39 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

Complete chicanery is all this is.  Lies and subterfuge by this government as usual.

Relax, I’m a nurse, says Thai soldier who showed off his Pfizer jab

A military man fired back this morning at those questioning how he came by a Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine, saying he was a nurse who deserved the much-sought vaccine. 

 

Noppadon Maneechan, a sergeant in Loei province, responded to outrage that the military was given preferential treatment to say that he works on the pandemic front  and therefore deserved to receive a dose of high-grade vaccines recently donated by the United States. 

 

https://coconuts.co/bangkok/news/relax-im-a-nurse-says-thai-soldier-who-showed-off-his-pfizer-jab/

26 minutes ago, mtraveler said:

Nice that it reminds you of that.  But they're not the same.  That's a false equivalency.  

 

Wrong?  Well, that's your opinion. 

 

As a taxpaying American, MY opinion is this:  I think there's some merit to my being allocated a vaccine, inasmuch as it's a small percentage of what is being donated, and it would be nice if some of the donated vaccine were allocated to us citizens.  Were there sufficient good quality vaccine here, that would be a different story, and I'd wait my turn for something offered to me. 

 

In addition, most of us foreigners are either over 60 (which I am), have risk factors, or both.  I've waited a long time for an opportunity to get the vaccine, and still waiting.  So, this to me seems fair.  

It is my opinion as well.  Everyone that chose to move to Thailand for whatever reason from our original (I will use United States in this thread - but it extends to all countries) country, chose to leave the United States and live under the rules, and regulations of Thailand.  You have that freedom to leave your country and do, but once you leave the borders of the US and move permanently to another country - you are choosing to live under that local jurisdiction (Thailand).   There is no medical priority of because you are an expat you have a higher priority, and any deviation from those medically decided prioritization are wrong...  US has no authority or responsibility for people living under another countries jurisdiction, though the US through it's embassy may exert pressure to make sure you are treated fairly and equal to a local citizen.  There is also a concept political of reciprocity, where the US does something for foreign nationals and can pressure foreign countries for similar treatment (it is under this that foreign diplomats generally were prioritized -- mainly since by sending them on a foreign post -- they are responsible to ensure they are safe -- and you cannot close an embassy or foreign mission and have everyone work from home). 

 

So there you have an example of hypocrisy generally speaking, there is talk of vaccines should be prioritized based on medical conditions and vulnerability... but then they want to change the priority to favor themselves and use other criteria such as nationality which is not a medical criteria to push themselves up as they see themselves deserving of special treatment by right of birth.

 

---

 

You should be treated equal to a Thai over 60 that has risk factors, it is medical criteria that must determine access to vaccines in Thailand.  Once you chose to live in Thailand, you chose to live under that jurisdictions laws and regulations.  The US has no responsibility to extend social programs (free vaccination is socialized medicine) to foreign jurisdictions.  If you want to be prioritized to the same as the US, you should take a PCR test, put on an N95 mask and hop on a plane and go home.

I'm not a fortune teller... I don't know what's going to happen in the future. But I can look at the recent past, and see we've had repeated temporary dips in daily cases (as noted by the red circles I've added to the MoPH graph), and each time, those dips thus far have been followed by subsequent increases to new highs....  Will this latest pause be any different?

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807010004296/?type=3

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382806963337634/?type=3

 

 

 

5 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

The reality is that this will be around for a long time unfortunately.  I just saw that Pfizer, Moderna and J&J have applied to the FDA to change the status of their vaccines from one of emergency use to one a true and approved vaccination.

 

Pfizer at the top for full approval it seems.

https://www.wkrg.com/health/coronavirus/pfizers-covid-19-vaccine-expected-to-receive-full-fda-approval-by-labor-day-report-says/

 

The approval is needed for companies, schools, government deparments etc to be able to impose vaccine mandates on the anti-vax idiots in the US who are putting everyone at risk.  They can't force people to take an experimental vaccine.

 

Thailand's anti-vaxxers are also a very significant group but not yet considered a problem while there are shortages. 

1 minute ago, bkkcanuck8 said:

You must have missed all the whinging about how the US government should vaccinate Americans in Thailand, and UK citizens demanding the same in that country... 

no I missed none of it, it has nothing to do with the post I responded to where he accused some people of wanting the Pfizer vaccine before Thai people. Wanting a share is a very different thing.

