Confusion reigns as Thailand ATM users set to pay more

[jabis]

BBL has been offering chip cards for a while. But they would work only at BBL ATMs, that why I declined. Will they now work at all ATMs across banks and even countries?

---------------------------------

i have have a Bangkok Bank Be1st Debit card for over 3 years NOT a Credt card a Debit card......and i have sucessfully used the card to withdraw funds in Malaysia, Singapore. and Vietnam.

From local bank ATMs in those countries which have an agrement with Bangkok Bank to honor Be1st cards.

That was one of the reasons I applied for a Be1st card. when i opened my account.

My current card i still one of the old type with the magnetic strip......but next month i may switch to the card with a chip.

Even if it costs me 200 Baht to convert.....it is worth it.

Do you have to report to them,that you are leaving the country and

will be using your card there?

Just I Remember my daugher,came here from UK,first time she used her card here,

within 15 mins,she had a phone call from her mother saying the service centre for

the card had phoned to report someone using the card in Thailand,(could just imagineI

flashing red lights sirens going off,someone using unauthorised card in Thailand).

regards worgeordie

I've been to the phone several times during the years, eventhough I've announced to the operators that I've moved over to the area permanently, and that I indeed do business here in SEA-region, and find it quite disturbing to constantly having my cards "frozen", as well as it is costly to have to call their service numbers overseas. My phone number is in their records, so they could at least just give me a call without automatically freezing them cards that I rarely use x)

My daughter lives in the states and she bought a special pouch to keep her chipped cards in after reading reports that thieves with special devices can steal the information off your card while it's still in your purse or pocket. The pouch is made of a material that blocks the devices from reading the cards chip. Anyone else heard of this?

Those cards come with RFID chips that enable small purchases - the issue is, the criminals would need to have a company thus have had to apply for a license for accepting the payments. Reading the RFID chip doesn't do much good if the signatures haven't been verified - much like the commuter cards where you top up money for local transport. Where someone reads the information - it without the decryption (key) are quite futile - all as well as one would need a "proper" channel to siphon the money without raising red flags. (about a paragraph vanished in between my writing and posting - too lazy to rewrite )

Edited May 20, 2016 by jabis

[jabis]

Given time, the crocks will find a way to crack not only chips, but also fish and chips that the

banks will introduce, so far the criminals are winning big times, and the banks don't care

for some reasons, and what happened to all those dozens skimmers that got caught already?

nobody knows.......

No need to wait, that's already happened. Malware exists that can compromise the ATM itself. The chip helps for now, but it's a never-ending cat & mouse game, the chip technology itself (referred to as EMV) hasn't actually been implemented properly in many instances to begin with, and even cards with chips are susceptible to being "scraped". Banks and businesses are like some people here on TVF: they have selective memories and don't tend to accept as real the bad things that haven't happened to them personally yet. Anyway, here's some info.

http://blog.trendmicro.com/%E2%80%8Bdefending-against-new-pos-malware-with-emv-technology/

http://www.trendmicro.com/vinfo/us/security/news/security-technology/faq-emv-credit-cards

Some more recent malware is really focused on the ATM itself, and can make it give up cash without anyone's card or strip or chip. That should make banks sit up & take notice I would think...

http://resources.infosecinstitute.com/hacking-atms-new-wave-malware/

There's not much about the muslim world that I find attractive, but the practice of cutting off the hands of thieves does have a certain appeal...

Well at least if the ATM is running Windows XP like most in SEA-region do.

Implementation of the countermeasures surely is the key - but TiT

[BlindMagician]

Given time, the crocks will find a way to crack not only chips, but also fish and chips that the

banks will introduce, so far the criminals are winning big times, and the banks don't care

for some reasons, and what happened to all those dozens skimmers that got caught already?

nobody knows.......

What are you on?

[kannot]

wow bet the scammers are even happier as they can now extract using atm machines and order stuff via debit.....good plan

[hgma]

its a question of time to introduce the tourist atm cards, chipped when a foreigner applies.

Charged like all rich tourist can afford, in this land of the poor.

[geriatrickid]

What this is really all about. The hip pocket.

But the public have been asking about possible charges for changing their cards and a suggested increase in yearly charges with the new system.

Big Banks finding new ways to get more money out of the punters?

This could well come in under the topic of, 'Is Thailand Becoming Too Westernised'

My Australian Bank is an expert at it, has been for some time. And don't tell me to change banks, because so are all the others.

