Manchester United

[smokie36]

8 minutes ago, Rc2702 said:

He went there for a payday and then got another bumper payday and got away with murder by questioning the direction of the club. Fair play for the wages like but let's not pretend his heart was ever in it for United till ringers.

 

Ringers?

[Rc2702]

Just now, RonniePickering22 said:

 

Ringers?

Ka-ching

[smokie36]

45 minutes ago, Rc2702 said:

Ka-ching

 

The drink has taken one of us at least.

[carmine]

5 hours ago, Rc2702 said:

He went there for a payday and then got another bumper payday and got away with murder by questioning the direction of the club. Fair play for the wages like but let's not pretend his heart was ever in it for United till ringers.

Totally irrelevant.  He went to United and the records speak for themselves.  His agent, Stratford i believe negotiated his pay increase which the club agreed, more fool them.  But no one can argue the commitment Rooney played with for United, and he was a great buy.

 

Scholes is a life long Oldham fan.....any stupid to say about him too?

[3 minus 2]

2 hours ago, carmine said:

Totally irrelevant.  He went to United and the records speak for themselves.  His agent, Stratford i believe negotiated his pay increase which the club agreed, more fool them.  But no one can argue the commitment Rooney played with for United, and he was a great buy.

 

Scholes is a life long Oldham fan.....any stupid to say about him too?

Yeah  rooney has to go down as one of utds best ever buys   off topic but  apparently he's absolutely  tearing the american lge up.

[Bredbury Blue]

7 hours ago, Rc2702 said:

He went there for a payday and then got another bumper payday and got away with murder by questioning the direction of the club. Fair play for the wages like but let's not pretend his heart was ever in it for United till ringers.

Using your logic, no player's (that isn't a fan of the club he plays for) heart is ever in to playing for his club. Thats nonsense isn't it. Some players give it 100% every time some don't. Not being a ManU fan i didn't  see him play every game but his heart looked it it when i saw him play.

[carmine]

29 minutes ago, 3 minus 2 said:

Yeah  rooney has to go down as one of utds best ever buys   off topic but  apparently he's absolutely  tearing the american lge up.

Yes, he's an older player, playing exceptionally well in a league more befitting of his age and the level of his play is highly commendable.  

[3 minus 2]

19 hours ago, carmine said:

Yes, he's an older player, playing exceptionally well in a league more befitting of his age and the level of his play is highly commendable.  

No ... he was the ONLY player england produced for ?? Years/ decades that could have hit the 'world class' table  he didnt but no one else got near him ... and of note again they are talking up wright phillips in new york i believe as one of the all time 'best' signings..goal ever 1.4 game.. pretty good.. funny cos he was the talented one that man city wanted shawn was there to look after his bro.. weird how that one worked out .

[3 minus 2]

19 hours ago, carmine said:

Yes, he's an older player, playing exceptionally well in a league more befitting of his age and the level of his play is highly commendable.  

This paints a clearer picture ... 11 by xmas.. thats bloody good going.. at 32 he should still be playin prem https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/wayne-rooney-sam-allardyce-everton-15301038

Edited October 19, 2018 by 3 minus 2

[carmine]

2 hours ago, 3 minus 2 said:

No ... he was the ONLY player england produced for ?? Years/ decades that could have hit the 'world class' table  he didnt but no one else got near him ... and of note again they are talking up wright phillips in new york i believe as one of the all time 'best' signings..goal ever 1.4 game.. pretty good.. funny cos he was the talented one that man city wanted shawn was there to look after his bro.. weird how that one worked out .

Don't agree with that, sorry. About Rooney, that is.  Gerrard and Lampard for starters.  Paul Scholes was world class and on a different level to Rooney.  Don't forget also, despite his record goals, Rooney never cracked in the euros or world cups.  Rather, he was completely disappointing.  

 

If i had the time i could name a hatful of players at the very least in his class or better.

Edited October 20, 2018 by carmine

[carmine]

2 hours ago, 3 minus 2 said:

This paints a clearer picture ... 11 by xmas.. thats bloody good going.. at 32 he should still be playin prem https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/wayne-rooney-sam-allardyce-everton-15301038

No, he shouldn't be playing in the premier league, the pace alone would finish him.  His form where he's currently playing bares no relation to how he would do back in the premier league.

[Kadilo]

3 hours ago, 3 minus 2 said:

No ... he was the ONLY player england produced for ?? Years/ decades that could have hit the 'world class' table  he didnt but no one else got near him ... and of note again they are talking up wright phillips in new york i believe as one of the all time 'best' signings..goal ever 1.4 game.. pretty good.. funny cos he was the talented one that man city wanted shawn was there to look after his bro.. weird how that one worked out .

Bradley Wright Phillips who 5 years ago ended up on loan at Brentford before going to the States. Who is talking him up apart from you? Has any Premiership team, even Championship or League One team tried to sign him?

 

He has done well to hit 100 goals in an inferior league which makes decent English players who are well past their best when they join look significantly better than they now are. Hence why the likes of him, Rooney, and Keane all continued to score goals and are/were successful there at the end of their careers , but if you brought them back would struggle to score regularly in the Championship. 

