Thailand falls in global English Proficiency Index for fourth consecutive year

[Mr Meeseeks]

11 minutes ago, cmarshall said:

Correct.  You know nothing about the science of linguistics and you don't seem to know much about Thai if you think it has only 3000 words.  I suggest you give your opinions more on subjects of which you do have knowledge.  

The TV thread I linked to claims that the Thai language has under 3,000 words. If you noticed in an earlier post I estimated at around 50,000.

 

Get out of bed on the wrong side this morning?

[iamariva1957]

So.... open English teaching to the expat retirment folks and/or those here with thai families without work permit regs but with background checks but waiving university paperwork (which is hard to get given the age group of expats)! They will not worry too much about salary issues as much as those of a younger age as their financial positions are better (based upon the financial regs for their visas... (which is also ridicules).  This way they will be able to fill the vacant English teacher positions and be far better off than listening to a thai teacher trying to do their best to cover.  Perhaps even open it up to online classes. It's the WP issue that has to be lifted... at least until the Worldwide covid situation allows this country to reopen to English speaking countries without the expensive quarenteen regs and the other hoops! Time for thailand to wake up or continue to loose.

[cmarshall]

1 minute ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

The TV thread I linked to claims that the Thai language has under 3,000 words. If you noticed in an earlier post I estimated at around 50,000.

 

Get out of bed on the wrong side this morning?

Same side every day, the one that is annoyed with people making wild claims about a science of which they know exactly nothing. 

[Scott Tracy]

I guess the question is, does anyone really care? There has to be a want and a need, in my view.

 

You want to marry a rich farang, maybe. If there is such a beast now. Chinese and Indian, that's what's needed.

 

If there is a want, in the Government, then swift action is needed. English is still, at the moment, the language of business, aviation and other global areas. But that's it....global....if Thailand wants to be isolationist then Thai is enough. But even dealing with ASEAN countries requires English language skills.

 

Mind you, everything I order online seems to come from China, that's why I say Chinese is the way to go now.

[Neeranam]

7 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Yes when i'm with them they do use english. We don't sit on the floor, we use the table in the dining room when we visit. We don't have chickens running around because the land they have is used by local farmers not the family.

Most of them studied overseas after Uni' here as the FIL wanted to make sure they could get a decent job. One just retired from flying commercial and one recently returned from working for the government in USA. 

I could go on. Oh ok, FIL built a 2 bedroom house for us in BKK as a wedding present.

Nearly forgot, one is a lawyer, studied in UK.

 

You miss the whole point of my writing. I was wondering if you feel a tad left out, or somewhat inferior when they are talking to themselves in Thai. Sounds like they are Chinese Thais and have managed to master a foreign language when you can't even do it after many years of living in the country! Truth is, they probably don't want you to know Thai as they can feel a rung higher on the hierarchical social ladder. I've seen this so often, these nouveau riche Thais think  they are better than their neighbours because they can afford chairs and a table. 

[Neeranam]

6 minutes ago, iamariva1957 said:

So.... open English teaching to the expat retirment folks and/or those here with thai families without work permit regs but with background checks but waiving university paperwork (which is hard to get given the age group of expats)! They will not worry too much about salary issues as much as those of a younger age as their financial positions are better (based upon the financial regs for their visas... (which is also ridicules).  This way they will be able to fill the vacant English teacher positions and be far better off than listening to a thai teacher trying to do their best to cover.  Perhaps even open it up to online classes. It's the WP issue that has to be lifted... at least until the Worldwide covid situation allows this country to reopen to English speaking countries without the expensive quarenteen regs and the other hoops! Time for thailand to wake up or continue to loose.

What did you work as in your previous country? Would you be happy if hundreds of retired foreigners with nothing better to do started doing your job for free?

[Mr Meeseeks]

5 minutes ago, cmarshall said:

Same side every day, the one that is annoyed with people making wild claims about a science of which they know exactly nothing. 

I bet you are great fun at parties though. 

[IamNoone88]

I expect English speaking countries rank very low in the Thailand language proficiency test. I am ashamed to say that my Thai is still no better than some peoples English.

[iamariva1957]

4 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

What did you work as in your previous country? Would you be happy if hundreds of retired foreigners with nothing better to do started doing your job for free?

I was a teacher. As for the second part of your question... who said they would do it for "free:? I didn't. But the salaries that are being paid now are terrible. But less so for the the group I  metioned. Furthermore... if there was a lack of teachers for any subject I would welcome the involvement of "foreigners" to fill the gaps on a temporary basis... as I said clearly. As for "hundreds" that sort of depends upon where you live. With borders closed and entry regs that present a hardship for anyone wanting to return... use the folks that are already here to fill the gap... UNTIL the situation improves. Don't know why that is such a difficult idea given that we are talking about someone's education and therefore future abilities to succeed. 

