What's a good secondhand car around 250k?

[transam]

55 minutes ago, transam said:

That was Ford, never heard of a real big problem with any other brand CVT. My own CVT ride is now near 6 years old, nooooo ploblems....????

Even most two wheel scoots have had CVT for years, doesn't seem to be any real ploblems with those either.. 

 

@Peterhua You posted a "sad" emijon on the post above, would be great if you could tell me what was sad about it...????

[Brick Top]

Hi , you will not find better car than my 2011 Honda City , looked after like a baby from new , prices in Bangkok around 325 to 350 , mine i want 275,000 buy may take 250,000

You can find it here.

https://dealer.one2car.com/pages/listing/ViewAd.aspx?lid=6939213

[bwpage3]

9 hours ago, Bob A Kneale said:

What are the chances that a Thaivisa reader asking about the viability of buying at the lowest end of the market will have the access and ability to use, never mind interpret, the output of an OBD reader?

If you can read English, then you can interpret the results.

 

Here is an example output: O2 sensor bad

 

Interpretation: The oxygen sensor is bad.

 

You simply plug it in to an open port the same way you would a USB port.

 

You can buy OBD readers online for next to nothing.

 

It is quite a simple device

 

 

 

 

[HauptmannUK]

15 hours ago, transam said:

That was Ford, never heard of a real big problem with any other brand CVT. My own CVT ride is now near 6 years old, nooooo ploblems....????

Even most two wheel scoots have had CVT for years, doesn't seem to be any real ploblems with those either.. 

Ford had major problems with their PowerShift transmission (known in the UK as PowerSh*t). Its not a CVT its a 6-speed dual-clutch unit.

JATCO CVT's as fitted to Nissans (and Suzuki Mitsubishi) are not reliable. The usual fault that comes up is P1777 or P1778 'ratio error' accompanied by slipping and jerking. Most repairers jump to the conclusion that the ratio control stepper is faulty. That is usually not the fault and in fact the problem is caused by leaking pulley seals and/or sticking ratio control valve.  The basic problem with the JATCO units in Thailand is that their cooling is inadequate and they run too hot.  They have recently improved the design but personally I wouldn't buy one. JATCO build transmissions in Thailand.

The Honda CVT's are of they own in-house design and did suffer some premature failures in the past. In 2014 the design was beefed up with increased drive contact area and those seem to be better.

Toyota use Aisin-Warner units on 1.0-1.5 litre cars and their own in-house units on 1.8+. These are actually very similar to the AW units, with many AW-sourced internal parts and drive belts.  

I think the post-2014 and the AW/Toyota units are pretty reliable. Be sure the fluid is changed regularly and don't drive the car if there is any sign of slippage. Once a CVT starts to slip it self-destructs very rapidly.

The CVTs used on hybrids are of a different design and are more reliable.

 

[Bob A Kneale]

16 hours ago, bwpage3 said:

If you can read English, then you can interpret the results.

 

Here is an example output: O2 sensor bad

 

Interpretation: The oxygen sensor is bad.

 

You simply plug it in to an open port the same way you would a USB port.

 

You can buy OBD readers online for next to nothing.

 

It is quite a simple device

I know what an OBD reader is, I was referring to the OP! 

 

What are the chances that he, asking about the viability of buying at the lowest end of the market, will be buying an OBD reader just for the purchase of this car?  He wouldn't even know where to plug it in.

[twizzian]

Look out for any flood damage, plenty of undisclosed Previously submerged vehicles for sale here.

[Peterhua]

On 7/14/2020 at 1:09 PM, transam said:

 

@Peterhua You posted a "sad" emijon on the post above, would be great if you could tell me what was sad about it...????

The fact you're even questioning somebody's choice of emijon is in itself very sad. Stop being a cry baby and accept that you won't get likes all the time.

 

I really can't be bothered to explain why i thought your comment was "sad" other than to ask you how many km's you have driven in your little 5 year old Suzuki with a cvt gearbox? And then ask you to read HauptmannUK's comment where he highlights some of the pitfalls of owning a car in Thailand with a cvt gearbox.

 

[transam]

2 hours ago, Peterhua said:

The fact you're even questioning somebody's choice of emijon is in itself very sad. Stop being a cry baby and accept that you won't get likes all the time.

 

I really can't be bothered to explain why i thought your comment was "sad" other than to ask you how many km's you have driven in your little 5 year old Suzuki with a cvt gearbox? And then ask you to read HauptmannUK's comment where he highlights some of the pitfalls of owning a car in Thailand with a cvt gearbox.

