Expat volunteers in Chiang Mai denied visas in work permit standoff

[snoop1130]

Expat volunteers in Chiang Mai denied visas in work permit standoff

 

 

The head of two foundations in Chiang Mai has revealed to Thaivisa that a standoff between the new head of the Chiang Mai labor office and the city's immigration department is causing trouble for up to a thousand foreigners who are volunteering at charities in the province. 

Our source - who has asked not to be named - said that visas were not being issued because volunteers were being denied work permits. 

He called it a standoff between the new head of the labor department and Chiang Mai immigration. 

Thaivisa understands the labor department in Chiang Mai has not been issuing work permits for foreign volunteers, with immigration then saying "sorry, we can't issue you visas as you don't have a work permit", said the source. 

He said this was causing serious problems for long term non-immigrant "O" volunteers and charitable foundations and that as many as 1000 foreigners are affected.

 

-- © Copyright Thai Visa News 2018-8-1

[ThaiPauly]

You couldn't make this stuff up...sheesh

 

They are trying to HELP, they are asking for NOTHING IN RETURN

 

Unbelieveable

[ukrules]

This new 'head of the labour office' is clearly not following the rules or doing their job properly.

 

Report them to the main department in Bangkok and get him / her bought into line or fired.

Edited August 1, 2018 by ukrules

[kotsak]

The epitome of gratitude..

[BritManToo]

I can see their point, there have been loads of white foreign bogus volunteers in CM getting VISAs.

You pay an agent, they set you up with a charity, you get a 1 year VISA for turning up for 1 or 2 days.

I've known at least two guys in the past who did this (both under 50s).

Edited August 1, 2018 by BritManToo

[Briggsy]

How many of these volunteers are evangelists?

[taipan1949]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I can see their point, there have been loads of white foreign bogus volunteers in CM getting VISAs.

You pay an agent, they set you up with a charity, you get a 1 year VISA for turning up for 1 or 2 days.

I've known at least two guys in the past who did this.

Thank you.

[moontang]

A high percentage are undereducated, unskilled, negative worth pricks, who left bigger messes at home to come save the world in Chiang Mai.  Apparently, the numerous dodgy guesthouses no longer have mirrors.

 

And thank you so much for feeding all the SO I dogs, a great humanitarian effort.  Keep up the good work, maybe CM will be entirely alcohol free soon.  Jesus would have wanted it that way..Buddha, too.

Edited August 1, 2018 by moontang

[from the home of CC]

34 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I can see their point, there have been loads of white foreign bogus volunteers in CM getting VISAs.

You pay an agent, they set you up with a charity, you get a 1 year VISA for turning up for 1 or 2 days.

I've known at least two guys in the past who did this (both under 50s).

Never heard about this till now (maybe cause I never looked for a back door in). There must be some legitimate volunteer work happening don't you think? Is this a case of a few bad apples.... Honestly looking for answers cause like I said I wasn't aware of this.

[ukrules]

It doesn't matter why they're doing it, banning work permits for all volunteers is just about one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

 

If there are a few bad apples then they should find them by doing their jobs. You can't blanket ban everyone.

 

Word will make its way back to the top and this situation will end.

Edited August 1, 2018 by ukrules

[PJPom]

Pay a lot of money and you too can become a volunteer, this has to be one of the biggest cons going. 

Unqualified and in some case totally untrustworthy people try to enter through the back door and in the process make some people very rich, about time it was clamped down on by Immigration.

[overherebc]

1 hour ago, taipan1949 said:

Thank you.

Oh no no no. According to many poster reading another thread ' work permit conditions and issue have been blown wide open.'

PS.

 I agree with your answer but can't find the sarcarsm emoji.

Edited August 1, 2018 by overherebc

[moontang]

2 minutes ago, PJPom said:

Pay a lot of money and you too can become a volunteer, this has to be one of the biggest cons going. 