2 hours ago, anchadian said:

The vaccination situation for 2,417 people who died from #COVID19. Along the bottom are the age groups. The colours are as follows: yellow (not vaccinated), grey (1 shot within 2 weeks), orange (1 shot more than 2 weeks), and blue (2 jabs of vaccine) #Thailand

 

https://twitter.com/ThaiNewsReports/status/1424608780600320002

 

Not sure I understand it but as someone else mentioned, no blue.  And, I would assume at least half and possibly the majority of 2 shot folks are Sinovac as most people seem to be waiting for their second Astrazenica.  So, is this evidence that Sinovac  (2 shots) is in fact preventing death?

Just now, Kadilo said:

My memory is fine thanks for your concern. 
 

Perhaps you could prove that before making insulting accusations. Ie they wanted it before Thai people

34 minutes ago, mtraveler said:

Nice that it reminds you of that.  But they're not the same.  That's a false equivalency.  

 

Wrong?  Well, that's your opinion. 

 

As a taxpaying American, MY opinion is this:  I think there's some merit to my being allocated a vaccine, inasmuch as it's a small percentage of what is being donated, and it would be nice if some of the donated vaccine were allocated to us citizens.  Were there sufficient good quality vaccine here, that would be a different story, and I'd wait my turn for something offered to me. 

 

In addition, most of us foreigners are either over 60 (which I am), have risk factors, or both.  I've waited a long time for an opportunity to get the vaccine, and still waiting.  So, this to me seems fair.  

Apparently according to some people you don’t exist. 
 

You were allocated some. Just not enough to stop the whiners as you were at the bottom of the priority list and rightly so imo. 
 

Only MY opinion of course.   
 

Hasn't appeared from TNR as yet:

 

Of the new cases, 16,119 were found in hospitals and medical services (which includes contact tracing cases), 3,159 were from a proactive approach at previously reported clusters, 313 were from prisons, and the remaining 12 were imported cases.

 

https://thepattayanews.com/2021/08/09/recap-thailand-finds-19603-daily-covid-19-infections-with-149-additional-deaths-191145-new-vaccinated-people-reported-nationwide-in-the-past-24-hours/

 

 

 

 

3 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Not sure I understand it but as someone else mentioned, no blue.  And, I would assume at least half and possibly the majority of 2 shot folks are Sinovac as most people seem to be waiting for their second Astrazenica.  So, is this evidence that Sinovac  (2 shots) is in fact preventing death?

I had no doubt of that (though Bangkok area is prioritized as AZ for first shot, and Sinovac the second shot; provinces the reverse)....  The evidence is that it is not as effective, but being partially effective is very likely to have a greater impact on the severity and thus the mortality rate.  A vaccine does not prevent infection, it prepares your immune system to recognize the virus and thus the speed at which it is able to fight off the infection... which typically means less likely to have symptoms, and much less likely to have severe symptoms (and since the Delta sheds in 4 days, potentially does not stop the spread of the virus as much as other vaccines).   The evidence of this is the 600+ medical staff getting infected after receiving full vaccination... and having medical staff infected and either being a spreader or at risk and thus potentially leading to a collapsing healthcare system -- very problematic.

Cases in Bangkok have been on a downward trend in recent days... But they also were before (as noted by the red circles I added to the graph), prior to reaching new record highs in a resurgence last week that peaked at 4,700 new cases just last Friday, followed by the weekend fall-off.

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807200004277/?type=3

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807113337619/?type=3

'

 

 

 

13 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

I'm not a fortune teller... I don't know what's going to happen in the future. But I can look at the recent past, and see we've had repeated temporary dips in daily cases (as noted by the red circles I've added to the MoPH graph), and each time, those dips thus far have been followed by subsequent increases to new highs....  Will this latest pause be any different?

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807010004296/?type=3

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382806963337634/?type=3

 

 

 

Walk in case's (blue bar) can't get much higher, there dont have more place where to walk in!

Other issue is , how much higher the infection rate can get?! If now make 50k test and find almost 20k case! In Europe ,contry's been really worried if infection rate has been 1 - 3%!!!!!!!

7 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Cases in Bangkok have been on a downward trend in recent days... But they also were before (as noted by the red circles I added to the graph), prior to reaching new record highs in a resurgence last week that peaked at 4,700 new cases just last Friday, followed by the weekend fall-off.

