim

File photo : Sittra Biabungerd (L)

 

Full story: Thai PBS 2024-03-30

 

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[flyingtlger]

13 minutes ago, webfact said:

They all agree while “good apples” are out there, the bad ones have been too dominant and unstoppable.

Very true. It's very difficult to change ingrained methodologies especially when it's the people who command power (power=money) that control the system...

[Gknrd]

There goes the new Benz in Mia noi's drive way this year.

[Srikcir]

"Police reform may be easier than everyone thinks"

But the entire article seems to point towards an impossible path to reform of deeply embedded corruption. Nowhere in the article is suggested any "easy" solutions. And that maybe the real truth.

Those who are supposed to enforce the rule of law distort and abuse the rule of law. This destructive culture might stem from decades of military direct and indirect control of the nation punctuated with frequent military coups that defy the rule of law and Thai people's sovereignty.

[bamnutsak]

So you're counting on Srettha to reform the RTP?

 

And it will be easy?

 

The clownish PM can barely dress himself.

 

 

Laughable.

 

 

 

[hotchilli]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

This week has seen rock bottom. Just when the country thought nothing would beat the Kamnan Nok incident, the most powerful men in the force have been accused, directly or indirectly, of involvement in massive and systematic bribe taking. In a matter of months, the badly-tainted image of the Thai police has been blown up apparently beyond repair.

It'll get investigated then forgotten

[wozzlegummich]

They (the cops) will fight tooth and nail to hang on to their jobs. The financial gains from endemic coruption are huge and they will want to continue the lifestyle that comes from all their ill gotten gains.

Until there is a complete clean out, Thai people will continue to carry on with their total lack of respect for both the law and the police. Traffic rules are a prime example.

[Classic Ray]

The police usually reflect the society in which they serve.

 

To root out police corruption there must be will from the society, its politicians and citizens, to change. It took many years using ICAC in Hong Kong to change, and that was when it was ruled by an external power. 
 

Until the Thai people say enough is enough, and elect leaders strong enough to implement change, nothing will improve.

 

Once corruption is entrenched in everyday life, it is extremely difficult to remove. In some countries it even took Revolution, but eg Russia, it has returned.

[mfd101]

A brick wall at dawn ...

[Rampant Rabbit]

ddint see the answer but halve the force double the salary would sort a lot of  it although for many its never  enough

[Pouatchee]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

A traffic offender feeling the urge to “settle” charges right on the spot because it would be cheaper and more convenient is an early symptom.

 

this one, i can understand. the whole ticket system is archaic and dates back to the Mesozoic era. back home the cop writes up a ticket and you can pay at any bank or send a check in the mail. here, they take our licences (i am not sure if this has changed yet... i have not got a ticket in a while... but it was supposed to change) and we have to go pay at the station. if i am coming from bkk and going to rayong, i dont want to waste time by going to the station...

 

in a nutshell, the whole system was rigged to promote corruption. but hey, who am i to complain? i am just a falang even if i should have my green card already. 

[RobU]

1. Pay a decent salary

2. Supply all equipment required to do the job, free of charge. (I understand traffic cops have to buy and maintain their own motorbikes, I don't know if they have to buy their own uniforms)

3. No on the spot fines, all fines must be paid at the court. 

4. All weapons to be supplied by the force and checked and maintained by an armourer. When a policeman is retired, sacked or suspended all weapons should be handed in and accounted for. 

5. Proper investigation of corrupt practice by an independent authority

Policing can be a dangerous job police run towards trouble when prudent citizens run away. Police officers can feel alienated from the people that they protect and think they may as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb so start taking bribes. 

[klauskunkel]

Quote

Police reform may be easier than everyone thinks

especially when it's the police themselves doing the reform, then it's gonna be real easy 

 

On a sidenote, the correct name for the Thai police is "Royal Thai Police". In news articles that name was much more in use in the past, now it seems the "Royal" portion does not show up when describing those  scandals. IMO, there is definitely some distancing going on.

[brianthainess]

''Police reform may be easier than everyone thinks''

 I don't think so, and nothing in this report suggests otherwise. 

Why even post this stupid story.

[SABloke]

3 hours ago, Srikcir said:

"Police reform may be easier than everyone thinks"

But the entire article seems to point towards an impossible path to reform of deeply embedded corruption. Nowhere in the article is suggested any "easy" solutions. And that maybe the real truth.

Those who are supposed to enforce the rule of law distort and abuse the rule of law. This destructive culture might stem from decades of military direct and indirect control of the nation punctuated with frequent military coups that defy the rule of law and Thai people's sovereignty.

 

It's just a typical Tulsathit Taptim word salad. Save your braincells and avoid reading his dribble in the future. 

[Tropicalevo]

3 hours ago, Srikcir said:

"Police reform may be easier than everyone thinks"

But the entire article seems to point towards an impossible path to reform of deeply embedded corruption. Nowhere in the article is suggested any "easy" solutions. And that maybe the real truth.