 

As for Rooney being the ONLY “world class” player England produced. Absolute nonsense. He weren’t world class and nowhere near the best. His legs had gone when he left Everton. He is at his level where he still looks decent and the fact no one is trying to sign him confirms that.  

 

Edited October 20, 2018 by Kadilo

[owl sees all]

Until Roon broke his metatarsal bone he was perhaps the most exciting player in European - if not world - footy.

 

He was never the same after the injury, although he has set records both for Man U and country.

 

So was/is he world class? For me 'yes', but just for a short spell in his career.

 

 

[Rc2702]

It's an interesting discussion but I think if anything it points to ibrahimovich being a better bet than anyone to return and succeed in the prem. The US league is a bit similar to the dutch leagues where you get players doing good numbers goal wise but cannot cut it in the Prem.

 

Jannsen v suarez

 

Looking at rooney and Phillips there ratios are decent but you look at ibrahimovich and he's a level above them and 4 years older so I still think he has more of a hunger but perhaps he's being smart to realise he's 37 and does not have the energy for a part time job when his season ends in USA.

 

 

 

 

 

[3 minus 2]

5 hours ago, carmine said:

Don't agree with that, sorry. About Rooney, that is.  Gerrard and Lampard for starters.  Paul Scholes was world class and on a different level to Rooney.  Don't forget also, despite his record goals, Rooney never cracked in the euros or world cups.  Rather, he was completely disappointing.  

 

If i had the time i could name a hatful of players at the very least in his class or better.

Gerrard lampard.. . exxellent players but wc A CHANCE to sit at the SAME  table the messi or ronnie'...NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS   scholesy was good .  vv good but same again.  rooney never QUITE  made it but he  came the closest.

[3 minus 2]

1 hour ago, Rc2702 said:

It's an interesting discussion but I think if anything it points to ibrahimovich being a better bet than anyone to return and succeed in the prem. The US league is a bit similar to the dutch leagues where you get players doing good numbers goal wise but cannot cut it in the Prem.

 

Jannsen v suarez

 

Looking at rooney and Phillips there ratios are decent but you look at ibrahimovich and he's a level above them and 4 years older so I still think he has more of a hunger but perhaps he's being smart to realise he's 37 and does not have the energy for a part time job when his season ends in USA.

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah.. but energy and pace too a degree can be managed and controlled it takes effort and HARD work but to a point it can be done look at ronaldo. Unfortunatly it was the cruciate injury that did for ibro.. post 27 atm note atm   it takes a yard of pace off and NOTHING any med regime can do..

[Rc2702]

Just now, 3 minus 2 said:

Yeah.. but energy and pace too a degree can be managed and controlled it takes effort and HARD work but to a point it can be done look at ronaldo. Unfortunatly it was the cruciate injury that did for ibro.. post 27 atm note atm   it takes a yard of pace off and NOTHING any med regime can do..

Injuries sustained in the past are not relevant. He just came back from a long lay off and has 20 in 21 in the same league your referencing for rooney and Phillips. Clearly a better player at 37. 

[Rc2702]

Just now, 3 minus 2 said:

Gerrard lampard.. . exxellent players but wc A CHANCE to sit at the SAME  table the messi or ronnie'...NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS   scholesy was good .  vv good but same again.  rooney never QUITE  made it but he  came the closest.

Gerrard and lampard were much better than rooney. Either ARD could have played for any team in the world. His debut for united was world class but that was it. Few wc goals too like but not WC.

[carmine]

34 minutes ago, 3 minus 2 said:

Gerrard lampard.. . exxellent players but wc A CHANCE to sit at the SAME  table the messi or ronnie'...NEVER IN A MILLION YEARS   scholesy was good .  vv good but same again.  rooney never QUITE  made it but he  came the closest.

Ronaldo and Messi have been on a completely different level to everyone else.   No one sits up there with those guys.  Rooney is not good enough to be spoken in any comparison.

 

Scholes wasn't just good he's arguably the best English midfield player of the last 25 years.  Whilst playing in different positions accepted, Rooney was not in the same class as Scholes.  Just my opinion of course.

Edited October 20, 2018 by carmine

[3 minus 2]

9 minutes ago, Rc2702 said:

Gerrard and lampard were much better than rooney. Either ARD could have played for any team in the world. His debut for united was world class but that was it. Few wc goals too like but not WC.

Lampard and gerrard couldnt even DREAM of being anywhere near the.same level as ronaldo or messi  rooney as did gazza stood a chance.. never made it but stood a chance. 

[Bredbury Blue]

8 hours ago, 3 minus 2 said:

No ... he was the ONLY player england produced for ?? Years/ decades that could have hit the 'world class' table  he didnt but no one else got near him ... and of note again they are talking up wright phillips in new york i believe as one of the all time 'best' signings..goal ever 1.4 game.. pretty good.. funny cos he was the talented one that man city wanted shawn was there to look after his bro.. weird how that one worked out .

^Where do you get that from? Twenty years or so since Shauney broke through at City and I've never heard that before and doubt it's correct.

