Thoughts on "will there be a Real High Season" this year?

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, shdmn said:

No no, the people spending millions upon millions of baht investing in Pattaya have it all wrong.  It's the random internet people on ThaiVisa who like to complain about everything who have it all figure out. ????

LOL. Thousands of people have invested millions of baht in bars in Pattaya, only to pay the staff more then the punters bought in drinks and go broke. Either they are daft and believed the BS, or they were using the bars as a front.

I remember one bloke that thought he could <delete> the staff instead of customers doing so. He didn't last long

[morrobay]

Forget about the bars!  That is not what shdmn and others referring to investments is about.

Sure beer bars are going fast, that's a no brainer. There could be market for go go bar entertainment with good music and girls but that's an if. They are referring to all the other investments/developments underway especially in N. Pattaya/Naklua and elsewhere. 

 

[kinyara]

Just back from an afternoon in Pattaya, beach road businesses were doing a good trade as far as I could see and the south Pattaya junction was busy with people heading both ways, out to Jomtien and into town. Definately filling up earlier this year.

[RoadWarrior371]

14 hours ago, kinyara said:

Just back from an afternoon in Pattaya, beach road businesses were doing a good trade as far as I could see and the south Pattaya junction was busy with people heading both ways, out to Jomtien and into town. Definately filling up earlier this year.

Easy on the positive tourist reports.  We will have to endure pages of useless drivel and rebuttals once our doomsday prophets peel themselves from the pools of vomit and despair found under the bar-stools of Soi Buakhao. 

Pattaya is Dead.  ????

[shdmn]

On 11/5/2019 at 8:02 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL. Thousands of people have invested millions of baht in bars in Pattaya, only to pay the staff more then the punters bought in drinks and go broke. Either they are daft and believed the BS, or they were using the bars as a front.

I remember one bloke that thought he could <delete> the staff instead of customers doing so. He didn't last long

Some of the serial complainers here probably are bar owners.  Speaking of serial complainers.....????

[jacko45k]

Well the season of high is here, high prices, 250 and 300 baht Lady Drinks can be found. The latter being Russian lady, and the former 'showgirl'. Time for the Expats to slink into the cupboard sized condo, pull the blanket high and hibernate like a wrinkly tortoise until April, get a few Changs in the fridge and watch the tourist kids in the pool. 

[champers]

3 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Well the season of high is here, high prices, 250 and 300 baht Lady Drinks can be found. The latter being Russian lady, and the former 'showgirl'. Time for the Expats to slink into the cupboard sized condo, pull the blanket high and hibernate like a wrinkly tortoise until April, get a few Changs in the fridge and watch the tourist kids in the pool. 

Did you say "Niet"?

Ken Dodd recalled how he once had a Russian stripper as a girlfriend. Her name was Leva Vestoff. She left him to join the circus and marry a Russian knife thrower called Vladimir Joptabolokov.

[BestB]

On 11/5/2019 at 8:55 AM, Peterw42 said:

I swear I must live in an alternate Pattaya, my day to day stuff in Pattaya is busy and getting busier. Theppasit markets on Sunday night was jam packed, I had to park way down the back as the carpark was full, Thais/tourists everywhere, more than I have seen in a long time. I gave up on my favorite chicken place as there was a wait for food.

BigC pattaya Klang yesterday was the same, car park full, Maybe something to do with start of the month and Thais/pensioners have just been paid, but people everywhere, trolley traffic jams, queues at the checkouts etc.

My condo block in Jomtien is filling up with snowbirds, the car/bike park is full every evening, the deckchairs and Gym are full every-day. The condo block isnt empty or unsold, most of the owners come for 1-2 months every year.

The local Thai eateries are full, actually had to wait a couple of minutes for a table last night, they have stopped the condo delivery as too busy. The local laundry no longer does same day turn-around as to busy.

Wife is currently doing some waitressing at a farang breakfast and roast dinner place, she got a call because busy and they needed a 3rd waitress and they have a sign up advertising for a 4th and a kitchen hand. she currently makes the same in tips each day as she does in wages.

