‘Joe Ferrari’, six other ex-cops deny charge of torturing suspect to death

[gerritkaew]

14 hours ago, webfact said:

None in the group confessed to the charge of murder

yes we understand, when you get the dead penalty  ...

[rudi49jr]

1 hour ago, koele2 said:

Don’t worry, a deal has probably been made already.  My guess is 5 yrs, all his fancy cars and money distributed to the higher ups, and he gets to keep a little when he gets out.  All contingent upon him not ratting out his bosses and how rotten to the core everyone at his level or above are.  If there was no video, he would have gone free.

My thoughts exactly, spot on!

[Thunglom]

8 hours ago, Asquith Production said:

This is not just about drugs. This is about how Police get there confessions know matter what the offence.

Good point - but they have obviously used the "drug" aspect of this as if it is some kind of justification.

Edited November 20, 2021 by Thunglom

[Thunglom]

1 hour ago, chang1 said:

So drugs of all kinds are totally safe and should be freely available to anyone who wants them?

an oxymoron if ever I saw one. The police are using the faux concept of "drugs war" to mitigate or justify their actions. = Probaly the most dangerous spin-off from drugs.

Unfortunately you really don't seem to have a grasp on "drugs" yourself - you appear to contradict yourself over and again.

the war on drugs has failed and it it attitudes like yours that keep th myth and the deaths going.

Edited November 20, 2021 by Thunglom

[LoeiI]

6 hours ago, Dont confuse me said:

My thoughts are that Joe is admitting assaulting the victim with a plastic bag, but not the fatal bag, he could argue that 1 or 2 were placed loosely over the head to illicit a confession however the others were not of his doing neither was the tightening of them around the neck.

A little far fetched but if the video was to go walkies along with the whistle blower, he might stand a chance!

I am also surprised that it appears they are all sticking together no one is apparently looking for a deal?

But TIT looking forward to the end result!

Kyle Rittenhouse ????, Red Bull boy.  the Boll%ck who crashed into the bus TIT ?? I also cant wait for the result (although i have an idea what it might be) ???? 

[RobU]

One thing we have to remember is that it was an honest policeman who posed this video after trying to complain to superiors with no success. I shows that at the sharp end there are many honest police officers the corruption lies in the management (just as happened in the red Bull Case) who override justice to protect the wealthy (and Jo Ferrari was wealthy)

[dinsdale]

There was an article a couple a days ago. Thai culture is more important than personal freedom. This is Thai culture on show. You have money then you can kill someone. Nevermind. Seems the missus has taken off with the money. I'm guessing he'll walk. 

[kimamey]

16 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

Right, so if you are torturing someone and they 'accidentally die' in the process they should get a lesser sentence or be charged with less, even less than manslaughter ? If you are not willing to accept the person you are torturing may die - don't do it ! 

 

Police officer (term used badly)  deserves the death sentence he is due

 

 

 

 

Manslaughter usually means unintentionally killing someone. I don't know what the sentencing options are in Thai law but in the UK you can still get a long sentence. It would depend on the likelihood of the victim dying due to your actions. In this case I would have thought that there was no intention of causing death but they should have been aware that it was a very real possibility so the sentence should be longer. 

[dinsdale]

5 hours ago, chang1 said:

Pointless war?

So drugs of all kinds are totally safe and should be freely available to anyone who wants them?

People should be allowed to give school kids whatever they want to get them hooked?

Just look at the harm legal drugs like alcohol and tobacco cause. 

Personally I don't care if someone wants to ruin their lives with drugs but unfortunately it's not just the users who suffer. Families, road users, work colleagues, hospital and first responders are just some of those that get impacted. The war will never be won as there will always be weak people needing a high and low life's willing to supply drugs no matter how risky.

Better education and more emphasis on the effects of drugs on other people may help. Things like 10 year driving bans for those found driving with illegal drugs. People who neglect their children or commit crimes due to drugs should be forced to go cold turkey and then get help to stay off them. Fines and prisons are certainly not much of a deterrent. 

If your drug of choice doesn't cause you to affect other people in any way and you have it under control then I see little point in taking any action against you but as soon as you start a car engine or forget to feed your kid then you deserve all you get. 

