Thai insurance regulator urged to rescind order forbidding cancellation of COVID insurance policies

[snoop1130]

 

The Thai General Insurance Association is urging the Office of Insurance Commission (OIC) to rescind its order forbidding insurance companies from cancelling the so-called “Found, Paid, Done” policies covering COVID-19 infection, claiming that it may force insurance companies in Thailand into bankruptcy.

 

The association president, Anon Vangvasu, said that insurance companies may have to turn to the Central Administrative Court to seek emergency protection if the order is not revised.

 

He pointed out that insurance claims under these policies, which currently amount to about 37 billion baht, accounting for 26.5% of the Insurance Fund, and which are likely to increase to 40 billion baht, or about 30%, could, if there were a new wave of the COVID-19 pandemic, overwhelm the Insurance Fund.

 

Full Story: https://www.thaipbsworld.com/thai-insurance-regulator-urged-to-rescind-order-forbidding-cancellation-of-covid-insurance-policies/

 

-- © Copyright Thai PBS 2021-11-19

 

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[ChrisY1]

Only here....Insurance companies very happy to take the insurance premiums for Covid.....but might go broke if they have to pay out! 

My guess would be the OIC (with some grand persuasion) might accept their claims!

[WHansen]

Alas, a familiar story with insurance companies, all smiles while they are taking the hefty premiums but then try every trick in the book to not pay out on a claim.

[ukrules]

Insurance companies which don't do their job properly already have a procedure to follow.

 

It's called bankruptcy and that should be the end of the matter.

[kotsak]

Keep getting while the getting is good.. Bloody blood suckers...

[robblok]

3 hours ago, ukrules said:

Insurance companies which don't do their job properly already have a procedure to follow.

 

It's called bankruptcy and that should be the end of the matter.

Indeed.. if you collect premium you have to pay out even if you got the odds wrong, its not like the people you insure get money back if they dont claim. 

 

This is what the fund is for.

[Enzian]

The potential for moral hazard here is stark. If they let the companies renig because their risk assessment was flawed, it will have consequences. How can the government require people to have insurance for certain things, like re-entry into the country, if the sanctity of contracts is not upheld and the insurance is therefore meaningless? Can companies only exist if they are never allowed to fail? They have a fund, but wouldn't they also be required to re-insure against black swans with outfits like Lloyd's, like every other insurance company in the world?

[RubbaJohnny]

That is why re=insurance giants like Munch Re exist, I have worked with them.

 

How very Thai poor risk management and now trying to wriggle out of contracts like Hopewell all over again and the failed airline, I guess they know the rest of the honest world says "don't Thai" me so their reputation is already poor but foreigners compelled to buy worthless policies seems like a dream come true.

 

What they may not realize the new 3 million here for OA and even $ 50k are all deterrents and when people fin that other equally attractive places don't cheat they may never return .Sometimes it not only the trivial sums it's the sheer timewasting inconvenience like 90 day report their TM 30 the renewal for me 156 pages to sign of the same stuff every single year. It is what it is take it or leave and I think fewer and fewer will find Thailand attractive for retirement.

[asean]

1 hour ago, RubbaJohnny said:

That is why re=insurance giants like Munch Re exist, I have worked with them.

 

How very Thai poor risk management and now trying to wriggle out of contracts like Hopewell all over again and the failed airline, I guess they know the rest of the honest world says "don't Thai" me so their reputation is already poor but foreigners compelled to buy worthless policies seems like a dream come true.

 

What they may not realize the new 3 million here for OA and even $ 50k are all deterrents and when people fin that other equally attractive places don't cheat they may never return .Sometimes it not only the trivial sums it's the sheer timewasting inconvenience like 90 day report their TM 30 the renewal for me 156 pages to sign of the same stuff every single year. It is what it is take it or leave and I think fewer and fewer will find Thailand attractive for retirement.

How are the 3 million and 50k deterrents ? 

[hotchilli]

15 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

The Thai General Insurance Association is urging the Office of Insurance Commission (OIC) to rescind its order forbidding insurance companies from cancelling the so-called “Found, Paid, Done” policies covering COVID-19 infection, claiming that it may force insurance companies in Thailand into bankruptcy.

LOL

[hotchilli]

This is Thailand... contracts mean nothing.

[Gsxrnz]

Assessing risk is a personality trait often found wanting in the land of smiles. 

 

I also wonder about the sanity of anybody who purchases an insurance policy of any kind in a developing country and expects the contract laws of that country to protect them. 

 

 

[tonray]

11 hours ago, kotsak said:

Keep getting while the getting is good.. Bloody blood suckers...

Traditionally you'll employ underwriters who assess risk and limit it to potential payout requirements. here Underwriting is an under the table envelope endeavor

[Scott Tracy]

Tough <deleted>. Should have carried out a proper risk assessment before taking the punters' money. 

 

Do not, repeat, do not repeal the instruction to Insurance companies. They made their bed, now they must lie in it.

[tomacht8]

Perhaps it would also be a good idea to start with the hospitals that issue disproportionately high bills for their services.

Such a Covit insurance, which covers $ 50K or $ 100K, is also a temptation for hospitals to exhaust this pot to the full.

A uniform list of costs / services would make sense. The price differences for one and the same service are gigantic here. And in the case of foreigners, an extra 200-300% is generally added again.

Edited November 20, 2021 by tomacht8

[Karma80]

This is disgusting. Nobody asked them to create or sell these products. It was of their own doing, making and greed.

 

It should equally serve as a warning to anyone thinking of coming to Thailand under the false notion that insurance here covers you for what you think.