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807200004277/?type=3

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807113337619/?type=3

'

 

 

 

Bangkok downward cases yes, upward positivity rate 15.75% also yes. clear sign they have not been testing enough as we all know and have not increased it as they know they should. Even when it was this bad in the UK it was never as high as this in places like London.

What’s funny about the post Kadilo. It’s a serious situation

You said it looked like the peak was in, a very different context to that described by me which is not a laughing matter, cases cannot be found when there is limited testing and lives lost as a result.

 

I will also name you at will when it is appropriate as it was then.

Thailand’s Ministry of Public Health is speeding up its COVID-19 vaccination drive for target groups, especially senior citizens, to reduce the death rate.

 

Department of Disease Control (DDC) deputy director-general Dr. Sophon Iamsirsithavorn said the department wants to vaccinate 70% of the elderly population in the “red dark” zones and 50% elsewhere, to cut the number of deaths by half. According to the Mor Prom app, fewer than 50%, or only 3.668 million seniors nationwide have received the vaccine.

 

https://www.facebook.com/nbtworld/posts/10158190877702050

MoPH today had a couple of updated charts on the COVID hospital beds situation in Bangkok and its 5 adjoining provinces, as follows:

 

The last time they posted a chart like this in late July, the combined number of hospitalized patients with moderate to severe symptoms (the red and yellow segments combined) was a combined 22% of all COVID hospitalizations. In the latest chart below, that combined share has now risen to almost 26%, with almost all of that increase coming in the moderate symptoms group. The mild symptoms group (the light green line) fell from 55% to just under 51%.

 

 

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807440004253/?type=3

 

July 25 prior version:

 

 

20 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Bangkok downward cases yes, upward positivity rate 15.75% also yes. clear sign they have not been testing enough as we all know and have not increased it as they know they should. Even when it was this bad in the UK it was never as high as this in places like London.

 

And the other issue, of course, is lately how many of the actual real COVID cases are not getting officially reported and instead shunted off into the "probable case" category in home isolation based on antigen testing, and then no followup RT-PCR tests to confirm.

 

It's worth noting that in today's report, almost half of all the new COVID deaths reported in Bangkok (24 out of 54 deaths) occurred at home instead of in hospitals.  That's pretty shocking!

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382806820004315/?type=3

 

 

1 hour ago, mtraveler said:

Nice that it reminds you of that.  But they're not the same.  That's a false equivalency.  

 

Wrong?  Well, that's your opinion. 

 

As a taxpaying American, MY opinion is this:  I think there's some merit to my being allocated a vaccine, inasmuch as it's a small percentage of what is being donated, and it would be nice if some of the donated vaccine were allocated to us citizens.  Were there sufficient good quality vaccine here, that would be a different story, and I'd wait my turn for something offered to me. 

 

In addition, most of us foreigners are either over 60 (which I am), have risk factors, or both.  I've waited a long time for an opportunity to get the vaccine, and still waiting.  So, this to me seems fair.  

And it need not be either-or.  The US could simply make an additional donation for its citizens.  They're binning unwanted expired vaccines now in some states.

16 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Bangkok downward cases yes, upward positivity rate 15.75% also yes. clear sign they have not been testing enough as we all know and have not increased it as they know they should. Even when it was this bad in the UK it was never as high as this in places like London.

isn't the high positivity rate related to the combo of delta variant and low % of vaccinated in the population ?  it is hard to compare it to london as the delta hit there when much of the population was vaccinated.  i realize the vaccinated can still get infected but the symptoms are more mild and i would assume many of the vaccinated that are infected aren't getting tested.   i remember some states in the US had positivity rates higher than 15% at certain periods.  i think some exceeded 20%.  before delta and before vaccines.

4 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

And the other issue, of course, is lately how many of the actual real COVID cases are not getting officially reported and instead shunted off into the "probable case" category in home isolation based on antigen testing, and then no followup RT-PCR tests to confirm.

 

They are trying to pull the wool over the people's eyes. The rational will see through this deception the gullible will not.

14 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

You said it looked like the peak was in, a very different context to that described by me which is not a laughing matter, cases cannot be found when there is limited testing and lives lost as a result.

 

I will also name you at will when it is appropriate as it was then.

You need to quote someone BKK Brian if you wish to reply to them. 

