Britain nears abandoning Brexit trade deal hope - The Telegraph

[izod10]

No

58 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 A fine example of how the gullible swallowed Cummings' and Farage's lies in 2016.

 

Brexit has made no difference to the migrant/refugee/asylum situation in the UK.

 

Those people you refer to as 'scum' do not and never have come under the aegis of the FoM directive. They are not EU/EEA or Swiss nationals and so their applications to remain here are covered completely and only by the UK's own laws and regulations; always have been.

 

In addition, most legal immigration to the UK has always come from outside the EU/EEA and Switzerland. Brexit will make no difference to that.

 

ONS Population by Country of Birth and Nationality statistics via The Migration Observatory at the University of Oxford

 

No difference?  hopeless,   why comment when reports are completely opposite what you are spouting  Brexit will make the difference,the ones you love ,the illegals,are well and truly under the cosh,little wonder vigilantes have formed to meet the scum arriving

 Public resentment The Times/Telegraph,not to mention the other tabloids making far more awareness of the problem the UK faces from the scum. The 'laws" you state are being ignored,already flights arranged and legal aid far more difficult if challenged...  just to get them to France quickly,get rid,

[3NUMBAS]

abandoned as in leaving a mexican cartel with your hand missing

[3NUMBAS]

brits signed up for a common market not a united states of europe run by a noxious cartel of unelected donkeys in brussels

[Rookiescot]

7 minutes ago, 3NUMBAS said:

brits signed up for a common market not a united states of europe run by a noxious cartel of unelected donkeys in brussels

And yet we have an unelected house of Lords and an unelected Head of State.

Do they need to go as well?

[RayC]

4 hours ago, Loiner said:

Welcome to the real world.

You must come from that there London town. You know, the place where the streets are paved with benefits, handouts and freeloaders. I wish it would disappear and take them all with it.

Your real world not mine.

 

I guess that you must come from that English idyll where it's all cream teas and the serfs know their place?

 

Yes I'm from London, where I grew up with WI children of the Windrush generation, whose parents came over and helped rebuild the UK after the war; Asian businessmen, doctors, etc, who contributed after they were thrown out of Uganda. Today, EU migrants continue that tradition.

 

No doubt your solution to those likely to be made unemployed by the Covid crisis, is to let 'em starve.

[torturedsole]

15 minutes ago, RayC said:

Yes I'm from London, where I grew up with WI children of the Windrush generation, whose parents came over and helped rebuild the UK after the war; Asian businessmen, doctors, etc, who contributed after they were thrown out of Uganda. Today, EU migrants continue that tradition.

You didn't mention the elephant in the room and I don't blame you as it muddies the water of your argument.

[melvinmelvin]

2 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

And yet we have an unelected house of Lords and an unelected Head of State.

Do they need to go as well?

and to top it off an unelected civil service - just as in EU

 

[david555]

2 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

and to top it off an unelected civil service - just as in EU

 

True ...both U.K. and the E.U. dont give the people even the right to vote for who become the garbage service people ....????????

[Upstate]

5 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

And yet we have an unelected house of Lords and an unelected Head of State.

Do they need to go as well?

Whataboutery at its finest,well played sir.

[Rookiescot]

4 hours ago, Upstate said:

Whataboutery at its finest,well played sir.

Just pointing out Brexiteer hypocrisy.

Again. 

[transam]

14 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

Yes it is; or parts of it.

 

Are you seriously suggesting putting the English/Scottish border there?

 

Be giving a large chunk of North England to Scotland if we did!

 

I made no reference to a border, just the Romans handy work....????

[transam]

15 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 A fine example of how the gullible swallowed Cummings' and Farage's lies in 2016.

 

Brexit has made no difference to the migrant/refugee/asylum situation in the UK.

 

Those people you refer to as 'scum' do not and never have come under the aegis of the FoM directive. They are not EU/EEA or Swiss nationals and so their applications to remain here are covered completely and only by the UK's own laws and regulations; always have been.

 

In addition, most legal immigration to the UK has always come from outside the EU/EEA and Switzerland. Brexit will make no difference to that.

 

ONS Population by Country of Birth and Nationality statistics via The Migration Observatory at the University of Oxford

 

We haven't finished Brexit stuff yet.....Why are you jumping the gun.....Again....?....

Remainers embarrassing themselves again......

