Thai tourism in trouble: And competitor Vietnam is "scary" for Pattaya

[brucegoniners]

Good. Maybe some of those tour buses will disappear in Pattaya.

[Surasak]

2 hours ago, Justgrazing said:

Just hang in there Pattaya the Indians are coming .. 

So the local cowboys can fleece them?

[GeorgeCross]

1 hour ago, BestB said:

Oh the trolly dolly out already . Try reading full sentences before making silly comments 

 

it was a tongue in cheek comment, chill out!

 

 

[Surasak]

All true Garybaldy. The thing is, many have strong roots here now and would find it very difficult to up sticks and go elsewhere.

[Surasak]

1 hour ago, khunano said:

You Reap What You Sow

Yes, and some of that sowing can fall on stony ground.

[Psychic]

Well, the actually said they wanted to discourage low end tourists and turn Thailand into an Asian Riviera.

Well, congratulations. Between that policy and a strong baht you aren't getting low end tourists.

The problem is that the high end ones you so desire know damn well this isn't the Riviera.

If they wanted they would simply go to the Riviera.

On the low side of the tourism scale the price of a beer has quadrupled in 10 years in most foreign currency. Hotel rates have, on average, probably at least doubled. Same with food.

Unsure what is happening in Europe but in NA a big complaint is that wages have been stagnant in that period so that doesn't compensate.

So what exactly has Thailand added as value added for these cost increases?

I really struggle to come up with a single thing.

It isnt just tourism. 

I looked at the price of an electric car...Nissan Leaf.

Canada about 800K baht, maybe less if there is a government incentive.

Thailand 2 million baht.

Now at 800K I'd buy one, install a solar array and charge from that when not in use.

Putting these on the road would help reduce that haze that swept down from Bangkok last year.

What exactly is the price difference all about except a tax grab?

That's a bit off topic but it points at what I see as a complete lack of foresight. This is now hitting tourism and I really don't know if they can bring it back.

Tourists are creatures of habit. If they start going to places like Vietnam and have an affordable, pleasant experience that's where they will go back to.

And that's where they will recommend others to go.

I've chirped on this before. Apart from expats who live here permanently who encourage friends/relatives to come there are also snowbirds who winter here.

As one said, I'm too old to start making a new social circle somewhere else.

But if those circles start getting set up in places like Vietnam that's where they are going to winter for 20-30 years in retirement.

This stuff starts to become cumulative.

I don't have first hand experience but I just googled wine prices in a restaurant in Vietnam.

It said a bottle (mid-range) started at about 180-190 baht equivalent.

The little low end type restaurant I go to is charging 160 baht for a glass of the boxes not quite wine swill here. The reason. A greedy, stupid tax aimed primarily at tourists.

Assuming other things low end tourists like is similarly discounted I wouldn't expect tourism in Thailand to come back any time soon.

[Surasak]

1 hour ago, bluesofa said:

I had one, but the leg fell off.

I also had one but the wheels wouldn't go round. Which proves its not always brake failure.

[MartiniMan]

Just the beginning wait until you see their housing bubble its gigantic one of the largest bubbles i have ever studied - its literally out of control with driver sleep at the wheel 

When this goes down they will beg IMF for bail out

[marcusarelus]

1 hour ago, Guderian said:

My gosh, why ever would Vietnam be a competitor to Thailand? The exchange rate is reasonable, beer costs  half what it does in Thailand, the beaches are clean, and the Vietnamese cuisine is arguably better than Thai food, but these are all minor points. Vietnam was colonised by the sweating farangs, so it isn't pure like Thailand. And they did away with their own alphabet, adopting an accented version of the Latin alphabet. How can they double-price things when foreigners can easily read the prices, unlike using Thai numbers? Really, these upstart Vietnamese have got a lot to learn.

I guess that's why Thailand has 40 tourists to Vietnam's 1.

[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, MartiniMan said:

Just the beginning wait until you see their housing bubble its gigantic one of the largest bubbles i have ever studied - its literally out of control with driver sleep at the wheel 

When this goes down they will beg IMF for bail out

In your dreams or do you have any data to support this fiction?

[Beggar]

I don't know why a tourist should come to Pattaya. To see Gogo bars, entertainment ladies, sex tourists and ladyboys? Vietnam has many interesting places. The only thing I don't like is the traffic noise in the big cities. 

[carstenp]

1 hour ago, Sticky Wicket said:

15p for draft beer in Vietnam

2 quid for a bottle of knob wash here .