 

SWP was absolutely brilliant for City before he went to Chelsea - he had such energy and speed - when he came back he was half the player.

 

Bradley played in over 30 Premier games for City but really wasn't good enough at Premier level.

 

SWP is nearly 37; his son D'margio plays for City and England u16s.

 

SWPs twitter profile (below) shows him having scored vs ManU; once a blue...

 

 

Edited October 20, 2018 by Bredbury Blue

[3 minus 2]

24 minutes ago, Rc2702 said:

Injuries sustained in the past are not relevant. He just came back from a long lay off and has 20 in 21 in the same league your referencing for rooney and Phillips. Clearly a better player at 37. 

Ibro joined arguably the biggest and best team and has done really well and as a gs center forward is outstanding BUT as a footballer .. no chance  not even on the same planet as rooney .. rooney joined a CRAP team in crisis and single handed turned their fortunes around.. go figure

 

I cant seem to cut and paste atm but the stats for pre and post rooney at dc are out there 

 

[Bredbury Blue]

Duplicate post deleted

Edited October 20, 2018 by Bredbury Blue

[3 minus 2]

1 minute ago, Bredbury Blue said:

^Where do you get that from? Twenty years or so since Shauney broke through at City and I've never heard that before and doubt it's correct.

 

SWP was absolutely brilliant for City before he went to Chelsea - he had such energy and speed - when he came back and was half the player.

 

Bradley played in over 30 Premier games for City but really wasn't good enough at Premier level.

 

SWP is nearly 37; his son D'margio plays for City and England u16s.

 

SWPs twitter profile (below) shows him having scored vs ManU; once a blue...

 

 

Up to you.. believe it or not..but  bradley w p's was then' the golden boy  that ALL wanted  but unfortunatly on reflection  had borderline personality disorder issue's that football just wasnt att equiped to deal with   and shawn   was the lesser talented one.. funny how players develop

[Bredbury Blue]

Based on R2D2's comments on Rooney I'm wondering how old he is because I'm guessing he didn't see Rooney in his pomp to see what a great player he was once (and I'm a City fan); for me Roomey was a notch above Gerrard and Lampard.

[Bredbury Blue]

4 minutes ago, 3 minus 2 said:

Up to you.. believe it or not..but  bradley w p's was then' the golden boy  that ALL wanted  but unfortunatly on reflection  had borderline personality disorder issue's that football just wasnt att equiped to deal with   and shawn   was the lesser talented one.. funny how players develop

So where did you get it from then that City picked up SWP to keep BWP company?

 

City picked up SWP late after he was released from Forest. Don't think  his talent was ever doubted, only his size.

[carmine]

31 minutes ago, 3 minus 2 said:

Lampard and gerrard couldnt even DREAM of being anywhere near the.same level as ronaldo or messi  rooney as did gazza stood a chance.. never made it but stood a chance. 

If you were to check Rooneys CL record compared to Messi and Ronaldo it will become very obvious that not only did he never get close to those two he's a totally different level of player.  The stats don't back up what you are saying.

 

I'd venture to say that in his peak Scholes could have started in any side in europe.  Rooney wouldn't.  Look at Lampard career goal scoring record, and all from midfield.  Phenomenal.  

[3 minus 2]

6 minutes ago, Bredbury Blue said:

So where did you get it from then that City picked up SWP to keep BWP company?

 

City picked up SWP late after he was released from Forest. Don't think  his talent was ever doubted, only his size.

I lived in the same area of london as they grew up in and knew kids that played with them my cuz being one of them  AND it was talked about on the media att of swp break through. 

 

4 minutes ago, carmine said:

If you were to check Rooneys CL record compared to Messi and Ronaldo it will become very obvious that not only did he never get close to those two he's a totally different level of player.  The stats don't back up what you are saying.

 

I'd venture to say that in his peak Scholes could have started in any side in europe.  Rooney wouldn't.  Look at Lampard career goal scoring record, and all from midfield.  Phenomenal.  

I repeat They WOULD NEVER  in amillion years been able to get to the same level as pele maradona  messi or ronaldo.. there was a chance witb rooney and gazza..neither did make it but there was a glimmer.. the others NO CHANCE

[carmine]

5 minutes ago, 3 minus 2 said:

I lived in the same area of london as they grew up in and knew kids that played with them my cuz being one of them  AND it was talked about on the media att of swp break through. 

 

I repeat They WOULD NEVER  in amillion years been able to get to the same level as pele maradona  messi or ronaldo.. there was a chance witb rooney and gazza..neither did make it but there was a glimmer.. the others NO CHANCE

OK i think what you are trying is that Rooney was in a different class to the others i've mentioned.  If so, i simply don't agree.

[3 minus 2]

5 minutes ago, carmine said:

OK i think what you are trying is that Rooney was in a different class to the others i've mentioned.  If so, i simply don't agree.

Putting it v v simply for you.. gazza and rooney HAD enough of the raw talent to think they POSSIBLY could  join pele maradona messi ronaldo at that level the others thèy JUST DIDNT