New "Smart TV" Installation

[tomazbodner]

On 7/13/2021 at 4:39 PM, Yellowtail said:

AIS provides:

1. Box that converts fiber to feeds router via CAT 5 cable

2. Router that provides WiFi and feeds set-box via CAT 5 cable

3. Set-box that feeds TV via HDMI cable.

 

A. I think the new TV should have internet access, correct?

B. I believe it will connect using WiFi or LAN, but I understand LAN is better, correct?

C. Assuming I connect the TV to one of the open LAN receptacles on the router, should it work "plug & play" without any password and or configuring?

D. I want to use my old AV amp & speakers, but it only has HDMI out. I think using an optical cord for this would be my best bet, is this correct?

1 - that box is fiber modem

2 - correct

3 - that's called Playbox

 

A - Yes, if it is smart TV it should have LAN or Wifi, or if newer, most likely both

B - Yes, LAN is generally more stable. Make sure to use a good quality cable at least CAT 5E or CAT6 type.

C - Yes, it should be plug and play. Plug one end into the LAN socket on TV, the other into one of LAN (NOT WAN/INTERNET) ports of the router. You can (or rather should) connect your Playbox with LAN as well. On Wifi it keeps sending errors and sometimes just hangs.

D - Connect HDMI of Playbox to your TV's HDMI input. Get optical cable and connect optical output of Playbox to your AV receiver's digital optical input. Adjust delay on receiver if you need to, in case the picture and sound don't perfectly sync. Some Playbox require setting to audio out to be on optical output, others will use all outputs at the same time. I remember you can't use analog out at the same time as digital out. If you turn on TV, analog output will stop.

Alternatively, if your TV has optical output, you could connect only HDMI cable to TV, and then optical output from TV to your AV receiver. On TV select external speakers/digital output for audio (or TV + external speakers). In both cases, the video will go straight to TV so AV receiver would not degrade the picture quality, but in case of taking optical cable out of TV to receiver, you would be able to get audio from anything TV is displaying, not only from Playbox, so it's probably preferred choice.

 

A cheap and reliable cable company that delivers very quickly is UGreen. They have a local reseller that sends immediately and delivers in Bangkok in a day or 2. The shop is called Gadget Villa. I buy their stuff on Lazada. So far, the quality of products has surpassed expectations and I've stopped buying far more expensive stuff that's no better than theirs.

 

They sell both LAN and AV cables.

 

https://www.lazada.co.th/shop/gadget-villa1622525197/

 

[Yellowtail]

1 hour ago, Eindhoven said:

What other sound output options are available via the TV menu? Did you try them all?

TV Speakers

Receiver (HDMI)

Optical

Bluetooth

 

Yes

[Yellowtail]

1 hour ago, pagallim said:

Same as you, HomePro/Powerbuy, but on-line.   I checked out the ranges that they had and made my choices for what I was prepared to spend.   Normally I just go into a shop and buy whatever is in stock, but can't be bothered at the moment.   I'm not in a rush, and can put up with the white dot for a few days.

 

My set up is an Apple TV box to the TV by HDMI (this receives all of my downloaded iTunes media from my iMac computer) and a Pulse TV box (again, HDMI to the TV, which has all of the UK channels plus movie and TV series libraries).   Both the boxes get their respective data wirelessly.

I bought mine online as well using the HomePro App.

 

I use AIS, Netflix & Amazon Prime..

 

Everything is hardwired unless I'm watching on the laptop or my kid/wife is watching on ipad or phone...

[Yellowtail]

1 hour ago, tomazbodner said:

1 - that box is fiber modem

2 - correct

3 - that's called Playbox

 

A - Yes, if it is smart TV it should have LAN or Wifi, or if newer, most likely both

B - Yes, LAN is generally more stable. Make sure to use a good quality cable at least CAT 5E or CAT6 type.