1 minute ago, buick said:

isn't the high positivity rate related to the combo of delta variant and low % of vaccinated in the population ?  it is hard to compare it to london as the delta hit there when much of the population was vaccinated.  i realize the vaccinated can still get infected but the symptoms are more mild and i would assume many of the vaccinated that are infected aren't getting tested.   i remember some states in the US had positivity rates higher than 15% at certain periods.  i think some exceeded 20%.  before delta and before vaccines.

positivity rate is solely related to testing and the level of the virus in a given area or place. The higher it is the higher the virus is spreading and the more testing is needed to identify the people with the virus. Simple as that.

10 minutes ago, Misty said:

And it need not be either-or.  The US could simply make an additional donation for its citizens.  They're binning unwanted expired vaccines now in some states.

Good call. 
 

Would leave even more for the Thai citizen's then to get an improved vaccine. 
 

Disgraceful that countries may be binning over supply when there are still countries that could do with a boost b

6 minutes ago, Kadilo said:

You need to quote someone BKK Brian if you wish to reply to them. 

You have just found out this is not the case as that’s exactly what you did, it is also not against forum rules.

2 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

positivity rate is solely related to testing and the level of the virus in a given area or place. The higher it is the higher the virus is spreading and the more testing is needed to identify the people with the virus. Simple as that.

 

That 15% positivity rate on outreach COVID testing is Bangkok is a cumulative rate, since the beginning of their outreach testing in BKK.... which is VERY high. It would be very/more interesting if they'd publicly provide the same info on the CURRENT testing results/rates they're getting.

 

All I can say is, I believe that rate has been gradually going up over time. I wanna say it was hovering around the 12% range for quite a long time. So that's at least some indicator that things aren't likely getting any better with recent results.

 

25 minutes ago, Kadilo said:

Good call. 
 

Would leave even more for the Thai citizen's then to get an improved vaccine. 
 

Disgraceful that countries may be binning over supply when there are still countries that could do with a boost b

What is the source of this 'binning' story?  What state is the vaccine in?  How long til it expires?  Is this binning opened vaccines, opened packs, (one vial contains 10 doses; 1 pack contains 195 vials).  A pack would be shipped in a container that serves as a temporary ultra-cold freezer (-70C) and the dry ice must be replenished regularly.  If shipped from the manufacturer directly, it can be packed on and loaded on a flight and arrive, but to collect these already distributed vaccines, merge them, probably cannot verify that the vaccines vials of an open pack have not been compromised -- then you get into a situation were maybe one vial is good and another not so much.  The US is donating ordered vaccines that are coming from the manufacturer but will not be needed within the time allocated... but I think you may not be getting the whole story (or the writer is not understanding the whole story) about what is binned and why and in what condition...

 

Once a vial has been breached it has to be used in a short period of time or the rest of the doses are lost, in fact in some regions when there was a priority list and you were not that priority... you could get a vaccine if you put yourself on a shortlist of people that could show up at a moments call so that doses in one vial were not lost.

Another couple of graphics today from MoPH on COVID hospitalizations in the BKK region (BKK plus five adjoining provinces):

 

The number of COVID patients hospitalized in the region has increased from 30,631 to 37,759 during the past month. And if you look at the light blue line, new admissions have been on a downward trend in recent days, but the graph doesn't explain why (lack of available beds or something else).

 

 

But the following graph gives a clue to the answer to that:

 

The government is reporting that there still is a backlog of 2,093 COVID patients needing hospitalization as of yesterday (the right portion of the graph below), including 100 with severe symptoms, and 77 of those having waited more than one day (the red line segments).

 

The left portion of the chart below, though, says that backlog number has declined from 5,668 as of July 24, though the unserved severe symptoms group (then 87/57) has instead increased over the past two-plus weeks.

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807526670911/?type=3

 

I believe, but the chart doesn't say, that a lot of the improvement in the backlog of COVID cases has been the government's recent policy of instead referring COVID cases to home isolation.

 

In separate graphs today, they posted a graph appearing to say there are are more than 45,000+ people currently in home isolation in the Bangkok region, and that they supposedly have the capacity to put up to 100,000 people in home isolation.

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807633337567/?type=3

 

 

 

8 hours ago, webfact said:

The news comes as the Public Health Ministry has decided to allow health units to administer Favipiravir to all groups of COVID-19 patients, including those currently under home and community isolation.

Wow what a novel idea.

MoPH graphic today says the positivity rate of antigen testing kit results in Bangkok, which has ranged almost up to 20% on Aug. 2 and 5, is currently running just under 8% for the latest day's results:

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/informationcovid19/photos/a.106455480972785/382807746670889/?type=3