 

Well thank you for that for filling reply. As for the cry baby thing, well I just hope your bird turns up to stop you getting angry.

 

My Suzuki has done 100,000km, few minor problems but not with the CVT. Suzuki uses the Jatco trans, a Nissan Co., so the Nissan March has the same box, and as we know there are zillions of them on the planet, though Suzuki India folk prefer the AMT..

Did you like that.....?  ????

[pineapple01]

22 hours ago, twizzian said:

Look out for any flood damage, plenty of undisclosed Previously submerged vehicles for sale here.

Easy to spot a Flooded Tesla, a fried blob.. Wait till they get popular here these battery things.????‍♀️

[barry553]

On 7/14/2020 at 12:23 PM, Bob A Kneale said:

"If you run on 95 fuel it has decent power for daily driving".

95 fuel octane rating doesn't give an engine any significant or noticeable power advantage over lower octane fuel.

When I use E20 the car feels almost asthmatic, when I use E95 it reacts as I think it should, not great but the power is sufficient for normal driving. I am just going by my own experience.

[HauptmannUK]

9 hours ago, barry553 said:

When I use E20 the car feels almost asthmatic, when I use E95 it reacts as I think it should, not great but the power is sufficient for normal driving. I am just going by my own experience.

You are mixing up two different things.

E20 means that the fuel is 20% ethanol and 80% petrol blend.  Since ethanol has a lower calorific value than petrol the engine will produce somewhat less power than if it was fuelled with 100% petrol. 

The octane rating (91, 95 etc) is a measure of the fuel's resistance to self-ignition ('knocking').  A high compression engine needs a high octane fuel to inhibit knocking and get maximum power out of the engine.  Putting a high octane fuel in an engine designed to run on low octane fuel is just a waste of money. It won't get you any more power.

You could have say an E20 that was 91 octane and an E20 that was 95 octane.

Edited July 16, 2020 by HauptmannUK

[Jitar]

On 7/15/2020 at 6:12 AM, HauptmannUK said:

Ford had major problems with their PowerShift transmission (known in the UK as PowerSh*t). Its not a CVT its a 6-speed dual-clutch unit.

JATCO CVT's as fitted to Nissans (and Suzuki Mitsubishi) are not reliable. The usual fault that comes up is P1777 or P1778 'ratio error' accompanied by slipping and jerking. Most repairers jump to the conclusion that the ratio control stepper is faulty. That is usually not the fault and in fact the problem is caused by leaking pulley seals and/or sticking ratio control valve.  The basic problem with the JATCO units in Thailand is that their cooling is inadequate and they run too hot.  They have recently improved the design but personally I wouldn't buy one. JATCO build transmissions in Thailand.

The Honda CVT's are of they own in-house design and did suffer some premature failures in the past. In 2014 the design was beefed up with increased drive contact area and those seem to be better.

Toyota use Aisin-Warner units on 1.0-1.5 litre cars and their own in-house units on 1.8+. These are actually very similar to the AW units, with many AW-sourced internal parts and drive belts.  

I think the post-2014 and the AW/Toyota units are pretty reliable. Be sure the fluid is changed regularly and don't drive the car if there is any sign of slippage. Once a CVT starts to slip it self-destructs very rapidly.

The CVTs used on hybrids are of a different design and are more reliable.

 

Good round up.  Toyota have had issues with Corolla CVTs.  

 

 

 

Moral of the story - generalising all CVTs are good or bad does not work.  Like other transmissions, some model years are good and some are bad.  

 

[johng]

Moral of the story get a manual transmission ????

[toofarnorth]

On 7/15/2020 at 6:11 PM, twizzian said:

Look out for any flood damage, plenty of undisclosed Previously submerged vehicles for sale here.

I wonder if that is why when my 15 yo Vios went in for MOT last week the chap looked under the mats.

[ChipButty]

There will be a nice second hand Aston Martin on the market soon

[johng]

3 hours ago, ChipButty said:

There will be a nice second hand Aston Martin on the market soon

Yes a great deal at only 50 million baht.  ????

[HauptmannUK]

On 7/19/2020 at 5:10 AM, Jitar said:

 

Moral of the story - generalising all CVTs are good or bad does not work.  Like other transmissions, some model years are good and some are bad.  

 

Generalising does work, and it works because of fundamental design differences between CVTs and conventional geared automatic transmissions.

CVTs do not use gears, the torque is transferred via friction across a very small contact area between drive pulleys and a segmented steel belt.  The problem is that CVTs are very unforgiving. If any slippage occurs between the belt and pulley then temperatures rise very swiftly, metal starts to melt and break up and debris is thrown off into the gearbox.