 

I seriously dont see the doom and gloom that others see, then again I dont measure empty barstools in soi sexpat or the occupancy of the 300 baht a night guesthouse. I do notice the Chinese and Indians out and about in places other than soi sexpat or ye old english sexpat pub. I used to go to tiger park for lunch once a week (150 baht buffet lunch with pink ID) but lately its just too crowded (Chinese and Indians paying full price) if you dont get there early.

 

Its not rose colored glasses and I want it to be high season, I want the opposite, I would prefer it being a little less busy.

Well now I am seriously confused .

 

Not too long ago your wife owned a seafood buffet restaurant that was jammed packed with lone Chinese tourists , business was so good that your wife even had buses to go collect all the Chinese dying to eat at her place .

 

now she is waitressing at farang owned restaurant ? ????????

[Peterw42]

1 hour ago, BestB said:

Well now I am seriously confused .

 

Not too long ago your wife owned a seafood buffet restaurant that was jammed packed with lone Chinese tourists , business was so good that your wife even had buses to go collect all the Chinese dying to eat at her place .

 

now she is waitressing at farang owned restaurant ? ????????

I am afraid any confusion you have is self inflicted.

I have never said my wife owned a seafood buffet restaurant, or any restaurant in Pattaya/jomtien.

Not sure why you troll/flame the same incorrect statement every-time I post something, as I have corrected you previously. 

She is currently waitressing at an Indian owned restaurant that serves farang food. "a farang breakfast and roast dinner place"

 

My wife's uncle owns a BBQ restaurant that does a good trade with, amongst others, Chinese customers and "yes", as far as I know they still have a bus that does hotel/condo pick up for any dinners who choose to call and book..

[BestB]

41 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

I am afraid any confusion you have is self inflicted.

I have never said my wife owned a seafood buffet restaurant, or any restaurant in Pattaya/jomtien.

Not sure why you troll/flame the same incorrect statement every-time I post something, as I have corrected you previously. 

She is currently waitressing at an Indian owned restaurant that serves farang food. "a farang breakfast and roast dinner place"

 

My wife's uncle owns a BBQ restaurant that does a good trade with, amongst others, Chinese customers and "yes", as far as I know they still have a bus that does hotel/condo pick up for any dinners who choose to call and book..

Yup, I thought so ????

[Leaver]

On 11/6/2019 at 12:33 AM, champers said:

As stated above already: monied guests, same as it currently is.

What is your definition of "monied guests?"

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

On 11/6/2019 at 6:05 PM, kinyara said:

Just back from an afternoon in Pattaya, beach road businesses were doing a good trade as far as I could see and the south Pattaya junction was busy with people heading both ways, out to Jomtien and into town. Definately filling up earlier this year.

 

I was just in Pattaya for a week. Five days on the Darkside and two on the beachside. Was a bit surprised at the volume of activity.

 

Murphy's Irish Pub on Khao Noi was doing a roaring trade, busier than I'd seen it a long time -- I used to live on Noen Plub Wan. Lucky Time on NPW was  pretty busy every night and not bad in the daytime. I stayed there for five days. 

 

On the beach side, I always stay behind Big C Extra. The supermarket and mall were super busy every day, the food court nearly full. Two restaurants I frequent on Soi Yume were definitely getting busier. All of the rising activity seemed to happen a lot earlier than I remember. 

 

Out with some Cambodia expats one night. All the bars we went to on Diana, LK Metro, Buakhao, Chaiyaphum and New Plaza had few empty tables.  Looked like lots of happy people out and about.

 

Got friends from the UK coming in next month for the first time in nearly two years. 

[Leaver]

9 minutes ago, Kaoboi Bebobp said:

All the bars we went to on Diana, LK Metro, Buakhao, Chaiyaphum and New Plaza had few empty tables. 

Can you name some of the bars you went to in this area, because other than a few well know bars, mainly for their price point and / or band, I only see empty bars, or bars with one or two customers, which doesn't even pay the salaries, yet alone the rent. 