Extrapolate those figs for a holiday and it starts to make you realise what a complete rip off this place is

I saw the writing on the wall last year, and moved out of Thailand after almost 8 years. Just Got enough of the no value for money and the scam everywhere.

[GeorgeCross]

6 minutes ago, Psychic said:

Tourists are creatures of habit. If they start going to places like Vietnam and have an affordable, pleasant experience that's where they will go back to.

And that's where they will recommend others to go.

 

and in a world connected as it is via social media EVERYBODY gets to hear about it and fast.

 

vietnam is going viral

 

even expats who live HERE are now taking their holidays there instead of phuket and the southern islands

 

 

Edited July 23, 2019 by GeorgeCross

[intherealworld]

Maybe they will give away free sticky rice and mango

to the tourists at the airport

That will pull them in for sure.

Welcome to the new, unfriendly, expensive,  xenophobic, Thailand.

a world player indeed. 

[Surasak]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

The "scary" reality for Thailand, is that the neighbors are making a real effort, improving, progressing, and creating a better environment for tourism. While here in Thailand, the environment is one of stagnation, regression, a total lack of vision, xenophobia, fear of foreigners, confused and muddled visa policy, and a baht that is far stronger than it needs to be, should be, or deserves to be. 

 

No effort is being made to address tourist safety, or public safety in general. No effort is being made to address traffic safety and the horrendous amount of bus, mini-van, car, truck, and motorbike accidents on the road. No effort is being made to improve the highway patrol, or even get those incompetent clowns to patrol the highways, and pull people over for reckless driving. No effort is being made to address the understaffed immigration counters at DM, or Swampy. No effort is being made to tackle corruption on the part of the RTP franchisees. Quite the opposite. They are being deliberately protected. No effort is being made to address the myriad of environmental issues Thailand faces, whether it be the water quality, the air quality, the burning by farmers, the plastic epidemic, the extreme lack of trash cans throughout the nation, and a vast host of other issues. And finally, no effort is being made to reform the tourism ministry, separate it from the sports ministry (hair brained to the extreme), or improve the TAT. Nothing. 

 

The army is doing nothing, to benefit the people, or tourists. Absolutely nothing. Perhaps even less than zero. Perhaps the name should be changed from the Thai Army to the Nothing men. Of course tourism is dropping. Why would it not be dropping? 

So, all down hill then!

[marcusarelus]

46 minutes ago, AllanA said:

Was in Pattaya in the early part of 2019 and it was quite ! Never seen it so quite for what they called ‘peak season ‘ there was definitely no peak yet hotels still charged peak season prices . . thus tourists that are there feel ripped off and thus talk negatively of time spent there. The more negative talking, the less tourist will come. Yes Vietnam is booming, went there and it was packed out, lots of hype and positive vibes and people seem to really be enjoying it. 

Well lets look. Shall we?

[Davedub]

Once again, I am compelled to chime in on the legal situation around vaping.

There are at least 3 million people who chose to vape regularly in the UK alone[1].

That's over 5% of the adult population of the UK who will think twice about visiting Thailand because of fear of persecution.

Just sayin'

 

[1] https://medicalxpress.com/news/2018-09-vapers-tops-million-britain.html

[brewsterbudgen]

When I first visited Thailand 9 years ago I was able to get a Visa allowing me to stay for 15 months with a border run every 90 days. Now I can only get 30 days unless I want to supply bank statements, return plane ticket etc. If for any reason my Visa is denied then my plane ticket is wasted. I've gone from staying 9 months of the year, contributing upwards of £20,000 a year, down to not even going. What does that tell you? I'm just one person.

But you were not a tourist.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[peter14]

Thailand IS OVER AND finished with drastic immigration  law....  people can''t come and it;s too expensive...   The  good days are over 

[peteski1]

3 hours ago, ezzra said:

I have stopped trying to make sense of those government official who bobs up every now and then with 'good news and good numbers' just so their bosses can see that they work and just warm up a seat in the office, so everything they say, believe only half and that's will be closer to the truth...

Loud and clear .... and as I have experienced 1st hand ... not just government, same story in the private sector, at least in old school Thai companies ... a big show with not much go ... covering their backsides and looking good seems to be the prime concern ... try working in that environment for any length of time and retain your sanity 

[marcusarelus]

Just now, peter14 said:

Thailand IS OVER AND finished with drastic immigration  law....  people can''t come and it;s too expensive...   The  good days are over 

For backpackers maybe but not for us retired folks.  Nothing about immigration has changed for me in 15 years.  I brought my money over 15 years ago so no change in money.  I'm not alone.  Many have done the same thing. 