Joe deserves to loose all his wealth and spend at least 20 years locked up. As for his subordinates, they are probably too scared to stand up against the system but still need to spend a good time behind bars. As for the victim, if he was involved with the drug trade, I am not too worried about him and his death will send out a warning signal to others. 

You may think the war is pointless but I would much rather police were stopping scumbags giving my kid drugs through the school railings than me having to stop them.

 

All drugs should be legal. Kids as you mention should be educated in a postive mode not just drugs are bad. Drugs aren't bad if used properly and are clean. Been used for centuries. Portugal has a good attitude towards this. Educate, set up community help for the addicted, set up employment programs and a lot more (worth having a look) and crime goes down as does other negative things associated with 'illicit' drug taking. Corruption disappears. This is why it doesn't happen. 

Edited November 20, 2021 by dinsdale

[phetphet]

13 hours ago, Classic Ray said:

In UK and US law an essential difference between murder and manslaughter is murder must be carried out “with malice aforethought, either express or implied” which translates as an intention to kill or cause really serious bodily harm. If the prosecution can prove that the acts committed were intended at minimum to cause really serious bodily harm, then it will be murder. Otherwise it can only be manslaughter at most. So putting one bag on a victim’s head for short periods resulting in death might be manslaughter, whereas several bags and tape being used is good evidence of intent from the point of view that such actions  showed at least recklessness for the welfare of the victim. 
 

It is difficult to prove what is in the mind of the killers, called mens rea, and depends on skillful interview and evidence gathered before and after the fact.

 

i also don’t know to what extent Thai law follows these principles.

Whether murder or manslaughter, the fact that it was carried out in a police station, by one or more police officers, on a suspect in custody and under restraint make this far worse than if it was done by common criminals.

 

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

 

 

Edited November 20, 2021 by phetphet

[RobU]

13 minutes ago, kimamey said:

Manslaughter usually means unintentionally killing someone. I don't know what the sentencing options are in Thai law but in the UK you can still get a long sentence. It would depend on the likelihood of the victim dying due to your actions. In this case I would have thought that there was no intention of causing death but they should have been aware that it was a very real possibility so the sentence should be longer. 

Death under torture is classed as murder in Thailand and many other countries. This applies whether there was intent to kill or not. The act of torture is in itself illegal thus any consequences must be dealt with as severely as possible.

[Neeranam]

15 hours ago, tracker1 said:

One has to remember if one has money and has influential friends anything is possible in the Land of Smiles !  He has both

Exactly, much ado about nothing, yet these cases always bring the expat judges out in force, thinking they are still living in Kansas or Kittyminster.

 

 

[Neeranam]

53 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

There was an article a couple a days ago. Thai culture is more important than personal freedom. This is Thai culture on show. You have money then you can kill someone. Nevermind. Seems the missus has taken off with the money. I'm guessing he'll walk. 

Really?

 

Different cultures have different priorities for various personal freedoms. 

This is one of the criteria that defines culture! Of course he'll walk, anyone who thinks otherwise is totally naive, or i not paying attention to the world around them

Take a look at Americans for example, personal freedom seems to be more important than washing twice a day, according to Anutin. Community spirit is  a higher priority in Thailand, hence wearing masks, unlike foreigners when Anutin offered free ones on that infamous day. 

[Rudey]

5 hours ago, chang1 said:

Pointless war?

So drugs of all kinds are totally safe and should be freely available to anyone who wants them?

People should be allowed to give school kids whatever they want to get them hooked?

Just look at the harm legal drugs like alcohol and tobacco cause. 

Personally I don't care if someone wants to ruin their lives with drugs but unfortunately it's not just the users who suffer. Families, road users, work colleagues, hospital and first responders are just some of those that get impacted. The war will never be won as there will always be weak people needing a high and low life's willing to supply drugs no matter how risky.

Better education and more emphasis on the effects of drugs on other people may help. Things like 10 year driving bans for those found driving with illegal drugs. People who neglect their children or commit crimes due to drugs should be forced to go cold turkey and then get help to stay off them. Fines and prisons are certainly not much of a deterrent. 