C - Yes, it should be plug and play. Plug one end into the LAN socket on TV, the other into one of LAN (NOT WAN/INTERNET) ports of the router. You can (or rather should) connect your Playbox with LAN as well. On Wifi it keeps sending errors and sometimes just hangs.

D - Connect HDMI of Playbox to your TV's HDMI input. Get optical cable and connect optical output of Playbox to your AV receiver's digital optical input. Adjust delay on receiver if you need to, in case the picture and sound don't perfectly sync. Some Playbox require setting to audio out to be on optical output, others will use all outputs at the same time. I remember you can't use analog out at the same time as digital out. If you turn on TV, analog output will stop.

Alternatively, if your TV has optical output, you could connect only HDMI cable to TV, and then optical output from TV to your AV receiver. On TV select external speakers/digital output for audio (or TV + external speakers). In both cases, the video will go straight to TV so AV receiver would not degrade the picture quality, but in case of taking optical cable out of TV to receiver, you would be able to get audio from anything TV is displaying, not only from Playbox, so it's probably preferred choice.

 

A cheap and reliable cable company that delivers very quickly is UGreen. They have a local reseller that sends immediately and delivers in Bangkok in a day or 2. The shop is called Gadget Villa. I buy their stuff on Lazada. So far, the quality of products has surpassed expectations and I've stopped buying far more expensive stuff that's no better than theirs.

 

They sell both LAN and AV cables.

 

https://www.lazada.co.th/shop/gadget-villa1622525197/

 

Thanks, I tried all of that. The AV does not have HDMI in, only out.

 

The optical from set-box to AV works (no surround) but from the TV optical to AV has no sound. 

 

I'm thinking the optical out on the TV may be defective, that's what I'm hoping anyway...

[Eindhoven]

9 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

TV Speakers

Receiver (HDMI)

Optical

Bluetooth

 

Yes

 

Those are not the ones I mean. There are options for the optical output too. 

 

Here they are on a YouTube video;

 

 

[Eindhoven]

2 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

It worked with the old TV using the earphone adaptor. That said, I guess I don't "know" that it is working, but I get sound from all the speakers, and the sound from the rear speakers seems appropriate. It sounded great with the old TV. 

 

The TV has one optical out, and one HDMI ARC. The AV amp is about ten years old, and only had HDMI out. Only one optical setting.

 

The TV has separate settings for:

TV Speakers

Receiver (HDMI)

Optical

Bluetooth

 

 

 

 

 

I suspect that you just need to change the Optical output to PCM and then it will work with your amplifier. 

I don't have a Samsung TV so didn't know where you would find the setting. Hopefully the video above will help you to find it on your TV.

Don't neglect to cancel the Technician appointment ???? 

 

[Eindhoven]

...and apologies for getting involved in the thread hijack. It meant that I didn't pay any attention to your problem until now. 

[Yellowtail]

1 hour ago, Eindhoven said:

 

I suspect that you just need to change the Optical output to PCM and then it will work with your amplifier. 

I don't have a Samsung TV so didn't know where you would find the setting. Hopefully the video above will help you to find it on your TV.

Don't neglect to cancel the Technician appointment ???? 

 

 

It is set for PCM.

 

The settings menu is real easy to navigate....

[tomazbodner]

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

Thanks, I tried all of that. The AV does not have HDMI in, only out.

 

The optical from set-box to AV works (no surround) but from the TV optical to AV has no sound. 

 

I'm thinking the optical out on the TV may be defective, that's what I'm hoping anyway...

Here's the thing. The BOX supports Dolby Digital 5.1. It supports it on its Netflix client, on Disney client, on your own videos played on the box... but not on TV content.

 

See AIS response to post below:

I know above is old, but I just went to Play settings, and there are only 2 channels of 2.0 audio on live TV, and nowhere to change that. It seems AIS is only broadcasting audio as bilingual stereo, not with surround sound.

 

Does anyone else have Playbox to confirm?