Manufacturers use CVTs because they are lighter, cheaper and more efficient than conventional autos. However they are very difficult to repair properly and economically if they suffer a drive failure.

The AW/Toyota units do seem very reliable. Honda somewhat less and JATCO less still. I have had a couple of boxes apart (Honda and Jatco) and in both cases we deemed repair uneconomic and sourced used 'boxes to get the cars back on the road.

Personally I prefer a conventional auto but I'd also take a Toyota CVT.

[n00dle]

On 7/14/2020 at 8:53 AM, Bob A Kneale said:

What are the chances that a Thaivisa reader asking about the viability of buying at the lowest end of the market will have the access and ability to use, never mind interpret, the output of an OBD reader?

Givrn you can buy one on lazada or even download an app, pretty good.

[Coremouse]

On 7/12/2020 at 9:08 PM, bert bloggs said:

One thats had regular servicing ,so that  leaves out one hell of a lot of Thai owned cars.

The other side isn't neccesarily fine n dandy. Some westerners could be equally dumb & deceptive. 

 

There're also LOT Thai guys knowledgeable and care about their car. To think of it for many Thais car is VERY expensive and a prize, while westerner usually much better standing some could treat car as disposable toy. I know some did. 

 

I know it's a humor just clarifys may some took it seriously

[bert bloggs]

2 hours ago, Coremouse said:

The other side isn't neccesarily fine n dandy. Some westerners could be equally dumb & deceptive. 

 

There're also LOT Thai guys knowledgeable and care about their car. To think of it for many Thais car is VERY expensive and a prize, while westerner usually much better standing some could treat car as disposable toy. I know some did. 

 

I know it's a humor just clarifys may some took it seriously

Must admit ,my brother in law is Thai and he treats his car like a baby ,but unfortunatly many Thai spend vast amounts on a car ,then cant afford to service it.

[Bob A Kneale]

15 hours ago, n00dle said:

On 7/14/2020 at 8:53 AM, Bob A Kneale said:

What are the chances that a Thaivisa reader asking about the viability of buying at the lowest end of the market will have the access and ability to use, never mind interpret, the output of an OBD reader?

Givrn you can buy one on lazada or even download an app, pretty good.

Given that he clearly knows nothing about cars and wants to buy at the crappy end of the market I'd reckon that, although they can be easily bought, the chances of someone in his position doing so and then is negligible.

[n00dle]

3 hours ago, Bob A Kneale said:

Given that he clearly knows nothing about cars and wants to buy at the crappy end of the market I'd reckon that, although they can be easily bought, the chances of someone in his position doing so and then is negligible.

so the advice that informs him that this is an option, is truly good, well timed counsel..

 

basically anyone can check that information easily these days and for less than 1000 baht.

there are even apps online that tell you where the port is located, in the event you cant find it

[Bob A Kneale]

10 minutes ago, n00dle said:

so the advice that informs him that this is an option, is truly good, well timed counsel..

 

basically anyone can check that information easily these days and for less than 1000 baht.

there are even apps online that tell you where the port is located, in the event you cant find it

"Counsel"?    Geez, that's a bit dramatic, my learned friend.

 

"basically anyone can check that information easily these days and for less than 1000 baht".

I know that, but the average person not into cars will never do that!  That's my point!

[n00dle]

1 minute ago, Bob A Kneale said:

"Counsel"?    Geez, that's a bit dramatic, my learned friend.

 

"basically anyone can check that information easily these days and for less than 1000 baht".

I know that, but the average person not into cars will never do that!  That's my point!

and my point is telling them that they  can is the best advice you could ever give them

[Jitar]

21 hours ago, HauptmannUK said:

Generalising does work, and it works because of fundamental design differences between CVTs and conventional geared automatic transmissions.

CVTs do not use gears, the torque is transferred via friction across a very small contact area between drive pulleys and a segmented steel belt.  The problem is that CVTs are very unforgiving. If any slippage occurs between the belt and pulley then temperatures rise very swiftly, metal starts to melt and break up and debris is thrown off into the gearbox.

Manufacturers use CVTs because they are lighter, cheaper and more efficient than conventional autos. However they are very difficult to repair properly and economically if they suffer a drive failure.

The AW/Toyota units do seem very reliable. Honda somewhat less and JATCO less still. I have had a couple of boxes apart (Honda and Jatco) and in both cases we deemed repair uneconomic and sourced used 'boxes to get the cars back on the road.

Personally I prefer a conventional auto but I'd also take a Toyota CVT.

Seems like you changed your mind somewhere between the first and last sentence.