Unqualified and in some case totally untrustworthy people try to enter through the back door and in the process make some people very rich, about time it was clamped down on by Immigration.

not to mention the obvious problems with orphanage tourism..FFsake

[from the home of CC]

IMO I would think that being an altruistic type person, giving back or paying it forward, it wouldn't matter where I practiced my selflessness. If it was me, I'd probably start in my own homeland where in my country (Canada)there's always a need for someone to step up and help others. With all these people that come here to lend a hand, are they leaving places that don't need anybody to volunteer to help? And also if it were me, I wouldn't travel across the world to help a nation that makes me jump through hoops to do it, it would be at home where it would be appreciated.

[moontang]

exactly...I used to ask why so many found it necessary to pay huge money to adoption agencies in china, when there were 10,000 kids in foster care in Washington DC, alone.  Even I. some very wealthy areas, you d not have to go far to find needy, or at least some very needy athletes and students.

[THAIJAMES]

50 minutes ago, from the home of CC said:

IMO I would think that being an altruistic type person, giving back or paying it forward, it wouldn't matter where I practiced my selflessness. If it was me, I'd probably start in my own homeland where in my country (Canada)there's always a need for someone to step up and help others. With all these people that come here to lend a hand, are they leaving places that don't need anybody to volunteer to help? And also if it were me, I wouldn't travel across the world to help a nation that makes me jump through hoops to do it, it would be at home where it would be appreciated.

In most cases it has nothing to do with altruism.  More of an ego thing.  looks good when you go half way around the world for an apparently selfless purpose.  Which looks great on paper.  But when you dig deeper, the organization has provided no benefit, just wasted a lot of money and in some cases has brought more problems.

[tfc]

If it wasn't for the "spirit" of "volunteering" expert divers from around the world wouldn't have essentially dropped what they were doing and come over to Chiang Rai to help rescue the kids trapped in the cave. 

Edited August 1, 2018 by tfc

[moontang]

37 minutes ago, tfc said:

If it wasn't for the "spirit" of "volunteering" expert divers from around the world wouldn't have essentially dropped what they were doing and come over to Chiang Rai to help rescue the kids trapped in the cave. 

just one small detail and difference:  they were highly skilled.

[balo]

Plenty of missionaries  in CM .  Most of them are Americans , they have a "call" and want to save the poor souls from the hill tribes like the Akha people. Many of them are disgusting people , sorry to say it. 

[NancyL]

4 hours ago, tfc said:

If it wasn't for the "spirit" of "volunteering" expert divers from around the world wouldn't have essentially dropped what they were doing and come over to Chiang Rai to help rescue the kids trapped in the cave. 

 

1 hour ago, balo said:

 

3 hours ago, moontang said:

just one small detail and difference:  they were highly skilled.

 

And another small detail -- many of them knew about the onerous rules concerning "volunteering" in Thailand and made a point of receiving special dispensation before entering the cave.  Remember the tsunami and how the people who came to help were treated?  

 

Frankly, the real surprise about the cave incident is that Thailand actually reached out and accepted expert help from foreign volunteers.  

 

[Thian]

8 hours ago, THAIJAMES said:

In most cases it has nothing to do with altruism.  More of an ego thing.  looks good when you go half way around the world for an apparently selfless purpose.  Which looks great on paper.  But when you dig deeper, the organization has provided no benefit, just wasted a lot of money and in some cases has brought more problems.

I met several young people/travellers/backpackers who would love to do volunteerswork in Thailand....but when i tell them they have to pay for that they can't believe it....it totally shatters their dream of free travelling and "doing something good for the world".

 

 

[cornishcarlos]

11 hours ago, ukrules said:

get him / her bought into line

 

He/she will already be using Line and Facebook, which is why they don't have time to do their job properly ?

[gk10002000]

12 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I can see their point, there have been loads of white foreign bogus volunteers in CM getting VISAs.

You pay an agent, they set you up with a charity, you get a 1 year VISA for turning up for 1 or 2 days.

I've known at least two guys in the past who did this (both under 50s).

no doubt many people are abusing the intent of the visas.  I am sure of a few I see posting on youtube blogging and trying make a few bucks a day that way are there in Thailand as "volunteers".  Nothing against volunteers.  So many really do mean well.  But many are there for far from altruistic reasons.  Evangelists, missionaries, that are really there trying to further their church or organization goals than to help the Thais. 