 

I've gotten rid of all the boxes when moving into a smaller condo and didn't want cable all over the place, hence using 2.0 setup now only. As such it's harder for me to test as even the receiver is only 2.0 (Marantz NR1200).

[Yellowtail]

8 minutes ago, tomazbodner said:

Here's the thing. The BOX supports Dolby Digital 5.1. It supports it on its Netflix client, on Disney client, on your own videos played on the box... but not on TV content.

 

See AIS response to post below:

I know above is old, but I just went to Play settings, and there are only 2 channels of 2.0 audio on live TV, and nowhere to change that. It seems AIS is only broadcasting audio as bilingual stereo, not with surround sound.

 

Does anyone else have Playbox to confirm?

 

I've gotten rid of all the boxes when moving into a smaller condo and didn't want cable all over the place, hence using 2.0 setup now only. As such it's harder for me to test as even the receiver is only 2.0 (Marantz NR1200).

Thanks, but it's not working on Netflix, and it worked fine with the old TV...

[Eindhoven]

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

 

It is set for PCM.

 

The settings menu is real easy to navigate....

 

I'll take your word for that and wait to see what happens on Monday.

[mtls2005]

On 7/13/2021 at 4:39 PM, Yellowtail said:

B. I believe it will connect using WiFi or LAN, but I understand LAN is better, correct?

 

Meh. Common misconception. 

 

If the TV has a Gigabit Ethernet (GbE) interface, 10/100/1000 (the AIS router does support GbE), then yes. Otherwise your TV is capped at 100 Mbps. On WiFi (it probably support 5 GHz) it will be much faster, ~ 200 Mbps or higher, even on 2.4 Ghz.

 

 

I haven't seen too many TVs with GbE, but this must be starting to be available?

 

 

 

[Mickeymaus]

16 minutes ago, mtls2005 said:

 

Meh. Common misconception. 

 

If the TV has a Gigabit Ethernet (GbE) interface, 10/100/1000 (the AIS router does support GbE), then yes. Otherwise your TV is capped at 100 Mbps. On WiFi (it probably support 5 GHz) it will be much faster, ~ 200 Mbps or higher, even on 2.4 Ghz.

 

 

I haven't seen too many TVs with GbE, but this must be starting to be available?

 

This is technically correct. But do you need such a high speed for a TV? 

[mtls2005]

21 minutes ago, Mickeymaus said:

But do you need such a high speed for a TV? 

 

Dunno.

 

I probably don't need 4G/LTE speeds. I probably don't need 1 GbE fiber. 

 

Given that TV's have not had GbE to date, then maybe not? Fast Ethernet (100 Mpbs) is probably fine for most applications, including 4K. 

 

But it certainly makes cabling less of an issue, or more of a non-issue. 

 

I guess my only point was to be a bit less fixated on a wired connection, especially if it requires complicated cabling installations, and/or a secondary router.

 

I've been down this path a few times, and after drilling holes, fishing and terminating cable, only to find that WiFi is usually faster, simpler, easier, cleaner.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Yellowtail]

2 hours ago, mtls2005 said:

 

Meh. Common misconception. 

 

If the TV has a Gigabit Ethernet (GbE) interface, 10/100/1000 (the AIS router does support GbE), then yes. Otherwise your TV is capped at 100 Mbps. On WiFi (it probably support 5 GHz) it will be much faster, ~ 200 Mbps or higher, even on 2.4 Ghz.

 

 

I haven't seen too many TVs with GbE, but this must be starting to be available?

 

 

 

 

Huh, guess I'll try it with wifi, I could do without the extra cable. 

 

Will using the wifi rather than the LAN  have a negative affect on the amount of wifi available for other devices?

[Yellowtail]

13 hours ago, Eindhoven said:

 

I'll take your word for that and wait to see what happens on Monday.

Indeed

 

 

 

[Eindhoven]

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

Indeed

 

 

 

If you can find HDMI Input Audio Format; change that to PCM too.

