Is the closure of your favorite bar or restaurant imminent?

[scubascuba3]

3 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Haven't seen him in there as much recently... perhaps he has changed his schedule at about the day/time I often visit. Previously always sat at the top table watching over things and occasionally getting up to do some job. He turned up once with a load of supplies, and commented how it was nice and cool in there... yes it was, but he obviously tweaked  something as it didn't stay that way. 

I haven't really noticed the price increases, but did overhear complaints of his supplier prices going up. Any new owner obviously needs to keep on top of things... they always deteriorate if not. Recall the soi 7 Sea Side place, dogs wandering around inside. 

he owns it with the Kiwi guy, prices all went up 40+ baht, for example chicken dinner from 99 to 179.

 

The fact he has to very closely organise the food shows that the correct staff aren't in place, so will quickly go down hill after a sale like Chunky Monkey

Edited March 25, 2022 by scubascuba3

[Leaver]

On 3/25/2022 at 3:32 AM, TaaSaparot said:

When has not been for sale?

It was For Sale even while it was being built, that's because the owner was suffering from ill health, even before he started to build it.  ????

[Leaver]

On 3/25/2022 at 4:33 AM, scubascuba3 said:

Many people have boycotted the place as price increases have been ridiculous the last few months, newbies don't realise. I'm not sure why anyone would buy it when the owner is instrumental in good preparation

 

I posted over a year ago he would either have to drop the asking price significantly, to the point of break even, or even sell at a loss, or, raise his prices.  He's done both, serval times.

 

It will eventually sell.  Just interested to see when it meets the market, if it ever does.

[Leaver]

 

Interesting sale by The Nightwish Group.  I actually thought they would offload some of their higher rented property late 2020. 

 

https://www.bahtsold.com/view/nature-bar-for-sale-soi-6--458026

 

It's going to take a few more years before tourists numbers are to the point where they can sustain a business paying 140k rent a month.  

 

With covid rent discounts coming to an end, and tourist numbers no where near 2019 numbers, interesting times ahead. 

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, Leaver said:

 

Interesting sale by The Nightwish Group.  I actually thought they would offload some of their higher rented property late 2020. 

 

https://www.bahtsold.com/view/nature-bar-for-sale-soi-6--458026

 

It's going to take a few more years before tourists numbers are to the point where they can sustain a business paying 140k rent a month.  

 

With covid rent discounts coming to an end, and tourist numbers no where near 2019 numbers, interesting times ahead. 

Everything looks exaggerated, Penthouse 50k a month, what muppet would pay that for soi 6. Price tag 4.5m, keep dreaming and yes the rent seems ridiculously high hence why they are selling no doubt

[TaaSaparot]

I can not believe people use Penthouse and Soi 6 in the same sentence.

[Leaver]

7 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Everything looks exaggerated, Penthouse 50k a month, what muppet would pay that for soi 6. Price tag 4.5m, keep dreaming and yes the rent seems ridiculously high hence why they are selling no doubt

 

Smoke and mirrors. 

 

The NWG would have a "friend" in place as a tenant, showing 50k month rent through the books, which is given back.  The tenant moves out a day after the place is sold. 

 

As for the rent, it is a double, but The NWG could be selling at a higher rent for a commission, on behalf of the Thai landlord. 

 

As I said, with covid rent discounts ending, there's some difficult times ahead., and I suspect The NWG will be stuck with quite a few non performing assets. 

 

Edited April 23, 2022 by Leaver

[scubascuba3]

23 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

Smoke and mirrors. 

 

The NWG would have a "friend" in place as a tenant, showing 50k month rent through the books, which is given back.  The tenant moves out a day after the place is sold. 

 

As for the rent, it is a double, but The NWG could be selling at a higher rent for a commission, on behalf of the Thai landlord. 

 

As I said, with covid rent discounts ending, there's some difficult times ahead., and I suspect The NWG will be stuck with quite a few non performing assets. 

 

Brian has fanboys following him on YouTube who may think it's a good proposition, see what happens

[kinyara]

On 4/23/2022 at 9:44 AM, Leaver said:

 

Interesting sale by The Nightwish Group.  I actually thought they would offload some of their higher rented property late 2020. 

 

https://www.bahtsold.com/view/nature-bar-for-sale-soi-6--458026

 

It's going to take a few more years before tourists numbers are to the point where they can sustain a business paying 140k rent a month.  

 

With covid rent discounts coming to an end, and tourist numbers no where near 2019 numbers, interesting times ahead. 

I think the Soi 6 target market will recover quicker than the general tourist market. Fully expect it to be back to normal for high season. Once the restrictions are fully lifted, which they will be sometime before the end of the year, the guys who postponed their trips up until now will be back. Normal service resumed.