If you don't like it, then do not use a bank. Keep your money in a sock under your bed.

I don't understand people like you. You want a third party to provide banking services for free or at a cost that you set.

The folks who own the banks, people like you, expect a sizable return on their funds and they become angry when they don't get it.

[4MyEgo]

I can't see why everyone just does as what is expected of them by the banks without thinking, "seriously guys" you put your money in the bank to keep it safe, the banks charge you an annual fee and provide you with very little interest, and the banks lend out your money, and make money on it, far more money than they pay you in interest, and now they have come up with a proposal which has been around for years in western countries, 'to make their ATM machines safer, so they don't have to reimburse you once you get fleeced from a skimmer on their ATM machine, and you have to pay for the new card, nice try sh-t for brains.

Mr Bank, please read the above, if you wish to charge me for a new card as you have been charging me for every time I withdrawal money from an ATM machine when I am outside of my area (not often), and charge me a fee when I deposit out of my area (not often), and then charge me 200 baht every year to get a bank statement to provide immigration for my retirement visa, welcome to the 21st century as I WON'T BE PAYING FOR IT.

I know how to close my account, perhaps the rest of the flock should follow as I can see the banks waiving any fee for the new card, which should be their cost, as its their change to the card. For the record I have a debit card with a western bank, and have had it for a decade, no ATM charges for withdrawals over $200 at any banks ATM machines and no annual fees.

Come to think about it, I might start shopping around now.

Edited May 21, 2016 by 4MyEgo

[tominbkk]

Dont see what's the confusion...chip cards are being introduced...old cards are good for another 3 years.

Just another typical TVF baitclick title.

[55Jay]

My daughter lives in the states and she bought a special pouch to keep her chipped cards in after reading reports that thieves with special devices can steal the information off your card while it's still in your purse or pocket. The pouch is made of a material that blocks the devices from reading the cards chip. Anyone else heard of this?

Those (are supposed to) protect RFID enabled cards from pocket skimming - like the proximity payment cards, "touch and go", etc., which is different than the visible Smart Chip.

My elderly mom in the US got somewhat taken in by the marketing for these protective card sleeves. She wasn't "scammed", she just didn't know any better.

I looked at all her cards (and IDs) during my last visit, and couldn't find any indication they were RFID enabled. She said she never asked the bank for a new card, and hadn't received any new cards in the mail with "touch and go" type payment capability.

She then pointed to the visible Smart Chip on a Wells Fargo bank card, "Well, what's that?", and said she assumed that's what the card sleeve was designed to protect.

[onthemoon]

I'll continue to use my ATM-only, non-debit, non-credit, non-chip card until I'm forced to change it.

Then I might not bother with any card and just get money out at the bank with my bank-book.

Averse to development, are we? Times change...

It called security. I would never use a credit or debit card in Thailand.

I haven't had a problem with cards in Thailand for the past 20 odd years. I use cards for security purposes: If cash is stolen out of your pocket (or from the sock under your bed), it's gone.

If your credit card gets stolen, you make a phone call and block it (happened to me before, in Europe).

If you find a suspicious entry in your card bill, you call and have them either prove that you signed it (happened to me before), or they cancel the charge (happened to me before).

When paying for services online, which is not possible with cash, I get an SMS every time the card is charged. If it wasn't me, a call will ensure that I won't be charged for it.

That's why I use cards: For increased security.

[Bangkok Barry]

ATM transactions, cards and accounts are all free of charge where I live.

Me too, from the UK. No charge for the ATM/Debit card, no charge for my contactless Visa card either when they are renewed. Why does Thailand charge? For the same reason it is the only country that I know of that charges for using a foreign card at the ATM, and even for Thais to use their card in a different part of the country to where their account is. Because they can, because of greed.

[doctormann]

Recently changed my TMB debit card to chip and PIN, at their request.

My old card was about to expire anyway but I didn't expect to be charged 500 Baht for the new one. Seemed a bit steep!

When any of my UK cards come up for renewal there is never any charge for this service but. of course, we have to deal with Thai banks here so not same same.

DM

[hugh2121]

Dont see what's the confusion...chip cards are being introduced...old cards are good for another 3 years.

The confusion is that banks are keeping any increased charges secret and some are charging for the new card and some are not.

[BernieOnTour]

what a discusion!

about 100 baht ??? - that's less than 2 beers... distributed over the validity period of 3 years, less than 3 baht a month.

[jacko45k]

ATM transactions, cards and accounts are all free of charge where I live.