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

10 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Can you name some of the bars you went to in this area, because other than a few well know bars, mainly for their price point and / or band, I only see empty bars, or bars with one or two customers, which doesn't even pay the salaries, yet alone the rent. 

 

Harry's, Scooters on LK, another smaller bar on LK,  some massage shop/bar on Chaiyaphum maybe Admon (?) (across the road Triangle was jammed), Scooters on Buakhao, Tiger on New Plaza, which was fairly busy all round. Also it was a very pleasantly coolish night. 

[Leaver]

12 minutes ago, Kaoboi Bebobp said:

 

Harry's, Scooters on LK, another smaller bar on LK,  some massage shop/bar on Chaiyaphum maybe Admon (?) (across the road Triangle was jammed), Scooters on Buakhao, Tiger on New Plaza, which was fairly busy all round. Also it was a very pleasantly coolish night. 

No argument from me about Scooters, Triangle, and I would also add Billabong bar and Cafe Racer.  I actually expected you to name these exact bars, before I posted.

 

The thing is, there are hundreds of bars and restaurants in this area, but the ones you name are the only ones that are busy.  This equates to a high percentage of very quiet, if not dead, establishments. 

 

Did you go into a gogo bar on LK?  Very few customers in them. 

[Kaoboi Bebobp]

12 minutes ago, Leaver said:

No argument from me about Scooters, Triangle, and I would also add Billabong bar and Cafe Racer.  I actually expected you to name these exact bars, before I posted.

 

The thing is, there are hundreds of bars and restaurants in this area, but the ones you name are the only ones that are busy.  This equates to a high percentage of very quiet, if not dead, establishments. 

 

Did you go into a gogo bar on LK?  Very few customers in them. 

 

I never go into go-go bars. It's been over 7 years since the last one. Anyway, yeah, the good bars always have customers.

[Leaver]

58 minutes ago, Kaoboi Bebobp said:

 

I never go into go-go bars. It's been over 7 years since the last one. Anyway, yeah, the good bars always have customers.

Ok, so, the good bars have customers, and I agree, but you never went into a gogo, but you say bars on whole Soi are busy, including the long Soi Buakhao. 

 

Given there are many gogo bars on LK Metro, how can you then declare LK Metro is busy if you never went into a gogo bar?

[RoadWarrior371]

6 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Ok, so, the good bars have customers, and I agree, but you never went into a gogo, but you say bars on whole Soi are busy, including the long Soi Buakhao. 

 

Given there are many gogo bars on LK Metro, how can you then declare LK Metro is busy if you never went into a gogo bar?

Give it a break, things are getting steadily more busy in Pattaya.  You seem to be a doomsday prognosticator, so it is time to eat crow and crawl back under your rock until next low season.  The rest of us will be having a blast. ????

[Leaver]

15 minutes ago, RoadWarrior371 said:

Give it a break, things are getting steadily more busy in Pattaya.  You seem to be a doomsday prognosticator, so it is time to eat crow and crawl back under your rock until next low season.  The rest of us will be having a blast. ????

Nothing to do with doomsday posting and everything to do with accuracy and fake news.  In KB's case, I am questioning accuracy. 

 

I simply see quiet shopping malls, bars, and restaurants, and I mean inside them, not people walking past looking inside them.  There are many For Sale signs around.

 

I comment on why I think that's the case, but have no financial interests in any of it. 

 

Other than the possible closure of a few of my favorite places, I couldn't care less.  Pattaya isn't going anywhere, so I'll be here having a blast also, but that doesn't mean the place is economically thriving, as it has in the past.

 

I really don't know why some on TV talk up the numbers, unless they actually do have a financial interest in Pattaya, be it a bar, restaurant, hotel, property, or, an emotional interest in a gf, wife, or kid/s. 

 

It would be good if those with a conflict of interests here try to at least post objectively.

[Matzzon]

On 8/18/2019 at 7:59 AM, joeyg said:

Any thoughts?