[Eindhoven]

16 hours ago, Eindhoven said:

If you can find HDMI Input Audio Format; change that to PCM too.

 

18 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

Indeed

 

 

 

Further to my reply above; it's worth suggesting that Samsung actually suggest choosing Bitstream as opposed to PCM in your case.

 

https://www.samsung.com/us/support/answer/ANS00085244/

[Yellowtail]

9 hours ago, Eindhoven said:

 

Further to my reply above; it's worth suggesting that Samsung actually suggest choosing Bitstream as opposed to PCM in your case.

 

https://www.samsung.com/us/support/answer/ANS00085244/

Thanks, but I don't seem to have Bitstream as an option...

[Eindhoven]

On 7/14/2021 at 10:57 AM, Yellowtail said:

Well I'm a little bummed. Can't seem to make this work. I can get the AV to work, but not with the surround.

 

Optical from AIS set-box to AV works, but the set-box box does not seem to have any settings for sound.

Optical from TV to AV works, but no surround

TV does not have earphone jack, so I can't us the RCA ports

TV has pass-through, but it only works with HDMI ARC

 

Open to suggestions.

 

If I can't get this going I may start shopping new AV receivers...

 

 

I missed this. So you actually get sound, just not surround sound. What source are you using for Surround? DVD Player? TV content?

[Yellowtail]

35 minutes ago, Eindhoven said:

 

I missed this. So you actually get sound, just not surround sound. What source are you using for Surround? DVD Player? TV content?

Mostly Netflix, through the AIS set-box.

 

It worked with the old TV..

 

 

[vinny41]

On 7/14/2021 at 4:57 PM, Yellowtail said:

Well I'm a little bummed. Can't seem to make this work. I can get the AV to work, but not with the surround.

 

Optical from AIS set-box to AV works, but the set-box box does not seem to have any settings for sound.

Optical from TV to AV works, but no surround

TV does not have earphone jack, so I can't us the RCA ports

TV has pass-through, but it only works with HDMI ARC

 

Open to suggestions.

 

If I can't get this going I may start shopping new AV receivers...

 

If you do look for new av receivers suggest you look at one that handles e-arc as your tv has that

What is HDMI eARC? What are the benefits?

https://www.whathifi.com/advice/hdmi-arc-and-hdmi-earc-everything-you-need-to-know

 

good chart contained in the above link shows you differences between optical, hdmi arc and hdmi e-arc

[Eindhoven]

Just now, Yellowtail said:

Mostly Netflix, through the AIS set-box.

 

It worked with the old TV..

 

 

Okay that is something else. You are confusing the TV as a source with the Set top box as a source.

The idea was to get surround sound from the TV up and running first,; otherwise you are complicating the issue.

 

Get TV surround sound up and running and then we can look at the set top box.

[Mickeymaus]

I can't stand it any longer and so I have to ask. What did the Samsung technician that was scheduled for last Monday say? What was / is the problem? 

 

In respect of the promised Dolby Digital to analog converter test - I ordered one at Lazada. The Chinese seller didn't even pack it and so Lazada cancelled it after several days. Then I ordered at a different seller but this Chinese seller didn't pack it too and therefore Lazada cancelled this order too.

 

Perhaps I will try to order one for more money at a Thai dealer. But my motivation in the meantime is... I don't need it because the speakers have a good built-in decoder for analog signals. But I would like to test it to find out if there is much/any noticeable difference in sound quality. 

[Yellowtail]

On 7/30/2021 at 2:25 PM, Mickeymaus said:

I can't stand it any longer and so I have to ask. What did the Samsung technician that was scheduled for last Monday say? What was / is the problem? 

 

In respect of the promised Dolby Digital to analog converter test - I ordered one at Lazada. The Chinese seller didn't even pack it and so Lazada cancelled it after several days. Then I ordered at a different seller but this Chinese seller didn't pack it too and therefore Lazada cancelled this order too.