 

Re the advert, if it is that easy to turn a profit by splitting it in 2, it begs the question why they wouldn't sell it as such. Could it be Pattaya's Rupert Murdoch is missing a trick there.

[Leaver]

3 hours ago, kinyara said:

I think the Soi 6 target market will recover quicker than the general tourist market. Fully expect it to be back to normal for high season. Once the restrictions are fully lifted, which they will be sometime before the end of the year, the guys who postponed their trips up until now will be back. Normal service resumed.

 

Re the advert, if it is that easy to turn a profit by splitting it in 2, it begs the question why they wouldn't sell it as such. Could it be Pattaya's Rupert Murdoch is missing a trick there.

 

The Soi 6 market is a niche market, but tourists are more price conscious in Thailand now, and the bars are struggling for girls.

 

Next high season will be interesting to see if Soi 6, and other areas, bounce back, but with something like 26 bars, there's  lot of full price rent to pay between now and next high season, with no guarantees the big numbers will arrive. 

 

Add to that the rise of girls freelancing online, and you might see a quiet high season on Soi 6 later this year and into 2023. 

 

 

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Leaver

[scubascuba3]

15 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

The Soi 6 market is a niche market, but tourists are more price conscious in Thailand now, and the bars are struggling for girls.

 

Next high season will be interesting to see if Soi 6, and other areas, bounce back, but with something like 26 bars, there's  lot of full price rent to pay between now and next high season, with no guarantees the big numbers will arrive. 

 

Add to that the rise of girls freelancing online, and you might see a quiet high season on Soi 6 later this year and into 2023. 

 

 

 

Last time i went down soi 6 the bars had loads of girls, just lacked customers

[Leaver]

7 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Last time i went down soi 6 the bars had loads of girls, just lacked customers

 

How many NWG bars were open when you were last there? 

[aussiexpat]

23 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Last time i went down soi 6 the bars had loads of girls, just lacked customers

I agree, went to Queen Vic on Thursday, loads of girls in the bars

[scubascuba3]

31 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

How many NWG bars were open when you were last there? 

I don't know but pointless opening too many when tourists aren't here

[Leaver]

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

I don't know but pointless opening too many when tourists aren't here

 

Yes, which is why I asked. 

 

Perhaps they had 5 bars open with 10 girls in each bar, but if they had 25 bars open there would only be 2 girls in each bar, which doesn't even cover the electric. 

 

Just as you say, pointless opening too many bars when not enough tourists are here, many of the bar girls think the same.  Pointless going back to Pattaya until there are enough tourists.

 

It's the ability of The NWG to pay full rent, for a lengthy period of time, until the big numbers of mongers come back, that will be interesting. 

 

It goes to solvency. 

 

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by Leaver

[aussiexpat]

Anyone know what the deal is with Action street on soi Bukhao. I live right behind it and they've just started blasting their incredibly loud music again even though zero customers

 

This has been ongoing since they opened about 2015 I think but when I look out the window I have never seen any customers there

 

How do these <deleted> open air bars survive 7 years with no customers ever?

 

Edited April 24, 2022 by aussiexpat

[kinyara]

7 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

Yes, which is why I asked. 

 

Perhaps they had 5 bars open with 10 girls in each bar, but if they had 25 bars open there would only be 2 girls in each bar, which doesn't even cover the electric. 

 

Just as you say, pointless opening too many bars when not enough tourists are here, many of the bar girls think the same.  Pointless going back to Pattaya until there are enough tourists.

 

It's the ability of The NWG to pay full rent, for a lengthy period of time, until the big numbers of mongers come back, that will be interesting. 

 

It goes to solvency. 

 

 

They've had plenty of time to plan and they obviously know their business model and customer base better than you or me so I'd be surprised if another 6 months will break them. I think their reopening strategy is being managed quite professionally.  You say their punters are price conscious but again has anything changed from before, have they increased their prices ?  I get the impression their customers are more blokes on blowouts rather than the 5 baht beer variance Soi Buakow whingers.

[Leaver]

14 hours ago, kinyara said:

They've had plenty of time to plan and they obviously know their business model and customer base better than you or me so I'd be surprised if another 6 months will break them.

 

Sure, but in a lot of ways businesses will be going back to around April / May 2020.  That's when they were still paying full rent, and tourism stopped. 

 

Fast forward to 2022, tourism has started, but nowhere near well enough to sustain pre covid rents / expenses, yet, Thai landlords will be ending covid rent discounts. 

 

The NWG has something like 25 bars.  Some of their Thai landlords may be realistic, and continue on with discounted rents, but some, possibly the majority, may not be, and will demand full rent soon, if not already.