I believe that statement fits my UK card and account, providing I use it only in the UK.

Use it overseas and I pay, use it in Thailand it is even more.

[freedom4life]

Most likely an excuse to better track you with chip-cards..no thanks they can keep it. Who are the real criminals?

[petedk]

Recently changed my TMB debit card to chip and PIN, at their request.

My old card was about to expire anyway but I didn't expect to be charged 500 Baht for the new one. Seemed a bit steep!

When any of my UK cards come up for renewal there is never any charge for this service but. of course, we have to deal with Thai banks here so not same same.

DM

TMB charged the girlfriend 100 baht.

Must be 2 tier pricing.

SCB didn't charge me anything

Edited May 21, 2016 by petedk

[MyFriend You]

Given time, the crocks will find a way to crack not only chips, but also fish and chips that the

banks will introduce, so far the criminals are winning big times, and the banks don't care

for some reasons, and what happened to all those dozens skimmers that got caught already?

nobody knows.......

Their are teaching the BiB how their scams work so...........Aaaah............Uuumm - Oh, teaching them, so more thieves can be caught!!................whew, that was difficult to get out. But we all would hope they were either prosecuted, incarcerated, and will be deported after serving their sentence's.

[pogal]

650 baht at Kasikorn!
I said I just wanted the old card and they insisted I must have the new one along with some insurance for accident!

Next day my Thai friend managed to open one without insurance for 500 and they said starting end of this month all cards must be chipped with a 6 digit PIN.

[Dumbastheycome]

The only timeI have had a fraudulent use of a credit card number was 20 years ago and that occurred after using it in a franchise store in the USA. The nominal fee I pay for insurance on such fraudulent covered the debits by approximately 1000 percent. Never since have I had any issues with the exception of temporary blocking of charges on a purhase made from a location not usual to historic locations. Resolved within minutes via alert and answer emails

.Banks are definately hungry dogs.And in the past when using credit they had more control.

Using debit facilities internationally actually gives customers of the "service" a lot more "right".

Those that use credit are basically caught by the short and curlies.

[OMGImInPattaya]

ATM transactions, cards and accounts are all free of charge where I live.

Me too, from the UK. No charge for the ATM/Debit card, no charge for my contactless Visa card either when they are renewed. Why does Thailand charge? For the same reason it is the only country that I know of that charges for using a foreign card at the ATM, and even for Thais to use their card in a different part of the country to where their account is. Because they can, because of greed.

Thai banks endeavor to make a profit in the banking business and usually, as with most businesses, that involves not giving away your product for free. Its also probably a reason why the Thai financial sector sailed through the Western financial crisis of 2008-10, without breaking a sweat, while many financial institutions in the UK went bust or required government bailouts.

[OMGImInPattaya]

Recently changed my TMB debit card to chip and PIN, at their request.

My old card was about to expire anyway but I didn't expect to be charged 500 Baht for the new one. Seemed a bit steep!

When any of my UK cards come up for renewal there is never any charge for this service but. of course, we have to deal with Thai banks here so not same same.

DM

Probably got suckered into buying a card with some worthless insurance add-on. Cards without insurance are only B 200-300.

[OMGImInPattaya]

Dont see what's the confusion...chip cards are being introduced...old cards are good for another 3 years.

The confusion is that banks are keeping any increased charges secret and some are charging for the new card and some are not.

How exactly does a business keep charges secret that they are charging you for?

[OMGImInPattaya]

650 baht at Kasikorn!

I said I just wanted the old card and they insisted I must have the new one along with some insurance for accident!

Next day my Thai friend managed to open one without insurance for 500 and they said starting end of this month all cards must be chipped with a 6 digit PIN.

Another suckered by the insurance...it is true that sometimes branches do run out of the non-insurance cards (they are actually physically different cards) so they will tell you all the cards available [at that time] are insurance atm cards. You can ask them when they expect to receive another batch of the "regular" cards.

[samsensam]

ATM transactions, cards and accounts are all free of charge where I live.

Nothing is ever free from a bank, your paying somewhere

not true. i have been a midland bank then HSBC customer since university some 30 years ago. as long as i stay in credit i pay no charges. as i have been in credit for the last 30 years i have paid zero bank charges for 30 years banking.

i pay off the full amount on my two credit cards every month and so again pay zero charges and no interest.

it's common sense to me; keep your finances in order, understand how your bank account/credit card work and you wont have to pay a penny to a bank

[onthemoon]

Most likely an excuse to better track you with chip-cards..no thanks they can keep it. Who are the real criminals?