[Scouse123]

19 hours ago, Kaoboi Bebobp said:

 

Incorrect for Cambodia. It should be 84th, very LOW proficiency. But it did gain 10 places from the previous year's ranking.

 

All the Cambodians in the street,tuk tuk drivers, taxis, hotel staff, bank staff that I have met or come across, speak far better English than the Thais.

[robsamui]

As long as the Thai school system continues to pass students no matter what results or scores they get in tests and exams, Thailand will remain uncompetitive in ALL international dealings.

Four or five years ago I was talking to a high-grade career chemist, previously employed by Faberge. He had branched out on his own and come to Thailand with the aim of setting up a small but very high-end company manufacturing exclusive spa products.

 

He needed two young research chemists to assist him. He contacted four major universities, three in Bangkok and one in the south, to interview post-graduate students for the position and interviewed the 16 most-qualified students in the country, over a period of several weeks. And was forced to abandon his entire scheme, due to their low educational standards.

 

In his opinion, none of them were even at international matriculation level . . . in other words they were about the same education level as capable 16 year-old schoolchildren in Europe.

 

For centuries Thailand has been proud to be an important nation - and compared to its neighbours, it is. But when forced out into the big world outside, it has very little to boast about., unfortunately.

[Saltire]

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

What did you work as in your previous country? Would you be happy if hundreds of retired foreigners with nothing better to do started doing your job for free?

In my mind there is a vast difference between a volunteer teacher and a paid teacher. It is not about taking someones job.

 

Most volunteers are not interested in 5 or 6 days a week, 8 or more hours a day. In my case, if allowed, I would do a couple of mornings or afternoons a week at the local high school. If I wanted a job I would not have retired 9 years ago.

 

The real spirit of voluteering is not to take someones job for free, but to give some of your time freely, with the goal of giving something back to the local community. I see it very much as complementing the students English class, encouraging confidence to actually open their mouth, without the fear of making mistakes and losing face in the class, which I think is a great hindrance for them in learning anything.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[overherebc]

14 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

You miss the whole point of my writing. I was wondering if you feel a tad left out, or somewhat inferior when they are talking to themselves in Thai. Sounds like they are Chinese Thais and have managed to master a foreign language when you can't even do it after many years of living in the country! Truth is, they probably don't want you to know Thai as they can feel a rung higher on the hierarchical social ladder. I've seen this so often, these nouveau riche Thais think  they are better than their neighbours because they can afford chairs and a table. 

Without turning this into a possible insult each other thread you are a bit off the mark.

I don't feel inferior or superior to anyone, I have two other languages, German and Australian, and they did not make their money recently. They are comfortable, not Hi-So. 

[cmarshall]

19 minutes ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

I bet you are great fun at parties though. 

To be more specific, your, as we have established, ignorant attitude that the Thai language is inferior to English is racism.  That's what I find most offensive.  There's a lot of anti-Thai racism here on TV which is quite offensive.

[Expat Tom]

Having taught English in Thailand at the University level, this is old news to me. Since Thailand will continue to become a vassal state for China farangs will bail out of there and fewer farang tourists will come. The English proficiency in Thailand will continue to decline as will the country in general.  

 

I am planning my escape now. "Don't cry for me Thailand".

[CM Dad]

I once had the head of the English Program at the largest and most prominent government secondary school in Chiang Mai proudly tell me upon her return from Singapore that she had just visited the "lee-on" city.

[Sydebolle]

Now that comes as an absolute surprise; English proficiency in Thailand falling?

Me idiot, I was not aware of the fact, that it could get any worse. 

[Neeranam]

11 minutes ago, Saltire said:

In my mind there is a vast difference between a volunteer teacher and a paid teacher. It is not about taking someones job.

 

Most volunteers are not interested in 5 or 6 days a week, 8 or more hours a day. In my case, if allowed, I would do a couple of mornings or afternoons a week at the local high school. If I wanted a job I would not have retired 9 years ago.

 

The real spirit of voluteering is not to take someones job for free, but to give some of your time freely, with the goal of giving something back to the local community. I see it very much as complementing the students English class, encouraging confidence to actually open their mouth, without the fear of making mistakes and losing face in the class, which I think is a great hindrance for them in learning anything.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Very noble of you and I agree to a point. However, all the English teachers wouldn't, the ones that pay their bills with the money they get from teaching. 

When I was a teacher, we used to hate those missionaries that affected our salaries. 