No thoughts, only facts. Thailand is doing great in the tourism sector, which is still going up year by year.

 

If the bars and some of the sleazy wntertainment venues have to close. Yeah, that just means the visitors have smartened up or that Thailand attracts a smaller amount of unwanted tourism.

[Leaver]

5 minutes ago, Matzzon said:

No thoughts, only facts. Thailand is doing great in the tourism sector, which is still going up year by year.

 

If the bars and some of the sleazy wntertainment venues have to close. Yeah, that just means the visitors have smartened up or that Thailand attracts a smaller amount of unwanted tourism.

I agree.  The numbers are up, on the back of Chinese and Indian tourists, but from what I see, the money from them must be down, way down, from the traditional western market.

 

What's the point of high tourist numbers, without a decent "spend" that should go with them, and this doesn't include the "zero baht tourist" issue. 

 

I see a lot less western tourists, so I also agree that we will see some closures of establishments that previously catered for them, hence why I started a relevant thread about this.  

[Matzzon]

10 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I agree.  The numbers are up, on the back of Chinese and Indian tourists, but from what I see, the money from them must be down, way down, from the traditional western market.

 

What's the point of high tourist numbers, without a decent "spend" that should go with them, and this doesn't include the "zero baht tourist" issue. 

 

I see a lot less western tourists, so I also agree that we will see some closures of establishments that previously catered for them, hence why I started a relevant thread about this.  

Why would you say that money is down, like the westerner is god when visiting other countries? They have caclulated median what both Indian and chinese tourists spend a day when visiting Thailand, and that´s a lot more than many westerners is spending.

https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/tourism/thailand-looks-to-indian-arrivals-for-new-wave-of-tourism

[Leaver]

4 minutes ago, Matzzon said:

Why would you say that money is down, like the westerner is god when visiting other countries? They have caclulated median what both Indian and chinese tourists spend a day when visiting Thailand, and that´s a lot more than many westerners is spending.

https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/tourism/thailand-looks-to-indian-arrivals-for-new-wave-of-tourism

You are inviting the "zero baht tourists" debate, which has been done to death, but will briefly mention that their package holiday is purchased in China, and they stay in Chinese run hotels, eat in Chinese run restaurants, and are taken to Chinese run businesses.  Thus, profits do not remain in Thailand. 

 

Anything needed that is not Chinese run, they beat operators down to their rock bottom price, or they take them elsewhere, or do not include the show / activity on their tour. 

 

Back to my comment.  Take a walk through Central or Terminal 21.  Where are all the high end Chinese and Indians buying brand name products that are not available in China or India, or have big import taxes placed on them, so are cheaper to buy in Thailand?  I don't see them.

 

Then, go to a 7/11 or Family Mart near a hotel where they are staying and have a look at what they are buying.  They are not just buying a bottle a water.  They buy meal replacements, like instant noodles. 

 

I actually saw a few Indians buy a bottle of whisky in a 7/11 the other day, which is a larger purchase for a 7/11, but no bars would have made money out of those guys that night, and probably for the duration of their holiday.  I'm guessing it was back to the room where they shared the whisky, then off to Walking Street or Beach Road for a freelancer.

 

Your article says:

 

"Thai language news outlet TNN says Indian visitors currently spend an average of 5,800 baht a day, nearly as much as the 6,400 baht a day spent by Chinese tourists."

 

Any idea how they calculate these figures?

[Matzzon]

31 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Any idea how they calculate these figures?

No, do you? In my opinion, you are just another poster that tries to bring life to the long time dead reality and now a myth. The one that Thailand needs the westerner and should put us on a high place as a very valuable custormer that contributes massively to the Thai economy. 

Just face it. Those days are gone. Do yourself a favor, and stop live in the past.

[champers]

5 hours ago, Leaver said:

What is your definition of "monied guests?"

Duh! Guests with a lot of disposable income - money, cash, beer vouchers, call it what you will. Invest some in a dictionary.