If your drug of choice doesn't cause you to affect other people in any way and you have it under control then I see little point in taking any action against you but as soon as you start a car engine or forget to feed your kid then you deserve all you get. 

Joe deserves to loose all his wealth and spend at least 20 years locked up. As for his subordinates, they are probably too scared to stand up against the system but still need to spend a good time behind bars. As for the victim, if he was involved with the drug trade, I am not too worried about him and his death will send out a warning signal to others. 

You may think the war is pointless but I would much rather police were stopping scumbags giving my kid drugs through the school railings than me having to stop them.

 

I agree with most of what you’ve written. 
But the biggest problem here is, the cops and army are the main “dealers”. 
This guy’s death is not a deterrent to selling drugs, it’s only a warning the small dealers must share with the “big dealers” (police and army). 
Yes sad, but true. 
What is also sad in this country is, many people have no other way to “get ahead”, other than selling drugs.  
Zero help from the government for the unemployed, due to Covid doesn’t doesn’t help!!!

[Neeranam]

2 minutes ago, Rudey said:

What is also sad in this country is, many people have no other way to “get ahead”, other than selling drugs.  

Compared to what country? I hope you are not from USA. 

 

• Over 500,000 people are incarcerated in the US on drug charges, which is more than all of Western Europe’s prisoners, on all criminal charges, combined.
• The US spent $1 trillion fighting the war on drugs.
• The global drug industry accounts for 1% of all worldwide commerce.
• 80% of all globally produced opioids are consumed by Americans.

[dinsdale]

8 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Really?

 

Different cultures have different priorities for various personal freedoms. 

This is one of the criteria that defines culture! Of course he'll walk, anyone who thinks otherwise is totally naive, or i not paying attention to the world around them

Take a look at Americans for example, personal freedom seems to be more important than washing twice a day, according to Anutin. Community spirit is  a higher priority in Thailand, hence wearing masks, unlike foreigners when Anutin offered free ones on that infamous day. 

I'm saying corruption is part of Thai culture. Every Thai person knows it is. I said on another thread that the Loy Krathong at the local temple broke the State of Emergency and CCSA laws yet was allowed to continue. We all know why. Not sure why you questioned my post. Corruption is top to bottom here.

[Thunglom]

1 hour ago, dinsdale said:

There was an article a couple a days ago. Thai culture is more important than personal freedom. This is Thai culture on show. You have money then you can kill someone. Nevermind. Seems the missus has taken off with the money. I'm guessing he'll walk. 

More police culture than Thai culture.

[Thunglom]

6 hours ago, chang1 said:

Pointless war?

So drugs of all kinds are totally safe and should be freely available to anyone who wants them?

People should be allowed to give school kids whatever they want to get them hooked?

Just look at the harm legal drugs like alcohol and tobacco cause. 

Personally I don't care if someone wants to ruin their lives with drugs but unfortunately it's not just the users who suffer. Families, road users, work colleagues, hospital and first responders are just some of those that get impacted. The war will never be won as there will always be weak people needing a high and low life's willing to supply drugs no matter how risky.

Better education and more emphasis on the effects of drugs on other people may help. Things like 10 year driving bans for those found driving with illegal drugs. People who neglect their children or commit crimes due to drugs should be forced to go cold turkey and then get help to stay off them. Fines and prisons are certainly not much of a deterrent. 

If your drug of choice doesn't cause you to affect other people in any way and you have it under control then I see little point in taking any action against you but as soon as you start a car engine or forget to feed your kid then you deserve all you get. 

Joe deserves to loose all his wealth and spend at least 20 years locked up. As for his subordinates, they are probably too scared to stand up against the system but still need to spend a good time behind bars. As for the victim, if he was involved with the drug trade, I am not too worried about him and his death will send out a warning signal to others. 

You may think the war is pointless but I would much rather police were stopping scumbags giving my kid drugs through the school railings than me having to stop them.

 

The irony of this post is it is by a chap who names himself after a legalised drug.

[kimamey]

6 hours ago, RobU said:

Death under torture is classed as murder in Thailand and many other countries. This applies whether there was intent to kill or not. The act of torture is in itself illegal thus any consequences must be dealt with as severely as possible.