 

I don't think it will break The NWG, but there will be a significant cash burn before things get better for the company, and they will probably cut lose the properties of the Thai landlords that are unreasonable in the current circumstances.  This can be seen in my recent post.

 

14 hours ago, kinyara said:

I think their reopening strategy is being managed quite professionally. 

 

I don't think they have much choice with their reopening strategy.

 

The reopening is in stages, but those closed bars still have expenses every month, which is / will be higher shortly.   Open them too early, and the expenses simply increase with electric etc. 

 

14 hours ago, kinyara said:

You say their punters are price conscious but again has anything changed from before

 

Yes, there has been a global pandemic.  ???? 

 

14 hours ago, kinyara said:

I get the impression their customers are more blokes on blowouts rather than the 5 baht beer variance Soi Buakow whingers.

 

True, but it's that customer base that will be lacking in big numbers until all covid rules are over for most countries.  Even for the ones that could come here next week, why would they?  Soi 6 is nowhere near what it was in 2019. 

 

That big wave of returning mongers just never really eventuated.

Edited April 25, 2022 by Leaver

[Leaver]

 

More for sale on Soi 6.

 

https://www.bahtsold.com/view/bar-building-with-6-room-for-sale-soi-6-453513

 

https://www.bahtsold.com/view/bar-with-9-big-room-soi-6-take-over-453510

[scubascuba3]

We haven't heard from AJ for a while

[Rimmer]

Some posts have been removed:

 

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[kinyara]

On 4/23/2022 at 6:31 PM, Leaver said:

 

Smoke and mirrors. 

 

The NWG would have a "friend" in place as a tenant, showing 50k month rent through the books, which is given back.  The tenant moves out a day after the place is sold. 

 

As for the rent, it is a double, but The NWG could be selling at a higher rent for a commission, on behalf of the Thai landlord. 

 

As I said, with covid rent discounts ending, there's some difficult times ahead., and I suspect The NWG will be stuck with quite a few non performing assets. 

 

I heard a very plausible explanation this afternoon sitting across the road from the premises in question.

 

The landlord controlling the block of buildings in question hasn't paid his mortgage payments to the bank for the last 2 years. The bank won't let the businesses open because of the size of the debt, hence the official letters stamped on the front of the shuttered businesses. ( I thought an entertainme group were advertising for cashiers ). 

 

Now if you are a sub-tenant of a landlord who hasn't paid the prime mortgage for a couple of years , your lease becomes null and void.  Pretty sure it's only a massive coincidence that.........................  

 

Edited May 1, 2022 by kinyara

[Leaver]

On 5/1/2022 at 6:38 PM, kinyara said:

I heard a very plausible explanation this afternoon sitting across the road from the premises in question.

 

The landlord controlling the block of buildings in question hasn't paid his mortgage payments to the bank for the last 2 years. The bank won't let the businesses open because of the size of the debt, hence the official letters stamped on the front of the shuttered businesses. ( I thought an entertainme group were advertising for cashiers ). 

 

Now if you are a sub-tenant of a landlord who hasn't paid the prime mortgage for a couple of years , your lease becomes null and void.  Pretty sure it's only a massive coincidence that.........................  

 

 

I would not be surprised if there are quite a few properties around Pattaya in a similar situation.  

 

Not only is it buyer beware, but current lease holders could be shut down by the bank, who is the real owner, until the debt has been discharged.

[Leaver]

 

I guess the 2000 / 5000 baht bar fines didn't work out so well. 

 

https://www.bahtsold.com/view/go-go-bar-for-sale-451800

[scubascuba3]

6 minutes ago, Leaver said:

 

I guess the 2000 / 5000 baht bar fines didn't work out so well. 

 

https://www.bahtsold.com/view/go-go-bar-for-sale-451800

I don't think there were 5,000 bar fines, now 1,000-2,000 I recall from a recent video

[Leaver]

3 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

I don't think there were 5,000 bar fines, now 1,000-2,000 I recall from a recent video

 

Maybe that youtube guy should be charged with defamation.  ???? 

[3NUMBAS]

they never reopended in the first place  ,still closed

[Leaver]

3 minutes ago, 3NUMBAS said:

they never reopended in the first place  ,still closed

 

I think with the prices quoted in that video, even if they are open, they are still closed.  ???? 

 

Edited May 22, 2022 by Leaver

[The Hammer2021]

Given all that's happened in the  last two  years perhaps  the closure of this thread should be imminent

[Leaver]

24 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

Given all that's happened in the  last two  years perhaps  the closure of this thread should be imminent

 

Why do you say that?

 

Covid rent discounts are coming to an end, and the clock was still ticking on the leases. 

 

All was not well before covid, check the date I started this thread.

 

Why do you think more closures are not imminent?