[Burma Bill]

High proficiency when it comes to:-

 

"Hello Mister, what's your name, how are you, buy me drink"!!!!

[Neeranam]

12 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Without turning this into a possible insult each other thread you are a bit off the mark.

I don't feel inferior or superior to anyone, I have two other languages, German and Australian, and they did not make their money recently. They are comfortable, not Hi-So. 

Where did you insult me? But you think your relatives are more superior. This thread is about English ability, now how much money -  

Quote

We don't sit on the floor, we use the table in the dining room when we visit. We don't have chickens running around because the land they have is used by local farmers not the family.

 

 

 

 

[hotchilli]

19 hours ago, simon43 said:

My online students are: mainland Chinese, Hong Kong, Russian, Ukrainian, French, Israeli, Korean, Australian, British, Romanian ... er no Thai students.....

You'll find Thai students on FB

[Scouse123]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I taught here for 25 years at high school, university. The leaders, directors, education ministers etc want to keep the students ignorant. They are succeeding, so you can't criticise them for failing. 

 

 

That was before the days on the internet and widespread social media no doubt.

 

But to back up your point, Thailand actually came lower than the opening post suggests, even lower than Cambodia!

 

Cambodia was 84th and Thailand 89th!

 

There was a thinking by the "fossils running the  current government", and previous interfering military juntas, that the population was easier to control if kept down and in the lower ranks of educational standards. That of course, didn't apply to their own kids, who they had educated abroad.

 

https://www.khmertimeskh.com/50785845/english-proficiency-index-shows-cambodias-language-skills-progress/

 

 

 

 

[Saltire]

5 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Very noble of you and I agree to a point. However, all the English teachers wouldn't, the ones that pay their bills with the money they get from teaching. 

When I was a teacher, we used to hate those missionaries that affected our salaries. 

I don't see how volunteering in a village high school with only Thai nationals teaching English, would affect their salary in any way?

 

Volunteers in a classroom are there along with the teacher, to support and assist in the lesson, not deliver curriculum or take over the class.

 

Again, my intention would be a couple of hours a week to support the particular lesson with native speaking.

 

 

 

 

[Neeranam]

20 minutes ago, Scouse123 said:

 

All the Cambodians in the street,tuk tuk drivers, taxis, hotel staff, bank staff that I have met or come across, speak far better English than the Thais.

I used to work offshore with Scousers and Geordie. Although from England, I found it hard to understand their English. 

[Scouse123]

2 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I used to work offshore with Scousers and Geordie. Although from England, I found it hard to understand their English. 

 

 

That's a weird one!

 

I understand them just fine!

[CrunchWrapSupreme]

2 hours ago, trainman34014 said:

'Teachers' often inept and only in the job for the Pension

Indeed. At most of the schools I’ve been at, there have been many “teachers” who rarely set foot inside a classroom. They’ll occasionally summon students to distribute worksheets, or write some page numbers to be read on the board. Then they just sit at their desks, occasionally mark these papers, and enjoy a cushy office job until retirement. Meanwhile, there is near complete chaos in the classrooms, and nobody cares.

 

Surrounding these schools, the larger, provincial ones, the streets are lined with tutoring centers. They give those with the money to spend the education they actually need to pass tests and get university admissions, as not nearly enough goes on inside the school. Yet none of these surround the smaller, municipal (thesaban) schools. They are quite literally daycare centers, a place for kids to go until they’re old enough to go work on the farm, or in a factory.

[Neeranam]

19 hours ago, simon43 said:

My online students are: mainland Chinese, Hong Kong, Russian, Ukrainian, French, Israeli, Korean, Australian, British, Romanian ... er no Thai students.....

My online students are South American mostly, followed by Europeans, then Chinese, Korean, Taiwanese, Japanese, and Thai. However, most of the Thais work for global companies, whereas the Europeans often pay out their own pocket. 

[mikeymike100]

20 hours ago, tso310 said:

You get many Thai students coming to UK universities to study but having to spend the first year at a language school. Their proficiency after one year is usually quite impressive.

If their English language is that bad, as you infer,  how do they pass the entrance exam?

[J Town]

Quick question - when you go to the dentist, if you saw they were trained only in Thailand, would you let them go to town in your mouth?

[overherebc]

6 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

My online students are South American mostly, followed by Europeans, then Chinese, Korean, Taiwanese, Japanese, and Thai. However, most of the Thais work for global companies, whereas the Europeans often pay out their own pocket. 

That points in the direction of  I paid from my own hard earned cash so I'll learn as much as I can. When someone else is paying,  what does it matter?