Again I don't know the law in Thailand but some countries don't have manslaughter but have degrees of murder that cover the same offence. It may end up being neither murder or manslaughter. Nothing would surprise me here

 

[Artisi]

On 11/20/2021 at 9:25 AM, wombat said:

Of course they didn't kill him.

Thats obvious from the cctv...he chose to suicide rather than give up the name of his supplier.

Even blind Freddy could see that.

Actually you are not too far off the mark regarding not giving up the name of his supplier...... 

[kiwikeith]

On 11/20/2021 at 9:45 AM, RichardColeman said:

He seriously thought the man he was assaulting would not die having plastic bags and tape wrapped around his head ? 

 

The fact he has illegally obtained a huge fortune should be clear evidence that the guy is a huge liar 

It’s the bag delivery guys fault,the bags were supposed to be the ones with small holes in them

[meechai]

So...He is using the standard Thai get out of jail traffic accident excuse?

 

His brakes failed while torturing the victim he couldn't stop?

[Tropposurfer]

This guy is such a piece of filth, along with his conspirator murdering mates

[Black Angus]

Yep! will be found guilty. so  can be sent to jail with a long sentence. But he will be dead within a week or two, once the inmates get him have been paid. Accidental Dead (fell from Landing) or heart attack. Then those above him can sleep peacefully and carry on their Lawful duties. Till the next time  

[Dogmatix]

It doesn't matter under Thai law if they actually intended to kill him. They tortured him in such a way that they knew there was a good chance they would kill him which makes them guilty of premeditated murder.  It is not much different from playing Russian roulette on him with a revolver that has some empty chambers. In that case they couldn't argue that they didn't intend to kill him because they intended that the hammer should fall on one of the empty chambers. And murder through torture carries a mandatory death sentence in Thailand. 

[rubyjuan]

He’s just another skinny weasel with a badge and a mattress full of dirty money.  

[chang1]

On 11/20/2021 at 10:17 AM, Thunglom said:

an oxymoron if ever I saw one. The police are using the faux concept of "drugs war" to mitigate or justify their actions. = Probaly the most dangerous spin-off from drugs.

Unfortunately you really don't seem to have a grasp on "drugs" yourself - you appear to contradict yourself over and again.

the war on drugs has failed and it it attitudes like yours that keep th myth and the deaths going.

The war never can be won as there will always be someone craving some sort of drug. Easy to say the war has failed but what is your foolproof solution that will save lives? 

[chang1]

On 11/20/2021 at 2:04 PM, dinsdale said:

All drugs should be legal. Kids as you mention should be educated in a postive mode not just drugs are bad. Drugs aren't bad if used properly and are clean. Been used for centuries. Portugal has a good attitude towards this. Educate, set up community help for the addicted, set up employment programs and a lot more (worth having a look) and crime goes down as does other negative things associated with 'illicit' drug taking. Corruption disappears. This is why it doesn't happen. 

I didn't know all drugs are completely legal in Portugal. They kept that secret well. As for the education and other help, I agree, these interventions are extremely important in the war against drugs.

[chang1]

On 11/20/2021 at 2:25 PM, Rudey said:

I agree with most of what you’ve written. 
But the biggest problem here is, the cops and army are the main “dealers”. 
This guy’s death is not a deterrent to selling drugs, it’s only a warning the small dealers must share with the “big dealers” (police and army). 
Yes sad, but true. 
What is also sad in this country is, many people have no other way to “get ahead”, other than selling drugs.  
Zero help from the government for the unemployed, due to Covid doesn’t doesn’t help!!!

Totally agree. Crime around drugs is if anything the bigger problem. 

[chang1]

On 11/20/2021 at 3:16 PM, Thunglom said:

The irony of this post is it is by a chap who names himself after a legalised drug.

Where is the irony?

 

From my post -

"If your drug of choice doesn't cause you to affect other people in any way and you have it under control then I see little point in taking any action against you but as soon as you start a car engine or forget to feed your kid then you deserve all you get"

 

This clearly shows I don't have a problem with drugs, such as alcohol, when used responsibly.