 

Perhaps I will try to order one for more money at a Thai dealer. But my motivation in the meantime is... I don't need it because the speakers have a good built-in decoder for analog signals. But I would like to test it to find out if there is much/any noticeable difference in sound quality. 

Samsung rescheduled due to covid......

 

I ordered and received an optical to analog converter but it does not work.  

[Bruno123]

5 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

Samsung rescheduled due to covid......

 

I ordered and received an optical to analog converter but it does not work.  

So you think both the TV and the Convertor are malfunctioning?

[Yellowtail]

9 hours ago, Bruno123 said:

So you think both the TV and the Convertor are malfunctioning?

No. I have a new TV, an old TV and an old AV amp.

 

I also have the new optical to analog converter I thought would help but does not.

 

The headphone out on the old TV to the AV provides a signal that the AV converts to "surround" sound, or all speakers.

 

The optical out on the old TV to the AV provides a signal that the AV converts to "stereo", or left and right speakers only.

 

When the optical out on the old TV is connected to the converter, and the headphone out on the converter is connected to the AV, there is no sound.

 

The new TV has no headphone jack, but when it is connected to the AV via optical there is no sound.

 

[Bruno123]

49 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

No. I have a new TV, an old TV and an old AV amp.

 

I also have the new optical to analog converter I thought would help but does not.

 

The headphone out on the old TV to the AV provides a signal that the AV converts to "surround" sound, or all speakers.

 

The optical out on the old TV to the AV provides a signal that the AV converts to "stereo", or left and right speakers only.

 

When the optical out on the old TV is connected to the converter, and the headphone out on the converter is connected to the AV, there is no sound.

 

The new TV has no headphone jack, but when it is connected to the AV via optical there is no sound.

 

You haven't stated as to what happens when you connect the convertor to the new TV and then use headphones, not the AV, to check for sound from the convertor.

The convertor also being faulty, in addition to the Optical out of the new TV being faulty, seems rather unlikely. 

Take the AV out of the equation for now. Keep it simple. TV using a guaranteed source with a Digital output(USB Flash drive? Not your DVD player nor any other external source. TV only), the Convertor and a pair of headphones. 

The more you try to connect at once, the more opportunities you have for mismatching settings.

You certainly went for the cheapest convertor that you could find. A false economy as it likely does not support certain protocols.

 

[Yellowtail]

9 hours ago, Bruno123 said:

You haven't stated as to what happens when you connect the convertor to the new TV and then use headphones, not the AV, to check for sound from the convertor.

The convertor also being faulty, in addition to the Optical out of the new TV being faulty, seems rather unlikely. 

Take the AV out of the equation for now. Keep it simple. TV using a guaranteed source with a Digital output(USB Flash drive? Not your DVD player nor any other external source. TV only), the Convertor and a pair of headphones. 

The more you try to connect at once, the more opportunities you have for mismatching settings.

You certainly went for the cheapest convertor that you could find. A false economy as it likely does not support certain protocols.

 

I will try the headphones with the converter & new TV.

 

I don't know that the converter is faulty, I only know that it is not working for me. Clearly the optical out is working on the old TV, and the optical in in working on the AV.

 

Without knowing anything about converters, and not knowing if the converter would help whether it worked or not I did not see much point in spending much on it.

 

Do you have a converter that you recommend?

 

I'm still hopeful the Samsung tech gets it hammered out.  

[Mickeymaus]

11 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

I will try the headphones with the converter & new TV.

 

I don't know that the converter is faulty, I only know that it is not working for me. Clearly the optical out is working on the old TV, and the optical in in working on the AV.

 

Without knowing anything about converters, and not knowing if the converter would help whether it worked or not I did not see much point in spending much on it.

 

Do you have a converter that you recommend?

 

I'm still hopeful the Samsung tech gets it hammered out.  

You wrote that the optical out at the AIS box works. So the converter doesn't work on both - the old TV and the AIS box? In respect of headphones and the converter - it might not have a build in amplifier.