[dotpoom]

13 hours ago, ThaiPauly said:

You couldn't make this stuff up...sheesh

 

They are trying to HELP, they are asking for NOTHING IN RETURN

 

Unbelieveable

If it were me and I just wanted to help my fellow man (irrespective of what country), then I would simply go to another country where my help was welcomed and appreciated....and not be wasting my time with places that just want to put obstacles in my way.

[chrisinth]

9 hours ago, tfc said:

If it wasn't for the "spirit" of "volunteering" expert divers from around the world wouldn't have essentially dropped what they were doing and come over to Chiang Rai to help rescue the kids trapped in the cave. 

That's true, but they weren't asking for work permits. They were proper volunteers in every sense of the word.

[Kerryd]

I suspect that at least one person (or maybe both of them) have clued in that the majority of the "volunteers" are in fact just scammers. Just like how so many so called "charities" are nothing but a rip-off where people play on other people's sympathies to generate donations that they then use to pay themselves very nice salaries and claim all their expenses against the charity.

Kind of like how most religions have operated for centuries.

 

Could be that "someone" has read some forum(s) somewhere where "volunteers" like to talk about how easy it is to scam a visa by pretending to be volunteering for (whatever) charity. 

Kind of like how "someone" reads the Visa forums on here and the next thing you know they put a kibosh on 30 Day border runners and start cracking down on "Ed" Visa scammers and so on.

A lot of people have this idiot idea that they have some (self granted) "right" to do whatever they want, wherever they want and when someone tells them otherwise they get all huffy because they think their (self granted) rights overrule everyone else's.

Maybe a few of them are finding out that some people really don't give a **** what they think.

Or it could just be that the bosses of those 2 departments really don't like each other for some reason and are simply playing politics.

[melvinmelvin]

13 hours ago, ukrules said:

This new 'head of the labour office' is clearly not following the rules or doing their job properly.

 

Report them to the main department in Bangkok and get him / her bought into line or fired.

 

The Ombudsman office would be worth a try I think.

 

(have experienced similar myself.

one Departement requesting that I provide them with a certain document from immigration

in order for them to issue a document to me,

 my local IO flatly refusing to issue such a document)

 

catch 22 comes to mind

 

[GAZZPA]

13 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I can see their point, there have been loads of white foreign bogus volunteers in CM getting VISAs.

You pay an agent, they set you up with a charity, you get a 1 year VISA for turning up for 1 or 2 days.

I've known at least two guys in the past who did this (both under 50s).

Although I am sure what you say is true about these 2 guys abusing the system it does not mean the immigration department should stop issuing visas. There are many people that abuse the system in many different roles, student visa springs to mind. I have some friends volunteering here, genuinely so. They are working for a charity organisation that houses abandoned babies until a home can be found. They get zero money from anyone, 100% volunteering their time. They both have valuable experience, 1 a retired teacher and the other a  retired social worker,,, however they are jumping through hoops and being pressed with questions as if they are criminals to get their visas and permits sorted out. 

 

To be honest I would not bother, instead if i wanted to help less fortunate I would go somewhere who welcomes you into their country and treats you with some respect,,, the unfortunate thing is the people who suffer in the end are the ones in most need of help, very sad, very stupid...

 

 

[misterme]

It’s not the volunteers that are scammers, as much as the organization’s that find them. These Cash Factories luring genuine volunteers should be shut down. 

[tukadadoll]

13 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I can see their point, there have been loads of white foreign bogus volunteers in CM getting VISAs.

You pay an agent, they set you up with a charity, you get a 1 year VISA for turning up for 1 or 2 days.

I've known at least two guys in the past who did this (both under 50s).

True, we are always quick to criticise the Thai authorities (after all they do have form), however sometimes there is more to the story. My countries visa rules for Thais are pretty strict. This does however seem to 'fly in the face' of the recent softening attitude to work permits seen in Phuket.