[stevenl]

14 hours ago, izod10 said:

No

No difference?  hopeless,   why comment when reports are completely opposite what you are spouting  Brexit will make the difference,the ones you love ,the illegals,are well and truly under the cosh,little wonder vigilantes have formed to meet the scum arriving

 Public resentment The Times/Telegraph,not to mention the other tabloids making far more awareness of the problem the UK faces from the scum. The 'laws" you state are being ignored,already flights arranged and legal aid far more difficult if challenged...  just to get them to France quickly,get rid,

Which reports are saying brexit makes a difference to the immigrant situation in the UK?

[RayC]

16 hours ago, torturedsole said:

You didn't mention the elephant in the room and I don't blame you as it muddies the water of your argument.

That's a fair criticism and there is probably more than one elephant in the room!

 

It would be churlish to try to pretend that all migrants to the UK are going to become model citizens; some will struggle to adapt, some will be freeloaders and some will be criminal. (Growing up I knew a WI family where the father was a petty criminal, and the three brothers ended up as drug dealers). I don't have a solution(s).

 

However, my contention is that most migrants/ refugees are grateful for the opportunity and will try to become valuable members of society.

 

Imo a bigger problem for the UK are people who dismiss/ hate others just because of the colour of their skin and/or the nation of their birth. To be clear, I am not accusing you personally of this but, unfortunately, there do appear to be others here who fall into one of these categories.

[RayC]

4 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Parliaments should be filled with intellectuals and professionals from all walks of life.

That's what the House of Lords is meant to be. Very arguable how effective it is.

 

4 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Their names are drawn from a list and they have to serve one year with no other outside interests.

But like jury duty.  

It would take a year to learn the job. I'd argue the opposite. Imo a 4 or 5 year parliament is too short to effect any real change; politicians are always looking to the next election and will not enact policies which may be necessary, but are not popular e.g. tax rises.

 

Personally, I always thought the old French Presidential term of 7 years was about right. Just about long enough for most policies to take effect and be judged but not so long as to undermine democracy.

[Nigel Garvie]

5 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

I have said for years that anyone who wants to be a politician should be barred from being a politician.

Parliaments should be filled with intellectuals and professionals from all walks of life.

Their names are drawn from a list and they have to serve one year with no other outside interests.

But like jury duty.  

Absolutely, I have been saying the same myself for a long time. Ambition, particularly ruthless ambition, should immediately disqualify you from top posts in Government and in other walks of life. The problem is that, again and again, we see people elected, or who seize power, and have no idea what to do with it when they have it. Their only motivation was to actually be in power. Boris is a good example, great for a few (Often laughable) headline ideas like a bridge to Ireland, but absolutely useless when it comes to detail. 

 

Did you hear what happened to Fred?...........he got lifted off the street and forced to be Home Secretary. He is totally distraught, he only wanted to carry on his job as a Social Worker!  ????

 

It is impossible to imagine how anyone could do any worse than the current bunch of completely unqualified, utter inadequates.

It looks like they have simply resorted to lining their own pockets, and those of their friends, because that's the only world they ever knew. Thailand could give them no lessons in corruption. 

[tomacht8]

20 minutes ago, RayC said:

That's what the House of Lords is meant to be. Very arguable how effective it is.

 

It would take a year to learn the job. I'd argue the opposite. Imo a 4 or 5 year parliament is too short to effect any real change; politicians are always looking to the next election and will not enact policies which may be necessary, but are not popular e.g. tax rises.

 

Personally, I always thought the old French Presidential term of 7 years was about right. Just about long enough for most policies to take effect and be judged but not so long as to undermine democracy.

It would also help if the electoral systems reflected the real voting ratios in parliament. In the UK, BJ couldn't be PM without a coalition partner. In the USA there would have been no DT as president either. There is simply a lack of compromises that a majority would represent.

[kingdong]

6 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

And yet all you Brexiteers have a little hissy fit if anyone says anything derogatory about Johnsons appearance. 

Indeed, make a reference to Johnson using a tag like "Bojo the clown" will see the post removed.

Why is it acceptable for you guys to reference Scotlands First Minister with childish name calling?

i do apologise,didn,t know you have fantasies about her.

[kingdong]

5 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

I have said for years that anyone who wants to be a politician should be barred from being a politician.

Parliaments should be filled with intellectuals and professionals from all walks of life.

Their names are drawn from a list and they have to serve one year with no other outside interests.

But like jury duty.  

wonderful idea although think you,ll find the only people you get doing jury service haven,t got the brains to get out of it,4 times i,ve been called up,never done it.

