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Its Happening - Law to Tax Overseas Income Now in Progress


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2 hours ago, HappyExpat57 said:

I suspect renewing your extension will be tied in with proof of filing taxes. Nothing good will come of this to retirees.

I'll worry about that in Dec 2025.

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10 minutes ago, connda said:

And provide an path for "tax residents" to become Permanent Residents based on their tax status, and to eventually be able to have a path to Citizenship as we are taxed like Thai citizens. 

 

Sir you must be joking....No way ever will this happen...Maybe a 50% discount on a McDonalds happy meal for tax payers.....If your lucky....

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A piece from the Bangkok Post

 

Expats in Thailand, meanwhile, have raised questions about tax treatment of pension income from past employment when that money is brought into Thailand.

 

If this money is taxed in their home country and that country is one of the 61 that have agreements with Thailand to prevent double taxation, in theory there should be no problem. But debates about interpretation of the law are ongoing.

 

Ms Kulya said that in practice, collection of tax on foreign income will depend on international cooperation and information exchange. Thailand is already a member of the tax information exchange group spearheaded by the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD).

 

 

 

Please credit and share this article with others using this link: https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/ge … the-works. 

 

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Question: Does this tax on worldwide income mean that you will be taxed for your salary, say, in the US, where you keep most of your money? And THEN when you move some of that money to Thailand that Thailand has already taxed you on, will they also tax the remittance? Tax the money a second time they've already taxed before?

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21 minutes ago, jumbo said:

A piece from the Bangkok Post

 

Expats in Thailand, meanwhile, have raised questions about tax treatment of pension income from past employment when that money is brought into Thailand.

 

If this money is taxed in their home country and that country is one of the 61 that have agreements with Thailand to prevent double taxation, in theory there should be no problem. But debates about interpretation of the law are ongoing.

 

Ms Kulya said that in practice, collection of tax on foreign income will depend on international cooperation and information exchange. Thailand is already a member of the tax information exchange group spearheaded by the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD).

 

 

 

Please credit and share this article with others using this link: https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/ge … the-works. 

 

This rule was revised effective from Jan 1, 2024. Tax is now payable on foreign income regardless of when it is brought into the country. To give an example, Mr A sold shares in an overseas company in 2020, realised a capital gain and banked the money in an overseas account. If he brings the proceeds from that capital gain into Thailand in 2024, he must report it as assessable income when filing a tax return.

Please credit and share this article with others using this link: https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/general/2860812/law-to-tax-income-from-overseas-in-the-works.. View our policies at http://goo.gl/9HgTd and http://goo.gl/ou6Ip. © Bangkok Post PCL. All rights reserved.

 

Not much confidence in this article.

Seems like the author hasn't heard about P.O.162

Edited by tomkenet
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11 hours ago, NoDisplayName said:

I might consider getting me one of them 10-year China visas.  Unlimited entries for the bargain price of $140.  China also has a global tax system, but only takes affect for expats after 5 continuous years of tax residency, and the clock resets anytime you leave the country for more than 30 days.

 

That sounds pretty good.

 

But China...

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4 hours ago, JimHuaHin said:

Will income or taxable income be taxed?  In other words, will Thailand recognize that certain income in country A is not taxable in country A, that country A allows for certain allowances and deductions which are not available in Thailand?

The safe default assumption, is that it will be treated the same way the majority of countries in the world deal with it. You can explore what any other country taxing worldwide income does. Which is not always clear, but Thailand doesn't need to reinvent the wheel here.

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4 minutes ago, biervoormij said:

The US DTA does not cover IRA or 401K distributions so not exempt like social security or government pensions. I don't know how the Thailand RD will deal with this but saying it is exempt is not correct. I think if you are taking large 401K distributions you will have to pay the much higher Thailand tax rate.

This is a very interesting issue to me as I have a traditional taxed in the US as income IRA.

People with Roth IRA's are not taxed on withdrawals.

What's confusing to me is that why should the Thai tax system see any withdrawal from basically a retirement savings account (Roth IRA, trad IRA, or 401K) as income even if the U.S. system does? I'm not certain that they would. 

Also, IF they do, aren't people with Roth IRAs at risk as being taxed on withdrawals by Thailand even though they're exempt in the U.S.?

Is there really any DTA law to cover this mess?!?

Edited by Jingthing
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8 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

This is a very interesting issue to me as I have a traditional taxed in the US as income IRA.