 

[Pravda]

Forget about insurance companies trying to scam you. The real story here is why are they so scared. I thought covid in Thailand is under control?

[Snow Leopard]

When the profits role in they are privatised. When the losses mount up its socialised. Same the world over. They should really tighten up this loophole on publicly traded companies. The first hint of any troubled waters or looming bankrupcy the assets of the CEO, CFO, Directors should be frozen and liquidated if required before any bailouts from taxpayers. 

Edited November 20, 2021 by Snow Leopard
spelling

[khunPer]

Insurance is business, sometimes you gain a lot, and sometimes you lose some money, which results in that the owners, the shareholders, don't get dividend for some time.

[Cake Monster]

14 hours ago, kotsak said:

Keep getting while the getting is good.. Bloody blood suckers...

Leeches spring to mind.

[John Drake]

If the insurance companies will do this to their fellow Thais, imagine what they'll do to foreigners with mandated insurance.

[chilly07]

But haven't they insured against this risk? Too quick to gather premiums and too slow to offset and mitigate perhaps because the 'profits' have already been spent!

[Sheryl]

No way the OIC can allow this.

 

As for the companies, they either made errors in their initial assumptions, were not quick enough to stop issuing new  policies as the rate of COVID infection went up,  or have failed to weed out false claims. Or all of these things. 

 

 

 

 

[connda]

Why?  Insurance companies are essentially government condoned book-makers and betting pools.  So the insurance companies make a bet, then can't cover their bets without losing money, and then plead for the government to allow them to renege their bets which don't show a profit. Insurance companies need to eat there bad bets, quit whinging, or get out of the business.

[Sheryl]

1 minute ago, connda said:

Why?  Insurance companies are essentially government condoned book-makers and betting pools.  So the insurance companies make a bet, then can't cover their bets without losing money, and then plead for the government to allow them to renege their bets which don't show a profit. Insurance companies need to eat there bad bets, quit whinging, or get out of the business.

 

Agree and would add- they need to examine what happened, why it happened, what could have prevented it, and take necessary corrective action internally.

 

These payout for positive test policies were designed at a time that COVID prevalence was very low,  in fact near nil.  The companies made certain assumptions and projections that failed to take into account the very high probability of a COVID resurgence. That alone was a big error and one that could have been prevented had any qualified public health professional been consulted. They then were slow to react when the epidemiological picture changed. (They were stuck having to honor the policies already issued, but could have been quicker to stop issuing new ones or could have adjusted premiums for new policies upward).  And they may have seriosu weaknesses with their claims verification processes.

 

 

[realfunster]

38 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

No way the OIC can allow this.

 

As for the companies, they either made errors in their initial assumptions, were not quick enough to stop issuing new  policies as the rate of COVID infection went up,  or have failed to weed out false claims. Or all of these things. 

 

 

 

 

I have a contact in the industry. I was absolutely gobsmacked when I was informed some policies were being sold at 500-1000 with 100k-200k coverage just for getting COVID. Not health costs - just being able to present a positive test.

 

It was absolute insanity and greed to have been issuing these policies. I understand some companies continued to issue until as late as June this year. Stupidity, if not negligence. 

 

Be careful what you wish for when you request the OIC/government take a hardline stance on this matter. As usual, only the big boys will survive and available choice in the market will reduce. 

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, realfunster said:

I have a contact in the industry. I was absolutely gobsmacked when I was informed some policies were being sold at 500-1000 with 100k-200k coverage just for getting COVID. Not health costs - just being able to present a positive test.

 

It was absolute insanity and greed to have been issuing these policies. I understand some companies continued to issue until as late as June this year. Stupidity, if not negligence. 

 

Be careful what you wish for when you request the OIC/government take a hardline stance on this matter. As usual, only the big boys will survive and available choice in the market will reduce. 

 

Yes  it well may. BUT  the reduction will be insurers who do not know what they are doing/do not use good professional judgement and standards, and issue policies they are not able to cover..

 

What benefit is there to anyone in having them part of the pool of choices? If anything just increases the odds that people will end up having claims issues with their insurer.

[Golden Triangle]

Be interesting to see if I can renew the COVID-19 insurance from Roojai which I and a lot of other people on here bought at 800 Baht, one for me, one for the mrs, that was I believe either late last year or very early this year, I may have answered my own question ????

[madmitch]

Many of these policies were sold through banks. The commission the banks make on these poicies is obscene; insurers often only get a small percentage of the overall premium, the rest going not only to the banks but also to other intermediaries.

 

The companies have made a bad underwriting misjudgement here and if they've not taken out adequate reinsurance then they alone are to blame, though in all honesty I don't think any professional international  company would have underwritten this.

 

The OIC must stick to their guns here.

[Enzian]

I'm pretty sure I have one of these policies in my storage unit in Bangkok, where I will be in 3 weeks. It's a second year renewal. The first year I bought in my bank around March 2020. The second year was promoted by email and snail mailed to me this year. 

A point I have not seen made is that the insurance companies made exactly the same mistake as Anutin and his gang regarding vaccine procurement: they assumed that the low case numbers throughout 2020 would continue into 2021, even for the duration of the pandemic. The elite here operate as a unit so it suggests that the two parties are in some way the same people. And none of them paid attention to the trajectory of the virus in other countries, which is incredible; I did read of one doctor who tried to tell them in 2020 and said no one would listen to him. And if there were underlings who thought about it, they would know to keep their mouths shut. 

LOS needs a major house cleaning.