[Homburg]

Successive administrations have put an enormous effort into demonising westerners over many years, presumably to combat the undesirable sex tourist trade etc., but that has now impacted how Thais react to western tourists generally.  Thailand does not make western tourists feel welcome in the way it did in the past, or in the way that its competitors do now.

 

The Land of Smiles has turned into the Land of Snarls. 

 

Also the recent drive to "clean up" Thailand (removing street vendors etc.) is destroying Thailand's "exotic" appeal.  If Bangkok is "just another city" (but with dreadful traffic and smog), and Pattaya becomes just a city with a beach (but with a terrible beach and effluent in the water) then why on earth would you go there?

 

The strong Baht has only a limited impact - as a tourist one does not object to the cost provided one is having a good holiday, but these days one can feel far more welcome and have a far more enjoyable holiday elsewhere.

 

Western tourists still have money, and they are still visiting the region, but ever fewer are visiting Thailand.

 

But Thailand has got what it clearly wished for, so surely the Thais must all be happier now?

 

 

 

[simon43]

If Vietnam opened a resort aka 'old Pattaya - what happens here stays here', then Pattaya (Thailand) might as well turn off the lights and lock the door after the last person leaves...

[marcusarelus]

9 minutes ago, intherealworld said:

Maybe they will give away free sticky rice and mango

to the tourists at the airport

That will pull them in for sure.

Welcome to the new, unfriendly, expensive,  xenophobic, Thailand.

a world player indeed. 

My house payment is the same.  My wife is the same.  My money has been in a Thai bank for a long time.  You are talking about you not me. 

[crazykopite]

Koh Samui , Koh Phangan and Koh Tao are the same a week away from August and the places are empty TAT has become a bit of a laughing stock I think they count the number of bums on flights than the number that actually come through immigration plus they never ever give numbers that are leaving the Kingdom.

[Sticky Wicket]

7 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

Well lets look. Shall we?

Well done !! Two graphs with absolutely no headings or titles. GENIUS work!!

[Percy P]

4 hours ago, Metapod said:

Exchange rate is bad, costs are going up, visas are getting a lot harder to get, and more competitive alternatives are arising.

 

it isn't really surprising stuff. Thailand ain't that cheap anymore. Aussie dollar is like 21.7 thb these days. A lot of things are cheated back in Aus now,

Yes but the Aussie money has no value. You can't get a good rate if your money is less valuable  then the Thai Baat. Get on to your Government. Not spending money on your own country doesn't help.The British Pound is 38B/£ but that's not Thai doing, that's the Brexit situations. What's Australian poor value too.

[Sticky Wicket]

11 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

But you were not a tourist.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

TOURIST - a person who is traveling or visiting a place for pleasure.

 

Nothing more, nothing less. There is NO specification on time in any definition anywhere

[Peterphuket]

4 hours ago, GeorgeCross said:

wait a minute..

 

if visitors from china, europe, oceania and the middle east are down but tourism is still up where are the new tourists coming from?

 

russia, india? they dont have the numbers to offset europe never mind china, so are they counting surrounding countries too?

 

this cannot be good either way (well for thailand, good for me :D)

 

 

Aliens, I think so.

[marcusarelus]

1 minute ago, Homburg said:

Successive administrations have put an enormous effort into demonising westerners over many years, presumably to combat the undesirable sex tourist trade etc., but that has now impacted how Thais react to western tourists generally.  Thailand does not make western tourists feel welcome in the way it did in the past, or in the way that its competitors do now.

 

The Land of Smiles has turned into the Land of Snarls. 

 

Also the recent drive to "clean up" Thailand (removing street vendors etc.) is destroying Thailand's "exotic" appeal.  If Bangkok is "just another city" (but with dreadful traffic and smog), and Pattaya becomes just a city with a beach (but with a terrible beach and effluent in the water) then why on earth would you go there?

 

The strong Baht has only a limited impact - as a tourist one does not object to the cost provided one is having a good holiday, but these days one can feel far more welcome and have a far more enjoyable holiday elsewhere.

 

Western tourists still have money, and they are still visiting the region, but ever fewer are visiting Thailand.

 

But Thailand has got what it clearly wished for, so surely the Thais must all be happier now?

They kicked me and 50,000 Americans out in 76.  I didn't feel welcome then.  British tourists are vacationing in Cyprus, Turkey or Dubai because of the fall of value of the pound.  

 

When the fellow who won all of his elections stopped topless dancing in Bangkok I got my feelings hurt and knew it was the beginning of the end. 

 

I've been ripped off since the 60's in Thailand and I see no real difference.  There are good people and bad people and always has been.