People with Roth IRA's are not taxed on withdrawals.

What's confusing to me is that why should the Thai tax system see any withdrawal from basically a retirement savings account (Roth IRA, trad IRA, or 401K) as income even if the U.S. system does? I'm not certain that they would. 

The thing I find frustrating is the lack of details on issues like this. Until someone does a tax return we may not know how the RD will see these distributions and it may change between the current remitted income and if this global income comes into law.

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Just when the old threads were getting boring!  My last post on the part 2 thread was I can only hope someone will post another ambiguous tax article so everybody will lose their shttt. It has happened 🙂  BTW, do you guys know most countries expats here come from  have taxes on global income for residents.  

 

So when is everybody leaving? Yawn but then again this is SUPER entertaining.

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1 hour ago, redwood1 said:

 

Good idea.....Tax all those dirty farang condo owners until they are living on the street....While at the same time keep telling the world Thailands the hub for retirement.......lol........

 

Exactly. Tax the stupid.

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56 minutes ago, anchadian said:

All my income is sent directly to my Thai wife's bank account and I withdraw our living expenses each month and the balance of monies remaining is left in her account.

 

I have no other family members when I pass.

I'm thinking along the same lines as you. I qualify for the monthly income test. I'll send half to my account and half to Madams account. 450K each shouldn't attract much tax.

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1 hour ago, biervoormij said:

The US DTA does not cover IRA or 401K distributions so not exempt like social security or government pensions. I don't know how the Thailand RD will deal with this but saying it is exempt is not correct. I think if you are taking large 401K distributions you will have to pay the much higher Thailand tax rate.


i think a TRD official discussed this in a presentation to one of the chambers of commerce. The position was that IRA and 401k plans are considered self-directed pensions and distributions would be taxed as regular pension income under Thai tax laws.

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4 hours ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

omitted from the OP

 

If and when it is enacted

There was a quite a lot ommitted from the OP.

This article appeared on my phone a couple of days ago and the OP appears to be a redacted version.

https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/general/2860812/law-to-tax-income-from-overseas-in-the-works#:~:text=The Thai Revenue Department is,director-general of the department.

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6 hours ago, JimHuaHin said:

Correct me if I am wrong, but this is going to open a massive can of worms, and huge implementation problems for the TRD.

 

Will income or taxable income be taxed?  In other words, will Thailand recognize that certain income in country A is not taxable in country A, that country A allows for certain allowances and deductions which are not available in Thailand?

 

Will all current Thai DTAs be strictly enforced, or will they have to be renegotiated/amended?

 

How will people who have annuities or superannuation pensions, which have already been taxed when contributions were made, and are thus not taxed when payments are made, receive their annual reports which provide no indication of tax paid, as tax was paid many years in the past when contribution were made, successfully explain this to the TRD?  (The Australian Tax Office understands this, but will the TRD??  Will the TRD demand that I get a valid authorized documents from the ATO/super fund stating how much tax was paid 40 years ago when I started paying super??)

 

The conversion of daily, weekly, monthly, etc. foreign incomes, and allowances/deductions, to Thai Baht would mean that the TRD would have to provide a daily exchange rate for every global currency into Thai Baht.  Which in turn will present a burdensome nightmare to the expat tax resident attempting to calculate their foreign (taxable) income in Thai Baht.

 

Yes, it is doable, in advanced countries when the national taxation authority is automatically supplied income/tax data from all local employers, all local financial institutions, all government social welfare/security departments which provide government payments/pensions to the population, and various other government and private authorities.

 

But, TIT.

 

 

The information the Thais need will be served to them on a plate from your country as part of the CRS data exchange...as long as you admit in your country you are a Thai tax resident.

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2 hours ago, connda said:

I know one thing for sure.  Every year when I submit my extension based on marriage, right their in bold letters it says that I'm only "Visiting my Thai wife."   So much for "permanent." 

Permanent Residency is something completely different to visa status extension. Nothing to stop you pursuing that option.

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5 hours ago, Gottfrid said:

The biggest problem here is not the taxation itself. The horrible thing is that they will just take the money, and we will not be included in neither health system nor any pension system.

 

I dunno where you are from, but where I come from tax and social security are two different payments. They are not the same thing.

 

Generally, to get social security you have to be working, not merely paying tax on capital gains or foreign income.

 

That said, I despise taxation in general and socialism is inherently evil, IMHO

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