[7by7]

20 hours ago, izod10 said:

<snip>

No difference?  hopeless,   why comment when reports are completely opposite what you are spouting  Brexit will make the difference

Explain how Brexit will make a difference to refugees/asylum seekers/migrants, call them what you will, in the UK when dealing with them has always been a matter for individual members, in this case the UK, not the EU and so has never been subject to any EU law or regulation.

 

 

[7by7]

7 hours ago, transam said:

We haven't finished Brexit stuff yet.....Why are you jumping the gun.....Again....?....

Remainers embarrassing themselves again......

It is @izod10 who is jumping the gun, not I. 

 

I am merely pointing out that his rants are nothing to do with the EU and the situation will not be affected one iota by Brexit.

 

But, of course, as usual you have to resort to rubbishing facts you cannot disprove.

[7by7]

18 hours ago, torturedsole said:

You didn't mention the elephant in the room and I don't blame you as it muddies the water of your argument.

What elephant would that be, then?

[7by7]

37 minutes ago, kingdong said:

wonderful idea although think you,ll find the only people you get doing jury service haven,t got the brains to get out of it,4 times i,ve been called up,never done it.

That's your attitude to doing your civic duty!

 

Explains a lot.

[ukrules]

On 8/8/2020 at 5:05 AM, Andrew65 said:

BF people were/are based on the French side because of an agreement. The border between Britain & France is the border of the Schengen Area, much more relevant than where the continental shelf is, in this regard.

 There's a similar thing going on about the where Irish border should be, on land or in the Irish Sea.

The big change begins : https://www.gov.uk/government/news/home-secretary-appoints-small-boat-commander

[Loiner]

18 hours ago, RayC said:

Your real world not mine.

 

I guess that you must come from that English idyll where it's all cream teas and the serfs know their place?

 

Yes I'm from London, where I grew up with WI children of the Windrush generation, whose parents came over and helped rebuild the UK after the war; Asian businessmen, doctors, etc, who contributed after they were thrown out of Uganda. Today, EU migrants continue that tradition.

 

No doubt your solution to those likely to be made unemployed by the Covid crisis, is to let 'em starve.

Real enough for all those cheeky cockney chappies who have abandoned their old 'Larndan. I was there a while ago and surprised to see how much of a Shiite hole it has descended into even close to the West End. Are you safely ensconced away from it all in Belgravia, or chattering with other labour voters in one of the gentrified boroughs? You sound like you may have moved to those nice middle class leafy suburbs.

 

The lure of free handouts and benefits is still the mainstay of the gimmigrants wherever they originate from and however they arrive in the UK. Not sure how you've managed to link them to Covid though? 

[kingdong]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

That's your attitude to doing your civic duty!

 

Explains a lot.

not attitude,don,t do it out of principle,you will probably have to look the word up.

[7by7]

40 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Real enough for all those cheeky cockney chappies who have abandoned their old 'Larndan. I was there a while ago and surprised to see how much of a Shiite hole it has descended into even close to the West End. Are you safely ensconced away from it all in Belgravia, or chattering with other labour voters in one of the gentrified boroughs? You sound like you may have moved to those nice middle class leafy suburbs.

 

The lure of free handouts and benefits is still the mainstay of the gimmigrants wherever they originate from and however they arrive in the UK. Not sure how you've managed to link them to Covid though? 

 

Who was your guide on your trip to London? The thug in your avatar?

 

As a resident of a town with a large Muslim population; as a frequent visitor to all parts of London from the City to Brent, your description bears no relation to reality.

[7by7]

Just now, kingdong said:

not attitude,don,t do it out of principle,you will probably have to look the word up.

 So your principles mean that you try any and all methods to dodge your civic duty; got it.

[kingdong]

4 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 So your principles mean that you try any and all methods to dodge your civic duty; got it.

herd mentality?think you,ve got flock of sheep mentality,i also consider it my duty not to aid and abet paedopile rings,so run along and do your "civic duty" and check your tv license is in date.

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

Explain how Brexit will make a difference to refugees/asylum seekers/migrants, call them what you will, in the UK when dealing with them has always been a matter for individual members, in this case the UK, not the EU and so has never been subject to any EU law or regulation.

 

 

You're probably right, at least for now, but the problem with the EU is that their freedom of movement pillar and the Schengen Zone encourages their own members to facilitate continuing and onward travel of migrants far too easily across Europe - notably from the south to north - ending with the formations of places such as the "Jungle" of Calais. Migrants who do not request asylum in the first 'safe' country avoid pressing that country to hold to The Dublin Agreement.

 

Do these migrants know that? Probably. 

Edited August 9, 2020 by nauseus