How is tracking you by chip card "better" than tracking you by magnetic strip?

Same same, my friend.

[onthemoon]

ATM transactions, cards and accounts are all free of charge where I live.

Me too, from the UK. No charge for the ATM/Debit card, no charge for my contactless Visa card either when they are renewed. Why does Thailand charge? For the same reason it is the only country that I know of that charges for using a foreign card at the ATM, and even for Thais to use their card in a different part of the country to where their account is. Because they can, because of greed.

Thai banks endeavor to make a profit in the banking business and usually, as with most businesses, that involves not giving away your product for free. Its also probably a reason why the Thai financial sector sailed through the Western financial crisis of 2008-10, without breaking a sweat, while many financial institutions in the UK went bust or required government bailouts.

That's historically untrue. The Global Financial Crisis [tm] of 2008-2009 was caused by US banks buying substandard loans and derivatives thereof. Many Asian (including Thai) banks did not participate in that. That's why they weren't directly affected.

Edited May 21, 2016 by onthemoon

[cpofc]

ATM transactions, cards and accounts are all free of charge where I live.

Me too, from the UK. No charge for the ATM/Debit card, no charge for my contactless Visa card either when they are renewed. Why does Thailand charge? For the same reason it is the only country that I know of that charges for using a foreign card at the ATM, and even for Thais to use their card in a different part of the country to where their account is. Because they can, because of greed.

Thai banks endeavor to make a profit in the banking business and usually, as with most businesses, that involves not giving away your product for free. Its also probably a reason why the Thai financial sector sailed through the Western financial crisis of 2008-10, without breaking a sweat, while many financial institutions in the UK went bust or required government bailouts.

That's historically untrue. The Global Financial Crisis [tm] of 2008-2009 was caused by US banks buying substandard loans and derivatives thereof. Many Asian (including Thai) banks did not participate in that. That's why they weren't directly affected.

Marvellous isn't it. People sitting in front of the greatest reference tool in the history of mankind and they still waffle crap without doing any research.

Does Sub-Prime ring a bell?

Yes you are quite right, the Thai banks were not exposed to Sub-Prime. Neither were the Australian Banks. Known as the Big Four. There are only four major banks in the entire country and they have a controlling monopoly unlike any in the world. Not only were Australian Banks not exposed to Sub-Prime but they made a fortune out of the GFC. The were touted as the best, most profitable in the WORLD during this period. All retaining their AAA Ratings. never in doubt.

While it is great to read about everyone's personal banking habits etc., the bottom line here, this topic, is about whether the Thais are going to get hit with fees or charges. I can only imagine it is a big a deal here, with the man in the street, as it would be back home in Australia. The punters are sick of getting hit with fees as the banks continually post record profits, quarter after quarter, year after year, as they do in Australia. Massive profits! Mind boggling profits!

It is so bad in Australia, that if Immigration wasn't the hottest issue dominating the upcoming Federal Election - Banking more than likely would be. Scandals abound in the Banking Industry in Australia and Labor have promised a Royal Commission into the banks if they are elected. There is widespread support from an extremely fed up public.

Actually I pay little to no fees anymore, I am pretty well sorted, but if I wanted to waste a few hours I could post up some things my bank in Australia has done to me that would make your hair curl. Nothing to does with everyday fees, but about other dishonest practices, Like when the glorified bank teller took it upon herself to change my Australian Citizen/Resident Status and start slugging me 'Withholding Tax' at the Top Rate! All because, when I called the bank with a query I mentioned I was calling from Thailand. Don't believe me? Ok. Never mind. Forget I mentioned it.

[cpofc]

Oops I forgot to mention, about this you beaut Insurance 'Scam' deal

Do yourself a favour, forego the 'Insurance Extra' when purchasing your chipped card. It's a snip. For what? Bit like that Extended Warranty garbage when you buy something here,

How do I know this. I don't. But I would like to be as sure as winning the lottery.

Which Bank?

Commonwealth Bank staff implicated in alleged $76m fraud

http://www.smh.com.au/business/banking-and-finance/commonwealth-bank-staff-implicated-in-alleged-76m-fraud-20160204-gmllia.html

Edited May 21, 2016 by cpofc

[nausea]

Do you live in the UK samsensam, because HSBC closed down their Thai domestic business some time ago, so your comments wouldn't really apply to Thailand, would they.