Those who are supposed to enforce the rule of law distort and abuse the rule of law. This destructive culture might stem from decades of military direct and indirect control of the nation punctuated with frequent military coups that defy the rule of law and Thai people's sovereignty.

"Police reform may be easier than everyone thinks"

It does not say that it is easy. Just easier than people think.

Looking at many comments here, some AN posters think that it is impossible.

The article explains that it is not impossible. It takes determination and planning.

 

The measure will take time, but this is not a problem that can be fixed with one piece of magical legislation, gag orders, endless transfers or setting up of fact-finding committees that will not recommend any purge anyway.

 

Those countries cultivate young players, preparing them for the dangers that come with ability and fame. To have a capable and responsible police force for the long term, the same approach is required.

[Thingamabob]

The ruling elite, top police, top politicians and top busines people have no intention to tackle police corruption so it will not happen.

[Pouatchee]

2 hours ago, RobU said:

Policing can be a dangerous job police run towards trouble when prudent citizens run away.

 

 you obviously dont know thai police. couple years ago, in rayong, there was a gold shop robbery. police had plenty of time to get there, but waited for perpetrators to be gone before showing up. it made the news and people were really pee'd off.

 

only reason these corrupt @$$ wipes have a gun is for intimidating the honest folk.

[bamnutsak]

The RTP is simply put, Organized Crime. Full stop.

 

 

Maybe with a civilian oversight board, that is Royally Sanctioned, some progress could be made.

 

 

But let's be honest. No one wants, nor has the power, to make changes.

 

 

 

[mikebell]

The first time a Thai citizen sees corruption in action is at the local cop level.  It grows upwards and outward from there and permeates every facet of Thai life.

[rudi49jr]

There is indeed one very easy solution: fire the whole lot and start building it from the ground up with non-corrupt people. Although finding non-corrupt people in Thailand who are willing to do the job may be a bit difficult.
One more tip: increase their wages so they can live on it, and don’t have to resort to illegal measures to supplement their meager income.

[Will B Good]

6 minutes ago, rudi49jr said:

There is indeed one very easy solution: fire the whole lot and start building it from the ground up with non-corrupt people. Although finding non-corrupt people in Thailand who are willing to do the job may be a bit difficult.
One more tip: increase their wages so they can live on it, and don’t have to resort to illegal measures to supplement their meager income.

OMG...being saying this for years...almost word for word.....nice to know there are two of us....555

[Seeall]

4 hours ago, RobU said:

1. Pay a decent salary

2. Supply all equipment required to do the job, free of charge. (I understand traffic cops have to buy and maintain their own motorbikes, I don't know if they have to buy their own uniforms)

3. No on the spot fines, all fines must be paid at the court. 

4. All weapons to be supplied by the force and checked and maintained by an armourer. When a policeman is retired, sacked or suspended all weapons should be handed in and accounted for. 

5. Proper investigation of corrupt practice by an independent authority

Policing can be a dangerous job police run towards trouble when prudent citizens run away. Police officers can feel alienated from the people that they protect and think they may as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb so start taking bribes. 

They pay for their own guns that's why you see some relics of course maintain to support condition

[Mavideol]

can not do.... in order to reform the police they have to wipe out their DNA, the "virus" has been infecting them for so long that's the only way out

[bkk6060]

Recruiting properly, training and wages.

Would take several years and a lot of money do much of anything.  And, they need to bring in foreign advisors to start it right. It will never change just like the horrific drivers, bad air, etc.   

[RobU]

2 hours ago, Pouatchee said:

 

 you obviously dont know thai police. couple years ago, in rayong, there was a gold shop robbery. police had plenty of time to get there, but waited for perpetrators to be gone before showing up. it made the news and people were really pee'd off.

 

only reason these corrupt @$$ wipes have a gun is for intimidating the honest folk.

Here's a thought, why should they risk their lives for peanuts? Low wages, debt having to buy their own equipment. I don't know about police widows pensions and disability pensions but I'll bet they are virtually non existent

[timendres]

5 hours ago, RobU said:

1. Pay a decent salary

2. Supply all equipment required to do the job, free of charge. (I understand traffic cops have to buy and maintain their own motorbikes, I don't know if they have to buy their own uniforms)

 

This. You cannot remove the bribery without paying a living wage, which the current salaries are not.

[biggles45]

You could double their wage but corruption is so ingrained into the system that they would be unlikely to forgo that income

 For those at the top, paying millions of corruptly obtained baht to secure a more powerful position you could not pay them enough. 

[RobU]

3 hours ago, timendres said:

 

This. You cannot remove the bribery without paying a living wage, which the current salaries are not.

I agree

[Pouatchee]

3 hours ago, RobU said:

Here's a thought, why should they risk their lives for peanuts?

 

Because they chose this career. Plain and simple.

Do i agree they are not paid enough?  yes

Do i laugh when i see them on silly motorcycles instead of cars? yes

 

but they chose this career path. no excuses there