[Leaver]

25 minutes ago, Matzzon said:

No, do you? In my opinion, you are just another poster that tries to bring life to the long time dead reality and now a myth. The one that Thailand needs the westerner and should put us on a high place as a very valuable custormer that contributes massively to the Thai economy. 

Just face it. Those days are gone. Do yourself a favor, and stop live in the past.

No, I don't know how they derive these spend figures.  You put the article forward, not me.  If it includes the cost of the package holiday itself, which also includes flights, then they would be quite rubbery.  

 

Your characterization of me is wrong.  I've never viewed a western sex tourist coming to Pattaya in a God like way, due to the money they spent, or held them in such a high regard to the Pattaya, or the Thai economy. 

 

It's no bother to me what nationality of tourists spend the money.  It's just I don't see the spend from the majority of tourists to Pattaya now, which are Chinese and Indians. 

 

All I am suggesting is the increase in tourists numbers may not have a corresponding effect on an increase in the revenue from them.

 

I see a lot of Chinese and Indians.  I just don't see them spending. 

 

So, the question is, how many more would they need to bring in to maintain past revenues, and can the infrastructure and environment here handle such numbers?   

[Leaver]

15 minutes ago, champers said:

Duh! Guests with a lot of disposable income - money, cash, beer vouchers, call it what you will. Invest some in a dictionary.

Feel free to name some establishments in Pattaya where said "monied guests" are spending their money.  

 

Choose any goods and services you like. 

 

By the way, you don't have to be "monied" to buy a 1 hour massage for 200 baht.   Duh!

 

 

[champers]

9 minutes ago, Leaver said:

Feel free to name some establishments in Pattaya where said "monied guests" are spending their money.  

 

Choose any goods and services you like. 

 

By the way, you don't have to be "monied" to buy a 1 hour massage for 200 baht.   Duh!

 

 

No. I am not playing your game anymore. You have a narrative that Pattaya is on the road to rack and ruin and inject it accross a variety of threads. OK, that is what you think.

I think differently because more visitors are coming and more hotels are being built to accommodate them. A greater proportion of visitors are Asian but many still come from the West. Pattaya is now all things to all people. Sex still underpins much of the tourism here to a greater or lesser degree and will continue to do so for many years to come.

High season and low season boundaries are more blurred because they are no longer solely defined by changes in climate in the West - the snowbird effect. The 2 Golden Weeks in China are an example.

Enjoy your time in Pattaya; for all your negativity about the place you still choose to come here.

[Matzzon]

23 minutes ago, Leaver said:

I see a lot of Chinese and Indians.  I just don't see them spending. 

 

So, the question is, how many more would they need to bring in to maintain past revenues, and can the infrastructure and environment here handle such numbers?

Where are you looking for them spending? Are you sure you are looking in the right place? Or are you really taking the time and effort to look at all? Maybe it´s just an opinion without any kind of base in reality?

 

Maybe do not need more, depending on your wast knowledge regarding looking in the wrong places.

[Leaver]

4 hours ago, champers said:

No. I am not playing your game anymore.

No game playing here.

 

Serious question.  Where in Pattaya do I go to see wealthy Chinese and Indians shopping, eating, and drinking?  I don't see it happening in Central, or T21, and I don't see it in mid price ranged restaurants.

 

I have never said Pattaya is on the road to rack and ruin. 

 

I have said I believe tourist numbers to be up, but their spend down, way down, when compared to the traditional western market.

 

4 hours ago, champers said:

High season and low season boundaries are more blurred because they are no longer solely defined by changes in climate in the West

I agree.  The high and low seasons have been replaced by a steady stream of Chinese and Indians, year round.

 

4 hours ago, champers said:

Enjoy your time in Pattaya; for all your negativity about the place you still choose to come here.

 

Errr, no.  I live here.  This is why I don't see what you claim to see, other than hotel occupation, which I have said in the past, you can't sell the Chinese and Indians, sex, food, alcohol, activities, and shows, but they do need accommodation.